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Author Topic: Limited color space, Why???  (Read 2859 times)

mcfoto

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Limited color space, Why???
« on: December 25, 2007, 10:37:28 pm »

Hi
I had a discussion with one of the best retouchers in Sydney last week. He doesn't use camera raw or the processor in LR either & one reason is the limited color space. In LR for example you have 3, Adobe 98, sRGB & ProFoto. You cannot install your own prefered color space. I am using Raw Developer with DeCam 3 which is also loaded in Photo Shop. I down loaded the new Capture One program & they have many profiles including DeCam 3. Why is LR ( Adobe ) with there Camera Raw limiting us to only 3 color spaces? I will use LR for the library but not for processing my Raw files.
Denis
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Denis Montalbetti
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Schewe

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2007, 12:18:45 am »

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Why is LR ( Adobe ) with there Camera Raw limiting us to only 3 color spaces?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=163132\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Because, if you understand color spaces and the way they are used, all you need are those three. And, I wouldn't call Sydney the hotbed of digital imaging (no disrespect intended to any individuals) and I doubt this guy has ever spent any time hanging around with people like Thomas Knoll and Bill Atkinson (who loves Lightroom BTW) but color science ain't rocket science (rocket science is a lot easier).

If you want an image in any other color space, export as 16 bit ProPhoto RGB and do the transform in Photoshop. You'll loose essentially, nothing.
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Farmer

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2007, 01:18:18 am »

As a Sydneysider - no offence taken.  I'd also add that I know several folks doing retouching in this local market and/or the photographers who use them or have them on staff or do the work themselves, and they don't see the need for more colour spaces.

I find a lot of people over complicate a subject that is sufficiently complex as it is, which is a real shame.
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Phil Brown

mcfoto

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2007, 01:52:59 am »

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Because, if you understand color spaces and the way they are used, all you need are those three. And, I wouldn't call Sydney the hotbed of digital imaging (no disrespect intended to any individuals) and I doubt this guy has ever spent any time hanging around with people like Thomas Knoll and Bill Atkinson (who loves Lightroom BTW) but color science ain't rocket science (rocket science is a lot easier).

If you want an image in any other color space, export as 16 bit ProPhoto RGB and do the transform in Photoshop. You'll loose essentially, nothing.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi
No offense taken but I am sure you have heard of:
[a href=\"http://www.josephholmes.com/propages/AboutRGBSpaces.html]http://www.josephholmes.com/propages/AboutRGBSpaces.html[/url]
What is your view point on this, I am sure you have heard of him.
Thanks denis
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Denis Montalbetti
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Farmer

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2007, 02:02:19 am »

BTW, Denis, congratulations on your 2007 awards (I just had a great time looking through the galleries on your website :-)
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Phil Brown

Schewe

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2007, 02:11:35 am »

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What is your view point on this, I am sure you have heard of him.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=163152\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

While Joe is a great digital printer, I'm pretty sure he's still primarily a film guy–where modifying color spaces can be useful because you can do un-edited color transforms by applying different profiles to an image to achieve substantially different results (without ever actually "touching the image"). It's only very recently that Joe's been doing much of anything with digital capture.

But even Joe says that if your raw converter won't allow use of his profile variants, just process into ProPhoto RGB (ideally, in 16 bit).

Since ProPhoto RGB is _SO_ big, once you've processed into it, you can convert it to just about any other color space (including Lab) with very minor impact from having started in ProPhoto RGB in the first place. But I really don't worry about PP RGB being so big. I switched over to it a few years ago after testing a bunch of RGB color spaces including Bruce RGB and Joe's original Ekta RGB. In the grand scheme of things, my preference is to keep things simple. And none of the captures from ANY of my cameras get clipped when processing into PP RGB. So, I just use that unless the image is going on the web (then sRGB) or I have to submit RGB images to others (then I send Adobe RGB unless they pass a color intelligence quiz). The test? When I ask them how they handle embedded profiles, and they can tell me, then I "might" give them a PP RGB file...otherwise, if they don't have a clue what I'm talking about, then it's Adobe RGB (or possibly sRGB if they are _REAL_ stooopid).

:~)

BTW, nice work on the www.montalbetticampbell.com site...nice to know photography is alive and well in Sydney!
« Last Edit: December 26, 2007, 02:14:08 am by Schewe »
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digitaldog

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Limited color space, Why???
« Reply #6 on: December 26, 2007, 09:40:44 am »

Yup, Joe based his color space on film usage. For Raw work, I can't see why ProPhoto RGB wouldn't serve you well. Its really not a topic of controversy after all these years and images run through ProPhoto RGB. I'd do it all in high bit.
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