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Author Topic: Leica M10 Review  (Read 8490 times)

Sal_VE

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #40 on: February 02, 2017, 03:33:01 AM »

I agree that is not possible to remove all variables. There will Always be differences between the 2 test. Although I will post two samples of the same shot, with the following:
- Sony 7Mr2 + adapter+ 50 summicron M
- Leica M240, same lens
same aperture, same exposure. Both raw and no curve applied (C1 linear curve)
Beside the obvious difference in file size, there is a slight difference in tonal rendering along the Whole scale of darks trough highlights. This difference is reflected in the color rendering.
Is it dynamic range? Perhaps.
The difference is even stronger using sony's lens. But here I add another variable
As soon as I can locate those file in my Archives they'll be posted for your evaluation.
As you say, I'm very happy with my Leica results. Happier with film, for what is my pictorial ideal.
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Rob C

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #41 on: February 02, 2017, 06:28:42 AM »

I agree that is not possible to remove all variables. There will Always be differences between the 2 test. Although I will post two samples of the same shot, with the following:
- Sony 7Mr2 + adapter+ 50 summicron M
- Leica M240, same lens
same aperture, same exposure. Both raw and no curve applied (C1 linear curve)
Beside the obvious difference in file size, there is a slight difference in tonal rendering along the Whole scale of darks trough highlights. This difference is reflected in the color rendering.
Is it dynamic range? Perhaps.
The difference is even stronger using sony's lens. But here I add another variable
As soon as I can locate those file in my Archives they'll be posted for your evaluation.
As you say, I'm very happy with my Leica results. Happier with film, for what is my pictorial ideal.


Re film, I agree wholeheartedly. But, I simply don't want to go back to the time-lag that the process inevitably involves, and the logistics here in the Med are too annoying to be worth the effort.

Rob

alainbriot

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #42 on: February 02, 2017, 07:14:35 PM »

What I both like with Leica is that the M series was able to move from film to digital capture with no major modifications of the camera except that capture is now digital instead of film.  It's a classy transition that brings users the advantages of digital capture without losing the characteristics that made Leica Ms popular and succesful.
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Alain Briot
Author of Mastering Landscape Photography, Mastering Composition, Creativity and Personal Style., Marketing Fine Art Photography and How Photographs are Sold.
http://www.beautiful-landscape.com

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #43 on: February 02, 2017, 07:23:26 PM »

What I both like with Leica is that the M series was able to move from film to digital capture with no major modifications of the camera except that capture is now digital instead of film.  It's a classy transition that brings users the advantages of digital capture without losing the characteristics that made Leica Ms popular and succesful.

True, but can the same not be said of DSLRs and MF cameras too?

- I use my D810 the same way I used to use my F100
- There is basically no difference between an Hassy H1 and a H6D-100c
- ...

Cheers,
Bernard
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alainbriot

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #44 on: February 02, 2017, 07:30:24 PM »

True, but can the same not be said of DSLRs and MF cameras too?

- I use my D810 the same way I used to use my F100
- There is basically no difference between an Hassy H1 and a H6D-100c
- ...

Cheers,
Bernard

I have no experience with these two cameras so I'll take your word for it.  The main difference with the Leica M is how long it has been around, being the first camera to have made use of 35mm film.  For me the fact that Leica Ms still don't have autofocus is the most remarkable aspect.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2017, 07:35:12 PM by alainbriot »
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Alain Briot
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2017, 10:19:03 PM »

I have no experience with these two cameras so I'll take your word for it.  The main difference with the Leica M is how long it has been around, being the first camera to have made use of 35mm film.  For me the fact that Leica Ms still don't have autofocus is the most remarkable aspect.

I find those very hard to focus accurately, but the M is indeed a nice option.

Cheers,
Bernard
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adias

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #46 on: February 02, 2017, 10:35:57 PM »

... the Leica M  ... being the first camera to have made use of 35mm film. 

I do not think Leica was the first manufacturer of 35mm cameras - LINK.

alainbriot

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #47 on: February 02, 2017, 11:41:56 PM »

I do not think Leica was the first manufacturer of 35mm cameras - LINK.

Thanks for the history lesson.  I had no idea.  However, none had the impact of the Leica, certainly not on me since I had never heard of them.
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Alain Briot
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Rob C

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #48 on: February 03, 2017, 03:40:37 AM »

Thanks for the history lesson.  I had no idea.  However, none had the impact of the Leica, certainly not on me since I had never heard of them.


I had no idea either; just goes to show the value of a powerful trumpet! (No pun intended - at first.)

Advertise or tell a fib long enough and the world believes it. Wish I'd known that when I was younger...

Rob C
« Last Edit: February 03, 2017, 05:57:24 PM by Rob C »
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Telecaster

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #49 on: February 03, 2017, 04:16:53 PM »

Lots of "firsts" are actually just commercially successful firsts. Which is nothing to sneer at. Leo Fender didn't invent the solidbody electric guitar…he just designed & built the first one that really worked well. And with the help of Fender Sales & its first-class promotional skills that guitar caught on with musicians. Et voilà!

-Dave-
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adias

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #50 on: February 03, 2017, 10:03:08 PM »

I simply checked the statement as I recalled other manufacturers had 35mm cameras before Leitz. But boy, did I ruffle a few feathers, sensitivities, or biases. :)

Rob C

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #51 on: February 04, 2017, 03:57:34 AM »

I simply checked the statement as I recalled other manufacturers had 35mm cameras before Leitz. But boy, did I ruffle a few feathers, sensitivities, or biases. :)


How so? All you did was show that there had been other stills users of cine film before the Leica was made. I would have considered your link as interesting, not at all combative or negative, so no ruffled feathers - at least as far as I can see.

Of course, whether or not your position had been to cause upset is another matter, which only you will know.

As it stands, thank you for the link which I found interesting.

Rob C

alainbriot

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #52 on: February 05, 2017, 12:14:08 PM »

I simply checked the statement as I recalled other manufacturers had 35mm cameras before Leitz. But boy, did I ruffle a few feathers, sensitivities, or biases. :)

It certainly did not ruffle my feathers as you put it.  I sell art you know ;-) If this was all it takes to ruffle me out I'd be out of business!
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Alain Briot
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roscoetuff

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #53 on: February 18, 2017, 07:55:12 AM »

Well.... I don't second guess. I love the idea that Leica is actually listening to their base and anticipate this will lead to good things. I also like they didn't RAISE the  price into the stratosphere. I'd love to have one. This is the first digital Leica where the specs seem to hit all the right spots. Maybe they missed on the megapixels in sticking at 24, but even then... as a camera that shoots in their defined style, I'm sure they'll be forgiven.

For my part, the price point from the outside - with no M mount lenses is just too high. I couldn't even swing for an old digital Leica because "why buy a cheap VW when you really want a Porsche?" If you're going to want to buy that Porsche, the VW just raises the price. So I bought a Leica M4-2 as a platform to shoot B&W and gather a few M-mount lenses figuring if I didn't like it, the exit wouldn't cost much either. I'm very happy with my Zeiss ZM lenses by the way, and not feeling this was a mistake at all. Now if the M10 prices will just suddenly come into range, it's a much smaller step.

Great review! Great pics as always.
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donbga

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #54 on: February 18, 2017, 09:46:32 AM »

Well.... I don't second guess. I love the idea that Leica is actually listening to their base and anticipate this will lead to good things. I also like they didn't RAISE the  price into the stratosphere. I'd love to have one. This is the first digital Leica where the specs seem to hit all the right spots. Maybe they missed on the megapixels in sticking at 24, but even then... as a camera that shoots in their defined style, I'm sure they'll be forgiven.

For my part, the price point from the outside - with no M mount lenses is just too high. I couldn't even swing for an old digital Leica because "why buy a cheap VW when you really want a Porsche?" If you're going to want to buy that Porsche, the VW just raises the price. So I bought a Leica M4-2 as a platform to shoot B&W and gather a few M-mount lenses figuring if I didn't like it, the exit wouldn't cost much either. I'm very happy with my Zeiss ZM lenses by the way, and not feeling this was a mistake at all. Now if the M10 prices will just suddenly come into range, it's a much smaller step.

Great review! Great pics as always.

I'll keep my Zeiss Ikon ZM thank you! I've always wanted that Red-Dot feeling but my wallet always pushed back.
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Rob C

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Re: Leica M10 Review
« Reply #55 on: February 18, 2017, 11:13:41 AM »

I'll keep my Zeiss Ikon ZM thank you! I've always wanted that Red-Dot feeling but my wallet always pushed back.


Thank your wallet, then.

True stealth bombers hide red dots and adopt camouflage. Your wallet knows you don't need that camera, and that it would only get you into trouble.

;-)

Rob C
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