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Author Topic: Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000  (Read 11182 times)

Ronny Nilsen

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« on: October 22, 2006, 04:15:12 pm »

I have almost 10.000 mounted slides taken over the last 25 years that I would like to scan. I'm thinking about buying the Nikon LS-5000 with the Slide Feeder SF-210 to batch process 50 slides at the time.

Have any of you used this scanner and the sw? Is it usable for batch processing? Doing som post prosessing in Ligthromm etc. is OK, but the sw must be able to do an ok job i the first place with regard to exposure etc. to capture the dynamic range in the image. I do not want to have to check each image and have to rescan with manual settings....
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svein

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2006, 02:04:30 pm »

I've used the Ls-2000 and the Ls-5000 with the SF200 for batch scanning (very similar to the SF-210). The automatic results have improved a lot from Ls-2000 to Ls-5000 thanks to better dynamic range and other updates. I'd say that the LS-5000 produce pretty good results on automatic for most "normal" slides. But difficult slides is still an obstacle for automatic processing, and even fairly "easy" slides can often be improved with manual overrides.

Another potential problem is the type of mounts you use. E.g old cardboard mounts or other very thin frames wil occasionally get stuck in the feeder. The sf-210 is possibly improved in this area over my slidefeeder, but it's still not perfect.
I've also got the impression that glassless frames give better results. No newton rings and ICE will work correctly (I'm not sure that ICE can't work with glass, but some of mine didn't work well, haven't tried many).

One way to do the job is scanning everything on automatic. Images you're not happy with and want to use for something important/sell could be rescanned for best results. That's probably much faster than trying to decide in advance which slides need special treatment.
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Ronny Nilsen

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2006, 04:45:33 am »

Quote
One way to do the job is scanning everything on automatic. Images you're not happy with and want to use for something important/sell could be rescanned for best results. That's probably much faster than trying to decide in advance which slides need special treatment.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81811\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I guess this is the best way to do it. Just get everything ok into the computer and rescan the images that I feel are important or want do make larger prints from.

Thanks for sharing your experience! Most of my slides are mounted in glass frames, so feeding will probably be ok, and I was expecting to have to remove the mounting on the slides that need better quality.
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Ronny A. Nilsen
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svein

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2006, 01:50:23 pm »

Since buying the slide feeder I've mostly used 2mm glassless gepe frames. Slide feeder work very well with these, so if you have to change frames something similar to these are good options.
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ThomasH_normally

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2006, 06:09:39 pm »

Quote
I have almost 10.000 mounted slides taken over the last 25 years that I would like to scan. I'm thinking about buying the Nikon LS-5000 with the Slide Feeder SF-210 to batch process 50 slides at the time.

Have any of you used this scanner and the sw? Is it usable for batch processing? Doing som post prosessing in Ligthromm etc. is OK, but the sw must be able to do an ok job i the first place with regard to exposure etc. to capture the dynamic range in the image. I do not want to have to check each image and have to rescan with manual settings....
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=81641\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I have tens of thousands of slides by myself, and I scanned lots of them using the predecessor model LS4000, with both Roll Film Adapter and the Slide Feeder SF200.

It is a viable solution to get the job done, however, it is not a perfect setting.

SF200 and the almost identical SF210 will not take any slide trays, so you will be forced to unload the slides from trays, and to rotate every each of them if they are vertical ("portrait"). This is a tedious job. The slides will land in the exit tray of SF200/210 in an opposite order, thus you will have to load them in an opposite order to your trays. SF200 used to jam very often, we all used the "world famous credit card and paper clip trick," the SF210 promises to be better in this matter. The slides rub on each other during the feed, thus if you have these cardboard mounts, be prepared to battle a serious amount of nasty particles.

Of course, we can safely assume that nobody will be adding newer scanner models anylonger. Thus Nikon LS5000+SF210 might the best because the only game in town.
Actually Braun and Pacific Image made a scanner with a lesser resolution, what is a combination of a Braun slide projector and scanner. This scanner takes trays, what would liberate you from removing and loading back the slides in trays and rotating them!

Lightroom, the recent monstrosity of Adobe, is not your solution to processing scanned film raw files!!! They are called raw, they may have also a suffix *.NEF, but they are not "camera raw" files! They are rather RGB lossless files, which you cannot even process in Lightroom so far. It comes worse: NikonScan is a very naive program concerning Color Management or image processing ability. You mileage may vary, I made myself cozy in the following workflow:

1) scan using LS5000/LS4000 with Nikon Color Management *off*, make large max. color depth TIFF files, 14 resp. 16 bit per color channel, preferably with ICE dust removal and maybe even GEM grain analyser set to your film, and

2) use Vuescan to process them including an ICC profile for each film kind.

I am not a very big fan of Vuescan, neither of the a bit awkward and rough way of dealing with the customer support, but simply I have not found anything better to this workflow. Vuescan will allow you to make a batch conversion of any number of files, albeit only with the same setting of color adjustment for the entire batch.

If you will try to work one by one on each image using NikonScan, you will spend untold hours of time on rescans initiated by NikonScan at some surprizing points of time. By making "raw files" to the disk, you will be able to avoid this tedious rescanning, and make your corrections as long you might need it at the speed dictated by your computer.  The resulting image goes into Photoshop, Paint Shop Pro or Picture Window etc.

Film profiles: Working with Vuescan will allow you to use IT8 targets or target strips to make your own film profiles, or more accurately, to make scanner profiles. Scan the target with identical settings which you would be using later with regular images, and use Vuescan to generate ICC profile from this scan. This way you will generate a combined film+scanner profile for your setting, not to be confused with any profiles made from greycards or WhiBal cards. Observe that you can do the same process with negatives(!!), what simplified the processing greatly. Scan the negative image of an IT8 target using NikonScan to obtain a positive image of the target, and use Vuescan again to generate the ICC profile.


As of now, Lightroom does not even read in correctly NEF's from NikonScan, neither does it allow you to make any ICC profile for your film! However, we do not know what will be the final shape of this tool.

About SF200/SF210: There is no real limit of 50 images in these adapters, this is merely a space constraint. You can remove scanned slides from the output tray one by one, and keep adding some to the input tray while the scanner works. This will practically implement an "endless batch." The only problem is that the log window in the miserable written NikonScn runs out of space(!!!) for the logs. But the scan will go on.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2006, 06:15:15 pm by ThomasH_normally »
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Ronny Nilsen

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« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2006, 02:57:34 am »

Thanks ThomasH_normally!
Many good advices on the use here that will come in handy when the scanner arrives. I ordered the LS-5000 a month ago, but have not received it yet. Should arrive any day now....

Most of my slides are mounted in GePe-glass frames, so feeding will hopefully be ok with the 210.
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ThomasH_normally

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« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2006, 06:12:41 pm »

Quote
Thanks ThomasH_normally!
Many good advices on the use here that will come in handy when the scanner arrives. I ordered the LS-5000 a month ago, but have not received it yet. Should arrive any day now....

Most of my slides are mounted in GePe-glass frames, so feeding will hopefully be ok with the 210.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=87655\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Ouch, let me just point to the one pesky "not" forgottten in the sentence of my message:

"SF210 will take any slide trays,"

Should be "will NOT take any slide trays." Just wanted make sure that this will be clarified!

Sorry,
Thomas
« Last Edit: December 09, 2006, 06:13:22 pm by ThomasH_normally »
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Gregory

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Nikon Scanner Coolscan LS-5000
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2006, 09:52:05 am »

I have the Super Coolscan 4000ED and the SF-210. we are mounting negatives and scanning them this way because the Nikon software/scanner was unreliable in detecting the edges of the frames when using the film roll adapter (and because much of our film has been cut into 4- and 6-frame strips).

with the NikonScan 4.0.2 software on OS X 10.4.x, batch scanning of the SF-210 slides stops on the second slide. the software sends the eject command to the second slide but forgets to send the load command to the third slide and everything just stops! we're currently using VueScan which works without a hitch.

I'd prefer to use SilverFast which is a great scanning software but because it uses the Nikon libraries to talk to the Nikon scanners, it has the same eject/no-load bug with the SF-210. SilverFast just came out with a bigger update to their software and they advertise compatibility with the SF-210 so I'm going to test it (tomorrow). but again, since they use the Nikon libraries and since the local Nikon office hasn't told me about any updates to the Nikon software since I reported the bug, I'm not holding high hopes for the new SilverFast update.

if you're using OS X, ask if you can test the scanner and software before you buy.

I've been scanning on and off for a few years now. as someone else indicated, batch scanning is not ideal. most images have different requirements with min/max values and curves. we too have adopted the approach of scanning everything in "auto exposure" mode and only rescanning those that are 'nice' or important.

we will be importing the scans into Aperture for archiving.

regards,
Gregory
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ThomasH_normally

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« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2006, 01:25:14 am »

Quote
I have the Super Coolscan 4000ED and the SF-210. we are mounting negatives and scanning them this way because the Nikon software/scanner was unreliable in detecting the edges of the frames when using the film roll adapter (and because much of our film has been cut into 4- and 6-frame strips).
[...snip...]
regards,
Gregory
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=90041\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Right you are! Their NikonScan was notorious for problems, lack of reply or evasive generic replies by the customer service, and marking bug reports as "resolved" for some reason. They are not resolved, though.

And so we wait, and wait and wait for that fix release of the v4.02. The worse problem was their erratic film eject with SA30 on "cannot autofocus" condition. Imagine that you worked already for 20-30min on setting up all frame crops, exposure adjustment and than in the frame 30 message comes "cannot autofocus" and... the entire film get ejected. Thank you very much, start from the beginning.

In the beginning with NikonScan 3.0 I have send them in 12 pages with bugs and crash reports. This is the "downfall of the house of nikon" syndrom! I am currently using D200, and I am not a happy camper: miserable egrononics.
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Ronny Nilsen

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« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2006, 03:53:14 am »

It's almost 2 months since I ordered the scanner now, and I still have no idea when to expect it....

The shop where I'm buing it just says that since it's Nikon they have no idea when to expect it. When ordering other brands (Canon etc.) they can tell me when to expect deleviery and that will happen and be in my hand whiting a week or two even if the item is not in stock in Norway. And this is the shop in Norway that probably sells most Nikon abd Canon gear in the country. Small wonder Canon have almost the whole professional SLR markert in Norway.

I guess I will have to be prepared to buy VueScan to get thing working when the guy from Nikon carrying my scanner (probably someplace in Russia at this point) finally arrives.  

Thanks for your input! It will be very useful when the scannwer finally arrives!
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