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Author Topic: Shooting with the masters - William Neil  (Read 15254 times)

Ray

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Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« on: December 18, 2015, 02:24:48 am »

Interesting video, although a bit tedious at times, waiting for major points to be articulated.

William Neill certainly has the right idea, which I can relate to.

An impressive, awe-inspiring landscape, might require a wide-angle lens to capture the entire experience. But within that landscape there are numerous sub-sections which can be accessed with a telephoto lens or from close up.

This is the procedure I adopt on my travels. A good quality zoom lens with a decent range, I find essential.
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GrahamBy

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2015, 04:06:18 am »

Interesting video, although a bit tedious at times, waiting for major points to be articulated.

Which is a fundamental problem of video... there is a lot to be said for text that you can skim through to get the interesting bits.
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pw-pix

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2015, 04:29:35 am »

Yes, that is what is wrong with this site (and some others), tedious, chatty videos.
Give me concise writing every time.

Petrus

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2015, 05:22:03 am »

Yes, that is what is wrong with this site (and some others), tedious, chatty videos.
Give me concise writing every time.

+1

Why do they think older people like (most of) us can not read anymore? Is is faster to make a simple video than write an article? Could be, but then we are expected to waste our time watching the clumsy videos. Modern ways are not necessarily better than the old.
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Dave (Isle of Skye)

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2015, 06:26:57 am »

Sorry folks, but I entirely disagree. Reading or flicking quickly through text to find those hidden nuggets of information is one thing, a bit like studying, whereas sitting back and watching a talking head video interview, is much more informative, entertaining and inclusive.

I also think that the majority of people nowadays, find watching video a much more convenient and effective way to absorb content, than the old method of studying text, as the nuanced ideas, methods and even body language etc, can be fully communicated to the viewer a lot more easily, accurately and entertainingly through video.

Just my 2p’s worth.

Good interview Kevin BTW, I must admit I didn’t think you had the greatest of interview styles as compared to Michael, which is someone I am afraid you are always going to be compared to, as you normally seem a little on edge and occasionally lost for direction when asking questions, but with these two videos you are superb, you are relaxed, entertaining and have developed a good sense of where best to dig down to reveal the essence of what makes William Neil tick photographically. Excellent work!

I really look forward to viewing the rest of the William Neil interview segments of this series and hopefully to many more “Master” interviews, I think you might have struck gold here Kevin, well done that man!

Dave
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 08:16:29 am by Dave (Isle of Skye) »
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Rob C

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2015, 06:34:26 am »

Videos are simply unable to get out of the 'entertainment' box.

Unless made with professional, and good, actors, the cast can't be 'natural' and somebody who looks patently uncomfortable makes the audience squirm- or laugh - at the wrong moment. The people on show remain stiff, their little foibles infuriate after a time, and the direction/concept seems to drift all over the place. This seems to happen most with 'arty' videos where a particular person is being interviewed about his life and photography. (I say this, because that's the sort of video - apart from music - that I watch, mostly.) The questions, no doubt for the sake of the neophye viewer, are tediously basic and, worse, the interviewer often reveals great ignorance about the person he/she is interviewing. Another problem, as great, is that the person being interviewed is not always able to relax, either, and discomfort is catchy! Then you have the occasional opposite: people such as David Bailey, who has the chutzpah to handle anyone, backed up with a sense of humour even about himself.

I understand completely that doing the thing at a professional level is going to cost the Earth; possibly that's why the BBC manages to acquit itself so well when it takes on the challenge: it has both the funding (thank God) as well as the professional expertise to do the job it sets out to do. Perhaps that's also partly due to the source of much of its staff: you can't produce miracles if you can't believe in them.

Rob C

Chairman Bill

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2015, 06:35:24 am »

There's videos? No one said.

Zorki5

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2015, 07:05:26 am »

Why do they think older people like (most of) us can not read anymore?

I bet you can walk, and yet you do use cars, planes etc. for transportation -- whenever appropriate. Horses for courses.

I would agree that this particular interview turned out to be underwhelming, for whatever reason (do not want to dig into that...). But, overall, I for one think that video is perfect medium for interviews; here's one example of an interview where video did make a difference, and a hugely positive one at that.
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Dave (Isle of Skye)

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2015, 08:03:33 am »

Videos are simply unable to get out of the 'entertainment' box.

Rob C

Perhaps Rob, it has something to do with where people are on the Photographic learning curve? People who are already fairly confident in their knowledge, might just want the entertainment of video interviews, with the possibility of it being peppered with a few meaningful insights, sort of like topping up or even reinforcing what you already know or intuitively understand. I admit that videos lean more towards the entertainment style of learning than the text studying style of learning, but the videos here on Lula are just one part of the full spectrum of material available and I do think interviews such as these, certainly add something different and just as informative to the mix.

Dave
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 08:09:24 am by Dave (Isle of Skye) »
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Zorki5

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2015, 08:09:07 am »

Perhaps Rob, it has something to do with where people are on the Photographic learning curve? People who are already fairly confident in their knowledge, might just want the entertainment of video interviews, with the possibility of it being peppered with a few meaningful insights, sort of like topping up or even reinforcing what you already know or intuitively understand.

Agree, but not only that...

Rob, you made a good point in another thread that it's important to understand what makes people "tick". I bet videos convey that better than any other medium.
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GrahamBy

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2015, 08:19:55 am »

Then you have the occasional opposite: people such as David Bailey,

I very nearly added to my post "with occasional exceptions", thinking of Bailey. In motorcycle racing, it's one reason Valentino Rossi is so huge: he has this constant high-voltage feel about him, you could ask him about how he chooses his socks in the morning and he'd say something riveting. And previously Barry Sheene, who happened to steal one of DB's women... not purely a coincidence I suspect ;D
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2015, 08:50:55 am »

... Give me concise writing every time.

"F/8 and be there."

If concise is the goal, nothing else should ever be written about photography.

HSakols

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2015, 09:32:29 am »

Hey Kevin,
While you were in Yosemite did you run into the Yosemite Marching Band?
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Paulo Bizarro

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2015, 10:24:49 am »

"F/8 and be there."

If concise is the goal, nothing else should ever be written about photography.

Even more concise: "Be there":)

Zorki5

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2015, 10:38:24 am »

Even more concise: "Be there":)

Ditto, see item 3 here.
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Patricia Sheley

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2015, 11:51:06 am »

Quote Paulo:  "Be there":)

 :) !
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A common woman~

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2015, 01:08:59 pm »

"Be there" - and you could be anybody - tourist, visitor, onlooker, living there... "F/8" part indicates, as metaphor, you are a photographer.

HSakols

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2015, 01:27:44 pm »

More like f64 to honor photographers like Edward Weston and Imogene Cunningham. 
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Patricia Sheley

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #18 on: December 18, 2015, 01:28:29 pm »

~there...present.
Tao Te Ching, Chapter Thirty-three
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Rob C

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Re: Shooting with the masters - William Neil
« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2015, 01:57:41 pm »

First of all, when I wrote my earlier post here, I hadn't realised that the OP was about a video on this website; I have not seen it, and my views were not based on it - obviously enough when you are aware that I didn't see it!

But in general: I do not think video is all that good as a learning tool; equally, I once had a Photoshop manual and had to get rid of the thing - I couldn't get anywhere with it, perhaps because it took up from beyond my own knowledge level at that period. For me, and I'm willing to believe it's different for others, the ideal way to learn is one-to-one with somebody simply doing the thing in front of my eyes, letting me try it too, and then helping to iron out my mistakes. In a crowd/classroom situation, I don't see how it would work unless every student had a computer and dedicated teacher, returning it, more or less, to 1+1.

From the point of view of learning/appreciating what makes a photographic mind work, then video is great: I can think of stream-of-consciousness from Sarah Moon as she talks her way over some photographs, going into the anguish, despair, disappointment, fear and then huge joy as something starts to happen; the rapid acceleration from there to the climax of that moment - it's all stuff I know to be genuine because I have lived it and understand her emotions clearly: they are mine. It's wonderful because it lets me see that at least an artist whom I admire absolutely, doesn't just walk into a situation, click once, and wander away with an instant masterpìece. You have to build it, bit by bit. And of course, I'm not writing here about technique - that's a given: it's about maximizing the essence of what's possible between the two people, the model and the photographer. And the funny thing, when I hear her say of a moment when she feels, during a slow shoot, "I don't want to be a photographer anymore," I understand it so well, even as I know that negativity only lasts until the moment the reward hits your eyes, whereupon it becomes the greatest high there is. So yes, Zorki5 is right: it's a wonderful medium for getting into a soul.

Island Dave is also correct in saying that video adds; I suppose, as he suggests, much depends on where the viewer stands, and what he wants to draw from the watching experience. The BBC runs an occasional series "What do artists do all day?" and one such was devoted to Albert Watson doing a shoot (for P1, afaik) on Skye. I've watched it numerous times, not because I'm into landscape (I'm not), but because of Watson. He has something that makes watching easy, and a rewarding experience, regardless of genre, and he ends up with amazing pictures. However, it's funny seeing a pro who has a dedicated "tripod assistant"... How the other micropercent lives!

Rob C
« Last Edit: December 18, 2015, 02:30:56 pm by Rob C »
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