MFDB Back Comparison Shoot

[SecondFocus]

This is a comparison test of three backs...

http://www.deathtofilm.com/2007/04/19/medi...t-out/#more-129

[BJNY]

Edit

[Don Libby]

I like the article - the images look like they're off the pages of American's Most Wanted......

[nicolaasdb]

the images might looks a little mug shot like.....but the show exactly why I went with Leaf!!

Look at the skin tones!! It looks like shot with actual film... not digital!!!

I tested the phase back before the leaf. I almost went for the phase....because a little post-production...the image looked great! I just don't want to use any other software.

Leaf let me keep my workflow and it was just a little easier to work with.....like the writeup says: If I would have been a product photographer I would have gone with Phase...sharp, crisp and accurate colors....

BUT I am a people photographer and need great skin tones and don't like to change my workflow.

[jimgolden]

interesting that the IM guys prefer a Bridge/ACR workflow b/c it can be used across all
platforms...this seems huge to me, not having to have 2 or 3 software packages to work w/ different cameras...

[vgogolak]

Do I understand correctly? They were processed in CS3?

Makes no sense. Redo do the Phase with C1 etc. and the comparison might make some sense. From what I see using the right SW for all of them makes more sense, but to process with third party SW  - well if you make decisions on that basis you could take a ferrari and test it with 83 octane fuel, and might not be impressed.


Victor

[Mark_Tucker]

interesting that the IM guys prefer a Bridge/ACR workflow b/c it can be used across all
platforms...this seems huge to me, not having to have 2 or 3 software packages to work w/ different cameras...
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

It might make a person wonder if they were doing it to make the digital tech's life easier, as opposed to getting every ounce out of each digital file, no matter what camera it was shot with. The day that I start doing things to make the digital tech's life easier is the day that I stop using a digital tech.

The whole test is just so screwy that it doesn't make sense. I have spoken with Michael about other matters, and he knows his stuff. That this "Shoot Out" would be set up with these parameters is just so wacky that it makes you wonder if there's not something else that's not being said. I cannot imagine.

Ironic, too, that I find that same "red in the eyes and lips" with my P45, that he did, but I find it in CaptureOne. I used the Color Editor, after a suggestion from a friend, to create a custom input profile that reduced that red/magenta in that way. Piece of cake in The Color Editor. You can save out that custom input profile, and set that to be the new default input profile in the Prefs, and then the issue is gone forever.

I would imagine too, that the Leaf guys are wondering why the final TIFF might not be processed in LC 10. Even with all its quirks and issues, at least the final file processing is known as pretty stellar.

I have limited experience with Hasselblad; cannot speak with experience there.

I wrote to Michael today, to try to get some clarification. It's just too strange to accept at face value.

This is one opinion only.

MT, [a href=\"http://www.marktucker.com]http://www.marktucker.com[/url]

[eronald]

I have red turning to magenta on the M8, wonder whether it's not something to do with the specs that Kodak hand out for their chips, and which the Raw guys then use to create the converters.

I've written to ask for the files and suggest they be put up via www.yousendit.com

So far no response. If someone has Michael's direct email ?

It might make a person wonder if they were doing it to make the digital tech's life easier, as opposed to getting every ounce out of each digital file, no matter what camera it was shot with. The day that I start doing things to make the digital tech's life easier is the day that I stop using a digital tech.

The whole test is just so screwy that it doesn't make sense. I have spoken with Michael about other matters, and he knows his stuff. That this "Shoot Out" would be set up with these parameters is just so wacky that it makes you wonder if there's not something else that's not being said. I cannot imagine.

Ironic, too, that I find that same "red in the eyes and lips" with my P45, that he did, but I find it in CaptureOne. I used the Color Editor, after a suggestion from a friend, to create a custom input profile that reduced that red/magenta in that way. Piece of cake in The Color Editor. You can save out that custom input profile, and set that to be the new default input profile in the Prefs, and then the issue is gone forever.

I would imagine too, that the Leaf guys are wondering why the final TIFF might not be processed in LC 10. Even with all its quirks and issues, at least the final file processing is known as pretty stellar.

I have limited experience with Hasselblad; cannot speak with experience there.

I wrote to Michael today, to try to get some clarification. It's just too strange to accept at face value.

This is one opinion only.

MT, http://www.marktucker.com
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=113719\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[Camdavidson]

This is a comparison test of three backs...

http://www.deathtofilm.com/2007/04/19/medi...t-out/#more-129
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=113631\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I've known Michael for many years and have great respect for his abilities as a shooter and teacher.

This test seems flawed to me.  Mark points out the use of C1 and the Color Editor.  When I looked at the results, it surprised me.  C1 is such an amazing program and the ability to control tones with the color editor and apply it to a group of images makes it incredibly useful.

I own a P30 back and am super happy with the skin tones and profiles.  If you take a P45 and use the "no profile Phase" profile that is semi-hidden in C1, you will have a dead neutral file.

Using CS3 to process a Phase file seems like agony to me.  Especially when you went to the effort to compare the backs.  Actually, it seemed more like a comparison of CS3's abilities to process different raw formats rather than creating the optimum file from each back.

If you re-did the test using C1, I believe you would come up with very different results.  Using CS3 seems to be easier for the tester - however - any tech worth his or her salt should know C1 inside and out.  It is an amazing product and worth investing the time and effort to learn and use it.

[Sisyphus]

I have tested all of the cameras in the test, and I have to say that if you don't use the associated software to process the "RAW" files than you invalidate any test.
I found little difference between these backs after they had been run through the capture software. All three had excellent color rendition with the only reel differences being in saturation. Leaf tends to under saturate slightly and Phase and Hasselblad tend to over saturate slightly. Neither of these factors amount to a hill of beans once you get used to and except the minor corrections that have to be made on all digital backs.
This is much the same as we had "In the Old Days" with film. There was no best film for everyone, Fuji tended towards the Magenta and Kodak films tended towards the warmer Yellow/Reds. the adjustments were made with filters, in post production, or on the press. The capture software is part of post production so cutting that out means you loose the chance to automate some simple corrective actions.

I don't know Michael and I intend no disrespect with this post.

Brian

[pss]

not sure what they did to the phase files, but i never get magenta lips/eyelids with my P30 either out of C1 or LR (camera raw 4.0).....i can make them look like that, but that is not the point....
i have tested all backs out there myself and used to own a leaf back....
i can only recommend for everybody to go and do their own tests.....all these backs can provide great results, but it seems that everybody is looking for something different....