A Leica S Type Hasselblad camera?

[Theodoros]

Assuming Hasselblad introduces a new "entry level" medium format camera utilizing the same 33x44 sensor currently in the H5D, H6D, and CFV-50c, at a price point that "attracts new users," their first question is how to do so without cannibalizing sales on those other platforms.  You want to give new users a taste of the quality the larger format is famous for, but not such a flexible system that users - both new and old - can conclude that it mostly does everything they need.

And the R&D and pre-prod fab expenses must be kept tightly in check.

With that as the brief, what would make sense to me is a fixed lens rangefinder.

IMO, it won't matter if there is some cannibalisation happening, not if it adds more customers and more profitability because of larger per sale margin... Let me explain... If you notice the real price of H6D-50, (after the trade in value is subtracted) it comes down to 16K USD, If they price the same package, but rehoused in a non-modular body for 12K, there can be even larger profit remaining per item...  Besides, one would expect for many to still prefer the modular body (especially if they need the body to be modular) and there is still the H6D-100 that will keep the H6D system running well... But the 12K DSLR, will surely attract more customers to invest into the system other than cannibalising (but still have the same customers) some out of the H6D sales... I also don't expect the H5D-50 to continue after the H6D trade policy will stop... I expect them to then come with a similar pricing policy with the H6D, if you take the currently offered trade in prices of the H6D, it's easy to conclude that they are not that much different to the H5D-50 pricing policy... 

[Theodoros]

Can someone explain the target buyers of this monstrosity?

Edmund

What is there to explain? If a DSLR type camera is introduced, you'll have a new series of lenses (with smaller image circle) for it... The compatibility with H lenses (via an adapter) will be retained only as to "bridge" the two systems into one...

[JV]

What is there to explain? If a DSLR type camera is introduced, you'll have a new series of lenses (with smaller image circle) for it... The compatibility with H lenses (via an adapter) will be retained only as to "bridge" the two systems into one...

I am guessing Edmund is probably talking about the Leica SL...

I don't think it is a monstrosity...  it is a very incomplete system at present with only 2 zooms available but IMO it holds a lot of promise for the future...

As soon as the S-adapter becomes available I will probably get one...

[eronald]

I am guessing Edmund is probably talking about the Leica SL...

I don't think it is a monstrosity...  it is a very incomplete system at present with only 2 zooms available but IMO it holds a lot of promise for the future...

As soon as the S-adapter becomes available I will probably get one...

Ok, ok, a juvenile monster then.

[Theodoros]

Ok, ok, a juvenile monster then.

I do believe you miss the point with the SL... The SL is NOT there to be appealing, if Leica wanted to do that, they could make an interchangeable lens Q instead (cheaper than the Q too since there would be no lens) with T mount and market that... (which might as well happen). Instead, the SL is marketed as a PRO camera and it being a mirrorless, it has great compatibility (and LV) as to play the roll of an MFDB on a Sinar camera, as well as providing a great video platform for professional use... My Opinion is that the SL was never meant to be a mainstream product, the dedicated lenses made for it are to support the future T -mount (FF) cameras, the SL is there only for pros... (and that's how Leica markets it...). Wait until the S to SL adapter will be introduced (by next month I think is what Leica's intro announcement said) and thus the communication interface for one to use the SL on a view camera (as a back) with the (larger image circle) S lenses on the front standard and full communication interface between (the SL) camera and (the S) lenses...  The SL has 4mm (!!!!) wider mount (in diameter)  than the Sony a7 and only 19mm lens mounting  distance... That "says" (by itself) a lot more for its purpose (to pros) than what Synn's mind can achieve... 

EDIT: There are two kinds of viewpoint with the SL... One that sees a FF mirrorless with respect to Sony a7 and another, (the correct one) that sees an ALPA 12 FPS alternative...

[eronald]

Wait until the S to SL adapter will be introduced (by next month I think is what Leica's intro announcement said) and thus the communication interface for one to use the SL on a view camera (as a back) with the (larger image circle) S lenses on the front standard and full communication interface between (the SL) camera and (the S) lenses...  The SL has 4mm (!!!!) wider mount (in diameter)  than the Sony a7 and only 19mm lens mounting  distance... That "says" (by itself) a lot more for its purpose (to pros) than what Synn's mind can achieve... 

EDIT: There are two kinds of viewpoint with the SL... One that sees a FF mirrorless with respect to Sony a7 and another, (the correct one) that sees an ALPA 12 FPS alternative...

There may be something to what you say. I never got the point of the SL as a handheld, but as a digital back in all but name ... 

Edmund

[Theodoros]

There may be something to what you say

Edmund

There is always something in what I say... Otherwise... I don't speak. 

[JV]

I never got the point of the SL as a handheld, but as a digital back in all but name ... 

Right now the Leica SL IMO only makes sense for people with R-glass (call it the R10 if you want) and long M-lenses (rather difficult to focus on the M for some).

With the 2 zoom lenses you can add versatility but they are expensive, heavy and rather slow...

This can all change when Leica releases the 50mm at the end of the year.  Leica claims that it will be the new reference for this focal length.

If they pull this off I am sure a lot more people will become interested in the Leica SL...

As a video platform you will also be able to use Leica Cine lenses through an adapter.

[hasselbladfan]

If they pull this off I am sure a lot more people will become interested in the Leica SL...

I am sure the success of the S and the SL (and the failure of the Lunars) has made Hasselblad thinking why they cannot do the same.

[JV]

I am sure the success of the S and the SL (and the failure of the Lunars) has made Hasselblad thinking why they cannot do the same.

Unfortunately Hasselblad made a lot of poor decisions in the past and it will take them a while to catch up again.

It would appear they are at the right track again, although I wouldn't call pricing the H6D-50c at $26K one of their better judgement calls...

You can shoot Hasselblad H lenses on the Leica S with a focal plane shutter, you can't on the Hasselblad H...

You can shoot the Hasselblad Zeiss Planar 110mm on a Leica S body, you cannot on the H-body.

The H-body accepts H and V lenses, the Leica S does the same and (in addition to S-lenses) also Contax 645, Pentax 67 and Mamiya 645 lenses.

And by stacking adapters you will also be able to use them on the Leica SL.

There's some catch up to be done here for Hasselblad...

[Theodoros]

I am sure the success of the S and the SL (and the failure of the Lunars) has made Hasselblad thinking why they cannot do the same.

It's rather, "why they weren't doing the same..." Agreed... Go figure! My guess is with the answer "because products where designed by marketeers instead of photographers & engineers working together..." Never the less, one can't help to notice that P1 is completely the other way around... They sleep in the "marketing nirvana" of the past years.... Unless if they wake up, I can see them having big trouble to compete soon... pity... They don't listen... they are based on the fanboy base they've created (like Hassy was until 3 years ago) and think that they can rely on that... It's explainable... they luck past experience!

[eronald]

It's rather, "why they weren't doing the same..." Agreed... Go figure! My guess is with the answer "because products where designed by marketeers instead of photographers & engineers working together..." Never the less, one can't help to notice that P1 is completely the other way around... They sleep in the "marketing nirvana" of the past years.... Unless if they wake up, I can see them having big trouble to compete soon... pity... They don't listen... they are based on the fanboy base they've created (like Hassy was until 3 years ago) and think that they can rely on that... It's explainable... they luck past experience!

P1 have dealers who can sell ice to eskimos; that gives them a lot of flexibility.

Edmund

[hasselbladfan]

There's some catch up to be done here for Hasselblad...

A lot to catch up, but it may be easier if they copy someone else.

[Theodoros]

First thing that they should do, is to include a focal plane shutter in the design. They should have done that with the H1 too ages ago...  Next is that they should introduce back the CF series of self contained backs... Third is that they should have done a 28mm lens for the V some... ages ago!

[Theodoros]

P1 have dealers who can sell ice to eskimos; that gives them a lot of flexibility.

Edmund

One should better think as to "why the Eskimos do buy the Ice" instead... IMO the answer is simple... It's all Hasselblad's fault, if they would have continued making the CF series of backs, Eskimos would have a choice...