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Author Topic: Auto White and Black points.  (Read 4573 times)

Onslow

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Auto White and Black points.
« on: August 21, 2016, 08:11:01 pm »

One feature that I do like is the Shift Whites and Shift Blacks (on PC) to set the white and black clipping points for the image. Is there a way to have LR do that to all images in a folder? It would be handy as a starting point for me before images are adjusted... I also mean have each image individually assessed either as part of the import process or through perhaps a plugin?
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Onslow

rdonson

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2016, 08:24:01 pm »

Create a PRESET that you will use during import.

Select - Basic Tone - White Clipping and Black Clipping.

Also smart to set Process Version and depending on your needs or camera you might also want the preset to execute all the Lens Corrections options
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Onslow

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2016, 08:34:21 pm »

Create a PRESET that you will use during import.

Select - Basic Tone - White Clipping and Black Clipping.

Also smart to set Process Version and depending on your needs or camera you might also want the preset to execute all the Lens Corrections options
Cheers, I have an Auto preset for import that covers process version, contrast, vibrance, lens corrections and an S curve in the tone panel. I didn't know those were there. I have just noticed them. When were they introduced??
Much appreciated.
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Onslow

Onslow

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2016, 09:17:51 pm »

Cheers, I have an Auto preset for import that covers process version, contrast, vibrance, lens corrections and an S curve in the tone panel. I didn't know those were there. I have just noticed them. When were they introduced??
Much appreciated.
Hmm, Just tested it out with a new preset. All my other settings are applied correctly bar the White Cliiping and Black Clipping. Any idea ? All that occurred was whatever value the white and black was set to is applied to the new imports. I'm after each images individual clipping points to be set on import.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2016, 09:24:32 pm by Onslow »
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Onslow

MBehrens

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2016, 10:09:35 pm »

There isn't any way to initiate the <shift> White or <shift> Black in a preset. And Auto Tone is something entirely different.

It is odd that <shift> White and <shift> Black result in very different settings from Auto Tone. I never use Auto Tone and was surprised at how different the Black and White settings were from it. I expected it to mimic the <shift> White and <shift> Black results.

This brings up a frustration with LR for me, I grew very tired of stamping static values (Presets) and never use them any longer. Adobe needs to provide some way of applying parametric presets to an image. Like the <shift> White and <shift> Black, a way to arrive at a preset value based on an analysis of the image.
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digitaldog

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2016, 10:54:01 am »

Could this be an 'issue' between the difference of an absolute vs. relative adjustment?
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Onslow

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2016, 07:22:07 pm »

Could this be an 'issue' between the difference of an absolute vs. relative adjustment?
Andrew, I'm not sure I understand your question?
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Onslow

digitaldog

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2016, 07:25:21 pm »

Andrew, I'm not sure I understand your question?

QD is Relative. Develop is Absolute. The preset is which ????
There’s also a significant difference in how corrections are applied in Quick Develop versus Develop. In Library grid, if you have multiple images selected and use the arrows in Quick Develop, the edits will change in a relative approach where in Develop the edits are absolute.
Say you have 5 bracketed images and use the Exposure button in QD. ALL five images will be adjusted relative to that one click rather than synchronizing all the photo’s with the same exposure value. Useful for batch processing the same relative correction to many images.
Say 1 image has a setting or 5, the other 6 (the edit isn't important, the value is). Now you add 1 relative to those images. The image that was 5 jumps to 6. The image that was 6 jumps to 7.
With absolute, both images would end up with the setting copied (1) as this isn't a relative (to the original) setting. It's an Absolute, fixed increase.
Relative Adjustments in the Develop would permit, for example, applying in Increase in black clipping level to multiple images rather than synchronizing Absolute black clipping level between images.
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Onslow

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2016, 07:35:52 pm »

QD is Relative. Develop is Absolute. The preset is which ????
There’s also a significant difference in how corrections are applied in Quick Develop versus Develop. In Library grid, if you have multiple images selected and use the arrows in Quick Develop, the edits will change in a relative approach where in Develop the edits are absolute.
Say you have 5 bracketed images and use the Exposure button in QD. ALL five images will be adjusted relative to that one click rather than synchronizing all the photo’s with the same exposure value. Useful for batch processing the same relative correction to many images.
Say 1 image has a setting or 5, the other 6 (the edit isn't important, the value is). Now you add 1 relative to those images. The image that was 5 jumps to 6. The image that was 6 jumps to 7.
With absolute, both images would end up with the setting copied (1) as this isn't a relative (to the original) setting. It's an Absolute, fixed increase.
Relative Adjustments in the Develop would permit, for example, applying in Increase in black clipping level to multiple images rather than synchronizing Absolute black clipping level between images.
Ah, got it. Thank you for taking the time to explain that. I don't use quick develop. I find for my own workflow that Develop is the one I use for consistency.
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digitaldog

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2016, 07:41:06 pm »

Ah, got it. Thank you for taking the time to explain that. I don't use quick develop. I find for my own workflow that Develop is the one I use for consistency.
Yes but my question boils down to, what's the preset using of the two options? Where's Schewe?
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Onslow

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2016, 07:57:18 pm »

Yes but my question boils down to, what's the preset using of the two options? Where's Schewe?
Ah, now I understand your question. Yes, which one indeed..
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MBehrens

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2016, 12:13:21 am »

Let me see if I understand the question.
  If a preset created in Dev is applied in the Q.D. module instead of the Dev Module, will the settings be relative per Q.D., instead of absolute per Dev?
Is this correct?
The tests I've done indicate the preset is absolute in either module.

That said there are 7 values stored in the preset file that indicate parametric values...
         ParametricDarks = 0,
         ParametricHighlightSplit = 75,
         ParametricHighlights = 0,
         ParametricLights = 0,
         ParametricMidtoneSplit = 50,
         ParametricShadowSplit = 25,
         ParametricShadows = 0,
The *Split items seems to be for split toning, but I did not have the split toning checkbox selected in the create preset dialog. And there isn't a mid-tone slider in split toning. Anyone know what these are recording/where they are applied?
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MBehrens

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2016, 12:47:50 am »

The parametric* values in the preset file are all Tone Curve values stored as absolutes. The 3 *Split values are the 3 tone split adjustments along the bottom.

Seems all preset values are absolute.

Of course the Tone Curve is a parametric adjustment unto itself. Thus the label in the preset file.
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luxborealis

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2016, 09:38:24 am »

The answer to the OP is "No".

Auto anything is relative to the tonal values of each individual image. So, the auto values set for one image will not work on other images that have different tonal values.

I, too, find the Auto Black Point and Auto White Point helpful for a great many files, but not all.

I would recommend you re-think setting an Import Preset with contrast, vibrancy and tone-curve as, in my opinion, you are losing far too much of the inherent character of each image before ever seeing it. I understand we all have different regimes and styles, but to do that much to any image right off the bat seems counter to the myriad options available in the Develop module. But then again, I now have very little use for the Tone a Curve in LR, despite being raised on Tone Curves in PS.
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AFairley

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2016, 12:06:45 pm »

Though I do use an import preset that boosts shadows, contrast and vibrancy as a universal starting point because I found I was applying near to those settings to almost every D800E image. But that's my taste, of course.
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Auto White and Black points.
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2016, 07:06:50 pm »

Though I do use an import preset that boosts shadows, contrast and vibrancy as a universal starting point because I found I was applying near to those settings to almost every D800E image.

I guess that's the point, and it probably is a good approach if you tend to shoot a certain style of images. I do a similar thing, but I do (have to) modify my defaults when the image contrast or lighting conditions deviate from the average situation (which isn't often with  a controlled lighting / studio setup). Also, if I have more time, I tend to change more settings from the default starting point, but when rushed the defaults are often close to what I want anyway.

Cheers,
Bart
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