Diluting ink for bubble jet printers

[martin0reg]

There are several fluids to dilute ink for epson piezo printers, like epson compatible gloss optimizer or ink base from MIS (Paul Roark's Lab). Both for dye and for pigment ink.
But I am not sure if you could use these also to dilute ink for canon bubble jet printers, because of the heating process for building the droplet.

I use to dilute epson piezo ink without problems: to get LC and LM from C and M (for using 4 color drylab ink in a 6 channel desktop printer) or to dilute a pure B&W ink set out of PK or MK...
Now if I want to dilute canon bubble jet ink for similar purpose, can I use the similar fluids as mentioned for epson?
(...at the first for canon dye ink... but the question refers both to dye and pigment inks for canon..)

[Ernst Dinkla]

For an HP thermal head printer I have used this gloss optimizer fluid meant for the Kodak thermal heads. In my case to dilute the HP cart no 70 photoblack ink. No issues.

http://www.rjettek.com/kgo-ocp-kodak-no-10-1935766-gloss-optimizer/

Of course this is another set of inks and another set of thermal inkjet heads. I learned that it is possible for these conditions.


Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
January 2016 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

[martin0reg]

Thank you for the info, I will try the kodak optimizer

... I learned that it is possible for these conditions....

Did you also learn what sort of thinner is not useable? Why and what happened, clogging... or nozzles simply not firing..?

I had used epson compatible optimizer from OCP for diluting epson ink, but since I found the clear ink bases from MIS / "roark's lab" I am glad I can do it without the optimizer.. which would be kind of "abused" because regarding its actual purpose...

BTW Is there any cleaning fluid for canon to use inside a cleaning cartridge, by performing cleaning cycles?

[martin0reg]

As Paul Roark may be around here:
Do you have any information or experience if your ink bases, e.g. the clear base for noritsu dye, could be used also for diluting canon dye?

[Paul Roark]

(I'm not sure why my previous comment did not appear.)

The generic dilution base for ("Eboni") carbon pigments used in Epson printers, as well as the dilution base for the Epson/Noritsu "Claria" type dyes is not appropriate for thermal heads like Canon uses.  The thermal heads generally use a less viscous ink, and the thermal head inks have ingredients that keep the heating element relatively clean.  These heating element cleaning agents are missing in the dilution bases made for the Epson printers.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

[martin0reg]

Thank you for commenting, Paul ... that is what I suspected..
My amateurish idea was: there have to be a component which is needed to build up the bubble at all, by heating - other than by piezo pressure...?!

I'm no chemist, but out of interest:
what is that "cleaning agent"?
and which ingredients in general are needed, which are forbidden to make a bubble jet ink?

PS: one thing I've learned regarding refill of simple home printers: there is no "universal ink", not dye nor pigment.
Because last week I filled UCK3 matte black (epson OEM) in a canon cart for text black, unintentional.
Afterwards the text black channel was missing totally... came back with a canon compatible text black ink, fortunately..

[Ernst Dinkla]

Thank you for the info, I will try the kodak optimizer
Did you also learn what sort of thinner is not useable? Why and what happened, clogging... or nozzles simply not firing..?

I had used epson compatible optimizer from OCP for diluting epson ink, but since I found the clear ink bases from MIS / "roark's lab" I am glad I can do it without the optimizer.. which would be kind of "abused" because regarding its actual purpose...

BTW Is there any cleaning fluid for canon to use inside a cleaning cartridge, by performing cleaning cycles?

No other experience than with the parts and conditions sketched. Like you I assumed that thermal heads required a different mix in the ink medium both on the bubble effect and the cleaning effect, the last for a thermal head means no build up on the heating element etc in the nozzle.

If we all do some experiments there will be a library to search in for all of us. Paul wrote a lot of pages, my contribution is more a footnote.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
January 2016 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

[Paul Roark]

The inkjet companies don't tell us their strategies, but all the thermal inkjet companies have an issue with "kogation" that the Epsons don't face.  There are reams of patents on the issue.  As stated in one application (http://www.google.com/patents/US8622534), "A problem in virtually all thermal inkjet printheads is the build [up] of solid deposits on heater elements used to heat the ink—a phenomenon known in the art as ‘kogation’. ... [A]pproaches to reducing kogation in the prior art employ additives in the inkjet inks ..."

Looking at the various company Material Safety Data Sheets, explanations in patent applications, descriptions of the chemicals used and other sources gives some hints as to what the OEMs may be using, but I'm not an expert in this particular issue.  I prefer to deal with Epsons where I just do not have to worry about this and other issues that relate only to the thermal heads.  To their credit, HP and Canon seem to have been rather successful in fighting the problem.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com