Are Epson's 7890 Printer Profiles Not Very Good. . .

[PaulStL]

or do I have another problem?

Long time listener lurker, first time caller poster.  Anyway. . .

I recently acquired a 7890 that's literally like brand new.  The total print count was 10 and all maintenance components, except ink and the maintenance tank, registered as new.  The inks were between 20 and 60 percent.  I attribute the low ink values to the fact that the owner had auto nozzle check set to "every job" and print nozzle check pattern to "every page".  I ran a nozzle check (perfect) and printed a test print before purchase.  I didn't use any paper profiling when I printed because I didn't know the type of paper in the machine but the print looked "decent".

So here's the problem.  When I got it back to my office and got everything set up, I printed an image from a senior photo session that I had already printed on an Epson R800.  The R800 print matched the LR/PS edit and looked great.  When I printed the image on the 7890 the colors were off from the screen and the R800 print.  In both cases, the prints were made from Lightroom on Epson Premium Photo Luster with the appropriate paper profiles (from Epson).  After additional nozzle checks, reprints using Epson's profile and letting the printer manage color, printing Bill Atkinson's test print, all with similar results, I decided to print the image on my 4880 (same inkset and a printer I've never noticed any extreme color variations from the edit) using Epson's profiles.  The 4880 print didn't have as much "pop" and the colors were not exactly like the R800 but for the most part, true to the image in LR.  Next, I fired up the ColorMunki and created a new profile for the 7890.  When I printed the image using the new profile, the colors were almost indistinguishable from the edit and the R800 print.

I've attached the images for the sake of comparison (scanned, the colors are not a perfect match to the prints but good enough to show the bad color of the 7890 with Epson profiles).

It should be noted that when I got the printer back to my office, it didn't immediately recognize the the LVM cartridge.  My research says that is a fairly common problem but I thought I'd give full disclosure since the bad images seem to lack magenta.

So, are the canned profiles the problem or something else?

[digitaldog]

Not all ICC profiles are created equally


In this 23 minute video, I'll cover:
The basic anatomy of ICC Profiles
Why there are differences in profile quality and color rendering
How to evaluate an ICC output profile
Examples of good and not so good canned profiles and custom profiles on actual printed output.


High resolution: http://digitaldog.net/files/Not_All_Profiles_are_created_equally.mp4
Low resolution (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNdR_tIFMME&feature=youtu.be

[dgberg]

Did you agitate the ink carts before printing?
More importantly what are the dates on the inks?

[Farmer]

1. The canned profiles are not an issue, but Andrew's video is a great resource.

2. What Dan said - exactly right starting point to figure this out.

[I.T. Supplies]

Technically the expiration on the Epsoon inks won't have that much of an effect on the quality unless the cartridge is sitting in a climate change that goes between hot and cold often to mess with the chemicals.  We've sold expired Epson ink to customers (been sitting in our warehouse for some time and as-is) and rarely had any complaints with how they printed.

However, the quality difference will be factored on the profile being used (as well as other settings), if you're monitor is actually calibrated properly to have it match towards the printer, the nozzle check has been done to make sure everything is firing properly.  Yes, the canned (manufacturer) profile is created from the manufacturer on the printer they have upfront, but everyone's printer that is identical to theirs "won't" always print the same since environment is factored in on the location of the customers printer.  If the canned profile doesn't suffice, it's best to get a custom profile made to match your printer environment and what not.

Also, when doing the settings, want to make sure the media type is correct, Photoshop/LR manages color to select the appropriate ICC, Relative Colormetric is selected and Black Point Compensation is checked.  Otherwise, if the monitor is calibrated properly, the print should look very similar (close to identical).  Basically custom profile with these options are recommended from our G7 color expert.  You can also try "softproof" via Photoshop (not sure in LR) to see how it will print before actually printing (thus monitor needs calibrated for this to work correctly).

[PaulStL]

Andrew:  I'm aware of the variances in canned profiles but I don't think there should be such a large variance between the 4880 profile (creation date 2007) and the 7890 (creation date 2010) regardless of the software and optimizations especially given that there's only slight variances between the 4800 and the R800 prints.  My concern was that something wasn't working correctly with the printer but the ColorMunki created profile seemed to eliminate that possibility.  BTW, it's been a while but I have read your book.  I also rewatched the linked video to make sure I hadn't forgotten anything.

Dan:  I did agitate all of the cartridges before printing anything (except the test print at the couple's house).  I got the idea that the printer had been sitting for quite a while so I knew settlement could be an issue.  Regarding the dates, they're dated Nov/Dec 2012.  It's definitely a concern and may be the source of the discrepancy.  Like Atlex's comments, in my own experiences I haven't had any problems with expired carts.  The difference is that these cartridges have been sitting in the printer (open and exposed to the environment) for who knows how long.  The expired carts I've used in the past have all been sealed.  One thing that points away from the age of the carts being the problem is that the color and density of the nozzles checks between the 4880 and the 7890 are, to the naked eye, the same.

Atlex:  I've been printing for a loooonnnnngggg time.  Monitors are regularly calibrated, all appropriate selections and boxes are selected and checked (and if they weren't, they were still the same between all three printers).  Soft proofing showed slight variances amongst the profiles but not the extreme difference of the prints.

It's still a puzzle.  Any other thoughts or ideas are certainly welcome.  Before I don't forget, thanks for the help.

[Farmer]

The difference is that these cartridges have been sitting in the printer (open and exposed to the environment) for who knows how long.

That's your problem most likely.  If they have been sitting there for more than a year, you need new carts AND put enough ink through to get rid of what's in the lines.