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Author Topic: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc  (Read 3735 times)

Pete JF

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Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« on: March 02, 2017, 05:51:05 PM »

I'm finally going to streamline my viewing area and about to order some Solux (black back) bulbs

What wattages are you guys using with, for example, the clamp on gooseneck style lamp holders?

Any of you finding that 3500 k is working well for you as a sole light source? (in my commercial days i would probably set up for closer to daylight but these days it's almost always a gallery wall or a home wall)

Wondering about fixture options..rigging a track isn't practical in my studio because I have 14 foot ceilings.

I wish Solux made it's screw in bulbs par 30's in 3500 and 4700 K..Wuld make my issues much easier. Is there a limitation
in color temp options because of they are 120v..guessing this is the case. But..like said before, if it feasible to only use
3500 k then I'm good with the screw in style in 120v

Anyhow..Wondering if any of you have any products you know of in a fixture that is clamp able or stand mountable..

Also interested a dimmer option that doesn't change the specs of the light.

Anything and everything idea-wise..I would rather source that is available in stores as far as fixtures go..if not then I'm fine with the Solux products

Thanks!
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Pete JF

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2017, 05:55:01 PM »

Also..are there other companies making similarly priced and similar quality bulbs?

Products that are available at lighting stores, electrical supply houses?

Mr-16 is a common standard, no?



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Robert DeCandido PhD

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2017, 08:33:05 PM »

LED lights is the way I would go...
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Pete JF

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2017, 08:55:00 PM »

Hi Robert,

Why? Everyone seems to love the Solux bulbs..

What type/brand of LED?

Thanks
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Wayne Fox

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2017, 01:11:28 AM »

I've been testing these from Lumicrest.  think I like them better than Solux, mainly because Solux tends to heat up my room.

  So far I've just tried the 3000k bulbs.  sounds warm, and maybe it is, but seems to work well.  going to order a couple of the 4000k bulbs just to compare.

I just installed 100 of these in my gallery, and they work really well for that.

bill t.

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2017, 01:34:10 AM »

I helped a client install several of my largest sized prints.  They used these bulbs...

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RMJZQ4C

The presentation is stunning.  4000K from these leds looks very neutral and incredibly color rich, without the greenish tint one gets from claimed 4000K halogens.  It is very vindicating to my battered photographer's soul.  Haven't measured the actual CRI, but I can believe it's as claimed.  The ceilings are high, the bulb to print distance is about 8 feet or 2 and a half meters and the print brightness is exactly to my liking, which is to say just enough over the room ambient light to stand out, without being glaring.

Beats the heck out of the 2700K lighting you will find in most homes, with CRIs and brightness best suited to long term dead-storage facilities, or to make the bananas look good at the supermarket.  So what's a printmaker to choose, reality or beauty?  When I personally make sales I make a pitch for good lighting so salve my conscience, and leave it at that.
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Pete JF

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2017, 01:40:08 AM »

I've been testing these from Lumicrest.  think I like them better than Solux, mainly because Solux tends to heat up my room.

  So far I've just tried the 3000k bulbs.  sounds warm, and maybe it is, but seems to work well.  going to order a couple of the 4000k bulbs just to compare.

I just installed 100 of these in my gallery, and they work really well for that.

Wayne,

Are you using these as reference lighting for making prints as well as for gallery light?

Do you use a dimmer with them and if so, what kind..and do they hold spec well when dimmed?
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Pete JF

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2017, 01:44:14 AM »

I helped a client install several of my largest sized prints.  They used these bulbs...

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RMJZQ4C

The presentation is stunning.  4000K from these leds looks very neutral and incredibly color rich, without the greenish tint one gets from claimed 4000K halogens.  It is very vindicating to my battered photographer's soul.  Haven't measured the actual CRI, but I can believe it's as claimed.  The ceilings are high, the bulb to print distance is about 8 feet or 2 and a half meters and the print brightness is exactly to my liking, which is to say just enough over the room ambient light to stand out, without being glaring.





Beats the heck out of the 2700K lighting you will find in most homes, with CRIs and brightness best suited to long term dead-storage facilities, or to make the bananas look good at the supermarket.  So what's a printmaker to choose, reality or beauty?  When I personally make sales I make a pitch for good lighting so salve my conscience, and leave it at that.

I'm guessing you're comfortable with using these as your reference lighting for a print station?

Good price too..

Same question as I asked Wayne..will these hold up to dimming? and do they require a special dimmer of any kind?


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pluton

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2017, 02:06:52 AM »

These Soraa LED units cost more than the ones Wayne mentioned.  I bought one of the 10º units(for another purpose) and the 4000ºK meters at about 3800-3900ºK. I thought they'd make really good gallery/display lights for prints.
Soraa LED bulbs
 The only question is:  How long until the color shifts due to the fading of filters/phosphors? 
At the computer and printer, I use Kino Flo KF55 flo tubes in cheap 32Wx2 fixtures.  These have run without issues for years.  I figured the 5500ºK would closely match the NEC monitor, and in the summer I appreciate that they run pretty cool.
KinoFlos you can put in regular 32W fixtures
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2017, 04:03:57 AM »

I've been testing these from Lumicrest.  think I like them better than Solux, mainly because Solux tends to heat up my room.

  So far I've just tried the 3000k bulbs.  sounds warm, and maybe it is, but seems to work well.  going to order a couple of the 4000k bulbs just to compare.

I just installed 100 of these in my gallery, and they work really well for that.

Interesting concept, extra lenses for spot/beam lighting on them;
http://lumicrest.com/product/alternate-lens-par20/

Still one would like to see the spectral plot of the LEDs, the blue spike remains common.
Edit; sorry, overlooked this one;
http://lumicrest.com/pdf/Photometry/Apturi_Par20_4000K_95CRI_Report.pdf


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
February 2017 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
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deanwork

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2017, 10:39:37 AM »

Very cool Ernst,

Focusing LEDs.

I'm working on building some large vertical shadow box frames for backlighting silk transparencies. I'm going to try several things. Right now banks of daylight led lights behind frosted plexi with the fabric suspended in front of that is what I'm trying for a self contained backlit module.

john





Interesting concept, extra lenses for spot/beam lighting on them;
http://lumicrest.com/product/alternate-lens-par20/

Still one would like to see the spectral plot of the LEDs, the blue spike remains common.
Edit; sorry, overlooked this one;
http://lumicrest.com/pdf/Photometry/Apturi_Par20_4000K_95CRI_Report.pdf


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
February 2017 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2017, 11:14:16 AM »

Very cool Ernst,

Focusing LEDs.

I'm working on building some large vertical shadow box frames for backlighting silk transparencies. I'm going to try several things. Right now banks of daylight led lights behind frosted plexi with the fabric suspended in front of that is what I'm trying for a self contained backlit module.

john

The serial LED assemblies as used for signs could be a good source.

http://www.gelighting.com/LightingWeb/na/solutions/sign-lighting/tetra-edgestrip.jsp

Just one of the many types available.


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
February 2017 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
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Wayne Fox

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2017, 11:14:35 AM »

Interesting concept, extra lenses for spot/beam lighting on them;
http://lumicrest.com/product/alternate-lens-par20/

Still one would like to see the spectral plot of the LEDs, the blue spike remains common.
Edit; sorry, overlooked this one;
http://lumicrest.com/pdf/Photometry/Apturi_Par20_4000K_95CRI_Report.pdf


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
February 2017 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
Color output of LED"s stills challenging, but these seem pretty good.  We really appreciate the ability to change out the reflector, as some locations we need to switch between spreads depending on what we're putting on the wall.  The extra lenses are only a couple of bucks each.

Another LED bulb I'm finding working pretty well is this one from Soraa. (which I bought on Amazon).  I bought them specifically to replace some MR-16 solux halogen lamps in one location.  Side by side the output of the 3000k Soraa and the 3000k Lumicrest appear extremely close to the 3500k Solux bulb.

I tend to use the slightly warmer bulbs when preparing work because I think most situations the print will be augmented with light.  In situations where the print may have much cooler daylight on it some of the time it still appears nice, but if I balance for daylight and then light it exclusively with much warmer artificial light it often appears to warm to my taste.  Just my personal preference .

GrahamBy

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2017, 11:37:55 AM »

The serial LED assemblies as used for signs could be a good source.

Have you looked at LED ceiling tiles? They are 60cm square LED panel lights designed to drop into a standard office suspended ceiling. I used one for some back-lit photos and the uniformity was pretty good. Plus they're relatively cheap, since they're an industrial product without any pretense of adaptation to art...

https://www.amazon.com/LEDwholesalers-40-Watt-Edge-Lit-Glare-Free-2104WH/dp/B00776HLRU
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stockjock

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2017, 01:59:18 PM »

Hi Robert,

Why? Everyone seems to love the Solux bulbs..

What type/brand of LED?

Thanks

I second the vote for the Hyperikon type bulbs.  I don't have the right fixtures for the Solux bulbs but I've found these to be very good:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0145Z0FGE

The package actually claims a CRI of 94 and better than normal fidelity with reds which is often a short coming of LED's.  I like the light from the 5000K bulbs better than the 4000K bulbs and the 4000K bulbs only claim a CRI of 90+.  The bluer light might be a little jarring in a living space light a den or family room but it seems appropriate for the hallway where I put my photos for evaluation.  I don't have a proper viewing booth but I am happy with using these as a compromise solution.  For my application the BR40's were definitely the right way to go since I don't have track mounted spot lights.

I am actually considering replacing all of the older 3000K Cree LED bulbs in my kitchen and living room with the Hyperikon bulbs because of the noticeable improvement in the quality of light from the Hyperikon's.  I didn't test the 2700 or 3000K versions of the Hyperikon's.  Again, they might seem more familiar in a living space but the yellower light is likely to impact how you perceive the prints matching your monitor.

FWIW

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Wayne Fox

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2017, 11:55:05 PM »

The CRI rating of these bulbs can be decieving because it's based on an average of 15 different  color temperatures measurements.  So a CRI of 90 can be achieved even if one of the spectral measurements is pretty weak.  one reason I went with the Lumicrest is they publish their spectral plots.  The bulb CRI is 95, which is pretty impressive.  The R9 rating is 84, and while that sounds low, it's actually pretty good.  As an example, one Hyperikon bulb which has a CRI of 90 and is a solid LED and terrific for interior home lighting, actually boasts that their bulb achieves a R9 reading of 70+. (this isn't the one mentioned earlier in this thread which i think has a better CRI).

The Soraa vivid bulb to me shows one of the best spectral ratings through all 15 temperatures (95) of any reasonably priced LED I've found so far , including a R-9 rating of 97 (for their 3000k bulb).  They emphasize their bulbs produce light throughout the entire visible spectrum, where most LED"s fail to produce any light in the low range (violets) and are lacking in the high end (reds). I use the Soraa's in my evaluation area (not on a dimmer to answer an earlier question) to replace the Solux's but I chose the Lumicrest for my gallery because of the ability to change the degree of spread.  (I would love Ernst's opinion of this data from Soraa)

Up to now good LED light sources have been challenging.  Seem to be some decent choices now.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2017, 12:16:11 AM by Wayne Fox »
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Tim Lookingbill

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2017, 05:15:29 AM »

I wish Solux made it's screw in bulbs par 30's in 3500 and 4700 K..Wuld make my issues much easier. Is there a limitation
in color temp options because of they are 120v..guessing this is the case. But..like said before, if it feasible to only use
3500 k then I'm good with the screw in style in 120v

I bought and reviewed a Soraa Par30 long neck, 36 degree beam spread, 5000K Vivid LED bulb on Amazon that includes pictures I shot of colored objects and neutrals lit by this bulb. As one of the pictures comparing it to actual outdoor daylight shows, it's the closest to sunlight I've seen in an LED bulb.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/review/R22VCQ80NDEQDY?ref_=glimp_1rv_cl

I still don't know why the review doesn't show up on the product page which indicates no one has reviewed it since I posted mine.

There is now a 60 degree beam spread version here...

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PAUUTQU/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=2BWNAUMEU7GRN&coliid=I1PXJTN04O8VGC

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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2017, 10:51:21 AM »

The CRI rating of these bulbs can be decieving because it's based on an average of 15 different  color temperatures measurements.  So a CRI of 90 can be achieved even if one of the spectral measurements is pretty weak.  one reason I went with the Lumicrest is they publish their spectral plots.  The bulb CRI is 95, which is pretty impressive.  The R9 rating is 84, and while that sounds low, it's actually pretty good.  As an example, one Hyperikon bulb which has a CRI of 90 and is a solid LED and terrific for interior home lighting, actually boasts that their bulb achieves a R9 reading of 70+. (this isn't the one mentioned earlier in this thread which i think has a better CRI).

The Soraa vivid bulb to me shows one of the best spectral ratings through all 15 temperatures (95) of any reasonably priced LED I've found so far , including a R-9 rating of 97 (for their 3000k bulb).  They emphasize their bulbs produce light throughout the entire visible spectrum, where most LED"s fail to produce any light in the low range (violets) and are lacking in the high end (reds). I use the Soraa's in my evaluation area (not on a dimmer to answer an earlier question) to replace the Solux's but I chose the Lumicrest for my gallery because of the ability to change the degree of spread.  (I would love Ernst's opinion of this data from Soraa)

Up to now good LED light sources have been challenging.  Seem to be some decent choices now.

The Lumicrest (3000K) has an impressive specification with CRI 95, R1-R15 93 and CQS 94 numbers.

My favorite independent testing source Olino.org tested some Pharox LED bulbs 3000K and 4000K that did not reach the level of the Lumicrest;
http://www.olino.org/us/articles/2016/03/14/pharox-pharox-400-ledlamp-dimmable-8w-40w-e27
I use that one next to halogens as a viewing light; 4006K, CRI 91.5, R1-R15 96.1, CQS 92.3

The Soraa is as impressive for an MR16 3000K, LED type. My calculation says R1-R15 93.4 which is better than the MR16s LEDs so far measured by Olino. They stay around 80 for the three standards mentioned here.

I still use the MR16 halogens for reproduction and evaluation; Osram Decostar, Cool Blue 51, 50 watt, 4000K (in practice), similar technology as the Solux but the Osrams were less expensive in Europe.

Edit; I see a "scientific" paper on the Decostar Cool Blue 51 appeared some years after I started using them. In Russia they pay 3x the price I pay for them.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/277326193_Qualimetric_Researches_of_Educational_Resources_Standardizing_of_Light_Conditions_in_the_Light_Booth


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
February 2017 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots
« Last Edit: March 06, 2017, 12:03:15 PM by Ernst Dinkla »
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Tim Lookingbill

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2017, 06:25:46 PM »

Just bought the 4000K BR30 Hyperikon on Amazon just to see the light quality of 4000K since most of the reviews state the 5000K is too blue. But also got it just to have for comparison against the 5000K Soraa since I've never had a 4000K light.

I've always suspected 5000K as it was with Solux and now Soraa white balance appearance leans more toward 4600K to 4700K. And my camera's AWB picks up on the Soraa's magenta component that attempts to filter green/cyan spikes as I noticed Philips applying to its T8 "Natural Light" flotubes. ACR's "As Shot" green/magenta slider shooting AWB shows the over correction toward green where CFL's force a huge over correction toward magenta like say +30. Soraa's 5000K reads more like 4700K/-10 tint toward green.
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Garnick

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Re: Print Station Lighting--Solux-Fixture options etc
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2017, 12:24:24 PM »

Hello all,

Definitely a lot of very interesting and helpful info in this thread.  For many years my business has consisted mainly of printing for professional as well as serious amateur photographers, both "C" printing and B&W(Silver),  and for the past 12 years inkjet of course.  My light source for viewing/judging my work has always consisted of fluorescent bulbs in the range of 4800 to 5000K with an intensity of approximately 500 to 600 LUX.  I am now in the process of moving my business to my home location, and in doing so, also exploring the various lighting possibilities for judging prints.  Again I come back to my original comment concerning the wealth of information presented thus far in this thread.  However, I have not yet come across any sort of discussion concerning the actual intensity of lighting that should be used for such viewing/judging of the printed work.  I guess what I am asking for is a sort of consensus among the group here as to an average intensity number in LUX for such a light source.  In my search I did find a rather old reference in the "Kodak Encyclopedia Of Photography" series, volume 3, which is a s follows: "For good viewing, a light source should provide an illuminance of 100 + - 50 foot-candles(= approx 600 to 1200 LUX).  50 foot-candles(approx 600 LUX) should be considered a minimum level.  The colour temperature of the light source should be 4000K + - 1000K.  A colour temperature of 3800 to 4000K serves well as an average of various viewing conditions". I then found another set of numbers on the x-rite sight as follows:

Light Intensity
Prints and Proofs
Casual Viewing (exhibition)—800 lux
Judging—2000±500 lux (required)
Judging—2000±250 lux (preferred)
Color temp. - D50 = 5000K

These are somewhat higher LUX numbers than I had anticipated, hence my reason for asking your help on this matter before I make a final decision on the light source and intensity I will be using in my new location.  Your input would be very much appreciated.

Gary 

 


     
« Last Edit: April 16, 2017, 09:01:53 AM by Garnick »
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