Trump II

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

You do understand the point I was making, don't you? Jeff did.

I said "You surely post and quote many articles that do just that."

Sure, the point is that you don't like the subject, which is fine with me.
Next thing is that quotes containing the word/name "trump" are not allowed?
Don't be silly.

Cheers,
Bart

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Actually, there's more evidence that unicorns do exist. 

Indeed they do, they're known as Narwhals.

Cheers,
Bart

[Alan Klein]

The unfortunate part of the whole collusion, and now obstruction business, is that it only has to do with domestic politics.  How the Democrats are going to take back power in Congress in 2018 and win the presidency in 2020.  The Dems could otherwise give a whit about all this. 

It's unfortunate because it's taking our eyes off of really important issues that most Americans who aren't addicted to Trump II are most concerned about.  These are,  Internationally: War, ISIS, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, trade, Russian and Chinese adventurism, North Korea, Iran, etc.  Domestically: taxes, health care, jobs, debt, immigration, opioid addiction, military, VA, etc.  There's no oxygen left in the room for these other more immediate and important issues. 

[Alan Klein]

Seems like the Sanders' family is part of the swamp as well.  Jane his wife is being investigated for bank fraud in 2010 when she was a college president and Senator Bernie for pushing the bank to give the loan.   I'm not saying they actually did this, Jeff, just passing on the article.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-jane-sanders-fbi-investigation_us_594fc816e4b0da2c731c2d1d

[Schewe]

Post #3885 above:

That's the best ya got? Really? The article itself didn't even accuse Trump of collusion, it merely referenced charges of collusion. If you are gonna quote, at least quote the whole darn sentence, not a sentence fragment (like the way Trump speaks)

But Trump’s reckless handling of these events should not distract from a startling reality: As the president faces accusations of colluding with the Russians during last year’s campaign, his policies in office have aligned almost perfectly with the Kremlin’s goals.

So, the article is referencing the face the president is facing accusations of colluding. It's not accusing him of colluding. So, from that tenuous thread you are trying to accuse me of accusing Trump of collusion?

That really is pretty entertaining, thanks...but no, I don't count that as me quoting an article accusing Trump of colluding with Russia, sorry, not guilty as charged...try again?

[Schewe]

Here's an article and Jeff's comments on collusion. Quote from above:
"In the meantime just in case somebody still believes Trump when he says This Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It's an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should've won., well here's Politifact to the rescue ~)"

I guess by rescue, Jeff means he agrees with the article.

Again doooode, ya gotta do better than that. I pointed to a http://www.politifact.com article debunking Trump's claim that "This Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It's an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should've won." was a pants-on-fire lie.

And that is somehow tantamount to an accusation of collusion by Trump how?

We all know (even Trump now but he blames it on Obama) that Russia interfered with our election, right? You believe that, right?

So, my saying "rescue" means I agree with the article is a true statement...

My saying "rescue" means I'm accusing Trump of collusion is a pants-on-fire claim...



#BUZZZZZ Thank's for playing our game...wanna try again?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I never said Trump colluded with Russia...if he did collude, he wouldn't have been capable of keeping his big mouth shut and not brag about it.

What I'm pretty sure about is there is likely some collusion with Russia on the part of Trump's campaign and/or his "satellites".

We know Flynn was talking with the Russians and lied about it.

We know Kushner talked to the Russians and lied about it.

We're pretty sure Manafort was talking to the Russians and we know he was talking Ukrainians who were Russian supporters and lied about it.

We know Carter Page went to Russia with the Trump campaign permission and we know he had been under FBI investigation because he was being requited by known Russian spies.

We know Roger Stone was bragging about Podesta coming under fire just before his emails were released (funny how he predicted that, huh).

What I'm also sure about was that Trump was acting as a "polezni durak" (useful idiot). Michael Hayden, former NSA director and former CIA director, described Trump as a polezni durak, translating the term as "the useful fool, some naif, manipulated by Moscow, secretly held in contempt, but whose blind support is happily accepted and exploited".

Heck, Trump even begged the Russians to try to hack Clinton's emails and release them. And while Trump may have said that largely in jest, don't think for a moment he's wasn't reveling in the release of the DNC Server and Podesta's emails so while Trump may not have colluded, he sure did benefit, right?

But that's why we're having this whole investigation...to find out who did what and why and how to keep it from ever happening again.

[Schewe]

Seems like the Sanders' family is part of the swamp as well.  Jane his wife is being investigated for bank fraud in 2010 when she was a college president and Senator Bernie for pushing the bank to give the loan.   I'm not saying they actually did this, Jeff, just passing on the article.

Yep...he and his wife are being investigated...we'll see what comes of it huh?

[Schewe]

As if the President of the United States doesn't have anything better to do today, he's still fixated on last year's election....

Donald J. Trump  ✔@realDonaldTrump

Hillary Clinton colluded with the Democratic Party in order to beat Crazy Bernie Sanders. Is she allowed to so collude? Unfair to Bernie!

7:00 AM - 25 Jun 2017
17,805 17,805 Retweets   66,451 66,451 likes

Seems he's got "collusion" on his brain...

[Schewe]

Don't let the door hit ya on the way out!

Russia is recalling ambassador at center of Trump campaign controversy: report

Russia is reportedly recalling Ambassador Sergey Kislyak, the man who has emerged as a focal point in the FBI probe into Russia’s election meddling.

BuzzFeed News is citing three sources saying Russia is calling Kislyak back home.

The Kremlin did not confirm to the news outlet when Kislyak would head back to Russia, but the US-Russia Business Council on July 11 will have a going away party for Kislyak at the St. Regis Hotel, the report said.

I hope they let him retire to his да́ча (dacha) rather than, uh, well you know what happens to Russians that disappoint Putin, right?

[Schewe]

Naughty, naughty...

Trump can’t stop hurling ‘Pocahontas’ insult at Warren

President Trump rekindled his feud with persistent critic Sen. Elizabeth Warren on Sunday, saying referring to her as “Pocahontas” is an insult to the Native American woman.

“She’s a hopeless case. I call her Pocahontas, and that’s an insult to Pocahontas,” Trump said in an interview on “Fox and Friends” on Sunday, taking a shot at Warren’s heritage.

Because, you know, he can...not that he should, but he can't help himself...

[Schewe]

So, he admits to throwing the House GOP under the bus just because he wanted the world to know he said "mean" before Obama said "mean" when talking about the Trumpcare bill. Boy, Trump sure is fixated on Obama, huh?



Trump confirms he called health care bill 'mean'

Washington (CNN)President Donald Trump accused former President Barack Obama of stealing his terminology when Obama said last week that there was a 'fundamental meanness' at the core of the Republican health care bill.

During an interview on "Fox and Friends" Sunday morning, Trump was asked about Obama's Facebook Post post condemning the Republican health care plan, and the President responded by saying Obama used the descriptor after he originally did.

"Well he actually used my term, 'mean.' That was my term," Trump said. "Because I want to see -- and I speak from the heart -- that's what I want to see, I want to see a bill with heart."

When White House press secretary Sean Spicer was asked about Trump's use of the word "mean" in reference to the bill last week, Spicer said he wouldn't comment on rumors about what the President may or may not have said behind closed doors.

[Schewe]

So, maybe there ARE tapes?

Trump 'is leaving open the possibility' conversations with Comey were taped: Adviser


Eeeek, sorry about the size...don't mean to give people the creeps (actually, I do)

President Trump is "leaving open the possibility" that his conversations with former FBI Director James Comey were taped, presidential counselor Kellyanne Conway said.

Conway's comments in an interview with ABC News Chief Anchor George Stephanopoulos on Sunday came two days after the president announced on Twitter that he had not personally taped his conversations with Comey.

Trump in a pair of tweets on Thursday wrote: "With all of the recently reported electronic surveillance, intercepts, unmasking and illegal leaking of information, I have no idea whether there are 'tapes' or recordings of my conversations with James Comey, but I did not make, and do not have, any such recordings."

Stephanopoulos asked Conway on "This Week" if the president has tried to end any uncertainty over the issue by asking the intelligence community if it had recorded any of the conversations between Trump and Comey.

She declined to say.

“I'm not going to comment on his conversations with his intelligence community," Conway said. “He is leaving open the possibility that it could have happened.”

Wait, what? Are there tapes? Who's on first? I don't know...he's on second!

[Alan Klein]

Russia is recalling ambassador at center of Trump campaign controversy: report

The Kremlin did not confirm to the news outlet when Kislyak would head back to Russia, but the US-Russia Business Council on July 11 will have a going away party for Kislyak at the St. Regis Hotel, the report said.

They should have had the going away party at one of Trump's Hotels.  Just to rub it in and drive the Democrats and the media nuts.  Could you imagine that news cycle?

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

That's the best ya got? Really? The article itself didn't even accuse Trump of collusion, it merely referenced charges of collusion. If you are gonna quote, at least quote the whole darn sentence, not a sentence fragment (like the way Trump speaks)

So, the article is referencing the face the president is facing accusations of colluding. It's not accusing him of colluding. So, from that tenuous thread you are trying to accuse me of accusing Trump of collusion?

That really is pretty entertaining, thanks...but no, I don't count that as me quoting an article accusing Trump of colluding with Russia, sorry, not guilty as charged...try again?

That's too funny.

Now... you are not accusing Trump of colluding... the article did not accuse Trump of colluding... Comey did not accuse Trump of colluding...but nevertheless, everybody, including yourself, is "just referencing" the accusations of colluding. So, who is actually accusing Trump? Apparently nobody, including yourself, is willing to admit the accusations (because, you know, that would make them look stupid), but somehow, someone is making the accusations, and the rest, the "innocent" gang is just "referencing" it.

Potato, potahto.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... Trump can’t stop hurling ‘Pocahontas’ insult at Warren

You know, there currently is an ad for Disney on Hulu that splashes the word Pocahontas across the screen. And every time that happens, my image of that heroine is destroyed by first recollecting the deranged, rabid Democrat. Damn you, Trump!

[Alan Klein]

Naughty, naughty...

Trump can’t stop hurling ‘Pocahontas’ insult at Warren



Because, you know, he can...not that he should, but he can't help himself...

You don't get the joke.  He's not insulting Indians.  He's insulting Warren who passed herself of as an Indian when she was younger so she could take advantage of a minority status.  That gained her entrance into schools and getting other benefits she would not have otherwise received.  She impersonated a minority of a different race and people.  She tried to be Pocahontas for personal gain.  So calling her Pocahontas reminds the world what a phony she is. 

[Schewe]

Trump is struggling to stay calm on Russia, one morning call at a time

President Trump has a new morning ritual. Around 6:30 a.m. on many days — before all the network news shows have come on the air — he gets on the phone with a member of his outside legal team to chew over all things Russia.

The calls — detailed by three senior White House officials — are part strategy consultation and part presidential venting session, during which Trump’s lawyers and public-relations gurus take turns reviewing the latest headlines with him. They also devise their plan for battling his avowed enemies: the special counsel leading the Russia investigation; the “fake news” media chronicling it; and, in some instances, the president’s own Justice Department overseeing the probe.

His advisers have encouraged the calls — which the early-to-rise Trump takes from his private quarters in the White House residence — in hopes that he can compartmentalize the widening Russia investigation. By the time the president arrives for work in the Oval Office, the thinking goes, he will no longer be consumed by the Russia probe that he complains hangs over his presidency like a darkening cloud.

It rarely works, however. Asked whether the tactic was effective, one top White House adviser paused for several seconds and then just laughed.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

A bit of history. What an Egyptian leader said about the request that all women should wear hijab when in public... in 1958 (!)

A required reading (watching) for all "multiculturalism" and "inclusiveness" nutjobs:

https://www.facebook.com/inthenow/videos/834567250026979/

[Alan Klein]

So, maybe there ARE tapes?

Trump 'is leaving open the possibility' conversations with Comey were taped: Adviser

Wait, what? Are there tapes? Who's on first? I don't know...he's on second!

Trump is playing you, the liberal media and the democrats like a well-tuned xylophone.  Bang! and you run down that blind alley.  Bing! and you then run down that dark alley.   

 He's keeping the tapes issue in the air (trolling?) to get you guys to run around like a chicken without a head.  He keeps capturing every news cycle.   His supporters get it and his enemies are getting ulcers.  Meanwhile, he's laughing it all up as the media fools keep trying to decipher the tea leaves. 

THERE ARE NO TAPES.  Now, there. 

[Schewe]

He's not insulting Indians.

Actually, he is...even the name Pocahontas generally refers to a historical myth with racist overtones...in case you are unfamiliar with the REAL "Pocahontas" whose birth name was actually Matoaka, here's a story about the historical sad reality...and if you know the real story of Pocahontas you would understand why native Americans find the use of the name to describe Warren as racist...and so should you. (I'll be you don't real the whole story :~)

The True Story of Pocahontas: Historical Myths Versus Sad Reality

Pocahontas had a Native Husband and Native Child; Never Married John Smith

Vincent Schilling • March 21, 2017

Despite what many people believe due to longstanding and inaccurate accounts in history books and movies such as Disney’s Pocahontas, the true story of Pocahontas is not one of a young Native Powhatan woman with a raccoon friend who dove off of mountain-like cliffs off the coasts of Virginia. (Note: there are no cliffs on the coast of Virginia.)

The true story of Pocahontas is a tale of tragedy and heartbreak.

It is time to bust up the misconceptions perpetuated over 400 years regarding the young daughter of Powhatan chief Wahunsenaca. The truth—gathered from years of extensive research of the historical record, books, and oral histories from self-identified descendants of Pocahontas and tribal peoples of Virginia —is not for the faint of heart.

The story of Pocahontas is a tragic tale of a young Native girl who was kidnapped, sexually assaulted and allegedly murdered by those who were supposed to keep her safe.

Pocahontas’ Mother, Also Named Pocahontas, Died While Giving Birth to Her

This is in many historical accounts, though not always. It is important to note that Pocahontas was born to her mother, named Pocahontas and her father Wahunsenaca, (sometimes spelled Wahunsenakah), who later became the paramount chief.

Her name at birth was Matoaka, which means “flower between two streams,” and according to Mattaponi history was likely given to her because she was born between the two rivers of Mattaponi and Pamunkey (York).

Due to his wife’s death, Wahunsenaca was devastated and little Matoaka became his favorite because she looked like her mother. She was raised by her aunts and other women of the Mattaponi tribe at Werowocomoco.

As was custom at the time, as the Paramount Chief of the Powhatan Chiefdom, Wahunsenaca had other wives from the other villages and little Matoaka had many loving brothers and sisters.

Because of his lingering grief and due to the reminder she gave to him of her mother, Wahunsenaca often called his daughter the endearing name of Pocahontas.

John Smith Came to the Powhatan When Pocahontas Was about 9 or 10

According to Mattaponi oral history, little Matoaka was possibly about 10 years old when John Smith and English colonists arrived in Tsenacomoca in the spring of 1607. John Smith was about 27 years old. They were never married nor involved.

Pocahontas Never Saved the Life of John Smith

The children of the Powhatan were very closely watched and cared for by all members of the tribe. Since Pocahontas was living with her father, Chief Powhatan Wahunsenaca, at Werowocomoco, and because she was the daughter of a chief, she was likely held to even stricter standards and provided with more structure and cultural training.

When she was a child, John Smith and English colonists stayed near the Powhatan on the nearby Jamestown Island, but later began to explore outlying areas. Smith was feared by many Native people because he was known to enter villages and put guns to heads of chiefs demanding food and supplies.

In the winter of 1607, the colonists and Smith met with Powhatan warriors and Smith was captured by the chief’s younger brother.

Because the English and Powhatan feared the actions of the Spanish, they formed an alliance. Eventually and according to oral history and contemporary written accounts by the Mattaponi, Wahunsenaca grew to like Smith, eventually offering him the position of ‘werowance’ or leader of the colonists as recognized by the Powhatan as well as a much more livable area for his people with great access to game and seafood.

Years later, Smith alleged that Pocahontas saved his life in the four-day process of becoming a werowance. But according to Mattaponi oral and contemporary written accounts, there would be no reason to kill a man designated to receive an honor by the chief.

Additionally, children were not allowed to attend any sort of religious ritual similar to the werowance ceremony.

She could not have thrown herself in front of John Smith to beg for his life for two reasons: Smith was being honored, and she would not have been allowed to be there.

Pocahontas Never Defied Her Father to Bring Food to John Smith or Jamestown

Some historical accounts claim Pocahontas defied her father to bring food to the colonists of Jamestown. According to the history of the Mattaponi tribe as well as simple facts, these claims could not be true.

Jamestown was 12 miles from Werowocomoco and the likelihood that a 10-year-old daughter would travel alone are inconsistent with Powhatan culture. She as well as other tribal members did travel to Jamestown, but as a gesture of peace. 

Additionally, travel to Jamestown required crossing large bodies of water and the use of 400-pound dugout canoes. It took a team of strong people to lift them into the water.

It is likely Pocahontas served as a symbol of peace by simply being present as a child among her people to show no ill intentions when her people met with the Jamestown settlers. 

Pocahontas Did Not Sneak Into Jamestown to Warn John Smith About a Death Plot

In 1608 and 1609, John Smith’s role as the werowance (chief) of the colonists had taken an ugly turn. The colonists made inadequate attempts to plant crops to harvest, and Smith violently demanded supplies from surrounding villages after once again holding a gun to the heads of village leaders. 

Accounts from Mattaponi histories tell of one tribal woman proclaiming to Smith, “You call yourself a Christian, yet you leave us with no food for the winter.”

Pocahontas’ father, who had befriended Smith, once said to him, “I have not treated any of my werowances as well as you, yet you are the worst werowance I have!”

Smith claimed Wahunsenaca wanted to kill him, and asserted he knew of the plot because Pocahontas had come to warn him.

Due to the icy conditions at the time and because of the many watchful eyes attending to the daughter of a chief, as well as gestures of peace by the Powhatan to include additional provisions, Native historians rebuff the historical claims of Smith as completely fabricated.

To further prove Smith’s tale was a fabrication, a letter by Smith written in 1608 was published without Smith’s knowledge. The letter makes no claim of Pocahontas trying to save his life on two separate occasions. It wasn’t until Smith published his book General Historie of Virginia in 1624 that he claimed Pocahontas had twice saved his life. Any of the people who could have refuted Smith’s claims by that time were no longer alive.

As Colonists Terrorized Native People, Pocahontas Married and Became Pregnant
The early 1600’s were a horrible time for tribes near Werowocomoco. Native tribes once comfortable wearing clothing suitable for summer — including exposed breasts for Native women and little or nothing for children — found themselves being sexually targeted by English colonists.

Young children were targets of rape and Native women in the tribe would resort to offering themselves to men to keep their children safe. The Powhatan people were shocked by the behavior and were horrified that the English government offered them no protections.

In the midst of the horrible and atrocious acts committed by the colonists, Matoaka was coming of age. During a ceremony, Matoaka was to choose a new name, and she selected Pocahontas, after her mother. During a courtship dance, it is likely she danced with Kocoum, the younger brother of Potowomac Chief Japazaw.

She married the young warrior at about 14 and soon became pregnant.

It was at this time rumors began to surface that colonists planned to kidnap the beloved chief’s daughter Pocahontas.

Pocahontas Was Kidnapped, Her Husband Was Murdered and She Was Forced to Give Up Her First Child 

When Pocahontas was about 15 or 16, the rumors of a possible kidnapping had become more of a threat and she was living with her husband Kocoum at his Potowomac village.

An English colonist by the name of Captain Samuel Argall sought to find her, thinking that a captured daughter of the chief would thwart attacks by Natives.

Hearing of her whereabouts, Argall came to the village and demanded Chief Japazaw, brother of Pocahontas’ husband, to give up Pocahontas or suffer violence against his village. Overcome with grief at a horrible choice, he relented with a hopeful promise that she would only be gone temporarily. That was a promise Argall quickly broke.

Before Argall left the village, he gave Chief Japazaw a copper pot. He later claimed to have traded it for her. This “trade” is still taught by historians. This is akin to the way that Smith ‘traded’ for corn by holding a gun to the heads of chiefs.

Before leaving the village, Pocahontas had to give her baby (referred to as little Kocoum) to the women of the village. Trapped onboard an English ship, she was not aware that when her husband returned to their village, he was killed by the colonists.

The tribal chiefs of the Powhatan never retaliated for the kidnapping of Pocahontas, fearing they would be captured and that the beloved daughter of the chief and the “Peace Symbol of the Powhatan” might be harmed.

Pocahontas Was Raped While in Captivity and Became Pregnant With Her Second Child

According to Dr. Linwood Custalow, a historian of the Mattaponi Tribe and the custodian of the sacred oral history of Pocahontas, soon after being kidnapped, she was suffering from depression and was growing more fearful and withdrawn. Her extreme anxiety was so severe her English captors allowed Pocahontas’ eldest sister Mattachanna and her husband Uttamattamakin to come to her aid.

Dr. Custalow writes in his book, The True Story of Pocahontas, The Other Side of History, that when Mattachanna and her husband Uttamattamakin, a spiritual advisor to Chief Wahunsenaca, Pocahontas confided in her sister.

When Mattachanna and Uttamattamakin arrived at Jamestown, Pocahontas confided in that she had been raped. Mattaponi sacred oral history is very clear on this: Pocahontas was raped. It is possible that it had been done to her by more than one person and repeatedly. My grandfather and other teachers of Mattaponi oral history said that Pocahontas was raped.

The possibility of being taken captive was a danger to be aware of in Powhatan Society, but rape was not tolerated. Rape in Powhatan Society was virtually unheard of because the punishment for such actions was so severe. Powhatan society did not have prisons. Punishment for wrongful actions often consisted of banishment from the tribe.

Historians differ on where Pocahontas was held, but tribal historians believe she was likely held in Jamestown, but was relocated to Henrico to when she was pregnant.

Pocahontas had a son, Thomas.

John Rolfe Married Pocahontas to Create a Native Alliance in Tobacco Production

Mattaponi history is clear that Pocahontas had a son out of wedlock, Thomas, prior to her marriage to John Rolfe. Prior to that marriage, the colonists pressed Pocahontas to become “civilized” and often told her that her father did not love her because he had not come to rescue her.

Pocahontas often tore off her English clothes, because they were uncomfortable. Eventually, Pocahontas was converted to Christianity and took the name Rebecca.

In the midst of her captivity, the English colony of Jamestown was failing. John Rolfe was under a 1616 deadline to become profitable or lose the support of England. Rolfe sought to learn tobacco curing techniques from the Powhatan, but curing tobacco was a sacred practice not to be shared with outsiders. Realizing the political strength of aligning himself with the tribe, he eventually married Pocahontas.

Though some historians claim Pocahontas and Rolfe married for love, it is not a certainty, as Pocahontas was never allowed to see her family, child or father after being kidnapped.

After the two were married, the Powhatan spiritual leaders and family to Pocahontas shared the curing practice with Rolfe. Soon afterwards, Rolfe’s tobacco was a sensation in England, which saved the colony of Jamestown, as they finally found a profitable venture.

The Powhatan tribal lands were now highly sought after for the tobacco trade and the tribe suffered great losses of life and land at the hands of greedy tobacco farmers.

It is worth noting that though it was custom for a Powhatan father to give away his daughter at a marriage, Wahunsenaca did not attend the wedding of his daughter to Rolfe for fear of being captured or killed. He did send a strand of pearls as a gift.

As Dr. Custalow wrote in The True Story of Pocahontas, The Other Side of History:

Although Wahunsenaca did not attend the wedding, we know through sacred Mattaponi oral history that he gave Pocahontas a pearl necklace as a wedding gift. The pearls were obtained from the Chesapeake Bay oyster beds. The necklace was notable for the large size and fine quality of the pearls. Pearls of the size were rare, making them a suitable gift for a paramount chief’s daughter. No mention of this necklace has been found in the English writings, but a portrait of Pocahontas wearing a pearl necklace used to hang in the Gov.’s mansion in Richmond.

Pocahontas Was Brought to England To Raise Money and Was Then Likely Murdered
Rumors of the colonists desire to bring Pocahontas made its way to the Powhatan, who feared for her well-being and considered an attempt to rescue her. But Wahunsenaca feared his daughter might be harmed.

Rebecca “Pocahontas” Rolfe traveled to England with John Rolfe, her son Thomas Rolfe, Captain John Argall (who had kidnapped her) and several Native tribal members, including her sister Mattachanna.

Though many settlers were committing atrocities against the Powhatan, many elites in England did not approve of the mistreatment of natives. The bringing of Pocahontas to England to show friendship with Native nations was a key to continued financial support for the colonists.

According to the accounts of Mattachanna, she realized that she was being used and desperately desired to return home to her father and little Kocoum. During her travels in England, Pocahontas did meet John Smith and expressed outrage due to the mistreatment of his position as leader of the colonists and the betrayal to the Powhatan people.

After the journey and showing off of Pocahontas to the English elites, plans were made to return to Virginia in the spring of 1617. According to a recounting by Mattachanna, she was in good health while in England and on the ship preparing to go home.

Shortly after a dinner with Rolfe and Argall, she vomited and died. Those tribal members who were accompanying her, including her sister Mattachanna, said she was in previous good health and assessed she must have been poisoned due to her sudden death.

According to Mattaponi oral history, many of the Native people accompanying Pocahontas were sold as servants or carnival attractions or sent to Bermuda if they became pregnant after being raped and sold into slavery.

Pocahontas was just under 21 at the time of her death. Instead of being taken home and laid to rest with her father, Rolfe and Argall took her to Gravesend, England, where she was buried at Saint George’s Church, March 21, 1617. Though Virginia tribes have requested that her remains returned for repatriation, officials in England say the exact whereabouts of her remains are not known.   

Wahunsenaca learned from Mattachanna that his beloved daughter had died but had never betrayed her people, as some historians claim. Heartbroken that he had not ever rescued his daughter, he died from grief less than a year after the death of Pocahontas.

The Descendants of Pocahontas

Oral histories of both the Mattaponi and Patawomeck and historical references say she mothered two children, Thomas Rolfe, who was left in England after the death of his mother, and ‘little Kocoum.’

According to Deyo, Little Kocoum was the name that Dr. Linwood Custalow used for the purpose of his book to reference a small child whose name was not yet known.  In the sacred oral history of the Mattaponi, the child was raised by the Patawomeck Tribe. The name of that child was passed down in the Patawomeck oral history was discovered to be Ka-Okee, a daughter.

This lineage to Ka-Okee includes the world famous entertainer Wayne Newton, a member of the Virginia state-recognized Powhatan Patawomeck tribe.

Thomas Rolfe stayed in England and was educated there. He later returned to the Powhatan as an adult. He was married and had many descendants.