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Author Topic: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints  (Read 13302 times)

jamgolf

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Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« on: July 19, 2016, 09:49:41 am »

Hello

I have not ordered an acrylic mounted print before and wanted to get some opinions on this subject.

1. When ordering an acrylic mount do you prefer a super gloss print or a metallic print? Why?
2. Is it worth it to order a 1/4th inch vs. 1/8th thickness acrylic?
3. In addition to West Coast Imaging (and sister company Aspen Creek Photo) are there other vendors that you would recommend?
   I have found Bumblejax but their pricing is similar to WCI - so might as well use WCI.
4. And on a very subjective note, is this a look you like/prefer or was/is this just a fad?
   What other methods of display/presentation would you recommend for large prints (30x40in & larger)?

Thank you very much for your time and input.

Cheers!
« Last Edit: August 23, 2016, 10:17:32 pm by jamgolf »
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BAB

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2016, 10:07:33 pm »

Go to Peter lik gallery in Vegas before you waste trial and error tactics or seek forum advise and decide for yourself he got it down!
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jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2016, 10:52:51 pm »

I've been to one of his galleries once, a few years ago. Even with whatever I remember, it still leaves my questions unanswered - hence the post :)
Thanks for your reply though.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2016, 10:17:50 pm by jamgolf »
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BobShaw

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2016, 12:09:29 am »

You just simply have to order them to see what you like. There is little guide to what the customer likes also.
Pick a few representative scenes and order a smallish one from each.
Metallic suits some scenes and some not, so being covered by a piece of acrylic makes little difference.
One feature I found that is important is how they attach the mount. Some can't be hung in galleries because they can't use hooks each side.
I haven't done it myself yet but you can buy the film and do it yourself. Unfortunately the film is expensive.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2016, 12:54:47 am »

I found metals to be lighter and more scratch resistant.

jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2016, 01:06:43 am »

Thanks guys. I am going to order a Fuji Pearl print face mounted to 1/4th inch acrylic.
I guess thats the only way I'll know.
Will post back to share my thoughts once I receive it.
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TateD

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2016, 08:10:06 pm »

Hello

I have not ordered an acrylic mounted print before and wanted to get some opinions on this subject.

1. When ordering an acrylic mount do you prefer a super gloss print or a metallic print? Why?
2. Is it worth it to order a 1/4th inch vs. 1/8th thickness acrylic?
3. In addition to West Coast Imaging (and sister company Aspen Creek Photo) are there other vendors that you would recommend?
   I have found Bumblejax but their pricing is similar to WCI - so might as well use WCI.
4. And on a very subjective note, is this a look you like/prefer or was/is this just a fad?
   What other methods of display/presentation would you recommend for large prints (30x40in & larger)?

Thank you very much for your time and input.

Cheers!

Hi jamgolf, this is Tate from Bumblejax.  I thought I'd chime in and provide some input on your questions.  From what I understand WCI does good work so you can't go wrong there I'm sure.  We also do great work if I do say so myself :) 

1.  Generally speaking it is our experience that high gloss prints don't face mount well and can give off a bit of an "orange peel" effect.  The acrylic is going to give it a glossy look anyway.  For these reasons we don't offer a high gloss paper with our acrylic face mounting.  On the other hand, the metallic paper is a great option and provides a bit more depth and pop particularly when photos are bold and vibrant. 

2.  I'd say in most cases yes.  It won't make a huge difference in terms of the appearance of the photo, but the 1/4" with a diamond polished edge can provide a bit more light in and a bit more depth and pop to the image.  Of course it's more substantial looking since it's thicker as well.  We also offer 1/2" and 1" acrylic as well.

3.  Not sure acrylic face mounting is a fad.  It's actually been around a long time, but only recently has become more popular in the US.  It started in Europe and then mainly in high end galleries and homes in the States.  When we started face mounting there were just a small handful of companies in the US doing it.  West Coast was one and there were a few in NYC and a couple in CA.  Now you see companies popping up all over the place offering "acrylic prints".  It shold be known that most companies now print directly to the acrylic because it's far less labor intensive and can be offered cheaper.  The trade off is a diminished color gamut and color accuracy as well as diminished vibrancy. 

Anyway, hope that helps..
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jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2016, 10:02:46 pm »

Tate:  I appreciate it your response on behalf of Bumblejax. I'll give you guys a try sometime in the future.

I did some research and found a few more quality outlets for acrylic mounted prints, in addition to WCI and Bumblejax offcourse:
1. Nevada Art based in Las Vegas
2. White Wall based on Cologne Germany
3. Laumont

I ordered a 40"x30" Fuji Pearl 1/4" acrylic mount from West Coast Imaging and a 48"x36" 1/4" acrylic mount from White Wall. WCI order was placed on July 15th and has still not shipped and the White Wall order was placed on August 13th and is getting delivered on August 25th i.e. within 12 days and at a cost of $43 for delivery via FedEx from Cologne, Germany. I think WCI shipping will cost 2-3 times more than that.

I am awaiting both items and it would be fun to compare them, but so far I am impressed with White Wall and not so much by WCI. Their 48x36 product was cheaper than WCI 40x30 product. Their order processing is way faster and shipping is way cheaper. WCI will have to deliver something really special (in comparison) to earn my future business. Infact if they do not ship my order within the next 5 days, I plan to cancel my order even if that means forfeiture of the 50% deposit. They must really have an extraordinarily inflated opinion of themselves - since they dont even respond to emails promptly. If White Wall delivers a good product, they will have earned my future business.

I can't believe that a shop in Germany can deliver faster and cheaper than a shop here in the USA. I mean this ain't some 3rd world country running a sweatshop to keep costs low. If you view their videos on Youtube, their operation seems quite advanced.

As to my question regarding fad or not, I think I'll make up my mind once I have the products in my home for some period of time. But at this time I feel I am more of a print on rag/baryta paper and display in a modern floating frame type of guy. So for me, personally, acrylic is probably a fad.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2016, 10:16:56 pm by jamgolf »
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TateD

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2016, 10:37:52 pm »

You're quite welcome and if you do want to give us a try down the road just let me know.  We have a 50% off deal on the first order for photographers so you can see what we offer and how it compares.  Sorry to hear about the slow production time you're experiencing at WCI.   That is extremely slow.  We're about the same as Whitewall about two weeks to receive (with standard production and shipping time) the order regardless of size.  Less time on West Coast (we're in Seattle) and a bit more on East Coast.  Whitewall seems to do good work and a huge operation.  I don't think you can go wrong with the other two labs you mention either.  I think it takes time to sort out the lab you jive with on all fronts.  As you know it's everything from cost, to turn around times, to print quality of course, to customer service, to what happens when sh*%T hits the fan :) (ie you receive an order that FedEx abuses and breaks 3 days before the most important show of your life).   We're a smaller lab in Seattle, WA that specializes in acrylic face mounting and I feel that gives us an advantage in terms of more personalized support and quality assurance.  Anyway, hope the pieces you had done turn out great for you!
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Stephen Ray

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2016, 03:04:00 am »

1. When ordering an acrylic mount do you prefer a super gloss print or a metallic print? Why?
1) Understand, a Fujiflex Super Gloss is a chromogenic photo process film, and not a paper and not an inkjet print paper. Being a perfectly flat film, it lends itself to a perfectly flat appearance with no texture behind acrylic. Practically any paper print material will show a texture behind acrylic because of paper pulp. Thus, if you’re an inkjet printer, try printing on a film ;-). In this particular context, the metallic print you’re referring to is made of a paper base, not to be confused with actual metal prints which are a different animal. In my opinion, the metallic paper print only lends itself to special subjects or themes and not to landscapes, generally. Again, just my opinion.

2. Is it worth it to order a 1/4th inch vs. 1/8th thickness acrylic?
2) It’s common to use 1/4 inch plex for sizes over 40x60 inches but “worth it” will be up to you.

3. In addition to West Coast Imaging (and sister company Aspen Creek Photo) are there other vendors that you would recommend?
3) Vendors who understand landscape photographers are Weldon Color Lab in Los Angeles, Photo Craft in Boulder, and Nevada Fine Art Printers in Las Vegas are some options. (There are probably more.) Like West Coast Imaging, these shops deliver impeccable quality and know the Peter Lik product. Definitely look into the Lumachrome product at Nevada Fine Art Printers as a substitute for genuine Fujiflex.

4. And on a very subjective note, is this a look you like/prefer or was/is this just a fad?
If I were to display a landscape, a flat film print behind acrylic is what I would chose. These have been around since the early 80’s using Kodak Duratrans and Duraflex. The process was used almost exclusively by the exhibit industry and for commercial retail merchandising. Remember seeing bus stop shelter signs backlit at night back in the day? Face-mounted Duratrans on acrylic. It was later that photographers learned of the expensive process to differentiate themselves and Peter Lik, bless him, was not the first.

5. What other methods of display/presentation would you recommend for large prints (30x40in & larger)?
Duraflex was handy to use by traveling salesmen in a roll-up window shade banner stand device. Color accuracy was not as important as color vibrancy. On a trade show floor with all the different light sources, the Duraflex and the Fujiflex did “pop.” These light source are key, as they are high, point-source fixtures. Typical gallery lighting is the same high, point-source attribute and therefore, I would be sure to light my print accordingly. A modern “recessed” mount or a traditional frame-and-liner would need to be determined in each circumstance.

I hope this helps.
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Stefan Ohlsson

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2016, 03:56:37 am »

Being a perfectly flat film, it lends itself to a perfectly flat appearance with no texture behind acrylic. Practically any paper print material will show a texture behind acrylic because of paper pulp.

I don't agree that the paper texture will show up behind glass or acrylic. We do quite a lot of prints that then will be mounted behind acrylic or anti-reflex glass. After tests with the company that does our mounting we are using Epson Luster or Canson Platine Fibre Rag. None of the prints that we have done on these materials show any texture after the mounting.

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jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2016, 09:17:05 am »

Stephen Ray:  Thanks for taking the time to reply and provide thoughtful insight. Yes, It does help. Much appreciated.

Since asking/posting the question, I have learned quite a bit through forums, videos, books etc. and have researched products, papers, vendors as well as makers of such acrylic mounted products. Thanks for mentioning Weldon Color Lab and Photo Craft, I had not heard of them. I'll look them up. Nevada Art's Lumachrome product seems like a good product. I intend to give them a try at some point.

On the 1/8th vs 1/4th inch matter, I've personally decided to not bother with the 1/8th inch product, unless it is in a non-glare version e.g. Try Vue / Optium etc.

Your point regarding 'lighting the print' is well taken. I am currently trying to figure out where I might be able to mount the lighting and what type of lighting fixtures to use. 
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jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2016, 09:22:03 am »

After tests with the company that does our mounting we are using Epson Luster or Canson Platine Fibre Rag. None of the prints that we have done on these materials show any texture after the mounting.

Canson Platine Fibre Rag behind acrylic sounds quite intriguing. Do you use a particular type of non-glare acrylic for this or just the regular reflective/glossy kind?
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TateD

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2016, 06:34:09 pm »

We don't experience any issues with the inkjet photo paper we use to face mount.  You just have to be more careful and in our experience, if you stick to very smooth inkjet papers, there isn't ever an issue.  Lightjet prints are a different ballgame we have no interest in for quite a few reasons.  You could spend a lot of time and get a lot of different opinions about which process is better.  It used to be Lightjet was superior, but that is changing quickly and many believe inkjets are now superior.  As far as glare goes, there isn't a good option there with acrylic.  You can go with a matte acrylic or so called non-glare acrylic and those will typically diminish vibrancy considerably.  That's a tradeoff we don't feel is acceptable.  The point of the acrylic is the incredible vibrancy it offers over any other medium.  There are some anti-reflective acrylics that are good and we believe the product from Tru Vue called TruLife is the best.  By our estimates it reduces glare somewhere around 25% or so while maintaining full vibrancy.  It's also scratch resistant, offers better UV protection at 99% and anti-static to help minimize dust. 
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bbrantley

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2016, 05:16:17 am »

Jamgolf,

White Wall all the way:

- best pricing by far, use a 20% coupon
- process supports much bigger sizes; I've done 120x20" and 70x60".
- real ICC profiles for soft proof
- qualitatively better print sharpening
- will ship and re-ship until your print arrives safely (my 78x36 took three tries, yikes!)
- best crating

Bjax is also good, especially at customer service.  They seem like great people.  But I don't think they have the scale to compete with WW. 

I don't think facemount is a fad for display in modern venues and with subject material that needs the gooey, deep, liquid-y feel it brings.  Acrylic gathers and subtly collimates the light.  There's nothing quite like it.

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TateD

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2016, 11:10:30 am »

Whitewall does have some nice sales for sure.  I think they are doing 20% off right now and their shipping for large pieces is very good.  Bbrantley thanks for giving us a try and glad you found our customer service helpful.  I don't think you were directly comparing us to WhiteWall with your points there since I don't think you've had the opportunity to work with us much but just wanted to mention in terms of pricing we're very competitive despite being a smaller lab in the US.  We do provide the  50% off first order and permanent discounting up to 15% for repeat photographer customers.   Our max size is 96x48" and shipping anything over about 45" gets quite expensive.  We can't compete there for sure.  For large orders and single pieces, we build custom wood crates and ship via freight (not fedex or ups).  We've had exactly two crated and freighted shipments arrive damaged in seven years.  Many of these large orders are mission critical (ie the most important show for a photographer, the opening of a corporate building, restaurant, etc).  The cost tradeoff is one we're not willing to make even if it means losing business.  While we'll ship and ship until it arrives safely, that's not an enjoyable scenario for us or the customer.  Glad you found a lab you're happy with.  As I mentioned I think it takes time to find the one you jive with.  All labs have advantages and disadvantages and some things are more important to some customers than others. 



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jamgolf

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2016, 04:25:26 pm »

FedEx delivered the 48"x36" piece from White Wall earlier. Nicely packaged:

   

   

   

   

    Nice edge protection:
   

    Nice mounting hardware pre-installed:
   

   

   

Start to finish, I'd say experience with White Wall has been quite satisfactory.

Cheers!
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TateD

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Re: Questions: Acrylic Mounted Prints
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2016, 11:47:49 am »

Looks good!
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