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Author Topic: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type  (Read 5661 times)

Nickilford

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Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« on: April 17, 2018, 12:38:29 pm »

I use mostly Canson papers in my printing business and get by when choosing the paper type in the Canon 4000 printer when creating a custom profile but i would like to know what Canson suggests as the most suitable paper type. I download their icc/paper etc package for my printer but the suggested paper type is nowhere to be found. I'm I missing something?
If so is there anywhere I can find this info. At the moment I'm trying to create a profile for Canson PrintMaking Rag 310gr.

Cheers!
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rasworth

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2018, 12:42:30 pm »

Media type on their download page.

http://www.canson-infinity.com/en/icc-profiles

Richard Southworth

Added by edit - It's more convoluted than I at first suspected, have to choose printer brand and model, download the zip, and then drill way down for the AM1X file, that supposedly contains all applicable settings.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2018, 12:50:09 pm by rasworth »
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2018, 03:49:58 pm »

Media type on their download page.

http://www.canson-infinity.com/en/icc-profiles

Richard Southworth

Added by edit - It's more convoluted than I at first suspected, have to choose printer brand and model, download the zip, and then drill way down for the AM1X file, that supposedly contains all applicable settings.

Yes i have done all that but i don't install the AM1X file, i create a whole profile from scratch and read my own target. Maybe the way i'm doing it isn't the best way?!
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rasworth

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2018, 04:30:29 pm »

I assumed you could install the AM1X associated with their profile, and thereby derive the desired media setting for you to use with a custom profile.  My initial answer was based upon looking up my Epson printer, which does result in a direct media setting recommendation.

Another approach would be to list your papers of interest, and solicit recommendations in this forum.

Richard Southworth
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2018, 05:37:15 pm »

I assumed you could install the AM1X associated with their profile, and thereby derive the desired media setting for you to use with a custom profile.  My initial answer was based upon looking up my Epson printer, which does result in a direct media setting recommendation.

Another approach would be to list your papers of interest, and solicit recommendations in this forum.

Richard Southworth

Thanks Richard, i might just do that! Using the AM1X as a starting point sounds good too!
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Malcolm Payne

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2018, 03:52:06 am »

PrintMaking Rag is Canson's new name for what used to be BFK Rives. I don't know about the Canon 4000 printer specifically, but the media setting recommendation for the iPF8300 is Special 8. Assuming the 4000 offers similar media settings, that should be a good starting point. There should be a Media Settings Table pdf listing the recommendations for each paper somewhere on Canson's site.

Canson's own profiles are generally pretty good and are perfectly usable in the absence of anything else, though I've always ultimately preferred to make my own to eke out the best from the printer.

Hope that helps.

Malcolm
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2018, 12:39:51 pm »

PrintMaking Rag is Canson's new name for what used to be BFK Rives. I don't know about the Canon 4000 printer specifically, but the media setting recommendation for the iPF8300 is Special 8. Assuming the 4000 offers similar media settings, that should be a good starting point. There should be a Media Settings Table pdf listing the recommendations for each paper somewhere on Canson's site.

Canson's own profiles are generally pretty good and are perfectly usable in the absence of anything else, though I've always ultimately preferred to make my own to eke out the best from the printer.

Hope that helps.

Malcolm

I have tried to use Special 8 in the past on my Pro4000 because it worked so well for several papers on my iPF8100 but when using the "Specials" on the 4000 I lose the ability to control BW tones in Print Studio Pro (PSP). I can only take full advantage of PSP when using Canon's paper types as a starting point. Therefor I usually start off now with one of Canon's papers and then edit from there.
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2018, 12:47:08 pm »

I assumed you could install the AM1X associated with their profile, and thereby derive the desired media setting for you to use with a custom profile.

Richard Southworth

I just tried this approach and the AM1X file had an embedded Canon paper as a base that uses Photo and Matte Black. I thought only photo papers use PK and all matte Fine art papers use MK. I'm I correct in assuming this? At least this is how i have set up all my papers and have found close to perfect results. The paper I want to create a profile for is Canson PrintMaking Rag 310gr.

I have heard that using PK on matte papers is OK but not the other way around (actually i have had a bad experience using MK on a Baryta paper by mistake).

Would like to know what others are using as a paper base starting point to create a profile for this paper and should I use a paper that has predefined MK or both MK and PK?

Thanks



« Last Edit: April 18, 2018, 01:22:05 pm by Nickilford »
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rasworth

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2018, 03:56:34 pm »

In general one can use PK ink on fine art media, just gives up black density vs. MK.  Some printers require an ink switch cycle to go from one black ink to the other, so some photographers will use PK on fine art media (requires separate profile) to avoid the wastage.  MK ink on "photo" papers is not advised, it has no encapsulation to enable proper adhesion, and the gloss doesn't match the color inks.

My advice for creating a custom profile for the paper you specified is use the Canon profile media setting with MK ink.

Richard Southworth
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patjoja

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2018, 04:05:51 pm »

I just tried this approach and the AM1X file had an embedded Canon paper as a base that uses Photo and Matte Black. I thought only photo papers use PK and all matte Fine art papers use MK. I'm I correct in assuming this? At least this is how i have set up all my papers and have found close to perfect results. The paper I want to create a profile for is Canson PrintMaking Rag 310gr.

I have heard that using PK on matte papers is OK but not the other way around (actually i have had a bad experience using MK on a Baryta paper by mistake).

Would like to know what others are using as a paper base starting point to create a profile for this paper and should I use a paper that has predefined MK or both MK and PK?

Thanks

PrintMaking Rag is a matte paper.  The AM1X file is used to upload the Canson parameters to Canon's Media Configuration Tool.  If you install it correctly, when you go into the print driver, one of your choices for the paper media type will be PrintMaking Rag (it will be something like "cifa_iPFproxxxx_edition310" ).  If you find that and select it, your black ink type should toggle to Matte.  If you use the Media Configuration tool, you will not need to know what Canon's paper type is since you will be choosing the Canson paper itself.

Patrick
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patjoja

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2018, 04:18:07 pm »

PrintMaking Rag is a matte paper.  The AM1X file is used to upload the Canson parameters to Canon's Media Configuration Tool.  If you install it correctly, when you go into the print driver, one of your choices for the paper media type will be PrintMaking Rag (it will be something like "cifa_iPFproxxxx_edition310" ).  If you find that and select it, your black ink type should toggle to Matte.  If you use the Media Configuration tool, you will not need to know what Canon's paper type is since you will be choosing the Canson paper itself.

Patrick

BTW, have you installed the Media Configuration Tool?  If you're using Canson papers I've found it very helpful to upload the Am1 files into the printer.  Having the paper types uploaded to the printer makes it pretty easy when loading a new roll of paper onto the printer.  All I have to do is select the appropriate Canson paper from the paper list (since it was uploaded through the Media Configuration Tool).

The Media Configuration Tool software is available on Canon's printer support page for your printer.

Patrick
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2018, 06:36:27 am »

In general one can use PK ink on fine art media, just gives up black density vs. MK.  Some printers require an ink switch cycle to go from one black ink to the other, so some photographers will use PK on fine art media (requires separate profile) to avoid the wastage.  MK ink on "photo" papers is not advised, it has no encapsulation to enable proper adhesion, and the gloss doesn't match the color inks.

My advice for creating a custom profile for the paper you specified is use the Canon profile media setting with MK ink.

Richard Southworth

I'm on a Canon Pro 4000 that doesn't need black ink switching. After uploading the AM1X file I downloaded from Canson for the Printmaking Rag paper, the base paper that was used is "Canon Fine art Textured" and states in the custom paper settings that it uses both black inks, matte and Photo.

How does this work on the Canon Pro 4000, does it use MK in certain areas of the print and PK in others? I can't wrap my mind around why it uses both.
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2018, 06:42:05 am »

BTW, have you installed the Media Configuration Tool?  If you're using Canson papers I've found it very helpful to upload the Am1 files into the printer.  Having the paper types uploaded to the printer makes it pretty easy when loading a new roll of paper onto the printer.  All I have to do is select the appropriate Canson paper from the paper list (since it was uploaded through the Media Configuration Tool).

Patrick

Yes i have done this but what baffles me is that this particular paper, which is matte, uses both MK and PK. This is what is confusing to me. On all other matte papers i use i didn't upload the AM1X file and just chose a Canon Fine Art base paper that only uses MK. My results have bee stellar. So now I have tried the AM1X file upload route and apparently Canson suggests the use of MK and PK.
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patjoja

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2018, 04:41:31 pm »

Yes i have done this but what baffles me is that this particular paper, which is matte, uses both MK and PK. This is what is confusing to me. On all other matte papers i use i didn't upload the AM1X file and just chose a Canon Fine Art base paper that only uses MK. My results have bee stellar. So now I have tried the AM1X file upload route and apparently Canson suggests the use of MK and PK.

I don't have a 4000, but I do have an iPF6450.  What you're suggesting about the profile using both black inks does not sound right.  It's going to be one or the other.  Also, I don't think you have installed the AM1X file into the Media Configuration Tool because the media type in the printer driver window would read something like "cifa_iPF4000_edition310" (you have to toggle the media type field to see it), not Canon Fine art Textured. 

Just as an aside, where are you seeing "Canon Fine Art Textured"?  Installing the icc profile is different from installing the .am1x profile into the media configuraton tool.  They are two separate processes.

Have you actually run the Media Configuration Tool software and uploaded the am1x profile into that tool?  There is a .pdf file buried in the Canson zip file explaining how to add new papers to the Canon Media Config tool. 

Are you running Windows or Mac?

Patrick
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Panagiotis

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2018, 05:08:14 pm »

What you're suggesting about the profile using both black inks does not sound right. 

He is right. I use a PRO-1000, same inkset as the 4000 and there are some media types that they use both black inks.
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2018, 05:09:08 pm »

I don't have a 4000, but I do have an iPF6450.  What you're suggesting about the profile using both black inks does not sound right.  It's going to be one or the other.  Also, I don't think you have installed the AM1X file into the Media Configuration Tool because the media type in the printer driver window would read something like "cifa_iPF4000_edition310" (you have to toggle the media type field to see it), not Canon Fine art Textured. 

Just as an aside, where are you seeing "Canon Fine Art Textured"?  Installing the icc profile is different from installing the .am1x profile into the media configuraton tool.  They are two separate processes.

Have you actually run the Media Configuration Tool software and uploaded the am1x profile into that tool?  There is a .pdf file buried in the Canson zip file explaining how to add new papers to the Canon Media Config tool. 

Are you running Windows or Mac?

Patrick

Yes I use MCT and initially (before I edit the paper name to soemthing that makes more sense to me) the paper type is, in this case, cifa_iPfpro4000_pmk310. After it is installed, in MCT select the paper in question and press the info button. An info page will pop up showing all the information about this profile. Her you will see that the Black Ink used is Matte and Photo.

If you use the Edit profile button in MCT, the editing panel will pop up and you should see a "settings" or something of this nature in the bottom left corner. Click that and you will see which base paper was used. In my case (Printmaking rag) it is "Canon Fine Art Textured".

I'm on a Mac, Mac OSX Lion.
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David Budd

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2018, 09:40:52 pm »

Having just purchased a Canon Pro 2000 I found this to be more informative than the printer manual when it comes to setting up the MCT and customs papers.

http://www.redrivercatalog.com/profiles/How-to-Install-Canon-AM1X-Config-Custom-Media-Files.html

-D.
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Nickilford

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Re: Canson Papers - no best suggested paper type
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2018, 10:22:29 am »

Having just purchased a Canon Pro 2000 I found this to be more informative than the printer manual when it comes to setting up the MCT and customs papers.

http://www.redrivercatalog.com/profiles/How-to-Install-Canon-AM1X-Config-Custom-Media-Files.html

-D.

Thanks David will take a look!
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