Topic: My first impressions on the P30 (Read 5862 times)

Don Libby · « **on:** June 19, 2007, 02:56:13 pm »

Hi all - first, the following are my impressions, no one is paying me for them and I doubt very seriously anyone would. The only stake I have is in my own equipment and what that equipment can provide and produce for me. I'm not a lawyer - never was, never wanted to be, I am a retired federal agent turned full time photographer. All this being said this is my first impressions of the Mamiya 645 AFD II along with my loaner Phase One P30.

Up till early this year I had been shooting fulltime with a Canon 1Ds Mk II (still have it) doing landscape and nature photography. I brought the Mamiya in March of this year and shortly afterwards got a Kodak Pro 645 to go along with it. I won't go into any great depth as to my choice of the Mamiya other than it "fits". The Kodak Pro served me well as a "starter back" until I was sure that MF was the way I wanted to go. I found out very shortly on that MF was exactly the way I wanted to proceed and with the (unknowing) help of a very good friend of mine I found that Phase One was a perfect fit as well. I researched and researched for many weeks and decided on the P30 Plus. I had originally wanted a P30 thinking that would serve me just find, however I found out that I couldn't find a new one. I had decided early on that if I was going to make this commitment then I was going to be in it for the long haul and wanted a new back. With the generous assistance of Chris Lawery of Capture Integration (Chris - I hope the wedding went well, again, congratulations!) I ordered a P30 Plus. My loaner back arrived the week of May 21st however due to a conflict in work schedules I wasn't able to actually take the kit out till just this past week. The loaner came too late for me to use it for a commercial shot I was doing and I had to complete that job prior to being able to go out. I decided to go to the Island In The Sky District of Canyonlands National Park in Moab UT a short 9 hour drive from my home in Tucson AZ.

We spent 4 days in the Moab area shooting sunrise and sunsets. The first two days were cloudy while the rest were just ho-hum. No breathtaking, take your breath way colors till the drive home near Tucson and then due to the road conditions we weren't able to stop. Sometime you're the bug and sometimes you're the windshield.....

I shot with the 35mm as well as the 80 mm lens. I found that I was using the 35 much more than the 80. While using my Mk II I use a combination of the 24-70 and a 300 to shoot landscape and panoramas. I tried both the 35 and the 80 shooting multiple images and was very pleased with the results. I shot a two image hand held pano to see just how good Photoshop CS3 was. CS3 is great!

I had also just taken delivery of a Mamiya 300 f/2.8 that I wanted to try out. I found out very shortly on that the lens is very sharp, I also found that I needed to slow myself way down and pay better attention to what I was doing to ensure that the images would come out clear. I'd open the lens up, focus then stop down then using Av, take the shot.

My first and lasting impression is that the P30 will make even a not so nice day look great. The colors are rich and full body (sounds like a wine). My next thought and impression is that give me a location where everything is working, I'll knock your socks off!

Did I make the right decision going medium format? Darn Right!
Did I make the right choice in the Mamiya? For me dang yes!
Did I make the right choice in the P30 and soon the P30+? Oh hell yes!!!!

I've got a couple days left before I'll have any images ready for presentation but when I do I'll see about sharing them.

This is not meant to start a debate on what camera system is better - don't want to go down that road. If this turns into anything other than a gentle discussion I'll ask Michael to immediately delete the thread.

I've said this before but I feel it's worth saying again. Do your own research. Don't taken what you read as the holy grail. Don't make your mind up till you have actually looked at, touched, hands on experience with what you are thinking about.

I'll update this as soon as I get the Plus if anyone is interested......

Thanks to all

don

stevecoleccs · « **Reply #1 on:** June 19, 2007, 05:14:37 pm »

Congrad's Don - I was in your shoes the same time you were making a decision on MF -
I went from 1DS mkll to Contax/P30+ - waiting on the + now - The MF workflow
has caught me by surprise - much easier than the 35mm workflow. better colors,, smoother
gradations, etc...
Have not spent anytime retouching 'morie & anti-alias colors in the highlights etc...

I am using the 50mm lens most of the time - I perfer to crop in post, very easy in C1 Pro.

Don Libby · « **Reply #2 on:** June 19, 2007, 06:22:33 pm »

Thank you Steve. I've found it almost too simple in moving from the Mk II to the Mamiya. I was told that if you're used to Canon then the move to Mamiya will be very easy - which in fact it has been.

I am very surprised in my choice of lens so far. While I have wide angle for the Mk II I found myself using the longer lens to do my landscape and panos. So far I used the 35 and 80 (just been looking at the images) and am blown away by the difference between MF and 35. Why didn't I make the switch sooner?

I've been attempting to work with C1 but so far for me at least I perfer CS3 for my workflow. I too have noticed a decrease in the amount of work I do to get the finished image.

I don't believ I'll be parting with the Mk II anytime soon as I plan to doing an aerial of of the Moab area then off to Alaska for brown bear.
don

pss · « **Reply #3 on:** June 19, 2007, 08:32:56 pm »

Quote

Hi all - first, the following are my impressions, no one is paying me for them and I doubt very seriously anyone would. The only stake I have is in my own equipment and what that equipment can provide and produce for me. I'm not a lawyer - never was, never wanted to be, I am a retired federal agent turned full time photographer. All this being said this is my first impressions of the Mamiya 645 AFD II along with my loaner Phase One P30.

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=0\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

funny that we now have to put up a disclaimer.....for what are obviously reports of our personal experiences......

and close with the similar disclaimer...DO NOT BUY YOUR STUFF WITHOUT TESTING IT...

glad you like your P30/mamiya combo...it rocks.....but the best lenses come with the RZ...

Don Libby · « **Reply #4 on:** June 19, 2007, 08:39:10 pm »

Quote

funny that we now have to put up a disclaimer.....for what are obviously reports of our personal experiences......

and close with the similar disclaimer...DO NOT BUY YOUR STUFF WITHOUT TESTING IT...

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123848\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I agree with you regarding the disclaimer however I've found that sometimes you just can't teach common sense

don

Dustbak · « **Reply #5 on:** June 20, 2007, 01:50:24 am »

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I agree with you regarding the disclaimer however I've found that sometimes you just can't teach common sense

don
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123849\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I agree, you cannot. In that case the disclaimer probably won't work either

Congratulations with your move to MF and the P30+. I believe I have just upgraded my Aptus17 to an Aptus65.

It is a pity we don't have an image gallery for all images made with these backs. Would be nice to see the results of everyones work.

hubell · « **Reply #6 on:** June 20, 2007, 12:06:47 pm »

Quote

I've said this before but I feel it's worth saying again. Do your own research. Don't taken what you read as the holy grail. Don't make your mind up till you have actually looked at, touched, hands on experience with what you are thinking about.
Thanks to all
don
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123794\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Agreed. What MFDBs did you test before you bought the P30 and what was it in your testing that lead you to settle on the P30?

Caracalla · « **Reply #7 on:** June 20, 2007, 12:22:58 pm »

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Would be nice to see the results of everyones work.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123879\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[span style=\'font-size:14pt;line-height:100%\']!!! I TOTALLY AGREE !!![/span]

Regards

G_Allen · « **Reply #8 on:** June 20, 2007, 01:13:22 pm »

Agreed! It's very difficult to find images made with the different makes and models of digibacks. I shoot celebrities and fashion, and most of the images I've found are landscapes.

Gregory Allen
www.plasticimage.com

Don Libby · « **Reply #9 on:** June 20, 2007, 03:41:44 pm »

deleted double posting

Don Libby · « **Reply #10 on:** June 20, 2007, 03:44:56 pm »

hcubell, My first MFDB was a used Kodak Pro 645M that I picked up from a friend who had just upgraded to a P30. I knew I wanted to move into MF and wanted to experience digital a little before making the big jump with both feet. The Kodak and my Canon 1Ds II was very close in megapixels so that certainly help me. I didn't have the Kodak for very long before I knew that medium format was the way I wanted to go for my landscape images.

I looked at Leaf and Phase One and decided on Phase. One of the deciding factor was the rear LCD's, I just liked Phase much better, in particular I didn't think a touch screen would fit my shooting style. The next problem/concern was the ruggedness of the back as I wanted to concentrate my landscape and panoramas solely on medium format. In looking at the specifications of all the Phase One backs I immediately noticed that the P30 is the only back that is advertised as "..well suited for harsh environments." While I would have liked a "full sensor" the fact that I shoot in dusty, dirty, rainy, snowy, well you get the idea - "harsh environments" that's what sold me on the P30+. Add to that the huge price difference, well I was sold. I had the chance to shoot what I was told a "hybrid" P45 on a Hasselblad prior to ordering. I had already had my Mamiya and several lens but wasn't in it to the point that I couldn't or wouldn't change systems if I felt it was better, I choose to remain with my Mamiya 645 AFD II. Since ordering the P30+ I have received the loaner which appears to be a hybrid as well, I say this as it allows for live preview.

I don't have a studio per say. My studio is the Grand Canyon, Arches National Park, Montana - well you get the idea. I needed a system that will enable me to get where I want to go and take the image I want with little fuss. The only time I used the live preview was to see what it was all about - once.

There's been some discussion of wide angle and tilt shift lens. So far I've used the 35mm lens with absolutely no problems. I also just took delivery of a Hartblei 45mm f3.5 Super-Rotator. I've had the chance to use this lens very little but so far I have no problems to report. If you read the specifications closely of Phase One's site, their caveat on wide and T/S lens for the P30+ is for technical & large format cameras, no mention of medium format.

I'm going to attempt to include an image - wish me luck

don

pss · « **Reply #11 on:** June 20, 2007, 03:55:43 pm »

Quote

There's been some discussion of wide angle and tilt shift lens. So far I've used the 35mm lens with absolutely no problems. I also just took delivery of a Hartblei 45mm f3.5 Super-Rotator. I've had the chance to use this lens very little but so far I have no problems to report. If you read the specifications closely of Phase One's site, their caveat on wide and T/S lens for the P30+ is for technical & large format cameras, no mention of medium format.

I'm going to attempt to include an image - wish me luck

don
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=0\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

let me know how the super rotator works out for you....i just got the lens baby 3G for the mamiya and so far no color shifts at all! the specifications on the phase site go for all formats....T/S means that the light hits the sensor at angles....this can create problems with the micro lenses....some backs show this more, some less....that is why i haven't gotten the rotator yet....but the lensbaby is a lot of fun....of course optically very good, but the effect works....i wonder how the hartblei is when using movements (contrast, detail,....)

Don Libby · « **Reply #12 on:** June 20, 2007, 04:22:03 pm »

Quote

Agreed! It's very difficult to find images made with the different makes and models of digibacks. I shoot celebrities and fashion, and most of the images I've found are landscapes.

Gregory Allen
www.plasticimage.com
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123960\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

George, I'm sorry I can't help you out here as I just don't like nor want to shoot people - much perfer trees, mountains, and bears. I do agree that we might want a section for images - that being said, I just found out how easy it was to add 2 images to my other post - so maybe what we need is more folks willing to share that way.....

Just a thought

don

hubell · « **Reply #13 on:** June 20, 2007, 05:24:55 pm »

Quote

I looked at Leaf and Phase One and decided on Phase. One of the deciding factor was the rear LCD's, I just liked Phase much better, in particular I didn't think a touch screen would fit my shooting style. The next problem/concern was the ruggedness of the back as I wanted to concentrate my landscape and panoramas solely on medium format. In looking at the specifications of all the Phase One backs I immediately noticed that the P30 is the only back that is advertised as "..well suited for harsh environments." While I would have liked a "full sensor" the fact that I shoot in dusty, dirty, rainy, snowy, well you get the idea - "harsh environments" that's what sold me on the P30+. Add to that the huge price difference, well I was sold. I had the chance to shoot what I was told a "hybrid" P45 on a Hasselblad prior to ordering. I had already had my Mamiya and several lens but wasn't in it to the point that I couldn't or wouldn't change systems if I felt it was better, I choose to remain with my Mamiya 645 AFD II. Since ordering the P30+ I have received the loaner which appears to be a hybrid as well, I say this as it allows for live preview.

don
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=123993\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Did you have a chance to test the Leaf and compare it to the Phase P30? Also, when you use a Mamiya AFDII with a P30 and the crop factor of the sensor, do you not wind up using a significantly smaller part of your viewfinder image for framing and focusing compared to a "full frame" sensor? (I would think that becomes even more of an issue with a viewfinder like the Hy6's designed for 6x6 film.)

pss · « **Reply #14 on:** June 20, 2007, 05:37:02 pm »

Quote

Did you have a chance to test the Leaf and compare it to the Phase P30? Also, when you use a Mamiya AFDII with a P30 and the crop factor of the sensor, do you not wind up using a significantly smaller part of your viewfinder image for framing and focusing compared to a "full frame" sensor? (I would think that becomes even more of an issue with a viewfinder like the Hy6's designed for 6x6 film.)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=0\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

sorry to chime in here...when i got my P30 the smaller finder image was a major concern for me...i was coming from a P20 and the step "down" (in finder image size) to the P20 from my first back (valeo 17) was annoying....i compared the P25 and the P30 side by side (on H1s) and after switching back and forth a couple of times i had to check which back i was holding....on paper it seems the 1.1 to 1.3 is pretty substantial, but in the finder you forget about it....
of course the larger imager comes in handy to get wider shots (even with interiours it can give an extra foot or so, which makes a difference...) but the image does not feel smaller.....i hope i am making sense....

Don Libby · « **Reply #15 on:** June 20, 2007, 05:44:34 pm »

Thanks PSS I couldn't have said it better. The thing I don't like is the cheap go around that Phase provides for the focusing screen. Kodak has a crop and they provide an actual real life focusing screen to replace the one that Mamiya has - I was actually a little shocked to see that I got a plastic overlay instead of an actual replacement.

don

Author Topic: My first impressions on the P30 (Read 5862 times)