24" printer and printer stand

[jschone]

Hi,


I am using the Epson 9800 (Imageprint and Phatte black) and I am going to add a 24" printer. Now, I am still undecided which one to choose:

-Epson 7880
-HP Z3100
-Canon IPF6100

But, Before I choose I haver a more practical problem to solve:  the printer is going to be used without a stand, since it will reside on a sort of platform above the 9800...

Now, I know that the Epson x800 series can be use without stand and I assume the x880 will be the same in that perspective, but what about the Canon and the HP?
The Epson loads paper from the front easily, what about the Canon and HP? Do the Canon and HP have the possibility to stay flat (with the possibility to attach screws to secure them)?

Are there any other problems that I should be aware of?


Btw The 9800 (with Phatte) will be used for matte papers from 17" - 44" and Glossy only from 24" and above (Reason why I add the 24" is because of bronzing with Phatte, which shows more on smaller prints -->viewing distance)

Hope someone can answer my practical "stand" problem (but also general buying advice about these 3 printers is welcome)


Jochem

[rdonson]

Jochem,

I really like my 24" Z3100 and it has many virtues but it may not be the best choice for your environment.  While the Z comes with a very nice stand it may be able to work from a flat surface.  What may make you hesitate is that the paper feed, both roll and sheets, is from the back.  It wouldn't be very easy to try to handle this from the front of the printer IMHO.

[Geoff Wittig]

I'd agree with Ron.
My Z3100 lives in a narrow window dormer just to the right of my computer desk, and to load paper I stand in front of the printer and reach over the top. This works well with sheets that are loaded from above, but it's a pain loading the leading edge of roll paper because you have to stretch over the top of the printer and reach down behind it to thread the paper into the feed slot. It's doable with the printer at waist level on its stand, but if it's mounted on a shelf above your 9800 it would be very awkward if not impossible.

[jschone]

Ok, Thanks. So that rules out the Z3100. Well, from the positive side that makes my decision easier.
I probably go with the 7880.

I'd agree with Ron.
My Z3100 lives in a narrow window dormer just to the right of my computer desk, and to load paper I stand in front of the printer and reach over the top. This works well with sheets that are loaded from above, but it's a pain loading the leading edge of roll paper because you have to stretch over the top of the printer and reach down behind it to thread the paper into the feed slot. It's doable with the printer at waist level on its stand, but if it's mounted on a shelf above your 9800 it would be very awkward if not impossible.
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[Wayne Fox]

Hi,
I am using the Epson 9800 (Imageprint and Phatte black) and I am going to add a 24" printer. Now, I am still undecided which one to choose:

-Epson 7880
-HP Z3100
-Canon IPF6100

But, Before I choose I haver a more practical problem to solve:  the printer is going to be used without a stand, since it will reside on a sort of platform above the 9800...

Now, I know that the Epson x800 series can be use without stand and I assume the x880 will be the same in that perspective, but what about the Canon and the HP?
The Epson loads paper from the front easily, what about the Canon and HP? Do the Canon and HP have the possibility to stay flat (with the possibility to attach screws to secure them)?

Are there any other problems that I should be aware of?
Btw The 9800 (with Phatte) will be used for matte papers from 17" - 44" and Glossy only from 24" and above (Reason why I add the 24" is because of bronzing with Phatte, which shows more on smaller prints -->viewing distance)

Hope someone can answer my practical "stand" problem (but also general buying advice about these 3 printers is welcome)
Jochem
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It sounds like the best printer for you is the Epson, mainly because of the paper loading options.  The only time to ever access the back of the Epson is to plug in power and connecting cables ... all paper loading uses the same slot, from roll to thick media.  The Canon requires space behind the printer to use front load manual slot for thick papers.  

7880's are starting to hit now, and reports are quality wise they are very good.  I'm currently setting up my 11880 and it is very impressive ... to me a definite notch above the ipf6100 I've been testing for a couple of months (and really like BTW).  I'm not sure how much of the gamut gain and black density gains from the 11880 can translate down to the 7880, but some of it definitely will.  

(A full week and 0 clogs ... we'll see how that goes)

[jschone]

Hi Wayne,

Thanks for your reply. Yes, you're right the Epson is probably my best option. Also because I'm already used to the 9800 operation.

Strangely enough, clogging has never been a real issue for me. My studio is in the centre of Rome, near the river. It's a  building from 1500, so some humid there is. Might be that this is an optimal climate for the Epsons ;-)

Now, also with two Epsons I solve my black switching problem (although I will keep the 9800 loaded with Phatte for bigger PK prints).

Jochem

It sounds like the best printer for you is the Epson, mainly because of the paper loading options.  The only time to ever access the back of the Epson is to plug in power and connecting cables ... all paper loading uses the same slot, from roll to thick media.  The Canon requires space behind the printer to use front load manual slot for thick papers. 

7880's are starting to hit now, and reports are quality wise they are very good.  I'm currently setting up my 11880 and it is very impressive ... to me a definite notch above the ipf6100 I've been testing for a couple of months (and really like BTW).  I'm not sure how much of the gamut gain and black density gains from the 11880 can translate down to the 7880, but some of it definitely will. 

(A full week and 0 clogs ... we'll see how that goes)
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[John Hollenberg]

7880's are starting to hit now, and reports are quality wise they are very good.  I'm currently setting up my 11880 and it is very impressive ... to me a definite notch above the ipf6100 I've been testing for a couple of months (and really like BTW).  I'm not sure how much of the gamut gain and black density gains from the 11880 can translate down to the 7880, but some of it definitely will. 

A notch above the ipf6100 in what way.  dmax? gamut? ease of use? overall print quality? something else?

Wondering about this as I am planning to get a 24 inch printer and the 7880 and ipf6100 would both be high on my list.  I don't print matte black much at all, so the ink switch wouldn't be a problem (but clogging would!).

--John

[John Hollenberg]

I'm not sure how much of the gamut gain and black density gains from the 11880 can translate down to the 7880, but some of it definitely will. 

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I was wondering what this meant until I noticed on Joe Holmes review a paragraph added a couple of weeks ago:

"Apparently, none of the inks, except for the two Vivid Magentas, used in the SP11880 are precisely identical to those in the other new machines, however, they are very close, and use the same pigments. The pigment loading of the 11880 inkset seems to have been increased substantially, because all of the six primary colors in the raw state of the printer are much darker and generally richer looking on photo paper than they were from the 9800, or it could be the driver putting more ink down by default, or it could be a change to the encapsulation technology used in this version of the VM inkset, or both, or something else, or any of the above, but this difference is striking. It may have a small effect on the darker colors gamut or the ratio of humectant to pigment in the print -- it's hard to say. It may be a direct consequence of the new head technology used in this machine (see item #3 below)."

Now it seems that we need a review of the Epson 7880/9880 separate from the 11880, as they use a (at least slightly) different inkset.

--John

[Wayne Fox]

A notch above the ipf6100 in what way.  dmax? gamut? ease of use? overall print quality? something else?

Dmax of the 11880 equals the ipf6100, and it looks like ink loading can be increased so it may be able to exceed it. Gamut volume gain to me seems pretty substantial on the only paper's I've worked with so far, Kodak and Epson Prem Lustre, and the gains seem to be in areas that will be useful to try and maintain detail in shadows. I'm actually seeing larger differences in gamut volume than Joseph did, so I'm reprofling the ipf6100 to make sure of my results.  I've always felt the Epsons beat the Canon's in ease of use, I especially like Epsons paper feed on the 24" and larger machines far better than Canon's, but of course that's a personal preference opinion.

So based on dmax and the gamut graphs I'm seeing, and a few preliminary prints, I believe 11880 output will be better.  I need to qualify that a little however. You already know I like the ipf6100 very much, think it's a terrific printer, and produces fantastic prints. I don't think any quality gains will be obvious, and most likely will be difficult to see even upon side by side comparisons.  One other qualification, I do 99.9% color work, and I know many really like the canon printers for B&W.  Others will have to comment on the 11880 for black and white  work.

Now it seems that we need a review of the Epson 7880/9880 separate from the 11880, as they use a (at least slightly) different inkset.

--John
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I concur.  In fact, it would be helpful if someone with an 11880 would put a 4880 or 7880 through the paces.  I'd love to, and I'm betting my supplier would lend me one for a while, but don't have the time.

I read Joseph Holmes article as well.  The increased density in the final page of Bill Atkinsons 5200 patch target is visually obvious.   While it could be due to reformulation of inks, my instincts tell me it has more to do with ink load than ink.  I have no way of knowing, (perhaps Jeff Schewe or Joseph Holmes will get an official word from epson), but it seems with the amazing control this printer has in dot placement and size, it would be easy to load up more ink and not get into problems.  It also could simply be new screening methods allow more ink load as well.

Obviously if it is due to the head/dot placement technology we may not see as much gain in the 48/78/9880 printers.  If it is with ink, probably not either because I don't think they are making a new full inkset and thus all but magentas would have to be backward compatible.

I guess thats a rather long way of say I concur