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Author Topic: Advantages of film over digital for magazine print  (Read 20595 times)

digitaldog

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Advantages of film over digital for magazine print
« Reply #40 on: June 07, 2007, 11:16:38 am »

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Could you kindly explain why it is dangerous Andrew.  Thanks.

Henry
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Its dangerous if the user isn't color management aware or savvy.

Do this, Assign various profiles other than sRGB to images and view them in say a web browser (other than Safari which is ICC aware).

In the old days, Photoshop 4 and earlier, the color space assumption for all files for conversions was the users display. This is how images are assumed to be outside ICC aware applications. The farther you are from sRGB or ColorMatch, two spaces that are pretty close to the behavior of a display (of which both spaces are based), the farther they will appear as desired. And this assumption, right or wrong is used for all conversions from color space to color space.
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Henry Goh

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Advantages of film over digital for magazine print
« Reply #41 on: June 07, 2007, 11:22:36 am »

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Its dangerous if the user isn't color management aware or savvy.

Do this, Assign various profiles other than sRGB to images and view them in say a web browser (other than Safari which is ICC aware).

In the old days, Photoshop 4 and earlier, the color space assumption for all files for conversions was the users display. This is how images are assumed to be outside ICC aware applications. The farther you are from sRGB or ColorMatch, two spaces that are pretty close to the behavior of a display (of which both spaces are based), the farther they will appear as desired. And this assumption, right or wrong is used for all conversions from color space to color space.
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I understand Andrew but I did say if the client knows how to convert.  Of course if the client is a layman who is going to hand the files over to his designer, I would rather give him a Colormatch tagged file or a sRGB file if he is going to the web.  Back to my original thought, would that TIFF file tagged with my camera profile be a good bet for someone who is color-managed and knows how to convert files?  Thanks again.

Henry
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digitaldog

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Advantages of film over digital for magazine print
« Reply #42 on: June 07, 2007, 11:27:23 am »

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I understand Andrew but I did say if the client knows how to convert.  Of course if the client is a layman who is going to hand the files over to his designer, I would rather give him a Colormatch tagged file or a sRGB file if he is going to the web.  Back to my original thought, would that TIFF file tagged with my camera profile be a good bet for someone who is color-managed and knows how to convert files?  Thanks again.

Henry
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The main problem with input profiles and of course output profiles compared to working spaces is they are not well behaved such that a neutral can be defined as R=G=B. Also, the tone response curve may be less than desirable (ideally, when editing, 2.2 is pretty close to perceptually uniform).

Now if someone on the receiving end is both color management savvy and image editing savvy, by all means, supply the document with the input color space. Also useful for film scans (you know the person doing the scan actually did characterize their scanner). If you're working with a raw converter that uses custom or non working space profiles for encoding, sure, use them.
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Henry Goh

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Advantages of film over digital for magazine print
« Reply #43 on: June 07, 2007, 11:29:17 am »

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The main problem with input profiles and of course output profiles compared to working spaces is they are not well behaved such that a neutral can be defined as R=G=B. Also, the tone response curve may be less than desirable (ideally, when editing, 2.2 is pretty close to perceptually uniform).

Now if someone on the receiving end is both color management savvy and image editing savvy, by all means, supply the document with the input color space. Also useful for film scans (you know the person doing the scan actually did characterize their scanner). If you're working with a raw converter that uses custom or non working space profiles for encoding, sure, use them.
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Thanks Andrew.  

Henry
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paulmoorestudio

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Advantages of film over digital for magazine print
« Reply #44 on: June 07, 2007, 11:46:56 am »

going back to whence we came..I am sure it was frustrating for the clients and the printers to get my velvia+astia chromes...they would never be able to match it..it was out of the cmyk gammat- maybe it would have been safer to shoot E100...but they kept comming back for more.

 The good printers didn't mind the bar set high, and did wonders with it.. why in the world would
anyone hand off a srgb file unless the end use was only for the web!  I didn't know I was living so dangerously..
btw, my estimates clearly states my workflow in adobe98 and cmyk proofing..nobody has had a problem with it yet..3+ years running.  
If you work toward the lowest common denoninator, the printers with the least knowledge about colour management, the safest route, then the work will look safe.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2007, 11:47:36 am by paulmoorestudio »
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