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Author Topic: mamiya/phase wish list  (Read 3330 times)

paul_jones

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mamiya/phase wish list
« on: November 28, 2007, 09:32:37 pm »

ive aways liked my good old mamiys 645 pro (back in the film days), but have never gelled with the plasticy molded, all in one afd. but i think the  afd is almost a good camera, it needs improving in quite a few areas to even be close to be concidered for me.

heres my wish list, although the design of the phase/mamiya is probably far too down the track to have any thing changed- i can only hope.
these things are not super high tech, or expensive to produce. just basic, important features (imho)


brighter larger viewfinder.
why does the h1 seem to have the monopoly of bright finders. even the newly developed zd camera was like looking down a tunnel.

vertical grip.
or at least leave the connectors to add an accessory one (and have it hold batteries).
if you shoot all day vertical, is a pain to hold a horizontal camera vertically. it can be one of those money making add ons that everybody would buy soon after the purchase of the camera body.
 

removable finder/ add a waist level.
another thing they definately went backwards on since the 645pro. all the good reasons for having the removeable finder still exists in the future as it did in the past. i am aways shooting from the ground, or along a wall, or even some times with the camera above my head - the waist level finder is the only way you can go in many of these instances. a professional system should have more options, not less.

the other reason to have a removeable finder,is that you can draw on the focusing screen layouts, and formats. this is important for many page layouts, advertising shoots.

a decent eyecup.
the h1 has a decent eye cup. i shoot along with cine crews quite a lot, and im jelous of the eye cups (and other accessories) they have on the arri cameras. its large and comfortable, with removable leather covers.
the phase/mamiya doesnt have to go that far, but a eyecup that effectivly removes light when shooting in the sun, and is comfortable enough to have stuck against your eye for long shoot days would seem like a no brainer.

leaf shutter lens option.
this has been hinted on- great. they had that feature with the good old 645 pro. even the old pentax 645 had a few leaf shutter options. i want to have the option to shoot with flash outside with one lens, then have a really fast shutter speed on another shot, and use a super fast lens for  
a tiny dof.

weather proofing.
it dosnt have to be as extensive as the canon, but should have had some though into it.
i had my p25 written off by the tinyest drops of water that splashed onto me and my camera when shooting off the side of a boat. a drop of water entered the FW hole, and shorted the back.
it wasnt worth repairing, a total write off. that could have been fixed by having a cheap rubber bung covering the hole.


the arri cameras are my dream design example of what stills camera should be like. i would would pay twice as much for a medium format camera that had that kid of modularity and build quality.
ultimate lightness isnt a super important thing for me either, it more important to have ruggedness, and shooting options. i guess most peolp that can afford digital backs, use assistants- i do. get them to carry the bags.
it should look professional- this is important, when you spend top dollar, it should look the part.
look at this as a piece of design-
http://retrothing.typepad.com/photos/uncat...zed/arri416.jpg

paul
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Mort54

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« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2007, 09:43:21 pm »

Give me smaller and lighter than the AFD II, with better buttons, and I'd be happy. Frankly I'd prefer a simple rangefinder body with manual focus and no mirror, but that's just me.
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Morgan_Moore

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« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2007, 10:37:01 pm »

Quote
heres my wish list,
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=156813\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

multipoint AF

leaf lenses

bright viewfinder

S
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Sam Morgan Moore Bristol UK

amsp

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mamiya/phase wish list
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2007, 10:45:11 am »

Paul, here's my thoughts on your list..

brighter larger viewfinder.
I think this is obviously something they will have improved on the AFDIII to stay competitive.

vertical grip.
All for it.
 
removable finder/ add a waist level.
Not sure I personally see much use for one anymore, and an integrated one might be robuster. But, if there are no downsides I'm all for choice.

a decent eyecup.
I think the eyecup is great already, much nicer than the H-series.

leaf shutter lens option.
Already announced, and about time if you ask me.

weather proofing.
Would be nice.


I love the Mamiya and personally I think it's the only camera today that looks the part, the rest remind me of toys with their silly colors. Just my personal opinion mind you. A somewhat more rigid plastic would be nice, but I think the "cheap feel" of the AFD is waaay exaggerated. All in all I think the new AFDIII sounds really interesting and I will most definitely buy one if the price is reasonable.
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Jack Varney

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« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2007, 09:19:01 pm »

As far as medium format goes I have had the good fortune to own (as a hobbyist after "retiring" from photogaphy for a career in IT with IBM) a Hasselblad 500C, Mamiya 500J, 1000S, Pro 645 and an AFD.

The 645 Pro was my favorite from a handling perspective; small and light. However, it had the rubberized covering many object to. The 1000S was the "real thing" so reminiscent of the old Rolleiflexes I grew up with. Solid metal with leather coverings. Bright chrome trim, etc. Sort of like the automabiles of the fifties.

Digital forced me to the Mamiya 645 AFD in order to use an integrated digital back, in my case the Phase One. Same rubberized 645 Pro covering, bigger too. But, the same solid aluminium body and magnesium prism finder underneath. Solid, if not heavier and a bit bulkier.

Don't short the Mamiya. 45 years experience with medium format says they are as rugged. less trouble free. and as capable as any of the others I have used.
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Jack Varney

rejcd

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« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2007, 11:18:02 pm »

Quote
ive aways liked my good old mamiys 645 pro (back in the film days), but have never gelled with the plasticy molded, all in one afd. but i think the  afd is almost a good camera, it needs improving in quite a few areas to even be close to be concidered for me.

heres my wish list, although the design of the phase/mamiya is probably far too down the track to have any thing changed- i can only hope.
these things are not super high tech, or expensive to produce. just basic, important features (imho)
brighter larger viewfinder.
why does the h1 seem to have the monopoly of bright finders. even the newly developed zd camera was like looking down a tunnel.

vertical grip.
or at least leave the connectors to add an accessory one (and have it hold batteries).
if you shoot all day vertical, is a pain to hold a horizontal camera vertically. it can be one of those money making add ons that everybody would buy soon after the purchase of the camera body.
 

removable finder/ add a waist level.
another thing they definately went backwards on since the 645pro. all the good reasons for having the removeable finder still exists in the future as it did in the past. i am aways shooting from the ground, or along a wall, or even some times with the camera above my head - the waist level finder is the only way you can go in many of these instances. a professional system should have more options, not less.

the other reason to have a removeable finder,is that you can draw on the focusing screen layouts, and formats. this is important for many page layouts, advertising shoots.

a decent eyecup.
the h1 has a decent eye cup. i shoot along with cine crews quite a lot, and im jelous of the eye cups (and other accessories) they have on the arri cameras. its large and comfortable, with removable leather covers.
the phase/mamiya doesnt have to go that far, but a eyecup that effectivly removes light when shooting in the sun, and is comfortable enough to have stuck against your eye for long shoot days would seem like a no brainer.

leaf shutter lens option.
this has been hinted on- great. they had that feature with the good old 645 pro. even the old pentax 645 had a few leaf shutter options. i want to have the option to shoot with flash outside with one lens, then have a really fast shutter speed on another shot, and use a super fast lens for 
a tiny dof.

weather proofing.
it dosnt have to be as extensive as the canon, but should have had some though into it.
i had my p25 written off by the tinyest drops of water that splashed onto me and my camera when shooting off the side of a boat. a drop of water entered the FW hole, and shorted the back.
it wasnt worth repairing, a total write off. that could have been fixed by having a cheap rubber bung covering the hole.
the arri cameras are my dream design example of what stills camera should be like. i would would pay twice as much for a medium format camera that had that kid of modularity and build quality.
ultimate lightness isnt a super important thing for me either, it more important to have ruggedness, and shooting options. i guess most peolp that can afford digital backs, use assistants- i do. get them to carry the bags.
it should look professional- this is important, when you spend top dollar, it should look the part.
look at this as a piece of design-
http://retrothing.typepad.com/photos/uncat...zed/arri416.jpg

paul
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=156813\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
add a wish for a revolving back, that will eliminate the need for a vertical grip
rejcd
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paul_jones

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« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2007, 03:13:30 am »

Quote
add a wish for a revolving back, that will eliminate the need for a vertical grip
rejcd
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=157405\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

yeah, i like the idea of a revolving back, but i was thinking of the simpler things to add to the existing afd, if they added a revolving back we would be waiting a long time.

paul
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Leonardo Barreto

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« Reply #7 on: December 01, 2007, 01:00:49 pm »

The only change I would make is easy to do, a rechargeable battery system other than the 4 AA, other than that, to be able to opt to make 1/3 exposure changes.

I photograph interior and 2D and 3D objects, so I don't need any of the modifications that Paul wants. I like the one piece body because, firs of all, you don't have to buy the body and then spend an extra $1,5k on the viewfinder as is the case of the HY6, second, the camera is more compact, robust and less prone to dust coming in. Although a viewfinder is not a moving piece, it has connectors that can give you problems connecting (as in RZ that failed from time to time because of this)

I think that the future of MF will take a more radical direction.

The entire reflex concept will become obsolete sooner or later. The mirror system has advantages, but at a high cost in design limitations for the body and optic system that can be avoid with a very high resolution live system.

Lenses could be half the size that they are now, cameras would have very bright viewfinders that would present all kinds of information to the photographer in the same way the Heads Up Display of a fighter jet does. You can shoot and check the image w/out removing the camera form you eyes or shoot from the hip, the wall or floor if you want. Same way the consumer are shooting now !

But   eliminating the good old reflex system is too much for the pro just yet, it would be like Fly By Wire.

So, Phase will probably continue with the SLR, but I think that Mamiya should come up with an Alpa that has an AF system, AE, "motor drive" and PC. Something that you could use with the new Live Preview that the backs come with, BUT WITH OUT THE COMPUTER.

This is the real system of the future, I think...
« Last Edit: December 01, 2007, 01:01:49 pm by Leonardo Barreto »
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