HD Photo - new file format

[Raw shooter]

This looks like a better choice form everyone.  As a raw capture enthusiast, I just hate the resulting Jpg image quality that I use in PowerPoint and other apps.  The Tiff’s are beautiful for my printing needs, but rather large files for my many other uses.
The HD photo seems to be the best of both worlds – lossless compression with small file size and great image quality. (I thought Jpeg 2000 should have be widely adopted too)
The only problem I see is that this was created by Microsoft – which by default means that every MAC user will feel the need to hate it – baselessly - and decided in advance by their bias view of the computing world.  PC users are just as bias. (as is Nikon vs. Canon threads we see everyday on this site)  Everyone thinks they are being objective but their predictable opinions are forgone conclusions.
I would hope that all photographers could embrace ‘better mouse traps’ on their merit alone and help evolve our profession with only better principles shaping our science.

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/xps/wmphoto.mspx

[DiaAzul]

I just hate the resulting Jpg image quality that I use in PowerPoint and other apps. 

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There is no reason you should have such poor performance with JPEG in powerpoint unless the original image was saved as a highly compressed JPEG. As you are probably aware JPEG is a perceptually based compression alogrithm and does a lot of conversion to preserve detail where we are likely to notice it, part of this is being able to preserve luminance information at 12-bits whilst chromanance is at (i think) 6-bits, so unless you have a high bit range sensor you ain't going to loose out a lot of detail with on-screen slide shows.


Once Canon recognise the benefits of installing Windows Mobile Platform as the cameras operating system so that we can download applications onto the camera to control lighting and other remote objets around the studio then we may actually get HD Photo as well. But it will take some time for people to wake up to the benefits of adding networking and computing platform to the regular camera features. Rather than trying to write a new small scale OS from scratch Canon could implement symbian or windows mobile platform. We could then have live view from the Canon 1DIII to your mobile over 3G network, better sharing of exposure information, live preview, post shot review integration into the workflow.

There is still a long way to go with camera development, the 1DIII is crawling out of the last century but as an imaging platform the DSLR has a long way to go to catch up with its potential. Unfortunately, the current limitation is not technology but the rate at which current photographers can keep up with the rate of change.

[61Dynamic]

I pretty much wrote it off as another dead end like Jpeg2000 due to it's proprietary nature. However, with recent news of MS promising to release it to a standards body there might actually be a future for it.

The problems at this point are 1) Jpeg is well established and now freely available. 2) MS is not fully supporting it themselves. It'll be hard for it to be a Jpeg replacement if their own web browser doesn't even support it. Maybe that'll change in the near future. It'll have to, however the current lack of support will only slow adoption. Ideally support should have been in IE 7 from the start.

Mac users won't hate it baselessly, they will hate it because it's MS only at this point and in the near future. It won't be until it becomes an open standard that any Mac people will be able to use it outside a small handful of imaging applications. *nix users will be in the same boat.

P.S. MS promises compression will be better but they only talk about lossy stuff in what I've read so far. There is a very good chance lossless compression will show no more benefit in size savings than what Tiff already does. Just like Jpeg2000.

[DiaAzul]

The problems at this point are 1) Jpeg is well established and now freely available. 2) MS is not fully supporting it themselves. It'll be hard for it to be a Jpeg replacement if their own web browser doesn't even support it. Maybe that'll change in the near future. It'll have to, however the current lack of support will only slow adoption. Ideally support should have been in IE 7 from the start.

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Supported by XP and Vista (and, therefore windows explorer).

I thought you promoted yourself as computer guru?

[Raw shooter]

Supported by XP and Vista (and, therefore windows explorer).

I thought you promoted yourself as computer guru?
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Easy DiaAzul,  your post made zero sense.

[61Dynamic]

Supported by XP and Vista (and, therefore windows explorer).

I thought you promoted yourself as computer guru?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=106093\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think you misunderstood me. I said Internet Explorer is where support is lacking. Not Windows Explorer. :)

[DiaAzul]

Easy DiaAzul,  your post made zero sense.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=106098\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The rendering engines in both windows and internet explorer depend upon capabilities within the base OS. Microsoft have had support for Windows Media Photo (which is the old name for HD Photo) available as download for XP and Vista for some time. It is, therefore, available throughout the Windows operating system.

With the release of Vista and change of name to HD Photo Microsoft is putting a renewed marketing push on the file format to capture more of the market share for digital imaging and photography. As an example of that consider their putchase of iView Media Pro - which has proven very popular and their amalgamation of a number of software packages under a common brand. Support for HD Photo (WMP) is available in Vista, as a download for XP and also as a plug-in for Photoshop CS2/3. They also provide device porting kits and support for developing code for embded devices (read: cameras).

Ultimately, whether HD Photo is a success or not is missing the point. Microsoft is going after the Media (or in narrow terms:photography/imaging) market and will do everything they can to be successful. On another branch of their strategy they are pushing strongly into mobile platforms (as is Apple with the iPhone). Bring the two strands together and it is not long, nor unrealistic, that we should see a Canon, Nikon or Sony camera sporting an Apple or Microsoft OS.

The desktop and camera is dead, long live the mobile multi-media platform.

[NB How long will it be after multi-media Canon professional cameras arrive that photographers on the touch line are downloaded customised shutter-tones and spiking their mates camera with some embarassing sound. You don't think that it is coming? Look at what the new breed of photography students are doing with their mobile phones today and think where we will be in five years time.]

[jani]

Bring the two strands together and it is not long, nor unrealistic, that we should see a Canon, Nikon or Sony camera sporting an Apple or Microsoft OS.

I think I'll be weeping at that point in time, even if it's Symbian as you suggested in an earlier post.

Well, perhaps especially if it's Symbian. I can feel an upcoming disturbance in the force, like a thousand programmers crying out in pain.

And then we'll enjoy the benefits of camera malware, too. Oh joy.

No, I don't look forward to it, not the least bit.

But I'm nearly willing to bet that you're right; there will be a time when cameras from different manufacturers will be running the same OS, and that we'll know what those OSes are.

[61Dynamic]

DiaAzul, you sound like a Bill Gates Keynote except you are far more to the point and less boring. Whether or not you are holding your hands together and crouching like Mr. Burns is yet to be seen...

Bill Gates has been preaching convergence for many many years now. It has been slow to happen because 1) convergence is not good in some areas, 2) technology wasn't ready, and 3) MS isn't the UI experts that Apple is leaving allot to be desired in the experience.

I don't think there will be convergence for cameras. It's just not practical and the last thing I want is my camera giving me a blue-screen of death in the middle of a shoot or having to reboot the dang thing. Cameras must be reliable and the more complex they are the less reliable they will be.

[BernardLanguillier]

Does the new MS format support 16 bits images and 8 bits alpha channels?

Regards,
Bernard

[61Dynamic]

Does the new MS format support 16 bits images and 8 bits alpha channels?

Regards,
Bernard
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It does have 16bpc support and alpha-channels but the alpha channels are for transparency only.

[John.Murray]

...and the last thing I want is my camera giving me a blue-screen of death in the middle of a shoot or having to reboot the dang thing.  ...[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=106139\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Isn't Hasselblad forging ahead on that front already?

Seriously, I applaud MS efforts to open the format.  It *is* natively supported on Vista, meaning thumbnail and metadata viewing without the need for 3rd party browsers.  I really miss the Camera Raw XP Powertoy not having support for Canon 30D files.  It's not that i don't appreciate Canon, Photoshop or Lightroom's file browsers - I'm just more comfortable browsing in the O/S . . .

PS:  Speaking of native support - Adobe's Reader v.8 (aka Acrobat) *finally* has native support for thumbnail viewing in Windows Explorer - I hope this is a harbinger for things to come from them!