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Author Topic: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah  (Read 8392 times)

John Camp

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Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« on: April 27, 2016, 04:57:55 pm »

Don't want to be disrespectful, but every time I seem an article about honoring women in something, I begin to wonder if I'm reliving the 50s. Women in the arts shouldn't be a separate sub-phylum: too often, "Women artists, 1980-1990" and so on are actually code words for "Artists who aren't quite good enough to stand on their own."

The thing about women in photography is, right from the start women have not only been important, but you could make a very good argument that THEY have been dominant, and not men. Let me throw out a few names: Julia Margaret Cameron, Imogen Cunningham, Dorothea Lange, Lisette Model, Cindy Sherman, Diane Arbus, Annie Leibovitz, Margaret Bourke-White, Helen Levitt, Lee Miller, Sally Mann, Carrie Mae Weems, Annie Leibovitz, Bernice Abbott, Tina Modotti, Mary Ellen Mark, Ruth Bernhard, Nan Goldin, Francesca Woodman, Ilse Bing, Jane Brown, and I'm still forgetting a lot of them. That's just off the top of my head, and I don't know the names of lots of distinguished Asian and European women photographers. Anyone think they could come up with a list of male photographers with names as familiar as those, and work as distinguished?

If the article were called, Honoring Women Gearheads, you wouldn't have heard a thing from me; honoring women *photographers* seems a trifle patronizing.   
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Rob C

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2016, 05:33:02 pm »

Don't want to be disrespectful, but every time I seem an article about honoring women in something, I begin to wonder if I'm reliving the 50s. Women in the arts shouldn't be a separate sub-phylum: too often, "Women artists, 1980-1990" and so on are actually code words for "Artists who aren't quite good enough to stand on their own."

The thing about women in photography is, right from the start women have not only been important, but you could make a very good argument that THEY have been dominant, and not men. Let me throw out a few names: Julia Margaret Cameron, Imogen Cunningham, Dorothea Lange, Lisette Model, Cindy Sherman, Diane Arbus, Annie Leibovitz, Margaret Bourke-White, Helen Levitt, Lee Miller, Sally Mann, Carrie Mae Weems, Annie Leibovitz, Bernice Abbott, Tina Modotti, Mary Ellen Mark, Ruth Bernhard, Nan Goldin, Francesca Woodman, Ilse Bing, Jane Brown, and I'm still forgetting a lot of them. That's just off the top of my head, and I don't know the names of lots of distinguished Asian and European women photographers. Anyone think they could come up with a list of male photographers with names as familiar as those, and work as distinguished?

If the article were called, Honoring Women Gearheads, you wouldn't have heard a thing from me; honoring women *photographers* seems a trifle patronizing.   

Their name is legion?

I'm knackered at the moment - should be in my bed, but spent the evening and most of tonight fighting Photoshop in an attempt to put to bed a little project I began on Saturday. If I remember in the morning, I will offer a short list of those I love. Female snappers, that is.

Rob C

RPark

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2016, 06:47:25 pm »

Let me throw out a few names: Julia Margaret Cameron, Imogen Cunningham, Dorothea Lange, Lisette Model, Cindy Sherman, Diane Arbus, Annie Leibovitz, Margaret Bourke-White, Helen Levitt, Lee Miller, Sally Mann, Carrie Mae Weems, Annie Leibovitz, Bernice Abbott, Tina Modotti, Mary Ellen Mark, Ruth Bernhard, Nan Goldin, Francesca Woodman, Ilse Bing, Jane Brown, and I'm still forgetting a lot of them. That's just off the top of my head, and I don't know the names of lots of distinguished Asian and European women photographers. Anyone think they could come up with a list of male photographers with names as familiar as those, and work as distinguished?

Judy Dater, Nina Raginsky, Bettina Rheims, Ellen von Unwerth, Jessie Tarbox Beals.
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mgrayson

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2016, 07:10:18 pm »

Google "famous photographers" yields
Ansel Adams, HCB, Annie Leibovitz, Dorothea Lange, Alvedon, Steve McCurry, Diane Arbus, Robert Capa, Weston, Elliot Erwitt, Mary Ellen Mark, Brassaï, Helmut Newton, David Bailey, Stieglitz, Man Ray, David LaChapelle, Cecil Beaton, Margaret Bourke-White, Berenice Abott, Irving Penn, Muybridge, Weegee, Cindy Sherman, Alfred Eisenstaedt, Nick Ut, Anne Geddes, Jeff Widener, Robert Frank, Brian Duffy, Terry Richardson, Henry Fox Talbot, Jacob Riis, Lyle Owerko, Julia Margaret Cameron, Joel Meyerowitz, Martin Parr, David Hockney, Eugène Atet, Andy Warhol, Mapplethorpe, Vivian Maier, Harry Benson, Bruce Gilden, Patrick Anton, Imogen Cunningham, Paul Strand, Mark Seliger, Philippe Halsman, and Patrick Demarchelier.

No Eliot Porter? Matthew Brady? Galen Rowell? Oh well... Anyway, I count something like  40 men and 11 women. Which is not to say that it isn't patronizing, only that the numbers are not obviously the reason.

-Matt


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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2016, 07:25:32 pm »

Let me paraphrase the Supreme Court Chief Justice Roberts' words on race: "The only way to stop discrimination based on race gender is to stop discriminating based on race gender."

Schewe

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2016, 01:35:07 am »

Don't want to be disrespectful, but every time I seem an article about honoring women in something, I begin to wonder if I'm reliving the 50s. Women in the arts shouldn't be a separate sub-phylum: too often, "Women artists, 1980-1990" and so on are actually code words for "Artists who aren't quite good enough to stand on their own."

You don't know Kevin very well huh? I do and I'm here to tell ya, your perception of what Kev meant to say was about 180º off base.

Kev is a rooter...he roots for people, he roots for camera makers, printer makers, paper makers, ETC! He is enthusiastic about everything (he can't help himself) so when he hit on writing about women he took his 60+ year old perspective and write about women in photography. That's about all you should read into his writing...

It's too late to to change the title...can you forgive Kev's enthusiasm?
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Rob C

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2016, 06:18:09 am »

Too late I return to the thread, refreshed - slightly - from a reasonable sleep, but suffering still from age lag.

So lets add to the list of European dames par excellence: my personal queen of 'em all, Sarah Moon; Domiinique Issermann; Regina Relang; Chiara Samugheo; Crista Peters; Brigitte Lacombe; Jane Bown and many others I have forgotten but still know are there in the recesses of my mind.

There are many American ones too, but this is about the Europeans.

Rob

John Camp

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2016, 07:06:38 pm »

You don't know Kevin very well huh? I do and I'm here to tell ya, your perception of what Kev meant to say was about 180º off base.

Kev is a rooter...he roots for people, he roots for camera makers, printer makers, paper makers, ETC! He is enthusiastic about everything (he can't help himself) so when he hit on writing about women he took his 60+ year old perspective and write about women in photography. That's about all you should read into his writing...

It's too late to to change the title...can you forgive Kev's enthusiasm?

Jeff, actually I can.

But expression counts too. Put it in terms of race: "I think there are many fine black photographers." And everybody who has been around since the fifties would wince. Because of course there are many fine black photographers. Don't have to say it. Saying, "Look at this -- there are many fine women photographers" comes out of the same kind of possibly good-hearted, but basically lame perception. Like we should be surprised or something. I guess what I'm saying is, I recognize that Kevin was trying to be generous, and trying to do a good thing, but it still winds up suggesting that women are a different breed somehow, and they're not. They shouldn't rise or fall because they're women, they should rise or fall on their photography. I became particularly sensitive to this problem after I went to the National Museum of Women in the Arts and came away thinking, "Jeez, what a load of crap." It was particularly embarrassing because of its nearby companion, the National Gallery, one of the best art collections in the world. The art in the women's museum included stuff from female artists who weren't in the National Gallery because they were second- and third-rate artists, or, when they were first-rate artists, the work shown was second- or third-rate examples. Women don't really need any longer to be collected together to show their strengths, and they don't really need men to point out that they have strengths, and that's particularly true in photography.
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ripgriffith

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2016, 11:23:26 pm »

Jeff, actually I can.

But expression counts too. Put it in terms of race: "I think there are many fine black photographers." And everybody who has been around since the fifties would wince. Because of course there are many fine black photographers. Don't have to say it. Saying, "Look at this -- there are many fine women photographers" comes out of the same kind of possibly good-hearted, but basically lame perception. Like we should be surprised or something. I guess what I'm saying is, I recognize that Kevin was trying to be generous, and trying to do a good thing, but it still winds up suggesting that women are a different breed somehow, and they're not. They shouldn't rise or fall because they're women, they should rise or fall on their photography. I became particularly sensitive to this problem after I went to the National Museum of Women in the Arts and came away thinking, "Jeez, what a load of crap." It was particularly embarrassing because of its nearby companion, the National Gallery, one of the best art collections in the world. The art in the women's museum included stuff from female artists who weren't in the National Gallery because they were second- and third-rate artists, or, when they were first-rate artists, the work shown was second- or third-rate examples. Women don't really need any longer to be collected together to show their strengths, and they don't really need men to point out that they have strengths, and that's particularly true in photography.
+1
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LesPalenik

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2016, 05:21:39 am »

Don't want to be disrespectful, but every time I seem an article about honoring women in something, I begin to wonder if I'm reliving the 50s. Women in the arts shouldn't be a separate sub-phylum: too often, "Women artists, 1980-1990" and so on are actually code words for "Artists who aren't quite good enough to stand on their own."

Couldn't agree more. Any article picking randomly just a handful of woman photographers does disservice to millions of ladies practicing fine art photography or specializing in a distinctive area. And going back to the history, already in the 19th century there were many accomplished female photographers.
 
Here is another random international group of not-so-well-known ladies known for their particular expertise:
Shao Hua (1938–2008), daughter-in-law of Mao Zedong photographed party celebrities, factories and army units in the 1950s
Mary Willumsen (1884–1961), who produced postcards of women in scanty clothing
Geneviève Cadieux (born 1955), captured women's facial expressions
Irina Ionesco (born 1935), erotic images of lavishly dressed women posing provocatively
Bettina Rheims (born 1952), specializing in strip-tease artists and acrobats, and stuffed animals
Astrid Kirchherr (born 1938), photographed the Beatles before they became famous
Shirin Neshat (born 1957), photos of women confronted by Islamic fundamentalism
Dianora Niccolini (born 1936), pioneer of male nude photography
Toyoko Tokiwa (born 1930), known for her depiction of the red-light district of post-occupation Yokohama, for a clientele of US servicemen
Teresa Margolles (born 1963), portraying death
Isabel Muñoz (born 1951), black-and-white pictures of the human body, toreros and dancers
Madame Yevonde (1893–1975), pioneered colour in portrait photography, including a series of guests at a party dressed as Roman and Greek gods and goddesses
Carol Beckwith (born 1945), photographer of the indigenous tribal cultures of Africa
Joan E. Biren (born 1946), with focus on lesbians and feminism (many more in this category)
Louise Arner Boyd (1887–1972), explorer who took hundreds of photographs of the Arctic
Sherrie Levine (born 1947) with a knack for appropriation photography
Anne Noggle (1922–2005), a photographer after a career as an aviator, depicted the ageing process of women
Rachel Sussman (born 1975), hunting for living organisms at least 2,000 years old

I'm not aware of any female Inuit photographers, but Michelle Valberg from Ottawa is well known for her photographs of Canada's Arctic and Inuit people
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Eric Kellerman

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2016, 07:14:31 am »

Flor Garduño, Lynn Bianchi ...
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Rob C

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2016, 10:08:18 am »

No to mention Yva, in Berlin, who gave Helmut Newton a two-year apprenticeship starting in 1936... at 45 Schlüterstrasse.

Rob C
« Last Edit: May 02, 2016, 10:36:32 am by Rob C »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2016, 10:15:55 am »

.... Any article picking randomly just a handful of woman photographers does disservice to millions of ladies practicing fine art photography...

Indeed, Les, the article would have been so much better if it listed those millions individually instead. But you are in the right track to correct it: only 999,980 or so to go ;)

LesPalenik

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2016, 10:29:05 am »

Just doing my duty.
If everybody would list twenty of their favorite female photographers, all the misconceptions would be cleared.
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Rob C

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2016, 10:35:32 am »

Like all male conversation, it eventually ends up with tall tales of sex.

Let's all quit whilst we're ahead.

;-(

Rob

ErikKaffehr

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2016, 10:43:15 am »

Hi,

We have a Swedish lady shooting ice bear...

http://www.kamerabild.se/artiklar/intervjuer/naturfotograf-i-arktis



Best regards
Erik
Couldn't agree more. Any article picking randomly just a handful of woman photographers does disservice to millions of ladies practicing fine art photography or specializing in a distinctive area. And going back to the history, already in the 19th century there were many accomplished female photographers.
 
Here is another random international group of not-so-well-known ladies known for their particular expertise:
Shao Hua (1938–2008), daughter-in-law of Mao Zedong photographed party celebrities, factories and army units in the 1950s
Mary Willumsen (1884–1961), who produced postcards of women in scanty clothing
Geneviève Cadieux (born 1955), captured women's facial expressions
Irina Ionesco (born 1935), erotic images of lavishly dressed women posing provocatively
Bettina Rheims (born 1952), specializing in strip-tease artists and acrobats, and stuffed animals
Astrid Kirchherr (born 1938), photographed the Beatles before they became famous
Shirin Neshat (born 1957), photos of women confronted by Islamic fundamentalism
Dianora Niccolini (born 1936), pioneer of male nude photography
Toyoko Tokiwa (born 1930), known for her depiction of the red-light district of post-occupation Yokohama, for a clientele of US servicemen
Teresa Margolles (born 1963), portraying death
Isabel Muñoz (born 1951), black-and-white pictures of the human body, toreros and dancers
Madame Yevonde (1893–1975), pioneered colour in portrait photography, including a series of guests at a party dressed as Roman and Greek gods and goddesses
Carol Beckwith (born 1945), photographer of the indigenous tribal cultures of Africa
Joan E. Biren (born 1946), with focus on lesbians and feminism (many more in this category)
Louise Arner Boyd (1887–1972), explorer who took hundreds of photographs of the Arctic
Sherrie Levine (born 1947) with a knack for appropriation photography
Anne Noggle (1922–2005), a photographer after a career as an aviator, depicted the ageing process of women
Rachel Sussman (born 1975), hunting for living organisms at least 2,000 years old

I'm not aware of any female Inuit photographers, but Michelle Valberg from Ottawa is well known for her photographs of Canada's Arctic and Inuit people
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Erik Kaffehr
 

LesPalenik

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2016, 11:04:49 am »

Good, now we are getting somewhere. There are even women shooting teddy bears.

http://www.boredpanda.com/rats-teddy-bears-ellen-van-deelen-jessica-florence/
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PeterAit

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2016, 11:35:13 am »

Don't want to be disrespectful, but every time I seem an article about honoring women in something, I begin to wonder if I'm reliving the 50s. Women in the arts shouldn't be a separate sub-phylum: too often, "Women artists, 1980-1990" and so on are actually code words for "Artists who aren't quite good enough to stand on their own."

The thing about women in photography is, right from the start women have not only been important, but you could make a very good argument that THEY have been dominant, and not men. Let me throw out a few names: Julia Margaret Cameron, Imogen Cunningham, Dorothea Lange, Lisette Model, Cindy Sherman, Diane Arbus, Annie Leibovitz, Margaret Bourke-White, Helen Levitt, Lee Miller, Sally Mann, Carrie Mae Weems, Annie Leibovitz, Bernice Abbott, Tina Modotti, Mary Ellen Mark, Ruth Bernhard, Nan Goldin, Francesca Woodman, Ilse Bing, Jane Brown, and I'm still forgetting a lot of them. That's just off the top of my head, and I don't know the names of lots of distinguished Asian and European women photographers. Anyone think they could come up with a list of male photographers with names as familiar as those, and work as distinguished?

If the article were called, Honoring Women Gearheads, you wouldn't have heard a thing from me; honoring women *photographers* seems a trifle patronizing.   

Jeez, eat a bran muffin. Or three.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Honoring women in Photography, blah blah blah
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2016, 11:47:43 am »

... all the misconceptions would be cleared.

And what misconceptions would those be?
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