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Author Topic: Paper Comparison  (Read 3605 times)

wolfnowl

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Paper Comparison
« on: October 09, 2007, 01:54:25 am »

Hi Folks:

This site: http://www.lfi-online.de/ceemes/page/show/..._fineart_papers

has a comparison of some of the digital papers available today.  The pictures are small but do provide some view of their capabilities, even if it's only in comparison to each other...

Mike.
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Josh-H

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Paper Comparison
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2007, 02:21:43 am »

Quote
Hi Folks:

This site: http://www.lfi-online.de/ceemes/page/show/..._fineart_papers

has a comparison of some of the digital papers available today.  The pictures are small but do provide some view of their capabilities, even if it's only in comparison to each other...

Mike.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=144775\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Interesting find.
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Brian Gilkes

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« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2007, 10:12:44 am »

This site tells almost nothing.
The eye /brain accomodates DMax to "black" (and DMin >white). Noone should buy a paper on the basis of a 0.01 , or even 0.1 or 1.0,  difference in DMax. To make a beautiful print the perceived transitions of tonality should approximate those in real scenes. Profiles can adjust tonal differences and some paper respond better than others.Even then the profiles must be perceptually edited. The results from technically correct profiles often look "dead". This applies to colour as well as tone. Colors that measure OK often don,t look so, and tht varies with the conditions of viewing. A crappy print under household ungsten light may look brilliant under a Solux lamp or if taken out into the sun.
The whole thing is far too complex for a summary list like this to have any value at all.
The comments on surface are meaningless and misleading. It is nt mentioned that hahnemuhle Photo Rag has a repeating , not random texture that deadens image varience. It has ecellent colour gamut though, and an edited cusom profile can make it jump.
Texture means little with large prints , viewed at  distance .Close up, without covering glass or acrylic it becomes important.
Random vs regular texture may enhance images. Few review mention randomness as an attribute. Some of the stuff offered now is so repetitive in mechanically produced texture  that it is impossible to see the image. So much for DMax.
Cheers
Brian
www.pharoseditions.com.au
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Ernst Dinkla

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Paper Comparison
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2007, 11:46:33 am »

Quote
This site tells almost nothing.
The eye /brain accomodates DMax to "black" (and DMin >white). Noone should buy a paper on the basis of a 0.01 , or even 0.1 or 1.0,  difference in DMax.

Cheers
Brian
www.pharoseditions.com.au
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

There's not much left of Dmax when you lower Dmax with 1.0 D, even on the best paper. I certainly check what Dmax a paper/ink combination is capable off and it is a good guide for what you may expect of gamut too. The eye may adapt to a degree but two matte prints one having 1.5 and the other 1.7 Dmax is quite a difference starting from the same paper white, for gloss there may be little gained above 2.4 D but below that number there's enough variation to make the difference between papers.

But I agree that it is difficult to get the right impression from a list like that. And I have the magazine itself with much more text than on the site but the images offset printed which makes the purpose futile. What I miss most in the article is any comment on gloss differential and bronzing, something that must be visible in some prints that were all made with an Epson R2400. I agree also on the random/repetitive texture differences, if there's texture needed it should have a random aspect and mentioned in a test like that.

The Digital Sample Book of RIT is at least a better attempt to show paper characteristics on the web.

[a href=\"http://www.digitalsamplebook.com/home.htm]http://www.digitalsamplebook.com/home.htm[/url]


Ernst Dinkla

try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/
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thompsonkirk

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« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2007, 11:54:08 am »

What an odd site!  The color swatches under the images would seem to be illustrations of how good or bad the profiles were!
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rdonson

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Paper Comparison
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2007, 11:56:14 am »

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The Digital Sample Book of RIT is at least a better attempt to show paper characteristics on the web.

http://www.digitalsamplebook.com/home.htm
Ernst Dinkla

try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=144833\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Very nice find, Ernst.  I really like the ability to show the surface texture.  I hope this site takes off and we can see various actual commercial papers.
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Regards,
Ron

Ernst Dinkla

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« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2007, 03:08:58 pm »

Quote
What an odd site!  The color swatches under the images would seem to be illustrations of how good or bad the profiles were!
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


The profiles used were the ones distributed by the paper manufacturer and the printer settings used were what the paper manufacturer advised for their paper and profile. The only factor consistent between the prints tested has been the R2400 printer.
There's a variety of papers from matte art to RC coated so you will get different results anyway but in this case it also represents different approaches to profile creation.


Ernst Dinkla

try: [a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/[/url]
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Brian Gilkes

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Paper Comparison
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2007, 07:44:57 pm »

Quote from: Ernst Dinkla,Oct 9 2007, 03:46 PM
There's not much left of Dmax when you lower Dmax with 1.0 D, even on the best paper.

True. Yet a print on Somerset Book White with a DMax of 1.2 can be well suited for a purpose, and look beautiful, as can a coated lustre paper at 2.2.
Best
Brian
www.pharoseditions.com.au
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