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Author Topic: Not so enjoy  (Read 995 times)

Ivophoto

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #20 on: June 22, 2018, 12:56:15 AM »

And this image is supposed to be a showcase for ‘ street ‘ at LuLa?

For me, yes it is. Maybe not the best, but it is. It asks more from the viewer than only looking to a running person in a street or a couple of baskets on a pile.
And I’m reacting not any further on this style of reaction. I know very well what street photography is.
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Rayyan

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #21 on: June 22, 2018, 01:17:07 AM »


So ‘ street ‘ is what each one of us thinks it is.
Sort of wastes all the time I spent reading what is, should, might, could be ‘ street ‘ in LuLa threads.

And the names of photogs galore, mostly dead, which were thrown about as being associated with the masters of ‘ street ‘.

Please, it is not my intention to be rude or diss the image you or anyone posts; but unfortunately the image posted and the ensuing discussion in this thread, leaves me very confused.

And, for sure, I ascribe it mostly to my limited intellectual development and understanding. As a consequence, the image posted makes no sense to me; in a thread devoted to ‘ street ‘.
Not unlike images, I would make of my grandchildren; without any merit and of no significance
for anyone else but me.

For me, yes it is. Maybe not the best, but it is. It asks more from the viewer than only looking to a running person in a street or a couple of baskets on a pile.
And I’m reacting not any further on this style of reaction. I know very well what street photography is.
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Ivophoto

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #22 on: June 22, 2018, 02:32:21 AM »

So ‘ street ‘ is what each one of us thinks it is.
Sort of wastes all the time I spent reading what is, should, might, could be ‘ street ‘ in LuLa threads.

And the names of photogs galore, mostly dead, which were thrown about as being associated with the masters of ‘ street ‘.

Please, it is not my intention to be rude or diss the image you or anyone posts; but unfortunately the image posted and the ensuing discussion in this thread, leaves me very confused.

And, for sure, I ascribe it mostly to my limited intellectual development and understanding. As a consequence, the image posted makes no sense to me; in a thread devoted to ‘ street ‘.
Not unlike images, I would make of my grandchildren; without any merit and of no significance
for anyone else but me.

Dear Fursan,

I respect your opinion.
And I understand that strict definition or boundary is an important guideline and framework for some.
It is not for me, I cross pass these boundaries on purpose.


I’m happy to reply to questions about why I keep this image, but I can’t do anything with your initial remark because I have a different mindset ( not better, not lesser)

Kind regards

Ivo
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Ivophoto

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #23 on: June 22, 2018, 02:35:24 AM »

So ‘ street ‘ is what each one of us thinks it is.
Sort of wastes all the time I spent reading what is, should, might, could be ‘ street ‘ in LuLa threads.


No, it was not a waste of time. I did the same.

Your choice is to stay within the definition, my choice is to seek the boundaries and go over it.
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drmike

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2018, 03:16:52 AM »

No, it was not a waste of time. I did the same.

Your choice is to stay within the definition, my choice is to seek the boundaries and go over it.

This is mainly a reply to Fursan.

I think the discussion was interesting as a discussion about photography but for myself I don't think you can apply hard rules and definitions to styles of photography.

Consequently I think those that spend ages categorising photographs and disputing their place within a forum are wasting their time :) while you followed an interesting discussion and possibly benefited. 

Does anyone think a master like Martin Parr cares one bit if I think his empty parking spaces are fine art or street?

Mike
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Rayyan

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2018, 03:24:52 AM »


Hello Ivo.

Thank you for your response.
I, too, disagree with the definitions that I have read, and inferred, about ‘ street ‘ on LuLa.
Most of what I would term ‘ street ‘ would fall outside the archaic, restrictive constraints that are in place.

To be honest, I neither have the time nor inclination to wander around the ‘ streets ‘ in search of ‘ the decisive moment ‘. I prefer the interaction of people with each other and/or their environment.
‘ street ‘ to me should more appropriately be loosely considered as ‘ public ‘. With the acceptance that ‘ public ‘ might not necessarily mean where people interact. And I do realize that different countries and cultures further restrict photography on the street or in public places.

Furthermore, I am not averse to photojournalism on the ‘ street ‘ as the boundaries are very fluid between the two.

I wish you the best in stretching the ‘ street ‘ boundaries. And don’t be alarmed if you find me hanging out there with you.

Kindest regards.



No, it was not a waste of time. I did the same.

Your choice is to stay within the definition, my choice is to seek the boundaries and go over it.
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Rayyan

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #26 on: June 22, 2018, 03:30:42 AM »


Hi there Mike.

No disagreement to what you posted.
Not even to empty streets or car parks!

Take care.

This is mainly a reply to Fursan.

I think the discussion was interesting as a discussion about photography but for myself I don't think you can apply hard rules and definitions to styles of photography.

Consequently I think those that spend ages categorising photographs and disputing their place within a forum are wasting their time :) while you followed an interesting discussion and possibly benefited. 

Does anyone think a master like Martin Parr cares one bit if I think his empty parking spaces are fine art or street?

Mike
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Ivophoto

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2018, 04:21:22 AM »


And don’t be alarmed if you find me hanging out there with you.

Kindest regards.

It will be a pleasure, Fursan
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RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2018, 08:07:12 AM »

So ‘ street ‘ is what each one of us thinks it is.
Sort of wastes all the time I spent reading what is, should, might, could be ‘ street ‘ in LuLa threads.

Opgr said it best on the 19th, Fursan: ". . .if we establish a general concept like Haiku in poetry, and then make a forum specifically for Haiku, it seems rather odd to post sonnets there instead. It doesn't mean they are bad poems, but they might not receive the appreciation they perhaps deserve."

Problem is, "Haiku" has a pretty specific standard, though when I was getting Haiku published in "little" magazines there were a few deviations allowed from that standard. At least the basic definition was a poem. Unfortunately, "Street photography" means something that has nothing to do with a street.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2018, 08:57:27 AM by RSL »
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OmerV

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2018, 09:34:45 AM »

Unfortunately, "Street photography" means something that has nothing to do with a street.

Russ, you’re a chameleon, maybe, in a good way. You’ve stated that “street photography” neededn’t be done on a real, like paved street. So in your statement above, the last word, “street,” is not meant to be the paved kind but the intention. Maybe? Not sure if I’ve got this right so,...

I was thinking of this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-nGvu-F2GEKU/TuGGcJd8o8I/AAAAAAAAmH8/M4pHBM_5JHE/s640/The+Americans+by+Robert+Frank+%252815%2529.jpg

Rayyan

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2018, 10:21:29 AM »


Without any prejudice, I would like anyone interested to read the following article if you have not read it before...

Street Photography?

Russ, thanks for your response.

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RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2018, 10:43:37 AM »

Russ, you’re a chameleon, maybe, in a good way. You’ve stated that “street photography” neededn’t be done on a real, like paved street. So in your statement above, the last word, “street,” is not meant to be the paved kind but the intention. Maybe? Not sure if I’ve got this right so,...

I was thinking of this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-nGvu-F2GEKU/TuGGcJd8o8I/AAAAAAAAmH8/M4pHBM_5JHE/s640/The+Americans+by+Robert+Frank+%252815%2529.jpg

I guess this chameleon doesn't understand what you're saying, Omer. I said that street photography means something that has nothing to do with a street, and you used one of Robert Frank's classic street shots from The Americans to illustrate that fact. ???? Help me out here. (Hasn't anything to do with urinals, either, by the way.)
« Last Edit: June 22, 2018, 11:23:47 AM by RSL »
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RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2018, 11:19:32 AM »

Without any prejudice, I would like anyone interested to read the following article if you have not read it before...

Street Photography?

Russ, thanks for your response.

Eric makes some good points in that article, Fursan, but mostly what he does is illustrate once again that you can't define the street photography genre with words. You need to become familiar with the photographs that defined it to understand what's involved. You can't really do that on the web. You have to sit down with the books, one of which is The Decisive Moment, and study what's there. And when you study The Decisive Moment you also have to realize that HCB's early work is street photography, but later on he became a photojournalist and was shooting photojournalism, not street. His later stuff, Ghandi's funeral for instance, is a long way from street even though it's still Henri's poetic soul at work.

It's sort of like the definition of Haiku. There's a lot of poetry that fits the supposed 5/7/5 rule that doesn't really fall within the spirit of Haiku. I once was a visitor at a lecture on Haiku at Colorado College given by a Japanese professor who was big in the Haiku world. One of the things he pointed out is that Haiku really has to be written in Japanese because the visual effect of the characters is part of the effect. But he bypassed that point and got into the spirit of Haiku, which, as he pointed out, is it's most important characteristic. He illustrated his lecture with examples, since Haiku is like street in that words can't really define the genre.

Here's an example of my own:

      Silent house! Darkness!
      Children breathing softly. Wind. . .
      Outside in the night.

In Haiku, as in street photography, within the genre's meaning there's great stuff at its core, but as you move away from that core it becomes less great, then less good, then, finally, just plain crappy. If you run through the pictures in this section of LuLa you'll be treated to that entire panoply of stuff that calls itself street photography.

Jeremy Roussak

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2018, 11:59:58 AM »

This is a haiku I heard recently, which I rather enjoyed:

To freeze the moment
In seventeen syllables
Is very diffi.

Jeremy
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RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2018, 12:10:11 PM »

Exactly the problem, Jeremy! But a better approach would be:

To freeze the moment
In seventeen syllables
Is very tricky

Ivophoto

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2018, 12:25:44 PM »

Exactly the problem, Jeremy! But a better approach would be:

To freeze the moment
In seventeen syllables
Is very tricky



Or


To freeze the moment
In seventeen syllables
Is very silly
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OmerV

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #36 on: June 22, 2018, 12:27:40 PM »

I guess this chameleon doesn't understand what you're saying, Omer. I said that street photography means something that has nothing to do with a street, and you used one of Robert Frank's classic street shots from The Americans to illustrate that fact. ???? Help me out here. (Hasn't anything to do with urinals, either, by the way.)

Okay, guess I got confused by the double negative in your sentence:

“Unfortunately, "Street photography" means something that has nothing to do with a street.”

And no, urinals have nothing to do with anything. I know that you know the photograph is from The Americans, that’s why I linked to it. My point was that “street” does not mean on a street necessarily, a point which you have made a number of times. So, hey, we agree. In a chameleon sort of way.

RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #37 on: June 22, 2018, 01:44:09 PM »

Okay, fellow chameleon.  ;D

Jeremy Roussak

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #38 on: June 22, 2018, 03:43:19 PM »

Exactly the problem, Jeremy! But a better approach would be:

To freeze the moment
In seventeen syllables
Is very tricky

True. Both this and Ivo's are haiku and both make sense. But neither is funny.

Jeremy
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RSL

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Re: Not so enjoy
« Reply #39 on: June 22, 2018, 03:49:53 PM »

Right. It's what I was talking about earlier: crappy Haiku. (Same effect as crappy street)
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