The intensity of film.

[GrahamBy]

So I'll just note that the human species put itself on the path to confronting such stuff the day an ancestor of ours first discovered that covering a wound with leaves from certain plants reduced or eliminated infection. Pathogens and antibodies.

We had a visit from the head of the Karolinska Microbiome Project last week. He was on the team that got to take samples from the that 5,500 year old hunter found frozen in the Austro-Italian alps. They found penicillin in his small intestine, "almost exactly Fleming's original strain".

[Farmer]

Justin - it's true of any complex system, not just GM.  The main problem is the GMO has been reduced to a few talking points on either side (mostly the negative side but by no means entirely) which makes the discussion, well, wrong :-)

The herbicide is but one of so many GMO improvements (if we restrict it to actual gene manipulation), but if we look at breeding, splicing, and other previous techniques, as well as evolution, then the examples are in the millions.

In a considered cycle of crop rotation and pest management, the GMO crops reduce the amount of herbicides needed.  If people don't follow the recommended protocols, then resistance can develop and then you have evolved yourself out of an advantage.  It's like over prescription of antibiotics or prescription of them for people who don't have a bacterial infection but just want "something" so the doctor gives it to them.  The issue is far more known and aware now, but like anything, when you stop following the instructions, things can go wrong.

Perhaps the biggest irony in the whole debate is that "organic" (and, really, everything we eat is organic by definition - the term has been co-opted for marketing purposes) usually requires more pesticides and herbicides - they're just considered "natural" ones.

[Justinr]

Justin - it's true of any complex system, not just GM.  The main problem is the GMO has been reduced to a few talking points on either side (mostly the negative side but by no means entirely) which makes the discussion, well, wrong :-)

The herbicide is but one of so many GMO improvements (if we restrict it to actual gene manipulation), but if we look at breeding, splicing, and other previous techniques, as well as evolution, then the examples are in the millions.

In a considered cycle of crop rotation and pest management, the GMO crops reduce the amount of herbicides needed.  If people don't follow the recommended protocols, then resistance can develop and then you have evolved yourself out of an advantage.  It's like over prescription of antibiotics or prescription of them for people who don't have a bacterial infection but just want "something" so the doctor gives it to them.  The issue is far more known and aware now, but like anything, when you stop following the instructions, things can go wrong.

Perhaps the biggest irony in the whole debate is that "organic" (and, really, everything we eat is organic by definition - the term has been co-opted for marketing purposes) usually requires more pesticides and herbicides - they're just considered "natural" ones.

And that is entirely the nub of the problem, you are trying to impose lab standard growing practices on a hugely diverse group of people and those people just happen to be entrusted with mankind's food supply and, to a great extent, the health of the environment. I think it rather disingenuous for the fans of GM to go blaming others for a situation that is of their own making, was completely foreseeable and arrived at through greed.

The term organic  was not co-opted by marketing people except in the case that having lost the battle of public opinion over GM the supporters of the technique are now protesting they were always included under that umbrella anyway! I have seen this move elsewhere and have had rather bitter arguments with people who say they are all for organic farming and aren't GM crops just the ticket! A laughable stance to those who have been observing the situation for well over 30 years and recall that Organic farming is primarily about the health of the soil from which all else follows, indeed, even the much compromised Soil Association still has reservations about glyphosphate -

https://www.soilassociation.org/soilhealth/

There has been something of a shift in the battle twixt intensive farming and organic farming of late, outright confrontation has not worked for the chemical suppliers and so they appear to be creeping in via the back door. Sorry, but some of us are awake to that to.

I should point out that I am not against pesticide use per se, but the drive to make us entirely dependent upon chemical use and genetic engineering. The development of glyphosphate resistance weeds through its over use should be a warning as to how not to go about using chemicals that have been of benefit in the past and were a useful tool if used in moderation. Monsanto have completey fecked that up and are now busy trying to blame everyone else.

[N80]

Well, since all this talk about GM food is boring (me) to the point of tears, I'll take a stab at changing the subject (back):

I developed a roll of Neopan Acros last night. First film I've developed in years. Results were not stellar but on the one hand I was a bit sloppy with the processing and on the other hand there were only a few keepers anyway. To be honest I was glad just to see an image on the film. I guessed at development times (Ilford DDX) and temps and have to say that the tonal range and contrast look pretty good.

I noticed when getting the water off the film that the emulsion layer of the Acros seemed sticky. Once dry it was not.

I've scanned them (tedious) on my old Nikon CoolScan IV ED using VueScan. I've done nothing in post yet but will play around with them tonight.

[Telecaster]

I was going through my small freezer of film last night, prompted in part by this thread, and rediscovered in a paper bag two exposed but undeveloped rolls of Kodachrome 200 from a trip to New York in March 2002. I'd exposed them at EI 400 'cuz I was interested in seeing how K200 responded when pushed. Then I found that Kodachrome push processing in the US had been discontinued. Oops. So I put the film in my freezer and forgot about it.

I shot both rolls in the World Financial Center area, including pics of the then damaged (9/11) Winter Garden. Also took pics inside one of the abandoned (though long since reinhabited) WFC buildings. I remember being amazed it was open…'twas a dusty mess inside. I used a Contax IIa rangefinder with a Zeiss Opton 35/2.8 Biogon lens. By the time of my next NYC visit, the following October, the Winter Garden had been rebuilt good as new and was hosting chamber music concerts along with a festive Halloween party.

I really should develop the film as b&w and see what I can make of it!

-Dave-

[GrahamBy]

I know you can run Ekta through C41 and get sort of usable negatives... only did it once, pushing 200 to 1600. Is that also possible for K200, or is B&W the only option?

[Telecaster]

Graham, with Kodachrome the color dyes were adding added during development. Technically it was a multi-layer monochrome film! I know it can be processed as b&w but I need to look into whether the resulting image quality would be worth the effort.

-Dave-

[Justinr]

One of the appeals of film is that it may not have the crisp clarity that we expect from digital nowadays as I think I have mentioned, yet I came across these today, they were taken about 105 years ago and are wonderfully clear and 'neat'. Would this be just down to a LF camera? I'm thinking it would have to be a damn fine lens to.

http://motorplogar.webnode.se/tillverkare/soverksplogen/