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Author Topic: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)  (Read 10716 times)

Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2016, 08:55:41 PM »

That's a change, and very good.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Joseph Kayne

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #21 on: March 10, 2016, 09:01:23 PM »

By the way, what Epson thick papers are similar to Ilford Gold Fibre Silk and hahnemuhle Photo rag Baryta?
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samueljohnchia

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2016, 09:53:00 PM »

By the way, what Epson thick papers are similar to Ilford Gold Fibre Silk and hahnemuhle Photo rag Baryta?

Legacy Platine and Legacy Baryta - which are Canson Platine and Canson Baryta Photographique repackaged.
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Joseph Kayne

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2016, 11:38:24 PM »

Legacy Platine and Legacy Baryta - which are Canson Platine and Canson Baryta Photographique repackaged.

So, I assume they would have the same issue?
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samueljohnchia

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2016, 01:02:14 AM »

So, I assume they would have the same issue?

Most likely. Then you can prove to Epson that something really is wrong with your P800.
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Joseph Kayne

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2016, 07:41:15 AM »

Legacy Platine and Legacy Baryta - which are Canson Platine and Canson Baryta Photographique repackaged.

Can u buy them yet
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #26 on: March 11, 2016, 07:52:46 AM »

Legacy Platine and Legacy Baryta - which are Canson Platine and Canson Baryta Photographique repackaged.

Your evidence?
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #27 on: March 11, 2016, 07:54:43 AM »

Can u buy them yet

Roll yes, sheets larger than US Letter, no not yet. But don't worry yourself - this is a distraction. If Epson tech support is encouraging you to submit samples of roller marks on the paper you are using, just do that and wait to see what they come back with.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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samueljohnchia

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2016, 08:09:58 AM »

Your evidence?

I'm not at liberty to share. It doesn't matter. If Legacy Platine and Fiber works on Joseph's P800, great. If they don't, Epson cannot say it's because his third party paper choices are incompatible with their printer, and he has good reason to get Epson to replace or fix his printer. Isn't that the more important issue?
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2016, 08:26:03 AM »

I'm not at liberty to share. It doesn't matter. If Legacy Platine and Fiber works on Joseph's P800, great. If they don't, Epson cannot say it's because his third party paper choices are incompatible with their printer, and he has good reason to get Epson to replace or fix his printer. Isn't that the more important issue?

Sorry - if you are not at liberty to share you probably also aren't at liberty to share the statement you made. I assume you understand it could make liars of Epson who publicly state on the back of the sample packs: "Working with famous European paper makers, art galleries and chemical engineers, Epson created the Legacy Paper line to be the finest papers available." This doesn't sound like repackaging to me - taken at face value. And what about legal implications in respect of any patents and copyrights that the original recipe holders retain for these products? Are these mills and manufacturers just collaborating with each other in a major con game? The paper industry is rather opaque (no pun intended) , but one would hope not.

The papers can look similar, they can feel similar, they can have similar physical specs in terms of thickness and mass, but yet they can still be different in subtle ways or under-the-hood. Anyhow, this is OT. I still think Joseph should do what the Epson rep said he should do, but I agree with your statement that if his printer produces the same defects on sheets of Epson Legacy paper it strengthens his case.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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samueljohnchia

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #30 on: March 11, 2016, 08:34:20 AM »

Mark, you are of course at liberty to make any interpretation of my comments. I'm not the only person making the connection between Canson papers and the Legacy range, I'm sure you've noticed. If I'm wrong about the paper, fine, I stand corrected. I'm only interested in helping Joseph, not starting an argument about this.

Joseph, so try these new Legacy papers, so Epson has no excuse to push the blame to third party papers that are incompatible with your printer. In particular, Legacy Fiber and Platine are particularly soft, so if anything those papers may help you reproduce the issue on Epson's own papers. Please let us know how it goes with Epson!
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #31 on: March 11, 2016, 01:37:41 PM »

Mark, you are of course at liberty to make any interpretation of my comments. I'm not the only person making the connection between Canson papers and the Legacy range, I'm sure you've noticed. If I'm wrong about the paper, fine, I stand corrected. I'm only interested in helping Joseph, not starting an argument about this.

Yes of course I've noticed, and insofar as I am preparing a review of these papers I'm examining all this objectively and rather carefully. So it wouldn't surprise me to see this discussion re-surface anon, but it will be in the context of tangible information. We can leave it at that for now, and wish Joseph the best in getting his printer issue resolved.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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Jane

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #32 on: March 11, 2016, 02:12:55 PM »

After 4 years of using the R3000, more or less successfully, to print on the 320 gram Harman Gloss Baryta, latterly 'Harman by Hahnemuhle Gloss Baryta ' ( and cursed be the day that Hahnemuhle took over distribution of the Harman paper as now the letter size is invariably and grossly curled ) as well as the Epson Ultrasmooth Fine Art matte paper, at 325 grams, the R3000, even after careful cleaning, has now started and persisted in delivering strike marks and other ink marks on thick media, including Epson Exhibition Fiber and Ilford Gold Silk as well as the Harman. ( I haven't switched over to matte black and larger papers since the troubles began.) There are strikes on the edges of the paper ( attributable to residual curl after straightening efforts ) as well as marks and some smudging in the middle of the sheets. This happened regardless of whether initial loading was successful or the paper was reloaded after several paper skews.

The Epson tech, informed that nozzle check printed clean and that thinner papers ( Epson Premium Luster ) also printed clean, only heavier papers affected, didn't have a solution, didn't suggest platen or drying-time adjustments.

I gave up and ordered a P800 and was planning on supplying myself with the raved-about Canson Baryta Photographique. Only subsequently did I come across the vintage discussion here about banding with Epson R3000 and Canson Baryta:      http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=58597.0 

Now it appears that some ( see -careful language ) P800s have similar issues. I still have the R3000 and mean to experiment with the printer settings.

I think that, unless it's got its head in the sand, Epson must have been aware of the issue before production of the P series.
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Joseph Kayne

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #33 on: March 18, 2016, 07:00:46 PM »

FYI...still working with Epson on this issue....
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Joseph Kayne

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #34 on: March 24, 2016, 12:36:14 PM »

I've worked in detail with Epson.  The short of it is that I have to used the front manual feeder. There is some issue with using the Auto Sheet feeder in that the intake roller puts too much pressure on the softer papers.  They will be relaying that to the development group.
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2016, 01:16:25 PM »

Likely a good outcome. At the start of this thread you mentioned that you are printing with Canson BP. I would ONLY feed that paper through the FFA feeder, not the auto feeder, and same for any other paper of equivalent weight/thickness or heavier. Please do let us know whether that solves your problem.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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JeanMarc

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #36 on: December 15, 2016, 07:00:15 AM »

I see this question has come up with both the P800 and the 3000 and I want to know if anyone has an update with any answers. I have experienced the same issue:

" I just love the output overall, the colors are spot on what I'm trying, the resolution is excellent and so on. But when examining the photos more closely I found a problem on which I'd like to have some opinions.

Printing on Canson Baryta Photographique, you can see some faint roller marks on the gloss of the paper. Not bad enough to be immediately visible but when you examine the print at an angle with a hardish light, you can easily see the faint, straight patterns of the rollers in the gloss at a slightly shallower angle (=closer to you) than the one of the light otherwise reflecting from the paper. Also they are visible at certain angles when the print is held vertically and the light source is almost directly above. Those are especially easy to find on the left side of an A3-sized print, though visible at the whole width of the print. The spacing and position match to the exit rollers visible on the output, so I'm assuming that they are causing these patterns. Mostly you can see them only in some very dark tones, but because I like to do much B&W stuff, I find them quite annoying - at least now when I've first spotted them..

The relevant(?) print driver settings are:

    Epson Premium Semigloss as a media type setting
    Full quality, no high speed/bi-directional in use
    Tested paper thicknesses 3-5
    Platen gap wide.
    Other settings default.

Tried both fine art feed and the normal feed, no difference. Except that the fine art feed also leaves some easily visible scratches to rear side of the paper... Epson seems to be quite rough at it's paper handling! The rear side is not a problem for me anyway, and if it was, the normal feed seems to handle the Canson equally well. The roller marks are not visible on a matte media, or plain stuff obviously, will try some other papers when I've got a chance.

Anyone having any experience and/or solutions for the issue? I've tried to search both the forums and did the usual googleing, but not sure I've found any specific issue with the exit rollers."

and:

"I'm mostly thrilled with the new P800 but today I made 15x15 prints on 17x22 sheets using Canson's Baryta Photographique. On the third print I noticed a small series of parallel lines about an inch long starting near the top edge of the image and running about an inch into the photo. Clearly roller marks. I've tried adjusting the platten gap to Wide and changing the paper thickness from the default of 3 to 4--really bad--and to 2 which only made the marks farther apart. The lines only happen at the beginning of the image--the end of the sheet first out of the printer--and only on the top center. The rest of the image is clean.

Has anyone else experienced this and, if so, did you fix it? "

Updated answers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Hello Joseph!

I realize that this thread hasn't been updated in a while. I'm a new member here, and I've also just recently purchased a P800 printer from Epson. I'm having the same problem with faint roller marks on Canson Platine Fibre Rag (A3 size) - parallel roller marks throughout the length of the printed surface.

My retailer here in Munich was nice enough to send my faulty printouts to Epson, and five days later told me to call Epson support for further assistance.
So: Yesterday I was on the phone with Epson Germany, and they told me a few things... First, they recommended selecting a different paper type in the driver (which I tried afterwards, setting it to "Legacy Platine", no change in the results), then they told me to "play with" the settings for "Drying Time per Print Head Pass" and "Paper Feed Adjustment" (which I also did to some extend - I'm not willing to waste a whole Box of Platine to try every setting... - no change in the results). Finally it was suggested to me that what I'm seeing in my printouts is "within the specification of the printer", which kind of made me furious inside.
In the end, it was suggested to me that I send them a sheet of the paper in question along with my file so that they can try it on their P800. What I'm hoping for is that their printer will not be able to reproduce the issue, proving my claim that my unit is faulty, leading to them replacing my printer.

Worst case: same issue happens on their printer, they tell me: "Use Epson paper, this is not our problem." In that case I'd have to wait for their Legacy Platine paper to become available - I hear it's somewhat similar to Canson Platine - and see if my P800 produces roller marks on their paper, which in turn would make my case stronger.

I've been saving up and looking forward to purchasing this printer for months now, same goes for using the Canson papers that I fell in love with at photokina this year (special shoutout to Robert Rodriguez Jr., who made it a blast!), and now I'm having nightmares about this whole experience...  :(

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Big salute from Germany!

Jean-Marc
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #37 on: December 15, 2016, 08:12:43 AM »

Jean-Marc,

I've been using a P800 for the better part of a year and have had no issues with visible roller marks on the paper. I've used quite a variety of Epson and non-Epson media in it, because I test various papers for my contributions to this website. I am therefore given to suggest that if these roller marks are quite visible, there is an issue with your unit and by the end of the process with Epson perhaps they should replace it if they come to the same conclusion. It is important for them to get this right, because they are facing two options: either the problem is generic to the model, which would be difficult for them, or there is an issue with your particular printer or how you are using it. Either way, important for you and them to get to the bottom of it. It is good that they have asked to see a sample of the problem you are having. This means they are taking you and the problem seriously, as they should - and from my experience usually do. Please keep us informed on this thread how it works out.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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unesco

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #38 on: December 16, 2016, 07:00:35 AM »

Mark - pizza wheel marks on Epson P800s are common, I have talked to a guy from Epson service who confimed... (construction internally identical to 3880) My own P800 also makes them. Non visible on matt or typical PE RC paper, but a problem with barytas and FB gloss.

Jean Marc - if Canson is a problem for Epson service, you can try Epson Traditional Photo Paper. My P800 almost makes no marks on glossy/pearl standard photo papers, but on Traditional it is quite bad. And this is Epson paper so they shoud accept your compliant ;-).
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Epson P800 Faint Roller Mark (not pizza wheel marks)
« Reply #39 on: December 16, 2016, 07:46:59 AM »

Mark - pizza wheel marks on Epson P800s are common, I have talked to a guy from Epson service who confimed... (construction internally identical to 3880) My own P800 also makes them. Non visible on matt or typical PE RC paper, but a problem with barytas and FB gloss.


I don't know what "common" means in this context. I don't see such problems with my P800 and I print extensively with a range of baryta-type papers - both alpha-cellulose and cotton rag substrate. I've seen at most half a dozen complaints about it in this Forum, and Epson sells many of these printers world-wide. That's why I think where it does occur, the people who have such units should get them exchanged while the warranty is still in effect.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
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