P-45Plus - Best body for tilt/shift landscape?

[Lust4Life]

I shoot landscape and I've moved from 4x5 film to MF Digital.
Currently using Phase One P-45+ back on either Hassie 503CW or Flexbody.  Primary lens used is the Hassie 40 CFE IF Distagon FLE stopped to 16 and 22.

Looking for better solution to allow tilt with some shift being a bonus.  Put emphasis on tilt as I'm obsessed with near to far perfect focus and find I'm having a difficult time getting that with the Flexbody and can't always stop down far enough to get resolution and sharpness I want with 503cw.  

Don't want to return to 4x5 as I've been there with film and want a much lighter solution.

As my work is landscape and my age is 61, weight of the body is important to keep as light as possible for backpacking.


Question:  What camera bodies have worked for others where they are using a Phase back and want tilt for landscape work?


Options I've just started to explore:  Arca 6x9 Micrometric Orbix; Arca Misura

As always, your guidance is appreciated.

Thanks,
Jack
My Webpage

[michael]

Have a look at the Sylvestri line, particularly the Flexcam. I know a few people that have them and speak highly of them.

Michael

[oscar falero]

I shoot landscape and I've moved from 4x5 film to MF Digital.
Currently using Phase One P-45+ back on either Hassie 503CW or Flexbody.  Primary lens used is the Hassie 40 CFE IF Distagon FLE stopped to 16 and 22.

Looking for better solution to allow tilt with some shift being a bonus.  Put emphasis on tilt as I'm obsessed with near to far perfect focus and find I'm having a difficult time getting that with the Flexbody and can't always stop down far enough to get resolution and sharpness I want with 503cw. 

Don't want to return to 4x5 as I've been there with film and want a much lighter solution.

As my work is landscape and my age is 61, weight of the body is important to keep as light as possible for backpacking.
Question:  What camera bodies have worked for others where they are using a Phase back and want tilt for landscape work?
Options I've just started to explore:  Arca 6x9 Micrometric Orbix; Arca Misura

As always, your guidance is appreciated.

Thanks,
Jack
My Webpage
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The Arca 6x9 F metric Compact w Orbix(that was long) is a nice solution, but the rummored now- closer-to-becoming-real Arca Rm3, might be lighter and easier to work camera unit if your cosidering wider lenses. See Link:[a href=\"http://www.photografica.com/news/default.asp?mode=display&category=37&id=546]Arca Rmd3[/url]

Oscar

[Gary Ferguson]

Jack, if you're trying to save weight you may want to look at software tools such as Helicon Focus as an alternative strategy, I wrote about it in a Luminous Landscape article entitled "Focusing In The Digital Era" which you can find here,


http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorial...0Focusing.shtml


Incidentally, like you I use a Phase One back on a Hasselblad 503 and a Flexbody, but I also use it on a Linhof M679cs. In a landscape context I find very little additional sharpness from the Linhof over the Flexbody, but it certainly adds a massive weight penalty!

[ynp]

Dear Gary,
Thank you for your article. It helped me to understand the focusing problems I had before with my digital back. I use Helicon Focus Pro with very good results. I do not see any need for a view camera now for my line of work (copying  and shooting of small art objects). Focus bracketing on my Sinar-m (the same as on the HY6)  makes it much easier.
Yevgeny
 

Jack, if you're trying to save weight you may want to look at software tools such as Helicon Focus as an alternative strategy, I wrote about it in a Luminous Landscape article entitled "Focusing In The Digital Era" which you can find here,
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorial...0Focusing.shtml
Incidentally, like you I use a Phase One back on a Hasselblad 503 and a Flexbody, but I also use it on a Linhof M679cs. In a landscape context I find very little additional sharpness from the Linhof over the Flexbody, but it certainly adds a massive weight penalty!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135258\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[MarkKay]

ONe of my concerns or questions with these light weight alternatives is how steady they are with the weight and size of the digital back. Has this been problematic for any?  I had heard some complaints with the Arca setup. I have been using the rollei x act 2 and this is rock steady but i can imagine with a lighter setup how this might be an issue.

[haefnerphoto]

How about the Mamyia 645 and a Hartblei 45mm super rotator?  I haven't tried the combination yet but intend to soon.  I'll keep you advised.  By the way, I just heard from MAC that Mamyia has developed a firmware update for their new 28mm, it was having communication issues with the P45 when used in manual mode (exposure).  They tell me that by early next week it will be fixed. Jim

[Gary Ferguson]

ONe of my concerns or questions with these light weight alternatives is how steady they are with the weight and size of the digital back. Has this been problematic for any?  I had heard some complaints with the Arca setup. I have been using the rollei x act 2 and this is rock steady but i can imagine with a lighter setup how this might be an issue.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135295\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

You're right to consider this. I think we tend to carry a lot of prejudicial baggage from the film days. In the past large format enjoyed a clear quality advantage, but that automatic quality advantage just isn't there when you attach a digital back to a large format camera. In fact I'd argue that unless you're meticulous in your technique and careful in your choice of large format camera, you'll likely see a clear quality reduction when you switch your digital back from a medium format camera to a LF camera.

Most LF cameras were designed around the more relaxed tolerances of 4x5 film, where the negative was unlikely to be enlarged more than x2 to x4. Now that we're scrutinising images at 100% on our monitors and routinely enlarging for extremely large prints you need a correspondingly more precise instrument.

But there's only a handful of LF cameras that actually deliver that precision, in fact I don't know one LF digital photographer who is satisfied with digital if they're using a camera originally designed for 4x5 film. An ultra rigid chassis, outstanding focusing screen/viewfinder arrangements, and fully geared controls manufactured to the highest engineering standards are absolute requirements for successful digital photography with a technical camera.

[sc_john]

If shooting one of higher mp backs (P45, A75, etc), does H'blad lens or conventional view camera lens have adequate resolving power to take advantage of increased capability of these new backs? Or, are the new breed of "optimized for digital" (Schneider Digitars, Rodenstock HR., etc) lenses required? I'm not criticizing  H'blad or other lenses, just trying to understand.

Thanks,

John Hurshman

[Lust4Life]

Have a look at the Sylvestri line, particularly the Flexcam. I know a few people that have them and speak highly of them.

Michael
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135245\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Michael,

I've now had a chance to look at the Flexicam web site and then spoke with the USA importer.  Device is very interesting looking!  Odd that I had never heard of it before your comment.

Flexicam weight is 2.5 pounds = excellent; body cost is $2895 retail; has slider back available for additional $1350 retail = seems high.  Bayonet Interface adapter for LF lenses with Copa 0 shutters cost $195 retail each.

According to the web site, the Flexicam is specifically designed for digital work, thus the comments made by MarkKay would hopefully be addressed.

Still trying to get more info on the Arca Swiss Rm3d device.  From images I found of it, looks like it is substantially less precise and less sophisticated than the Flexicam.  

Jack

[tom_l]

Michael,

I've now had a chance to look at the Flexicam web site and then spoke with the USA importer.  Device is very interesting looking!  Odd that I had never heard of it before your comment.

Flexicam weight is 2.5 pounds = excellent; body cost is $2895 retail; has slider back available for additional $1350 retail = seems high.  Bayonet Interface adapter for LF lenses with Copa 0 shutters cost $195 retail each.

According to the web site, the Flexicam is specifically designed for digital work, thus the comments made by MarkKay would hopefully be addressed.

Still trying to get more info on the Arca Swiss Rm3d device.  From images I found of it, looks like it is substantially less precise and less sophisticated than the Flexicam. 

Jack
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135411\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi
I'm also having a look at the flexicam and plan to switch from my flewxbody to the flexicam by the end of the year.
I really hope it is as well build as my Flexbody. The front element looks a bit weak IMHO.Tolerances with WA lenses are really small and this isn't a pancake-type of camera like Cambo, Horseman, ArcaR.

Price is a bit above 3000 Euro with the sliding back. The actuator to use V Hassy lenses is 800 Euro too, which seems very high for a tubus recocking the Zeiss lens shutter.
Silvestri say that you can't use lenses above 100 mm(too heavy?), which must be a bad joke, I have a 120 and 180mm V-Zeiss that just wait to meet the Flexicam.
If anybody had the chance to see this thing for real, I would love to hear some comments.

As for the Arca beeing less precise, don't know, for me it looks like a real contender for the best-build pancake camera. Really in the Alpa league i guess.

tom

[BJNY]

Award winning Rainer uses the brand Gottschalt?, made in Germany.  I'd be curious to know what is upcoming from them.  Would someone whose language is German contact them, please?

[Gary Ferguson]

Hi
I'm also having a look at the flexicam and plan to switch from my flewxbody to the flexicam by the end of the year.
I really hope it is as well build as my Flexbody. The front element looks a bit weak IMHO.Tolerances with WA lenses are really small and this isn't a pancake-type of camera like Cambo, Horseman, ArcaR.

Price is a bit above 3000 Euro with the sliding back. The actuator to use V Hassy lenses is 800 Euro too, which seems very high for a tubus recocking the Zeiss lens shutter.
Silvestri say that you can't use lenses above 100 mm(too heavy?), which must be a bad joke, I have a 120 and 180mm V-Zeiss that just wait to meet the Flexicam.
If anybody had the chance to see this thing for real, I would love to hear some comments.

As for the Arca beeing less precise, don't know, for me it looks like a real contender for the best-build pancake camera. Really in the Alpa league i guess.

tom
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135414\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I use a 180mm regularly on a Flexbody without problems, I've even used a 350mm Superachromat plus the x1.4 multiplier, although with this set up there were tripods on the lens and on the body.

[tom_l]

I use a 180mm regularly on a Flexbody without problems, I've even used a 350mm Superachromat plus the x1.4 multiplier, although with this set up there were tripods on the lens and on the body.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135576\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

You're right, no problem using all Hassy Lenses on the Hasselblad Flexbody.

Problems seem to appear with the Silvestri Flexicam that only takes lenses up to 105mm.
At the beginning I thought, the would mean LF-Digitars only, as they don't have focus mounts, and that it would of course be impossible to focus with telelenses on a small bellow camera. But they mean every kind of Telelenses above 105mm. I will definetly check this before buying the Flexicam. Well, let's get back on topic.


tom-

[Lust4Life]

But there's only a handful of LF cameras that actually deliver that precision, in fact I don't know one LF digital photographer who is satisfied with digital if they're using a camera originally designed for 4x5 film. An ultra rigid chassis, outstanding focusing screen/viewfinder arrangements, and fully geared controls manufactured to the highest engineering standards are absolute requirements for successful digital photography with a technical camera.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135337\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Gary,
I too have the Flexbody and I use it primarily with the Hassie 40mm CFE IF lens.  Frankly, the Flexbody does not meet what I'm looking for.  First, I having a bear of a time with focus and second getting consistant results of sharp image from foreground to background is quite elusive.

You mentioned there are a handfull of camera that make the grade - what in your opinion are those?

I'm down to the Silvestri Flexicam, possibly the Arca Rmd3 if I can ever talk with someone who has actually used one.  To my understanding the Cambo SW and the Alpha SWA do not offer tilt, which is what I'm really after so I can get my infinite focus on landscapes.  

Jack

[clawery]

Jack,

I was going to mention the Cambo Wide DS, but it looks as though you already have it on your list.
I would also look at the Horseman SW-D II Pro.  Here is a link to show you what it is:

http://www.horsemanusa.com/digital/SWD2pro.html

Chris Lawery
Sales Manager
Capture Integration
www.captureintegration.com

[Lust4Life]

Jack,

I was going to mention the Cambo Wide DS, but it looks as though you already have it on your list.
I would also look at the Horseman SW-D II Pro.  Here is a link to show you what it is:

http://www.horsemanusa.com/digital/SWD2pro.html

Chris Lawery
Sales Manager
Capture Integration
www.captureintegration.com
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135763\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi Chris,

Nice unit but it looks like it too is missing tilt features.  Correct?

I'm after the tilt effect I could get when I had the Ebony 45SU, without all of the weight and mass of the 45SU.  The old Sch. principal with tilt gave me the crisp focus from near to far in the image.

Best,
Jack

[clawery]

Hi Chris,

Nice unit but it looks like it too is missing tilt features.  Correct?

I'm after the tilt effect I could get when I had the Ebony 45SU, without all of the weight and mass of the 45SU.  The old Sch. principal with tilt gave me the crisp focus from near to far in the image.

Best,
Jack
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135769\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Jack,

You are correct.  The Horseman does not have the tilt feature, it can only rise and fall.

Thank you,
Chris Lawery
Sales Manager
Capture Integration
www.captureintegration.com

[Lust4Life]

As of this moment, it looks like only the Arca Misura and the Arca Rm3d are candidates that offer a decent range of movements and tilt yet are light enough to be backpacked.  And frankly, I've not found enough info on the Rm3d to be sure about it meeting my needs.

Seeking other cameras that meet this criteria which I've missed - guidance is appreciated.

Jack

[Caracalla]

As of this moment, it looks like only the Arca Misura and the Arca Rm3d are candidates that offer a decent range of movements and tilt yet are light enough to be backpacked.  And frankly, I've not found enough info on the Rm3d to be sure about it meeting my needs.

Seeking other cameras that meet this criteria which I've missed - guidance is appreciated.

Jack
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=135826\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Call ArcaSwiss directly regarding Arca Rm3d, I wouldn't rely on press anyways.