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Author Topic: LR and CO Print Differences  (Read 935 times)

jemsurvey

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LR and CO Print Differences
« on: May 14, 2017, 10:17:42 AM »

Hi all,

I'm doing some test printing from Lightroom CC and Capture One Pro 10.1.  I am noticing a slight difference in my black and white prints.  The LR prints are slightly cooler in tone than the CO prints.  It's not huge but is noticeable.  I have all my settings neutral as far as I can tell.

What could be the reason for this?

I am using the latest versions of LR and CO on the latest version of Mac OS Sierra and printing with a Canon Pro-1000.  All printer driver settings consistent.

Thanks for any help you can provide.

John
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Mark D Segal

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2017, 10:20:16 AM »

Hi all,


Thanks for any help you can provide.

John

The best help I can provide is to suggest that you not concern yourself about this. Different raw converters are expected to have different "starting points". The important thing is for you to be able to adjust the tint and temperature to what you want in your final result.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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howardm

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2017, 10:35:25 AM »

OP:  I think a LOT depends on how you're doing the color -> BW conversion and the way each piece of software deals w/ that.

jemsurvey

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2017, 10:58:39 AM »

I suppose I should have mentioned that the prints were made from the same TIF file.  The original RAF file was processed in CO and the B&W conversion was done in MacPhun Tonality CK, the TIF was saved and then printed from LR and then CO.  So theoretically the prints should be identical.

Sorry for leaving this step out.
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BartvanderWolf

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2017, 11:05:46 AM »

I suppose I should have mentioned that the prints were made from the same TIF file.  The original RAF file was processed in CO and the B&W conversion was done in MacPhun Tonality CK, the TIF was saved and then printed from LR and then CO.  So theoretically the prints should be identical.

Sorry for leaving this step out.

Hi,

As far as color is concerned, they should be identical. Check if the TIFF has a / the proper profile embedded, and the output profiles are the same. The profiles are the only thing I can think of producing differences on a B&W print with color inks.

Cheers,
Bart
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Mark D Segal

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2017, 11:18:27 AM »

Hi,

As far as color is concerned, they should be identical. Check if the TIFF has a / the proper profile embedded, and the output profiles are the same. The profiles are the only thing I can think of producing differences on a B&W print with color inks.

Cheers,
Bart

Based on the additional information from the OP one would think so, but I'm wondering whether there is more to it. Is it not the case that two profiles need to be involved: the file numbers to the PCS and the PCS to the printer? The printer profile deals with the latter and the applications should be using some input profile for the former; and these could differ?
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BobShaw

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2017, 07:31:13 PM »

Do you use an editing programme for editing? Then why use an editing programme for printing?
If you use a printing programme like Mirage or others for printing then your results will always be predictable no matter what editing programmes you use.
Les Walkling showed me Mirage years ago and it has saved me a fortune in time, paper and ink having to redo prints and redo presets every time you change a printer or paper sizes or do an upgrade.
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MHMG

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2017, 10:26:19 PM »


Les Walkling showed me Mirage years ago and it has saved me a fortune in time, paper and ink having to redo prints and redo presets every time you change a printer or paper sizes or do an upgrade.

Please enlighten me. How does Mirage do that?  How does it adapt to a new printer/ink/media combination any more efficiently than PSCC, LR, or other software applications sending source file data to destination output? Doesn't one still need to invoke a new ICC profile, new media settings, output quality settings such as uni versus bi-directional printing, printer dpi output values, etc.? If so, what is the advantage of Mirage that makes you an advocate for it's superior printing capabilities?
« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 10:29:20 PM by MHMG »
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BobShaw

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2017, 01:27:24 AM »

Please enlighten me. How does Mirage do that?  How does it adapt to a new printer/ink/media combination any more efficiently than PSCC, LR, or other software applications sending source file data to destination output? Doesn't one still need to invoke a new ICC profile, new media settings, output quality settings such as uni versus bi-directional printing, printer dpi output values, etc.? If so, what is the advantage of Mirage that makes you an advocate for it's superior printing capabilities?
Easy. Download a 30 day trial and find out.
There is an Automate option out of Photoshop, but I never use it. I never print out of any application.
Essentially my workflow is to export a 16bit ProPhoto TIFF file and save it. That is my file for that image of any size, any paper, any printer.
Drag and drop it onto the application.
Dialogue box opens. Select paper size, image size, profile, rendering intent. Move around the image on the visual if necessary. Print. It just works the rest out.
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Randy Carone

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2017, 10:19:12 AM »

I may be dense, but can you rephrase the last three sentences? What does "Move around the image on the visual" mean? And I don't know what' the rest' is.
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jemsurvey

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2017, 11:41:36 AM »

OK, so my output profiles are the same and I'm using the same TIF file with embedded profile.  How do I check the application input profile, or does it even matter? Does the application profile override any profile within the TIF file?
Thanks
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BartvanderWolf

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2017, 12:16:56 PM »

OK, so my output profiles are the same and I'm using the same TIF file with embedded profile.  How do I check the application input profile, or does it even matter? Does the application profile override any profile within the TIF file?

If the same document/TIFF is used, and it has an embedded profile, things should be well enough characterized to produce the same output results. Most Photo-editor applications can show which profile is embedded in the TIFF. If no profile is embedded then it depends on the application's preferences what happens (warning or use of a default profile).

Cheers,
Bart
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Mark D Segal

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2017, 12:23:22 PM »

Lightroom recognizes embedded profiles. Lightroom RGB Space
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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BobShaw

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2017, 07:49:20 PM »

I may be dense, but can you rephrase the last three sentences? What does "Move around the image on the visual" mean? And I don't know what' the rest' is.
Sorry, badly expressed. It means that you can move the image on the paper to vary the margins or rotate the image or if you are printing multiple images, either the same or different, then you can adjust or their size or placement to minimise paper. It even does the minimise paper bit for you.

The file you are working from must have an embedded profile. I always export a 16 bit ProPhoto TIFF and store those in a folder called "Print Files".
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Mark D Segal

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Re: LR and CO Print Differences
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2017, 08:51:02 PM »

Sorry, badly expressed. It means that you can move the image on the paper to vary the margins or rotate the image or if you are printing multiple images, either the same or different, then you can adjust or their size or placement to minimise paper. It even does the minimise paper bit for you.

The file you are working from must have an embedded profile. I always export a 16 bit ProPhoto TIFF and store those in a folder called "Print Files".

You can do all this printing from LR as well, except the calculations for minimizing paper use aren't in an algorithm; the user needs to exercise a bit of imagination.
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