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Author Topic: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target  (Read 5098 times)

datro

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i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« on: August 08, 2017, 11:42:30 PM »

In the past, I've had no problems printing my profile targets with i1Profiler....been doing it for years.  A while back I updated to 1.7.1 but today was the first time I've needed to do some new profiles.  When I hit the "Print" button in i1Profiler to print my 4-page target, nothing happens.  No error popup, nada.  Normally, I should see the Windows print dialogue so I can choose the printer and set the driver preferences.  I'm running Windows 10 (1607) 64-bit.  I have sent a request in to x-rite, but who knows how long that will take.

Has anyone else seen this problem?

Thanks,
Dave
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Jeff-Grant

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2017, 04:26:05 AM »

It's OK on a Mac.
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Mark D Segal

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2017, 07:30:23 AM »

Likewise, works on OSX 10.11x.

BTW, X-Rite support will respond, usually within a day or two.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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datro

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2017, 09:43:04 AM »

BTW, X-Rite support will respond, usually within a day or two.

Jeff, Mark, thanks for the verification of status on the Mac.

Well, I have good news and bad news.  The good news is that x-rite responded almost immediately to my query (< 24 hours).  The bad news is that x-rite has verified this problem as a known "software bug" that will be fixed in the next release.  They provide a couple of workarounds.  Here's what they sent to me:

*** Start of x-rite response ***
Comment: The RGB Printer profiling “Print” button does not work in the Test Chart workflow step. This has been verified and logged as a software bug to fix in the next update of i1Profiler. In the meantime, you have a few options:

1. Some users have reported that if they uninstall one of their printers (preferably one that you no longer use) and then reboot the PC, the “Print” button worked.
2. You can save the test chart out as a TIFF and then print it with all color management turned off.
3. You can uninstall i1Profiler 1.7.1 and X-Rite Device Services Manager in Control Panel > Programs & Features, reboot the PC, and then reinstall i1Profiler 1.6.7 using the following link: http://www.xritephoto.com/ph_product_overview.aspx?ID=1397&Action=Support&SoftwareID=1672

*** End of x-rite response ***

I will try option 1 first, then if that doesn't work I'll go directly to option 3.  Seems amazing to me that such a problem with a key feature of the software could somehow escape being caught in the QA process before release of the latest version.

Dave
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Mark D Segal

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2017, 09:50:38 AM »

Actually, it's not amazing, unfortunately. I'm anxiously awaiting the next release as well, hoping a couple of other bugs get fixed.

If it were me, I would probably go for option (2), making sure to use the Adobe Color Print Utility (ACPU, free download from the Adobe website) for printing the targets. I have found from several tests that this is a highly reliable way to print profiling targets that aren't colour-managed.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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rasworth

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2017, 10:06:48 AM »

I have a W10 system with the latest version of i1Profiler and had not run into the problem because I exclusively use ACPU, with no issues.  I tried printing from i1Profiler, and indeed the bug is present.

Richard Southworth
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Ethan Hansen

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2017, 07:46:51 PM »

Actually, it's not amazing, unfortunately. I'm anxiously awaiting the next release as well, hoping a couple of other bugs get fixed.

If it were me, I would probably go for option (2), making sure to use the Adobe Color Print Utility (ACPU, free download from the Adobe website) for printing the targets. I have found from several tests that this is a highly reliable way to print profiling targets that aren't colour-managed.

I tested printing targets from i1Profiler on three Windows boxes in the office. It worked on one machine and failed on the other two. Be careful using ACPU on Windows. It scales targets down to a greater extent than on a Mac. Depending on the target layout and the instrument you use, this may reduce measurement accuracy or even prevent i1Profiler from being able to recognize the target. You can compensate by increasing the size of the target by 4% in Photoshop using nearest neighbor interpolation.

As an alternative we have a simple utility for Windows users that bypasses Adobe's color management path.

rasworth

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2017, 07:56:43 PM »

Ethan,

I've had no issues with the slightly smaller target using ACPU and Windows 10 - I manually scan the patches using an i1Pro.  Can you be more specific as to the conditions where the shrinkage might cause a problem?

Richard Southworth
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Mark D Segal

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2017, 08:43:52 PM »

After saving the profiling targets out of i1Profiler as an untagged TIFF image, I print these targets from ACPU using Mac OSX 11.x, and there is no size reduction of the patches. The patches are supposed to be 8mm square, they are exactly that (I measured some), and the spectro reading process works as intended.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2017, 10:00:37 PM »

The ACPU Windows problem is well known and Adobe seems not to care.  I profile using ArgyllCMS and even though the patch size is 4%  smaller, I have no problems reading them with an i1 spectrometer.
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Rhossydd

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2017, 01:17:51 AM »

Can you be more specific as to the conditions where the shrinkage might cause a problem?
The main problem occurs when using an autospectrophotometer that needs specific sizing data of the chart that's being read*. Hand held measurements shouldn't really be effected unless you're trying to use the smallest patch size possible when you might start getting read errors from under sized patches.

* It is possible to hack a reference file to accommodate for the resizing, but it's not a simple task.
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digitaldog

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2017, 11:29:19 AM »

After saving the profiling targets out of i1Profiler as an untagged TIFF image, I print these targets from ACPU using Mac OSX 11.x, and there is no size reduction of the patches. The patches are supposed to be 8mm square, they are exactly that (I measured some), and the spectro reading process works as intended.
Indeed it is. However, depending on the Spectrophotometer and the degree of shrinkage, it may be moot. I have seen no such issues with Window customers when I use my custom targets from i1P on an iSis XL which can be picky about size. The issue appears to disappear by NOT using the default or minimum target size parameters when creating a target. Not enough 'fudge factor' in size I suppose. I'd suggest having this check box OFF and upping the various values a tad.

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Andrew Rodney
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Mark D Segal

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2017, 12:28:55 PM »

Welcome back Andrew!
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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digitaldog

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2017, 12:37:01 PM »

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Andrew Rodney
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datro

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2017, 05:27:21 PM »

Andrew,
Interesting suggestion regarding not taking the default patch sizing and make it larger before printing with ACPU.  I will try that before going to the trouble of uninstalling i1Profiler and back-dating to a previous version (BTW x-rite seemed to push NOT to take that option in some further communication I had with them).

Just a note for anyone looking at the actual numbers in Andrew's screen shot:  Don't just take those numbers and plug them in to your setup.  His numbers (and I believe the "Header Length" option which I don't have on my setup) are specific to the device he is using, i.e. the iSisXL.  For users with an i1Pro2 (my situation) the default patch size is 8mm x 8mm (or .315 in x .315 in).  Andrew's "expanded size" patches are actually smaller than that, but I believe that is because he is using a different measurement device. 

FWIW,
Dave
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Doug Gray

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #15 on: August 12, 2017, 08:04:34 PM »

Andrew,
Interesting suggestion regarding not taking the default patch sizing and make it larger before printing with ACPU.  I will try that before going to the trouble of uninstalling i1Profiler and back-dating to a previous version (BTW x-rite seemed to push NOT to take that option in some further communication I had with them).

Just a note for anyone looking at the actual numbers in Andrew's screen shot:  Don't just take those numbers and plug them in to your setup.  His numbers (and I believe the "Header Length" option which I don't have on my setup) are specific to the device he is using, i.e. the iSisXL.  For users with an i1Pro2 (my situation) the default patch size is 8mm x 8mm (or .315 in x .315 in).  Andrew's "expanded size" patches are actually smaller than that, but I believe that is because he is using a different measurement device. 

FWIW,
Dave

I'm interested in following this as I broke down and ordered an ISIS 2 XL which should arrive in a few days. My usual approach is to just save the tif file and print with Photoshop using the null transform technique and I'm curious to see how that works with the ISIS compared to just printing directly.  I prefer going through Photoshop since that lets me easily place identifying text on the target which helps with organization. Also, my windows machine doesn't maintain dimensions which makes ACPU marginal.

I hope it solves the issue I'm having with some matte papers with the I1Pro  2.
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Dale Villeponteaux

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #16 on: August 13, 2017, 11:27:14 AM »

Welcome back Andrew!

I,too,am glad to see Andrew Rodney again on the Forum.

Regards,
Dale
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rasworth

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #17 on: August 13, 2017, 11:59:31 AM »

I've been using ACPU several years for targets from my Epson 3880, and recently for my Canon Pro-100.  All profiles have been created with no issues, using both an normal I1 Pro and an UV Cut i1 Pro, all on a Windows 10 system running i1Profiler.  As I remember, we went to ACPU when Photoshop deleted the "No Color Management" command from the Print dialog.

So here's the question - can somebody tell me why the combination of Photoshop CC set to "Printer Manages Colors" and the print driver set to color management off, is not an appropriate method for target printing, specifically for a W10 system?

Richard Southworth
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Mark D Segal

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #18 on: August 13, 2017, 12:09:05 PM »

Hi Richard,

This whole business is about as transparent as a mud-bath. I've been trying for a long time to get to the bottom of it but, requests for clarification have been met with silence. Anyhow, as much as I could piece together, and may not be totally correct, are two factors: (1) there is colour management happening embedded in the operating systems which turning off colour management in the printer driver does not touch, and (2) ACPU doesn't turn anything off - it is a work around.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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rasworth

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Re: i1Profiler issue: Not able to print target
« Reply #19 on: August 13, 2017, 12:27:12 PM »

I found a stock of 4x6 Epson premium gloss, that I would like to use for snapshot printing on my Pro-100. The generic Canon "other glossy" profile doesn't work very well, so I decided to crank out my own.  I have 8.5x11 Epson premium gloss, so I printed a two page i1Profiler auto generated target, untagged image in Photoshop, "Printer manages colors" in Photoshop, and an appropriate media choice in the Canon print driver with color management turned off.

The targets look ok, and they are the correct size, no shrinkage.  I'll let them dry, and will report back as to the profile performance.

Richard Southworth
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