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Author Topic: Beyond the Print  (Read 5284 times)

Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2016, 12:19:42 PM »

It is a good idea but I don't see it instead of a print, but in addition to the prints. I agree with Russ that some images that don't need a sequence.

I agree.  I have many paper prints on my walls.  I eventually ran out of wall space, yet kept taking images that deserved display.  When electronic displays began getting very cheap they solved my wall space problem.

Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2016, 12:32:13 PM »

Oh we already have what you are talking about - those digital photo frames where you insert a memory card with photos and program it to cycle thru them every X minutes.

I propose an extension of "photographic style" by capturing how a scene changes with time or viewpoint via a sequence.  The hardware has been with us for years.  Almost all the landscape photography at present is "a moment in time".  I think we can go beyond a single image capture and thus capture more of the "essence" of a visual experience.

kikashi

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #22 on: September 26, 2016, 12:34:45 PM »

Oh we already have what you are talking about - those digital photo frames where you insert a memory card with photos and program it to cycle thru them every X minutes.

Even better - you can control some of them via the Web. My brother and I use one (Nixplay) to let our mother have a series of our photos. It's really rather nice, but it's no substitute for a large print.

Jeremy
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Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2016, 11:45:50 PM »

In order to clarify what I am proposing, I have added more examples to my web site [https://www.changingstaticimages.com]. I am proposing that we can improve the landscape aesthetic by adding image sequences which we could not do in the past with a "print".

GrahamBy

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2016, 08:17:33 AM »

Maybe it would be better to speak of creating a different aesthetic, rather than "improving." They are bound to be different and not immediately comparable.

Although it isn't landscape, David Bailey makes the point that despite all the hours of news-reel film exposed in Vietnam, the most powerful images for changing public opinion were two B&W stills: the vietcong soldier having his brains blown out, and the little girl burnt by napalm running down the road.
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Rob C

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #25 on: October 07, 2016, 08:48:38 AM »

Maybe it would be better to speak of creating a different aesthetic, rather than "improving." They are bound to be different and not immediately comparable.

Although it isn't landscape, David Bailey makes the point that despite all the hours of news-reel film exposed in Vietnam, the most powerful images for changing public opinion were two B&W stills: the vietcong soldier having his brains blown out, and the little girl burnt by napalm running down the road.


On top of which, who remembers any newsreels stuff accurately enough, other than the Twin Towers, to identify places or times? It all merges into the same thing: witness the Middle Eastern conflicts. Even Afghanistan - beyond the pretty picture of the lass with the piercing eyes...

The still shot is often accompanied with touching text which, together, make the whole memorable and also accessible quite easily at later dates. Newsreel vanishes as soon as it's off the screen.

Rob

petermfiore

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #26 on: October 07, 2016, 09:02:36 AM »

Hi Rob,

One piece of newsreel footage that is very memorable...the Hindenburg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgWHbpMVQ1Uhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgWHbpMVQ1U


Peter
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Rob C

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2016, 09:36:43 AM »

Hi Rob,

One piece of newsreel footage that is very memorable...the Hindenburg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgWHbpMVQ1Uhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgWHbpMVQ1U


Peter


Indeed! Maybe that's a reason I no longer like flying. Was a time I felt withdrawal symptoms if there wasn't a flight in the future; now I am happy never to fly again, if avoidable. Not only do I trust aircraft less and less physically, the whole experience has moved from being something cosseting to being a member of a herd of cattle. I'd rather drive a week than fly three hours. Perhaps it's an underlying dislike of being wedged in beside strangers and especially those bearing children. It has certainly lost its cachet.

Rob

chez

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #28 on: October 08, 2016, 06:53:29 PM »


Indeed! Maybe that's a reason I no longer like flying. Was a time I felt withdrawal symptoms if there wasn't a flight in the future; now I am happy never to fly again, if avoidable. Not only do I trust aircraft less and less physically, the whole experience has moved from being something cosseting to being a member of a herd of cattle. I'd rather drive a week than fly three hours. Perhaps it's an underlying dislike of being wedged in beside strangers and especially those bearing children. It has certainly lost its cachet.

Rob

Yeh driving would be great...but unless you just want to hermit in your own little world...I still need to fly if I want to get to places like Vietnam or Iceland...or just about anywhere interesting in this world.
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degrub

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #29 on: October 08, 2016, 08:52:07 PM »

and there in lies the rub....what one finds interesting...and what one can do with it. Has nothing to do with being a hermit crab.
Frank
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Rob C

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #30 on: October 09, 2016, 04:37:01 AM »

Being a hermit is a matter of mental attitide, and little to do with travel.

This little island, for example, is filled to disaster point with tourists every summer, and with bicycle maniacs every autumn, winter and spring. (Suicide jockey was a term coined for these people who regard white, edge safety-lines for bicycles on roads as the ideal marker for side-by-side riding, one on each side of said line.) The point, though, is this: the bulk of the summer flock seems to care nothing for local ways, culture, food  nor anything else: just sun, sand, free sex (they hope), booze and the production of fresh pavement pizzas each night. They fly in from God alone knows where, and go back home knowing nothing more than they did on arrival. Go, Johnny go! And please take your carapace back with you.

Of course, the problem is that they aren't LuLa readers and probably not even rabid snappers of images. That may or may not preclude sexting, though the latter may actually be an invention of the media and not really exist: no young lady, known or otherwise, has sent me either a requested (never requested) or unsolicited personal portrait of hidden bits via cellphone. I almost feel deprived.

Practical notes: my islands are double-edged swords: they make caravans very rare because of ferry costs (yes!) but also make moving off to the mainland of Europe quite a drag that involves booking, deciding how long you will stay away and thus how much you're gonna be screwed for the choice of type of tickets for your pair of little ovenight sailings. Ideally, the price should be standard, however long the muse tells you to drift in Europe - or beyond, if Visa is available strongly enough. How on Earth are you meant to know how the damned trip's gonna turn out? You may suddenly feel homesick or quite the opposite!

I hate the concept of variable pricing. Just as with airlines, they screw you when there is little choice of alternatives, and now it seems that when the volume is low, they no longer offer the flights at all. So, the sanctimonious argument about providing loooow-cost in winter and making up for such generosity in summer no longer holds if you want to fly here from Glasgow or Newastle, though I believe London always has flights available. That travelling north to south in Britain, which using London often necessitates, is also a heist-in-action is neither here nor there, which is why I mention it.

Rob
« Last Edit: January 06, 2017, 04:11:12 AM by Rob C »
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kers

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #31 on: October 09, 2016, 05:05:41 AM »

Maybe it would be better to speak of creating a different aesthetic, rather than "improving."
+1
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Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2016, 03:00:04 PM »

Maybe it would be better to speak of creating a different aesthetic, rather than "improving." They are bound to be different and not immediately comparable.


The "different aesthetic" requires consideration of time - how long should the image sequence cover, how many frames, what display time for each image?
 
I constructed one sequence by extracting particular frames from a 4K video of a person moving through a landscape.  Each image was a composition on its own but as a sequence it conveyed more of the range of body movement and relationship to the background. I could remove awkward positions, only keeping "key" frames.

Other sequences have been of beach sand. A few years ago I displayed a changing abstract sand pattern as a triptych. However it was too limiting and now I have image sequences showing how the patterns of sand change as waves come and recede.

Another aspect is the lack of need for high resolution since it is displayed on a 2K or 4K screen.
 
There remains the need to consider colour and intensity range. The new HDR (High Dynamic Range) 4K video format along with OLED and ULED display technology is capable of stunning image quality.

Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #33 on: January 04, 2017, 07:14:34 PM »

Given the quality of the TV displays announced/displayed at CES 2017, in my opinion this further dooms the "paper print display".  Reiterating my earlier posts, this is in two areas; (1) display quality (2) dynamic creativity.

(1) requires landscape photographers to pay more attention to colour coding.  JPEG coding is a limitation, current and future electronic displays can display a wider colour gamut. At present I mainly use JPEG because it is convenient and widespread.  With current electronic displays I can produce "stunning" images with JPEG images, but they could be better (for the purists).

(2) requires photographers to explore how to better convey visually cued emotion.  My website https://www.changingstaticimages.com has further discussion and examples of what I mean.

The current push for quality TV displays is for large form-factor displays, probably because that is where companies can make the most money.  Eventually these will be available in smaller "picture frame" sizes.  The Samsung Q9 "hanging" display shows what is possible in a thin display that is "hung" on a wall and minimises cable connections.

Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #34 on: January 13, 2017, 12:46:50 AM »

I have updated my web site https://www.changingstaticimages.com to include a section on "cars" where I explore an alternate way of presenting automobile images.  During a recent visit to a local car museum I took lots of "traditional" still images, but found them boring when I reviewed them.  I did get more excited with images that I could utilise as sequences - more dramatic!

Sharon VL

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #35 on: January 13, 2017, 02:16:13 PM »

We have series of waves at various points. They are interesting prints as you move down a wall and see the wave in "action". There is something about a print that no display can duplicate and vice versa. I prefer the print. I think we tend to like our own work on video displays but would others? I don't know. It reminds me too much of wallpaper for your pc's or macs desktop.

I think it is great that you have found a way to display your work that excites you - that's what it's all about. We all don't need or want to do the same thing.

wmchauncey

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #36 on: January 15, 2017, 09:33:02 AM »

What about...given the cost of printing and framing large images to hang in your living room...
would you rather have numerous prints or one of those new OLED televisions to display your stuff?
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Rob C

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #37 on: January 15, 2017, 10:12:39 AM »

What about...given the cost of printing and framing large images to hang in your living room...
would you rather have numerous prints or one of those new OLED televisions to display your stuff?

Prints, every time. I already have prints and paintings on the available walls; the electronic screen is never on anymore other than to catch some news. For me, tv and its associated media are dead. I detest the faux reality of elecronic imagery; it only serves a purpose as an example of something else, something tangible. A print, even unframed, is tangible. Of course, future generations may never understand what that might mean, never mind be.

;-(

Rob

Peter McLennan

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #38 on: January 15, 2017, 01:07:14 PM »

now I am happy never to fly again, if avoidable... the whole experience has moved from being something cosseting to being a member of a herd of cattle...dislike of being wedged in beside strangers and especially those bearing children.

I recently flew overnight nonstop diagonally across the world's largest ocean. From Vancouver to Auckland. A journey that took James Cook months took me one night - three movies, two tasty meals (with a superb Sauvignon Blanc) and a short snooze.

My active noise cancelling headphones isolated all but the tiniest whisper from the cranky two-year-old in the row ahead of me and automated passport readers and well-prepared, efficient security procedures mitigated, if not eliminated, most of the herd-of-cattle feelings.

A miracle, if you ask me.

I made a digital article about my attenuated photo trip to The South Island.  You can read it here if you like. About a five minute read.

https://indd.adobe.com/view/fc8ae9c8-e4c8-4d67-a805-d15d76af5c27



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Victor_John

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Re: Beyond the Print
« Reply #39 on: January 15, 2017, 06:26:33 PM »

Prints, every time. I already have prints and paintings on the available walls; the electronic screen is never on anymore other than to catch some news. For me, tv and its associated media are dead. I detest the faux reality of elecronic imagery; it only serves a purpose as an example of something else, something tangible. A print, even unframed, is tangible. Of course, future generations may never understand what that might mean, never mind be.

;-(

Rob

In addition to the display of images I am talking about the extension of photography to encompass "time" or how the image environment changes, e.g. how a sunrise/sunset view changes over many minutes.  An image sequence can capture that ambience.  I would like to see discussion about how best to "capture a time period" of a scene.
We are familiar with 24/30 frame per second image sequences (video), what about slower sequences?  I have a sequence of waves moving on a shore causing changing patterns in sand. One image/print does not do the scene justice - what makes it engaging is how the scene constantly changes creating pseudo-abstract patterns unique to that location and time-of-day. By displaying the image sequence on an "electronic picture frame" every time I look the image is same/different.  Another example is a sequence from a close-up panorama of tree texture - every time I look at the image it is same/different - I have captured the variety and visual complexity that could not be represented by a single image. I have "extended" the ambience of the scene.
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