Mamiya zd and canon 5d

[marcwilson]

Hi everyone,

Looking through the site here there are varios sample images from the zd camera but I am looking for anyone that has compared it to the canon 5d or similar (35mm) dslr.

I have also found some studio based test comparisons, however...

...what I am trying to gauge is how much extra quality the zd would give me over the 5d for uses such as landscape and slow stock work..i.e where speed of camera, autofocus, high iso etc are not important to me.
Shots would be almost 100% at lowest iso, 50/50 handheld / tripod, manual focus prime lenses, etc.

It is unfortunately not posible to rent a zd and I know some stores do a try out for a week but you still need to be leaving the full price deposit..which is not possible for me at the moment.

Thanks for any help,

Marc

[stefan marquardt]

hi, i use the 5d and the zd reguarly together on architecture/interior jobs. I usualy use the 5d with the 12-24 sigma for wide interiors and the zd with the 50shift and the 35mm for all ahots that don´t need a very wide lens  - always with iso50 and tripod. the main advantage for the zd is the extended dynamic range. holds highlights much better. with the 5d i always have problems with architecture exteriors where the sky gets overexposed. this must be a big relief with landscapes too.
the  only reason why i still use the 5d is the lack of wideangel lenses (like  the 12-24) without distortion for the zd. for landscape and stock the 35mm lens for the zd is fine. the distortion is very easy to correct.
to sum up my experience with boths cameras:

-the zd has better dynamic range, filmlike files (with raw developer), better resolution (you dont need to worry when AD/clients crop your files and blow them up).

-the 5d allows real wide angel lenses and allows very long exposures (like for nighttime architecture shoots).

landscape and slow stock seem to me the prime areas where the zd shines (especially over the 5d)

stefan

[marcwilson]

thanks for the reply stefan.

whilst of course the 5d is more than satisfactory for stock work I also do lot of personal artwork leading to print sales and they both often come out of the same shoot. location, etc....some art work is shot specifically with a 54 but that can only go with me on specific project shoots.

Personally I do not feel comfortable printing files fom the 5d at anything larger than 16x12 inches...whilst many out there are happy to print larger I don't.

if the zd would give me the quality to easily print up to 24x20 inches that would make a big difference to me...otherwise it often means having both a 5d and camera such as mamiya 7 kit together which can get cumbersome etc...the zd of course also gives the option of a lens with movements (shift/tilt/swing) that the mamiya 7 does not.

have you by any chance ever shot landscape or generally not close up studio shots with both for direct comparison for yourself?

Marc

[nik]

For what you're looking to do, even at 20*24, the ZD is what you need to use. DR and colour is simply better. I did quite a lot of testing / comparison with a couple canon's, the ZD just gave me a better file for my purpose. You can see the difference when you go to litho and at sizes larger than 11*14. I never went wider than the 45mm though.

Nik.

http://www.stoqq.com

[mcfoto]

Hi
I own both & use the ZD 80% of the time. The 5D is great for higher iso & when you have to shoot fast ie editorial shoot.
Denis

[stefan marquardt]

have you by any chance ever shot landscape or generally not close up studio shots with both for direct comparison for yourself?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

hi marc,

I have compared the cameras before i bought the zd. as soon as i had the zd, it was clear to me that the files are much better. so i never bothered to compare them directly.


<<<.the zd of course also gives the option of a lens with movements (shift/tilt/swing)>>>>>

marc, which tilt/shift lens are you thinking of?
as far as I know, there is only the mamiya 50shift (with no tilt) and the superrotator (tilt+shift) which, I think, is not realy that good distortionwise and with edgesharpness.
I have been searching for a long time and have just bought a Zörk multifocus thing (http://www.zoerk.de/nv02-mfs.html) , that uses enlarger lenses (only 100mm and up) which you can tilt a lot in all directions.  since I like using tilt with land/cityscapes (like: [a href=\"http://stefanmarquardt.de/show/show.html)]http://stefanmarquardt.de/show/show.html)[/url] in combination with longer lenses - thats ok for me.  

stefan

[stefan marquardt]

Hi
I own both & use the ZD 80% of the time. The 5D is great for higher iso & when you have to shoot fast ie editorial shoot.
Denis
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=119913\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

hi denis, have just been looking though your website. Why on earth is mamiya using those awfull sample-pictures on their website (and brochures) -  if you have produced so many absolutely beautiful and stunning images for promoting the ZD? I bet mamiya would sell a whole lot more ZDs had they used your images on their site.

lovely work!  
stefan

[BernardLanguillier]

I use both a ZD and a Nikon D2x for landscape.

The main value of the ZD is IMHO:

1. Much better DR and smoother transititions to blown highlghts,
2. More pixels and sharper pixels (not by much though, but the D2x has very sharp pixels),

The advantages of the D2x are:

1. Much better battery life in cold weather (about 10 times better) - the ZD is VERY bad at that,
2. More DoF (everything else being equal),
3. Much faster interface (image display after shooting),
4. Better histogram,
5. Much more robust build,
6. More unfiform image quality with wide angle lenses (center to corner).
 
Regards,
Bernard

[marcwilson]

So whilst it certainly seems that the common concensus is that for the type of shooting I am talking about the zd will allow me to print larger than the 5d (i.e. possibly upto 24x20 inches) my next task would be to try to find comparisons between a print of that size from the zd to one from 67 film which I am used to(i.e. mamiya 7 or even rollfilm back)....this will then allow me to see the zd as being able to replace the 5d + 67 film combo...which is my goal.

as for the tilt swing option on the zd it would be the hartblei I'm looking at..it would be used for creating narrow fields of selective focus for very particular projects so slight lack of edge sharpness would not be too detrimental.

marc

[BernardLanguillier]

So whilst it certainly seems that the common concensus is that for the type of shooting I am talking about the zd will allow me to print larger than the 5d (i.e. possibly upto 24x20 inches) my next task would be to try to find comparisons between a print of that size from the zd to one from 67 film which I am used to(i.e. mamiya 7 or even rollfilm back)....this will then allow me to see the zd as being able to replace the 5d + 67 film combo...which is my goal.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=119951\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Marc,

I haven't done any rigorous test, but my guts feeling is that the ZD is in the same ballpark as 6x7 in terms of resolution when it is accurately focussed (which is obviously more difficult to achieve with the ZD). I actually only use 6x9 roll film on my 4x5, but even then it is pretty close after Imacon scanning.

When you will see difference compared to slide film is in DR. The ZD is much more forgiving here.

Regards,
Bernard

[marcwilson]

Bernard,
So from someone who has, and still I assume shoots on 69 film at times, are you content with the quality of 24x20 type size inch prints from the zd?

[BernardLanguillier]

Bernard,
So from someone who has, and still I assume shoots on 69 film at times, are you content with the quality of 24x20 type size inch prints from the zd?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=119954\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Marc,

I typically only print up to 17x22 inch, but I am completelly happy about the quality I see at that print size.

Now, I obviously have no way of knowing whether you are more demanding than I am.

Cheers,
Bernard

[marcwilson]

Thanks Bernard,

Yes it is such a subjective thing.

Cheers for your input.

Marc

[jimgolden]

marc can you post the link to studio comparison tests?

I'm roughly in the same boat, need larger files for more discerning clients...

can anyone reccomend a reputable ZD dealer in EU or Asia?

has anyone dealt w/ any of the fleabay dealers?

thx
jim

[jimgolden]

double post

[marcwilson]

Hi Jim,

http://www.studiosamikulju.fi/playground/index.html

This is the link to the test I found.
In the uk I would recommend robert white..very helpfull and often with good deals on the zd..you can even try before you buy...for a full deposit!

Personally athough  I really like the idea of just the one camera for my two needs I do feel perhaps the zd is not quite there for my needs in terms of what I can produce from it...I always want to be able to print up to 24x20 inches and have images viewed from very close and also like to often print 40x30...that i know from experience I can do with 67 film so may have to stick to the 5d plus 67 film options for now and although I know I could use the zd and probably convince myself I am as happy with my prints as ever...I'd only be fooling myself!!

Good luck with your search.

Marc

[jimgolden]

I'll take a look @ that link,thx.

I've been renting a H2 w/ 22MP backs (CFH, Aptus 22) and the image quality is amazing.
I can rez WAY up with VERY little image quality loss if any. i would thingk 30x40 wouldn't
be an issue w/ either of these backs, but I never go that big.

I'm wondeirng how the ZD stacks agains these backs. I like the idea of the ZD, more towards
SLR handling than MF. the H2 is not very friendly in the handling dept, IMHO. vertical is a nightmare.
however, the viewfinder is huge and bright, but tends to barrel distort a bit.

jim

[nik]

can anyone reccomend a reputable ZD dealer in EU or Asia?

[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Try Teamwork in London, [a href=\"http://www.teamworkphoto.com/]http://www.teamworkphoto.com/[/url]  , good guys.

-Nik


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http://www.stoqq.com

[Quentin]

Teamwork are good, I have used them in the past, but last time I checked, they were more expensive than Robert White for the ZD.   Robert White seem to have the best UK ZD prices and they reacted with commendable speed and without complaint when mine had to be replaced due to firewire port failure.

So far as print size is concerned, I'd say the ZD more or less matches drum scanned 67 transparency film for subjective detail, based on personal experience.  I say more or less because there are always differences between film and digital.  The ZD's great strength is its excellent dynamic range, as other have commented already.

Quentin

[marcwilson]

...So far as print size is concerned, I'd say the ZD more or less matches drum scanned 67 transparency film for subjective detail, based on personal experience.  I say more or less because there are always differences between film and digital.  The ZD's great strength is its excellent dynamic range, as other have commented already.

Quentin
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=120195\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

What kind of print size are you talking about here Quentin?

Marc