Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 14   Go Down

Author Topic: Best of the Bunch  (Read 50739 times)

stamper

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5124
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #40 on: April 18, 2016, 03:29:44 AM »

I wondered that myself...the last shot I posted (The Stranger) was made using iso 1250  1/1,600 @ f8 .  I was at least 40 feet away which made it somewhat easier to attain sharpness. I used a 45mm(90mm) on a m/43.

Peter

Dear oh dear. You wasn't using a wide angle prime lens. This means that you aren't a real Street Photographer? ;) :)

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #41 on: April 19, 2016, 10:05:48 AM »


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztviA4W3C40

Why does this sequence with a couple books and a camera leave me with a bad taste in my mouth?

Rob

RSL

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 9588
    • http://www.russ-lewis.com
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #42 on: April 19, 2016, 11:39:02 AM »

Maybe because it's so choppy it's like a bumpy ride in a jeep over rutted and rocky roads, Rob.

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #43 on: April 20, 2016, 06:15:47 AM »

Maybe because it's so choppy it's like a bumpy ride in a jeep over rutted and rocky roads, Rob.


And it doesn't improve one iota; in fact, I think it gets more upsetting as it progresses. There's so much confusion of sound, colour and movement that nothing gels at all - for me. Oh, for simplicity and strength.

Truth to tell, I initially abandoned the trip after the first few shots where he's looking at other people's work 'for inspiration...' and felt that was uninspiring enough right there; but I did eventually finish and certainly doubt I'll be taking another ride on the magic carpet. My poor head. Of course, where responsibilty actually lies is possibly another matter that perhaps shouldn't be laid at his (Mario's) feet.

Rob

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #44 on: April 22, 2016, 10:01:54 AM »



1.  It's different today, vs. the nostalgia of the 60's, 70's and 80's.

The clothes were more formal but simple, even elegant for the average street person.  There wasn't a logo every 20 ft. and black and white really works well with simplicity, tones and humanity.

I hate to say it but I find the photography from the past, way before I started to be so much more daring and trend setting, (for a better use of the phrase).

2.   I had a brief period a few years ago where I wanted to try street photography.   I bought a bunch of little 4/3 cameras and took my Leica M8 everywhere my wife who is my partner and producer went.

I shot a few things ok, but nothing spectacular, actually rarely turned them on.   

3.   Fine art alludes me and I applaud anyone that can do it, but I have to either give myself or have a client allow me to shoot with purpose.

4    My wife finally said, put those bloody cameras up cause you look like a tourist.

It's funny the only image I've ever placed in the fine art world was this one.



It was shot for an editorial an our printer in France wanted to enter it into an auction.

It sold for an surprisingly high amount which really shocked me.

Funnier still, since I shot it at the last second I just grabbed a 5d2 and had an assistant hand hold a 575 hmi.

Simple photograph, not worthy of these other examples, but it sold.


IMO

BC


Excuse chopping up your post like above, but makes it easier for me to respond.

1. Be happy you didn't have to shoot in the early 50s: most girls dressed like their mothers, complete with girdles! (I state the bit about girdles based on what I was told.) It worries me thinking of the 60s as nostalgia: feels like yesterday, much closer to me than the 80s do! The 80s feel like a general mistake, a minor diversion off the main drag.

I think your appreciation of the vitality of earlier photography stems from the absence of Photoshop. I feel it very strongly too, and the problem is two-fold: almost nothing looks real now, and so it lacks the "wow, that's fantastic!" factor one could get about something that's basically real. Looking at Bailey/Shrimpton or Rubartelli/Verushka the stun came from knowing it was what they were doing together to make it happen as it looks, not what somebody was effing about with in another office somewhere. Not the same. As bad, I get the feeling everybody is now trying to be the same as everybody else, but just a further step into fantasy where possible.

(I realised just now that the two guys I mentioned are both pretty much around my own age. Says something personal about attitudes, I guess.)

2. " but I have to either give myself or have a client allow me to shoot with purpose."

I'm glad you wrote that; it mirrors something I have often expressed here too: the sense of need of assignment to make the whole thing feel both legitimate and worth the bother doing. Terence Donovan wrote the same in different words, to the effect that the most difficult thing for the amateur is to find a reason to take a photograph. Without assignment, even pros are faced with the very same difficulty uness it's something still work-related but slightly different, such as shooting for their own book.

I eventually got around it by realising that if I didn't get over that hurdle, I simply wouoldn't have anything else worth doing in life. I'm glad I did get beyond it, but it took years. It might be thought that for anyone as desperate to become a pro photographer as I was, there would always be motivation enough; not so: the original drive was clearly focussed, and once the possibilities of continuing along in that direction had vanished, there wasn't anything left but vacuum. If that's not a contradiction in terms.

4. Looking like a tourist.

Feeling like one is worse! I live in two (odd, but true) tiny towns: one, inland, is the original one where folks lived, safely enough away from the beach to have time to flee pirates (Barbary ones... nothing new there, then) and the other part of it, about eight klicks away, was where they kept the fishing boats, and is now the tourist resort: crowded in summer dead as a stone in winter, thought the current invasions of Lycrawheelies are upsetting that balance ěn recent times. So I live in one but spend most time in the other.

I suspect that for the first couple of decades spent here I was, to all practical purposes, invisible to the local folk except those from whom we bought the basic necessities of life, or whose restaurants we visited regularly. Then, when I started to shoot out in the streets just a few years ago, I suddenly became generally visible - an oddity. After a while it became obvious I was no loger a tourist and so I became pretty much invisible again - just another in the legion of foreign eccentrics such as painters etc. who live around here. Oddly, I never take my camera to the beaches in summer. I want to avoid people in, or partly in swimwear.

Not many tourists around here look like your model; the shot, dragging what looks like fur, reminds me of those old ETA animal rights campaigns... One that struck me was to the effect that it took several hundred minks to make one fur coat and just one silly bitch to wear it. My wife used to have one - don't know which breed of animal 'donated' pelt - but as the coat was a discard from my mother who had lost interest in it, I felt she couldn't be held accountable. She looked beautiful in it, and felt so delightfully cuddly out on a cold Scottish winter's day as we walked the pooch in the snow in the park. No wonder shooting personal photographs for 'fun' wasn't a priority in those years: work provided that photo-buzz.

Nice to see you crossing the tracks from the MF side of LuLa... please come visit more often!

Rob C

GrahamBy

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1705
    • 500px
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #45 on: April 25, 2016, 09:23:00 AM »

(Peter confesses to using a 90mm equivalent lens)

Dear oh dear. You wasn't using a wide angle prime lens. This means that you aren't a real Street Photographer? ;) :)

In one of his interviews (I'm willing to believe he contradicted himself elsewhere) Henri C-B said he finally preferred the 50mm, but he tried both 90 and 35. The 90 he liked but the dof wasn't enough for him to get a sufficient proportion of shots in focus; the 35 was great for dof but the perspective made him feel as though the photos were shouting.

So it's ok, Peter is a legit after all  ;)
Logged

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1251
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #46 on: April 25, 2016, 09:32:38 AM »

(Peter confesses to using a 90mm equivalent lens)

In one of his interviews (I'm willing to believe he contradicted himself elsewhere) Henri C-B said he finally preferred the 50mm, but he tried both 90 and 35. The 90 he liked but the dof wasn't enough for him to get a sufficient proportion of shots in focus; the 35 was great for dof but the perspective made him feel as though the photos were shouting.

So it's ok, Peter is a legit after all  ;)
I'm well aware...besides Robert chastising me is tongue in cheek.
Peter
Logged
www.peterfiore.com

Canvas Colors Brushes  
An Interview on The Savvy Painter >https://savvypainter.com/podcast/light-art-peter-fiore/
A life in Art >  www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRsNaNM0ZeU

GrahamBy

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1705
    • 500px
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #47 on: April 25, 2016, 09:34:04 AM »

Looking at several of his vids, I have begun to wonder ˇf he really can work with those longer lenses hand-held, or whether it's a PR ploy to discourage the rest of us. I have sometimes put my 2.8/180mm (an af lens) onto a body and tried doing that with stationary objects: I can't get 'em sharp even at a 1/1000th sec! I sway about like a poppy watching the approaching Taliban. However, with up to 50mm I am surprisingly capable of having slow shutter stuff working. I often have suspected I don't have the optimal physical shape.

Image stabilisation is remarkable stuff. This was shot at 1/125 at f11 with a 200mm on an apc, so 300mm equivalent (sorry, don't have the image on this machine...)
https://500px.com/photo/143712057/gallery-district-by-graham-byrnes?ctx_page=1&from=user&user_id=10643117

This one was shot at a concert under dodgy lighting: same 70-200 zoom at 200mm, f/4 and 1/30 ! But I was cheating, had a monopod  :D
https://500px.com/photo/140378311/cynthia-au-piano-by-graham-byrnes?ctx_page=2&from=user&user_id=10643117
Logged

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #48 on: April 26, 2016, 03:51:12 AM »

Graham,

Yes, I'd wondered if that (im.stab.) was partly his secret, but was a bit doubtful he'd risk it for glossy magazines... but then, he has artistic leeway at his level of standing...

I looked at your link, and clicking the arrows, found you have a real treasure chest of stuff hidden away there! Congratulations, and don't keep your lamp hidden behind bushes! A very keen eye indeed.

Rob

GrahamBy

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1705
    • 500px
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #49 on: April 26, 2016, 08:11:57 AM »

Thanks for the kind words Rob :-)

I wonder about these discussions of sharpness, when I think that the photos that have had the biggest impact on me were short on 35mm tri-X, or maybe on a good day 6x6 tri-X. I can actually get similar effects shooting digital at 1600 or 3200 iso on the Pentax, but usually chicken out and use 400 because it feels wrong to waste all that light :)

So the degree of sharpness is a personal judgement, and for a pro... "artistic leeway" is I guess what allows him to exercise that judgement. There must be an element of "no one ever got fired for photos too sharp" in the editorial chain, and in a world where risk-taking seems to be beaten out of people from an early age, it would be tempting to use IS, from a tripod, with rapid discharge flash and then shoot video anyway.

I'm glad that I get paid to do other stuff: trying to be a scientist is also complicated by risk-averse bureaucrats, but at least I got in early enough to have the luxury of keeping some principles.... it's also a form of artistic leeway, I guess  ;D
Logged

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #50 on: April 26, 2016, 03:39:24 PM »

I have a feeling I linked this before, but can't trace it:

http://www.jnevins.com/garywinograndreading.htm

Rob

AreBee

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 638
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #51 on: May 03, 2016, 07:17:39 AM »

Quote from: Rob C
Terence Donovan wrote... to the effect that the most difficult thing for the amateur is to find a reason to take a photograph.

An odd thing to write, given that each day millions of amateurs effortlessly find a reason to take a photograph.

Quote from: Rob C
Without assignment, even pros are faced with the very same difficulty uness it's something still work-related but slightly different, such as shooting for their own book.

This seems to indicate that some professional photographers love photography not for photography's sake, but for their own.
Logged

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1251
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #52 on: May 03, 2016, 07:44:45 AM »

This seems to indicate that some professional photographers love photography not for photography's sake, but for their own.

For an artist it's one and the same...

Peter
Logged
www.peterfiore.com

Canvas Colors Brushes  
An Interview on The Savvy Painter >https://savvypainter.com/podcast/light-art-peter-fiore/
A life in Art >  www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRsNaNM0ZeU

AreBee

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 638
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #53 on: May 03, 2016, 08:33:33 AM »

Peter,

Quote
For an artist it's one and the same...

Evidently it's not to Rob C. Make of that what you will.
Logged

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1251
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #54 on: May 03, 2016, 08:52:19 AM »

Evidently it's not to Rob C. Make of that what you will.
 
Not true...In my opinion, Rob C Is very much an Artist. In the commercial field, which I was apart, limitations offer creativity. Only a true Artist will find them. I think that's closer to the truth.

Peter
Logged
www.peterfiore.com

Canvas Colors Brushes  
An Interview on The Savvy Painter >https://savvypainter.com/podcast/light-art-peter-fiore/
A life in Art >  www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRsNaNM0ZeU

AreBee

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 638
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #55 on: May 03, 2016, 09:19:09 AM »

Peter,

Quote
...In my opinion Rob C Is very much an Artist.

How do you distinguish artist from Artist?

Quote
In the commercial field, which I was apart, limitations offer creativity. Only a true Artist will find them. I think that's closer to the truth.

In the world in which we all live, necessity is the mother of invention. I think that's closer to the truth.
Logged

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #56 on: May 03, 2016, 09:43:41 AM »

 
Not true...In my opinion, Rob C Is very much an Artist. In the commercial field, which I was apart, limitations offer creativity. Only a true Artist will find them. I think that's closer to the truth.

Peter

Thanks for the definition; somewhat reassuring...

I'm reminded of 1973, sitting inside (obviously enough, but can't be too careful) an aircraft belonging to Cyprus Airways, on the return leg to London from a Vogue/IWS shoot, and the two models had me playing a game with them that consisted of rapid words/responses. "Photographer" came up, and one replied, quick as a flash, artist! I questioned it, and they both looked at me like I was nuts: of course photographers are artists, one said, what else did you think you were?

But the point, I think, that I was trying to illustrate a way back, about snappers and down-time, is this: without the challenge(?) of the concept of the commission aspect, where is the buzz? As a pro you know - or damned well should - that you can pretty much do anything that you want to do with a camera. That innocence of surprise is long gone; in it's place is the pleasure, the thrill of success when you delight somebody who rated you highly enough to hire you.

For instance, I recently shot a local girl (for the second time) for our mutual entertainment, and the end result, after about a week, was not of extreme joy: it involved a bit of a wrangle about some shots she liked and some she did not. I'd tried to explain, back in January when we first met, that a model's rôle is not to be pleased: her rôle is to be the vehicle through which a snapper expresses his ideas. If she wants to be happy and look like she sees in the mirror, then she needs to go play with a wedding, communions, passport photographer, not somebody like me on a totally different wavelength, not a  better frequency, but a different one. She still doesn't get it, and I don't think I'm going to pursue further attempts at interplay. The point being, without a paying client - the focus for the satisfaction - why bother to enter into a situation that promises only further hassle? It shouldn't be rocket science to suss this.

Let's face it: anyone who willingly, and with great effort, manages to get himself into a full-time photographic career, with all the headwinds, fights and sonsofbitches he knows he's going to run into in the years ahead, must have some deep feeling for the medium per se. Anyone who believes otherwise is either beyond redemption, or just needs to take off his blinkers for a moment.

Rob

RSL

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 9588
    • http://www.russ-lewis.com
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #57 on: May 03, 2016, 10:07:03 AM »


Let's face it: anyone who willingly, and with great effort, manages to get himself into a full-time photographic career, with all the headwinds, fights and sonsofbitches he knows he's going to run into in the years ahead, must have some deep feeling for the medium per se. Anyone who believes otherwise is either beyond redemption, or just needs to take off his blinkers for a moment.

Rob

And I'd add that I think he does it not because he loves the equipment and the action, but because there's something he wants to say during this life and this is the medium he's chosen in which to say it. There's a pretty important difference between reportage and art -- both in writing and in photography. Scene and events are the focus of reportage. The artist's heart is the focus of art.

AreBee

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 638
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #58 on: May 03, 2016, 11:47:49 AM »

Quote from: Rob C
...the point, I think, that I was trying to illustrate a way back, about snappers and down-time, is this: without the challenge(?) of the concept of the commission aspect, where is the buzz?

For no other reason than: love of photography for its own sake. Selflessness, rather than ego.

Quote from: Rob C
As a pro you know - or damned well should - that you can pretty much do anything that you want to do with a camera. That innocence of surprise is long gone; in it's place is the pleasure, the thrill of success when you delight somebody who rated you highly enough to hire you.

If you tendered for a commission, perhaps you were simply the cheapest.
Logged

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 17089
Re: Best of the Bunch
« Reply #59 on: May 03, 2016, 02:54:04 PM »

For no other reason than: love of photography for its own sake. Selflessness, rather than ego.

If you tendered for a commission, perhaps you were simply the cheapest.


In later years from, say, mid-70s, I created projects for clients; I was the prime motivator: there was no tendering, but thanks for the vote of confidence.

Rob C
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 14   Go Up