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Author Topic: Dye-sub vs Aqueous  (Read 2143 times)

ThirstyDursty

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Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« on: December 25, 2015, 06:42:18 pm »

I've got an Epson P800

Bought originally for my art...but a little side business has taken of.

It started with cards for local Artists, has turned into also mini prints and smaller fine art paper print.

Things are going so well, I'm thinking about how to expand my offering and personal capabilities.

One direction is to just go up a size or two in Aqueous Pigment with Epson or Canon. Probably try to squeeze to the 44" option here.

Another is to diversify...and probably go down to A3, but get a dye-sub printer and heat press. I could maybe squeeze a 24" dye sub....but maybe worried it has limited "fine art" usefulness. Although aluminum and acrylic prints are selling well for me (currently outsourcing to China, won't save mo ey, but gain control)

Wondering pros and cons of each. And why dye-sub might be a bad route to go.
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arobinson7547

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Re: Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2015, 07:25:40 am »

Maybe you can show your local Artists some samples of things Sublimation can do and see what they think. That can give you in idea of how it will be received, before hand.
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BillK

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Re: Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2015, 10:44:44 am »

If you think you will ever print  Gallery wrap canvas, don't even think of a 24" printer, go with a 44".
With a 24" the largest width you could do is about 20" because of the extra needed to stretch, you would be missing
out on a large part of the market for the above the sofa size pieces. I own both, and my preference is canon
over epson with the larger printers. I would go with the IPF 8400.

Dye Sub metal is very popular now. I sell a ton of it at the art shows I do. Lots of people selling Dye sub at fine art shows.
The problem lies in once you go beyond the 16x20 size the equipment cost get very high. You will need to have a very high volume
in sales to justify the investment in equipment. You really need to run the numbers first before going that route.
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ThirstyDursty

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Re: Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2015, 06:57:07 am »

If you think you will ever print  Gallery wrap canvas, don't even think of a 24" printer, go with a 44".
With a 24" the largest width you could do is about 20" because of the extra needed to stretch, you would be missing
out on a large part of the market for the above the sofa size pieces. I own both, and my preference is canon
over epson with the larger printers. I would go with the IPF 8400.

Dye Sub metal is very popular now. I sell a ton of it at the art shows I do. Lots of people selling Dye sub at fine art shows.
The problem lies in once you go beyond the 16x20 size the equipment cost get very high. You will need to have a very high volume
in sales to justify the investment in equipment. You really need to run the numbers first before going that route.

Thanks for that.

I think you are right about the 44inch. Seems there is a market for printing art reproduction...and large canvases would fit well to this...while also expanding the fine art paper capabilities. Expand on what I know...and really still a beginner at this anyways. -

I was just thinking A3+ To A2 dye sub mostly for aluminum. I did a show recently of 30cm square panels...and they sold better then any show I've done to date. So definitely popular with the buyers.

In researching I've learned there are also solvent printers.

I'm a little confused as pro and cons of each type. Obviously traditional papers seem best served with aqueous pigment printers....

dye-sub is for transferring and requires a receptor layer on the transfer object and heat?
What are solvent printers for?

I also see some with white and or metallic inks and UV drying

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I.T. Supplies

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Re: Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2015, 05:32:03 pm »

It really depends on what you'd be printing and what your market for customers is to decide on printer and media/subtrates (dye-sub).

A 44" pigment (aqueous) printer is always helpful when going through different size media and have many options to choose from.  Bond, coated, matte, satin/luster, gloss, fine art, canvas, vinyl, film, etc.
Dye Sublimation has MANY substrates to use as well.  Metal plates is just the start, but you can dye- sub lanyards, scarves, hats, shirt, plaques, keychains, socks and on.  You can view the options from ChromaLuxe- http://chromaluxe.com/  The longevity for most of the products is much longer than aqueous printing.  If you do a metal print, it will probably last for many lifetimes (fire retardant, water proof, scratch proof) if the process is done correctly.

Solvent is very similar to Latex as the ink gets "baked" into the media so the longevity is longer than aqueous prints by far, but the selection of media is a bit more limited yet less expensive in the long run.  These printers usually get used for doing long term outdoor banners/signage and commercial usage basically. 

Hope this helps differentiate the versions a little.
Atlex.com
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ThirstyDursty

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Re: Dye-sub vs Aqueous
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2015, 07:09:59 pm »

It really depends on what you'd be printing and what your market for customers is to decide on printer and media/subtrates (dye-sub).

A 44" pigment (aqueous) printer is always helpful when going through different size media and have many options to choose from.  Bond, coated, matte, satin/luster, gloss, fine art, canvas, vinyl, film, etc.
Dye Sublimation has MANY substrates to use as well.  Metal plates is just the start, but you can dye- sub lanyards, scarves, hats, shirt, plaques, keychains, socks and on.  You can view the options from ChromaLuxe- http://chromaluxe.com/  The longevity for most of the products is much longer than aqueous printing.  If you do a metal print, it will probably last for many lifetimes (fire retardant, water proof, scratch proof) if the process is done correctly.

Solvent is very similar to Latex as the ink gets "baked" into the media so the longevity is longer than aqueous prints by far, but the selection of media is a bit more limited yet less expensive in the long run.  These printers usually get used for doing long term outdoor banners/signage and commercial usage basically. 

Hope this helps differentiate the versions a little.
Atlex.com

It does...thank you

While key chains etc doesn't interest me. Textiles like silk scarves, pillow cases, etc. does.

Glass/acrylic and metal prints seem to be most marketable from both my own art and printing for others.

I've started experimenting with Bonny's transfer methods, but they are too manual and bespoke/each turns out different...which is fine for me, but couldn't sell as a service to other artists.

I see Epson has some CTP attachments....suggesting the 7-9xxxseries can print direct to some plates...assume these are proprietary or similar to booksmart's offerings.

One issue is that I'm in Australia and products without local distribution channels are very expensive to ship. I paid more in shipping then for the DASS supplies themselves and same with the booksmart's and Inkaid orders I made recently. $250 of products and $300 shipping.
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