Purple blotches on Leaf Aptus 75S files

[eronald]

Edmund, I've checked the RAW file. Actually, the stripes or striations can be seen in my monitor even before you push the exposure. It's more visible even when pushing about two stops but I can clearly see the the stripes at 50% magnification.

You should open a support case at phaseone.com. They will help you.

/Samuel
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Samuel,
 Thank you for your confirmation of my own findings. I had a Phase One case open. They CLOSED my case as soon as I sent them that file !!!! They refused to acknowledge that this is a clear indication that the back has issues at 400 ISO, and pretend it's only a 800 ISO underexposed problem. I don't know what is the matter here but I'm feeling increasingly unhappy, even more so as I paid for the VA option.  The rep agreed now to send the back to Denmark, we'll see if Phase actually does something to fix the issues, but if they are in denial maybe having some pro photographers using Phase products look at that file and chiming in might help ...

if this is back is defective, as I believe, then it needs to be repaired or replaced. If as Phase believe it is in spec and this is Phase P45+normal quality at ISO 400 then I think prospective buyers deserve to be shown what problems they can expect.

Here is what they wrote me:

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Hi thanks for the image - i have looked at the image and i have posted Olivier from Prophot some suggestions and answers. I have also suggestted him that you can try one of their P 45+ to compare.

What i have written Prophot is that a 1-2 f-stop under exposure and then at ISO 800 leaves the signal/noise ratio in a very low position where you will get difficulties. The sensor will only use a minimum of the dynamic range that way. Instead we recommend that you get a image correct exposed and then afterretouch whatever changes you may have. I have also written that maybe you should try a P 30+ or P21+ instead - these camerabacks are more optimized for higher ISO (P 30+ ISO 1600) and they both have microlenses in case you need to shoot in dark invironment.

About the 3.7.7 crash when processing can only be related to your local Mac - please ensure that RAM and CPU are performing well and the harddrive as well. The pattern noise supression will be supported in the final 3.7.8 version that will be release in the comming weeks.

Thanks
Customer Support

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Here is my previous message, when I sent them the file posted above.

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    Here is another image @ISO400 with about 1 stop headroom. You will see the horizontal lines again. I suggest we do something about this, I have lines or blooming in a lot of my images even if they are not quite as visible immediately.

By the way, C1 3.77 is quite unstable when processing my P45+ files on both my comps, Mac Intel and G5, under 10.4.x, and also crashes predictably if I try to enable pattern noise reduction.

Edmund
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[Rick_Allen]

Jing what is the grain adjustment set to in LeafCapture? What happens when you drop it from th default 25 to 10 or 0 or even -10? Does sharpness suffer too much?

[jing q]

Jing what is the grain adjustment set to in LeafCapture? What happens when you drop it from th default 25 to 10 or 0 or even -10? Does sharpness suffer too much?
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I haven't used that setting properly yet so I'm not sure... I do remember that I've been setting it down once in awhile because I thought the grain structure was pretty horrible (looks like some sort of weird watercolour pattern in the out of focus areas)

[eronald]

Ric Agudelo was here in Paris, he's one of the guys using my profiles - looked at my P45+ back and didn't like what he saw on the display. The display maybe good, but those lines on the back ure look ugly. Ric tells me he too leaves some headroom during his use of his back.

I had agreed with my dealer that the best thing to do is send the back to the Phase mothership where it can be cared for, and maybe swapped; in the mean time the Paris rep ays that if he sends a back in and it isn't broken he gets billed thousands of dollars so he wants me to come in and prove to him that it's broken.

I'm tired. I like my dealer (Le Moyen Format) but see no need to argue with the rep. I will phone Phase tomorrow and see if I can get an RMA to send the thing directly to Denmark and bypass the locals. Why did I pay for the VA warranty to get all this aggravation?

Edmund

[bcroslin]

I haven't used that setting properly yet so I'm not sure...

If you set the grain setting at +50 it's the equivalent of turning noise reduction off.

Not very intuitive.

Furthermore, it would be nice if Leaf would just call this what it is: noise reduction.

[JessicaLuchesi]

Edmund,

Is this my impression, or they simply told you that you cannot use creative lighting/exposure with their back, in higher ISO, as you would in film, but rather, you have to rely on post-processing if you want it done? It's kind of shocking that they assume that, anyone who wants the photo to come out ready out of the camera, shouldn't be able to do it. It's simply like a guitar factory who has a crappy sound, and their response to the consumer, is that you digitally enhance the sound in the studio... despite the fact it's a US$35.000 + guitar :|

[thsinar]

hi Jessica,

I don't think it can be said this way. IMO, PO (or the dealer) did not yet aknowledge or recognize the seriousness of Edmun's problem (his back, not Edmund!). IMO the dealer does not know how to deal with this and what he is confronted with. It also depends which specifications and tolerances PO is having concerning the Kodak sensor. All it needs to do is to take the back ad run some basic tests to see what is wrong.

But as Michael says, Edmund should complain directly with the manufacturer, if the dealer does seem not to respond.

Best regards,
Thierry

Edmund,

Is this my impression, or they simply told you that you cannot use creative lighting/exposure with their back, as you would in film, but rather, you have to rely on post-processing if you want it done? It's kind of shocking that they assume that, anyone who wants the photo to come out ready out of the camera, shouldn't be able to do it. It's simply like a guitar factory who has a crappy sound, and their response to the consumer, is that you digitally enhance the sound in the studio... despite the fact it's a US$35.000 + guitar :|
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[eronald]

Edmund,

Is this my impression, or they simply told you that you cannot use creative lighting/exposure with their back, in higher ISO, as you would in film, but rather, you have to rely on post-processing if you want it done? It's kind of shocking that they assume that, anyone who wants the photo to come out ready out of the camera, shouldn't be able to do it. It's simply like a guitar factory who has a crappy sound, and their response to the consumer, is that you digitally enhance the sound in the studio... despite the fact it's a US$35.000 + guitar :|
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That's correct. Phase didn't like the brutal way I was underexposing the back originally, and the french rep -Prophot-  didn't like the fact that I actually insist on shooting at ISO 400 at least. Their position is that 400 shouldn't be used and certainly not underexposed. The dealer's position -Le Moyen Format- is that the back should be at least usable at 400 and 800. Thing is, I actually prefer the pushed look around 400-800, the same way as James Russell likes it.

Thing is, it's ironic, because my tests indicate that if it worked, the back should be pretty good actually at high ISO, a definite selling point to many of us. The image shown in the [a href=\"http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=21611]centerfold thread[/url] shows good color and minimal film-like grain at ISO 400, leave your Canon at home if you are lucky enough to have a working Phase P+ back.

Maybe we should concentrate this discussion in the centerfold thread to avoid excessively polluting Michael's nice forum.

Edmund