H3D-31 (not the II)

[mikemigs]

Hi everyone.

Right now I am teeter-tottering between a high-end DSLR or MFDB mostly for travel landscape (urban and nature) backgrounds for CGI applications. I just tested a pre-production 1Ds MkIII with a 135mm f/2 against a Phase P25/H1 with a 50-110 and have to admit the Canon held its own very well. I recently sold my 1Ds MkII and I really liked the speed and handling of the camera as well as the no-hassle freedom it gave me while shooting. I also think the Canons are more reliable and less likely to break down while traveling especially to exotic lands with no accessible repair facilities.

However, I suppose I have been spoiled by my (also recently sold) Phase H25 image quality. I know it's all compromises with camera gear but I have narrowed the choice down to either the Canon 1Ds MkIII or a pre-owned H3D-31 (for budget constraints, the II is beyond my reach). I already know the larger sensor H3D will yield a higher quality image, but the Canon is faster, lighter, less than 1/2 the price, while still providing very respectable pics.

So my question is to you H3D users. Is this system really worth it over the best DSLR? Does it advantages outweigh its shortcomings? I have read all the posts in this forum about flare in specular highlights during long exposures . Although it seemed only to affect the poster of the thread, I am wondering if any of you had similar experiences? Any other negative experiences or pet-peeves about the camera? My colleague recently rented one and had problems with the FW800 connector on the DB which prevented tethered shooting.

I found an H3D-31 seller but would not be able to test it prior to purchase since they are out-of-state, and my local Hassy dealer doesn't have one available for testing at the moment (rented out, demoed out, or under repair).

Thanks for everyone's comments!!!

Mike.

[eronald]

Looks like there are no Canons on sale yet, so you might as well preorder one, and use the month (at least) until delivery to get a Hassy for testing.

Edmund

Hi everyone.
I found an H3D-31 seller but would not be able to test it prior to purchase since they are out-of-state, and my local Hassy dealer doesn't have one available for testing at the moment (rented out, demoed out, or under repair).

Thanks for everyone's comments!!!

Mike.
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[MarkKay]

I think the advantages and disadvantages between the two systems are apparent except for the issue of IQ.  While IQ is going to have objective components, many of the differences will be subjective and open to personal taste.  I am in the same point trying to decide what to do with my MF -- leaf 65/Hassy H2 vs canon system.  I really love the IQ from the leaf backs and can state it is much better than what i could achieve with my 1DsmkII or 5D using the best canon lenses.  My concern is the 1DsmkIII is not going to be much better in IQ at the lower isos.  

Hi everyone.

Right now I am teeter-tottering between a high-end DSLR or MFDB mostly for travel landscape (urban and nature) backgrounds for CGI applications. I just tested a pre-production 1Ds MkIII with a 135mm f/2 against a Phase P25/H1 with a 50-110 and have to admit the Canon held its own very well. I recently sold my 1Ds MkII and I really liked the speed and handling of the camera as well as the no-hassle freedom it gave me while shooting. I also think the Canons are more reliable and less likely to break down while traveling especially to exotic lands with no accessible repair facilities.

However, I suppose I have been spoiled by my (also recently sold) Phase H25 image quality. I know it's all compromises with camera gear but I have narrowed the choice down to either the Canon 1Ds MkIII or a pre-owned H3D-31 (for budget constraints, the II is beyond my reach). I already know the larger sensor H3D will yield a higher quality image, but the Canon is faster, lighter, less than 1/2 the price, while still providing very respectable pics.

So my question is to you H3D users. Is this system really worth it over the best DSLR? Does it advantages outweigh its shortcomings? I have read all the posts in this forum about flare in specular highlights during long exposures . Although it seemed only to affect the poster of the thread, I am wondering if any of you had similar experiences? Any other negative experiences or pet-peeves about the camera? My colleague recently rented one and had problems with the FW800 connector on the DB which prevented tethered shooting.

I found an H3D-31 seller but would not be able to test it prior to purchase since they are out-of-state, and my local Hassy dealer doesn't have one available for testing at the moment (rented out, demoed out, or under repair).

Thanks for everyone's comments!!!

Mike.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=153510\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[jimgolden]

steve @ PPR had a refurb or demo unit of the H3D-31 for a very nice price

also, capture intergration has a demo unit sale going

I had a VERY informal test w/ a 1DsmkIII on friday just by coincidence (my dealer was having a canon demo daze) and I had my H3D-22 in my rig, so I shot in the store w/ both cameras and then
walked over to the imaging area and popped in the CF cards - the canon rep was not happy about his, BTW, but the MF solution (IMHO) still blow the socks of the canon - they're pushing A LOT of info thru a 36x24 sensor, I almost like the 5D better - needless to say the canon rep didnt let me take that file from the mkIII to go...the myth of the mkIII being a MF killer is just that - a myth...

AND for CGI applications, I would think you'd want the best possible capture

most all of my work prints offset, so I'm familiar w/ how CMYK printing can be the great leveler...

of course - these are my humble opinions...

[mikemigs]

Mark and Jim:

Thanks for your comments. I have also been in touch with Lance Schad at Capture Integrations (Miami) who also suggested a Phase P30 on a Hassy H body. I need to make up my mind on 2 things:

(1) I am trying to minimize the weight and size of my gear when shooting. Not a problem when I have my vehicle close by during the shoot, but not always possible depending on location. Assistants are not always possible either. Therefore, can I handle the weight of a MF system on my back (back pack)

(2) While not the latest and greatest, the H3D-31 is still newer than the discontinued H1 or H2, and therefore still considered part of Hassy's updates. The Phase/H1 or H2 combo's upgrade path is more uncertain; no-one knows exactly what Phase's plans are and whether current backs will play well with their new products. And we all know the H1 and H2 are pretty much dead, except for servicing. So that leaves me with the decision to buy into a newer system (H3D-31) or an older system (Phase/H) whose IQ I am more comfortable with.

(3) Or just buy the 1Ds MKIII, bask in the speed, convenience, and reliability and just accept the lower IQ.

     

[j.miller]

Mike,
      Also worth noting is with the anticipated release of Hasselblad's Phocus® software, you can expect some additional firmware improvements to the H3D and H3D-II series cameras, as we saw with the release of FlexColor 4.8.1.

What makes you less comfortable with H3D's image quality?

Regards,

Jordan Miller

Mark and Jim:

Thanks for your comments. I have also been in touch with Lance Schad at Capture Integrations (Miami) who also suggested a Phase P30 on a Hassy H body. I need to make up my mind on 2 things:

(1) I am trying to minimize the weight and size of my gear when shooting. Not a problem when I have my vehicle close by during the shoot, but not always possible depending on location. Assistants are not always possible either. Therefore, can I handle the weight of a MF system on my back (back pack)

(2) While not the latest and greatest, the H3D-31 is still newer than the discontinued H1 or H2, and therefore still considered part of Hassy's updates. The Phase/H1 or H2 combo's upgrade path is more uncertain; no-one knows exactly what Phase's plans are and whether current backs will play well with their new products. And we all know the H1 and H2 are pretty much dead, except for servicing. So that leaves me with the decision to buy into a newer system (H3D-31) or an older system (Phase/H) whose IQ I am more comfortable with.

(3) Or just buy the 1Ds MKIII, bask in the speed, convenience, and reliability and just accept the lower IQ.

     
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[jimgolden]

yeah, I hear ya. I dont think I'll be luggin my H3D around too much just yet, but the mkIII isnt
exactly a featherweight. Plus most of the good L glass is big and heavy. I'm not fond of the Hass 50-110 zoom for that matter either, it's a monster. but the kit w/ the 80mm is managable - plus the 1.7x converter is supposed to be good. most primes are managable

the H2 - I dunno. I could have bought one for a lot cheaper as a H2D-22 but didnt b/c of the current Hass situation and the lack of DAC and the 28mm (not that I shoot a lot of wide angle, but still leaves me open to it). I was exposed to Phase years ago, and like the IQ from them, but not on an
H2 - mam AFD2 would be my choice. however, AFD2 are lacking in some rental pools, especially
@ my location - somehing to take into consideration when traveling, especially.

There is the new Mam/Phase gear announced, but who kows how long? another HY6?

Bottom line: For me, it came dow to a nagging feeling that I'd always be a lacking in IQ w/ another DSLR. Then all the "little" stuff, like upgrade path, buying new lenses anyhow (to match 22MP on a FF 35mm), very few tilt/shift/rise/fall options, etc, etc.

make a pro/con list - if necc., give each pro/con a "value" rating as well...

[Dustbak]

yeah, I hear ya. I dont think I'll be luggin my H3D around too much just yet, but the mkIII isnt
exactly a featherweight. Plus most of the good L glass is big and heavy. I'm not fond of the Hass 50-110 zoom for that matter either, it's a monster. but the kit w/ the 80mm is managable - plus the 1.7x converter is supposed to be good. most primes are managable

the H2 - I dunno. I could have bought one for a lot cheaper as a H2D-22 but didnt b/c of the current Hass situation and the lack of DAC and the 28mm (not that I shoot a lot of wide angle, but still leaves me open to it). I was exposed to Phase years ago, and like the IQ from them, but not on an
H2 - mam AFD2 would be my choice. however, AFD2 are lacking in some rental pools, especially
@ my location - somehing to take into consideration when traveling, especially.

There is the new Mam/Phase gear announced, but who kows how long? another HY6?

Bottom line: For me, it came dow to a nagging feeling that I'd always be a lacking in IQ w/ another DSLR. Then all the "little" stuff, like upgrade path, buying new lenses anyhow (to match 22MP on a FF 35mm), very few tilt/shift/rise/fall options, etc, etc.

make a pro/con list - if necc., give each pro/con a "value" rating as well...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=154019\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The H2D as well as the H2 with CF back does DAC. Advantage of the CF is that it uses an adapterplate system so it can be used on more than one system. Leaves only the 28mm which cannot be used, or you need to invest in the Mamiya which would be a weird decision (buying a Hasselblad back and having to revert to Mamiya for using a 28mm).

I am still hoping for an Ixpress adapterplate and software module for the CF back.