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Author Topic: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?  (Read 6918 times)

schertz

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Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« on: September 21, 2016, 05:12:24 pm »

I was looking around the Canson website earlier and noticed a paper entry that I hadn't seen before, Baryta Prestige.

http://www.canson-infinity.com/en/products/baryta-prestige

Despite the slightly obnoxious name, it sounds intriguing; similar to Baryta Photographique (my most often used paper) but:
1) Thicker/heavier, 340gsm
2) Mixed wood (ie. alpha-cellulose) and cotton base (kind-of odd :o )
3) Glossier
4) High D-max, gamut, and sharpness (supposedly, reviews will tell...)

I'm interested to try it out as a fine-art'ish alternative to RC glossy media, depending on the cost. Has anyone seen this stuff around? It's not listed at B&H or my local photography bricks'n'mortar store Vistek, so it must be brand new? Maybe launched for Photokina?

MS
« Last Edit: September 21, 2016, 07:13:57 pm by schertz »
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Ken Doo

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2016, 06:09:38 pm »

It was announced at Photokina apparently---but I saw it on facebook first  :o ;D.  I'm interested in giving it a try....

It'll probably take a bit before it hits the various distributor's shelves....

Mark D Segal

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2016, 08:55:50 pm »

It's posted on the Canson Infinity Website, where the profiles can be downloaded. The profile for the Epson 4900 (very wide gamut printer) has a gamut volume of 939K, somewhat below the 977K I obtained custom profiling Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for that printer. The white point is slightly warm at b*=+2; otherwise quite neutral. They say it is a smooth gloss, and it has "very low" OBA content.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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schertz

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2016, 11:13:44 pm »

It's posted on the Canson Infinity Website, where the profiles can be downloaded. The profile for the Epson 4900 (very wide gamut printer) has a gamut volume of 939K, somewhat below the 977K I obtained custom profiling Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for that printer. The white point is slightly warm at b*=+2; otherwise quite neutral. They say it is a smooth gloss, and it has "very low" OBA content.

Do you think you'll get some of this paper in to review? It seems in the past that you have gotten a better gamut volume from custom profiles, than the canned ones.

If I go to the ProFusion show in October, i'll stop by the Canson booth and maybe they'll have some samples or something...
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2016, 06:04:37 am »

Do you think you'll get some of this paper in to review? It seems in the past that you have gotten a better gamut volume from custom profiles, than the canned ones.

If I go to the ProFusion show in October, i'll stop by the Canson booth and maybe they'll have some samples or something...

That's true; but those kind of gamut volume differences are not what matters most - for the most part the impact of even a 50K or larger difference of gamut volume would go undetectable in many photographs. The more important variable is accuracy in laying down the file numbers and this is where custom profiling could be of incremental benefit.

I wouldn't mind reviewing it if the Canadian distributor (Vistek I believe) would provide the amount I need to do it. This thread is the first I hear of this paper so there have been no approaches yet.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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JRSmit

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2016, 03:28:19 pm »

I saw it at Photokina on tuesday.  It is supposed to be more scratch resistant. It feels heavy and stiff. Images looked quite ok.
Its surface and texture is not unlike the platine fiber rag. Perhaps a bit more glossy.
Definitely worth looking into.
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Fine art photography: janrsmit.com
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Jan R. Smit

tonyrom

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2016, 06:21:02 pm »

Any one have luck downloading the profile (Epson/7000)?  I tried and the link does nothing.
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narikin

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2016, 09:40:01 pm »

Just saw this at PhotoPlus, in NYC - impressive thickness, that extra 40g is very noticeable, and yes it does seem more durable than Regular Baryta/Platine.

I tried to scuff it with a fingernail brush across, but couldn't (apologies Canson!). Also glad to hear they have made it 'flatter' than the old Baryta, which had a fierce curl, causing many printer problems when using rolls. Rather more glossy and 'stippled' than I like, and an unknown for its longevity at this point, but looks promising.

Sadly Rolls top out at 50", which is annoying for anyone with a 60+" printer.

Look forward to a proper test!
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2016, 06:56:12 am »


Look forward to a proper test!

We intend to do that once we receive some material.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Doug Gray

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2016, 02:45:29 pm »

That's true; but those kind of gamut volume differences are not what matters most - for the most part the impact of even a 50K or larger difference of gamut volume would go undetectable in many photographs. The more important variable is accuracy in laying down the file numbers and this is where custom profiling could be of incremental benefit.

I wouldn't mind reviewing it if the Canadian distributor (Vistek I believe) would provide the amount I need to do it. This thread is the first I hear of this paper so there have been no approaches yet.

Mark,
In general gamut volume is greatly overhyped. The colors affected are at the most saturated and perceptual sensitivity in those areas is greatly reduced. At those saturations it takes, on average, 3 dEs (standard 1976) to produce a perceptual change of 1dE (2000) which is a much better indicator. And that's on top of the fact that a 3% change in gamut volume that is evenly increased is only about a 1% change in a given dimension.

http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=111560.0

Far more important is the smoothness and accuracy of the profile in gamut. That's mostly a function of the printer, ink, number of patches used, and profiling software.

I would sure like to see some work to create useful quality metrics for printer/profile combos. Accuracy can be done with a separately generated, independent patch set but smoothness is another matter because it requires either a huge number of patches or analysis of imaged, gradients from a scan or photo and that is sensitive to how good the CMFs of the imaging device are.

I would think this sort of thing would be valuable in rating printers. What I use now is just printing a set of images like Roman 16 which stresses various saturation gradients but they are a small subset of gradients encountered and is subjective in any case.
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Brad P

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2016, 04:19:57 pm »

Has anyone had a chance to test this paper yet?    I would be particularly interested in

1. How it cuts and suitability for frameless presentation (a problem with Canson's Platine, which can display frayed edges, which hopefully is ameliorated due to the addition of cellulose solves).

2. Any info on OBA content and likely degradation, and guesstimates on likely achival characteristics, which I imagine might be similar to Canson Baryta Photographique). 

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Mark D Segal

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2016, 04:37:44 pm »

Has anyone had a chance to test this paper yet?    I would be particularly interested in

1. How it cuts and suitability for frameless presentation (a problem with Canson's Platine, which can display frayed edges, which hopefully is ameliorated due to the addition of cellulose solves).

2. Any info on OBA content and likely degradation, and guesstimates on likely achival characteristics, which I imagine might be similar to Canson Baryta Photographique).

We only received samples a short time ago. It's queued-up to be tested and reported on this website - but it will be a while. Hang-in there.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Paper from Canson - Baryta Prestige ?
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2016, 03:08:56 am »

Has anyone had a chance to test this paper yet?    I would be particularly interested in

2. Any info on OBA content and likely degradation, and guesstimates on likely achival characteristics, which I imagine might be similar to Canson Baryta Photographique).

Somewhat more OBA content than Canson Baryta Photographique, more in the coating than the paper itself in both papers. When cotton and alpha cellulose are mixed I like to see to what amount, not so much that I think one is more archival than the other but to compare it against other mixed fiber papers. The spectral plot is in the Alpha Cellulose/Satin etc map of SpectrumViz. Paul Graham posted a sample to me about a month ago.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
November 2016 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

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