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Author Topic: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape  (Read 145228 times)

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #300 on: November 29, 2015, 03:42:25 pm »

... NO ONE here actually knows just how many awesome participants don't post because of this behavior ... My only intent in bothering to post again here...

I am done with this. :(

Oh, no!? Just as I was dying to see how awesome a participant you are. Please come back!

Rajan Parrikar

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #301 on: November 29, 2015, 03:53:07 pm »

Happy to subscribe and pay the fee for LuLa, a site I like.

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #302 on: November 29, 2015, 03:59:18 pm »

Back then, the word "offensive" was understood mostly as a noun, not an adjective:

drmike

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #303 on: November 29, 2015, 04:22:24 pm »

Oh, no!? Just as I was dying to see how awesome a participant you are. Please come back!

See Slobodan  I just don't understand how you feel this adds anything good to the site. The guy has just said he thinks that some attitudes displayed here discourage participation by some members who being less confident feel intimidated and fearful about contributing. You are clearly both intelligent and sensitive and yet you seem to revel in reacting in this way.

You are a positive and generous contributor to the site giving time and thought to helpful, interesting posts but just that one post might put off many others who are less confident and are fearful of being reviled. I certainly can't see Gary wanting to post again, why would he? Like him, I wonder how many others don't post for similar reasons although clearly not on your account more a small but prevalent attitude.

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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #304 on: November 29, 2015, 04:59:19 pm »

Mike, I do not remember anyone posting something genuine for the first time and being immediately attacked or ridiculed. When something like that happens, it is usually after things escalate over time.  Most new posters are generally welcome here. If someone came here and said something smart and worthwhile that resulted in an attack, there are many here, myself included, that would jump to their defense (as you just did). I sincerely invite Gary to say something, instead of just complaining how the water is not warm enough.

My point being, this isn't an ideal world in which one can wait till this forum (and the world) becomes perfectly nice and polite to participate. Because that is never going to happen - we are all human, after all. So, if you have something to say, go ahead and say it. Test your stance. While some of the responses might be less than palatable, they still might contain a kernel (or more) of truth. That's the proper learning environment, when your stance is vigorously challenged, not when you are coddled. Kids, who are accustomed of getting a blue ribbon for being 37th in a race, then step into the real, grown-up world, where nobody gives a damn how nice you tried. The world where you don't get rewarded for efforts, but for results.

Gary Damaskos

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #305 on: November 29, 2015, 05:14:16 pm »

See Slobodan  I just don't understand how you feel this adds anything good to the site. The guy has just said he thinks that some attitudes displayed here discourage participation by some members who being less confident feel intimidated and fearful about contributing. You are clearly both intelligent and sensitive and yet you seem to revel in reacting in this way.

You are a positive and generous contributor to the site giving time and thought to helpful, interesting posts but just that one post might put off many others who are less confident and are fearful of being reviled. I certainly can't see Gary wanting to post again, why would he? Like him, I wonder how many others don't post for similar reasons although clearly not on your account more a small but prevalent attitude.

Nice point drmike.
I will add that another reason any person- including me - might chose to not post (or post further) might have nothing what so ever to do with "confidence" - in fact might have entirely to do with preferring to participate with groups that are interested in creating an inclusive environment so as to benefit from all possible sources of insight or knowledge. It can be as simple as that. I just like persons with that vision and the corresponding attitude/behavior. Having to pass "hazing" for entry to participate may in fact have a place somewhere in life, but since I am in control of where and how I use my time and contributions and I prefer being in environments where there is an absence of the behavior we are discussing and the presence of the behavior I just described (inclusive), I and most likely many others, who may in fact not be "damaged or weak", just choose to let you folks engage in your thing without me/us. In this case the whole forum loses contributors. Inclusive behavior or excluding behavior, not that difficult to recognize.
Regards

Slobodan - I do not feel that you (and others) actually understand or want to acknowledge what might possibly be useful in what those of us that have shared the perspective that some behaviors we have described are detrimental. That is what I am experiencing reading your post. I made an effort, kinda need to move on, kinda want to move on. Not sure that saying anymore is going to add much from here.

OK, one thing: dear forum - do you think sharing you are interested in something changing automatically = complaining? It slipped my mind that some people think that way, hence interested in a little impromptu polling. For fun, ok? Is suggesting something change =  complaining.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 05:52:34 pm by Gary Damaskos »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #306 on: November 29, 2015, 06:20:47 pm »

For the record, Gary and I already interacted in two threads about a year ago and it all ended in a terribly... polite and thoughtful exchange of opinions.

tnargs

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #307 on: November 29, 2015, 06:49:24 pm »

Time for SB to stop posting and quietly reflect on the good advice he has received above. Fat chance eh?

Sent from my HTC_0P6B using Tapatalk

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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #308 on: November 29, 2015, 06:58:57 pm »

Time for SB to stop posting...

Now you hurt my feelings. Off I go to find a safe zone  :'(

Manoli

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #309 on: November 29, 2015, 07:14:44 pm »

My point being, this isn't an ideal world in which one can wait till this forum (and the world) becomes perfectly nice and polite to participate. Because that is never going to happen ...

Slobodan -

Let's get one thing clear – behavioural issues, if you have them, are yours and yours alone – nothing to do with this 'forum' and even less to do with the world.
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Manoli

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #310 on: November 29, 2015, 07:15:14 pm »

But if you want good content, it can't be free.

Back on topic -

Very well said, Jeff. Now tell me just how many of the articles published on LuLa over the past two years have been other than pro-bono. With Michael receding into the background and LuLa's 'authority' crumbling faster than a soufflé in a freezer – no amount of cash, by itself,  will halt the slide unless that cash is put towards the reconstructive surgery LuLa needs.

Dumbing down ain't going to bring the masses back – all that's 'really' left of LuLa is the forum and even there, care to work out how many of your previous contributors and pros no longer post or contribute here but are often to be both seen and heard on other fora ?

You want better content? Pay for it...or not.

My point, entirely.
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JackWinberg

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #311 on: November 29, 2015, 09:33:30 pm »

I have followed LULA for years, teach photography at our local college, and have really enjoyed the site generally.  It is, of course, very well worth the modest annual fee being implemented.

It saddens me to see that a subset feel that this represents "greed", this site represents substantial effort that deserves to be rewarded. 

I fervently wish LULA roaring success with this new model, you guys well deserve that!

Jack Winberg
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AlterEgo

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #312 on: November 29, 2015, 10:23:50 pm »

I wonder though (not that I am reading or interested in anything except the forum itself) - what will be relationship between paid LuLa website (sans forum) and people who are posting articles - are those authors will be paid or provide the content for free in exchange for the honor or something else ?
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AlterEgo

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #313 on: November 29, 2015, 10:29:09 pm »

how many awesome participants don't post
and do they have anything informative to post other than their awesomeness ( like in http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?board=26.0 - where it is mostly like : you pat me, I pat you back  ;D ... and degree of awesomeness reaches almost D50, if not D65 )
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mbaginy

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #314 on: November 30, 2015, 12:01:23 am »

...have really enjoyed the site generally.  It is, of course, very well worth the modest annual fee being implemented.
It saddens me to see that a subset feel that this represents "greed", this site represents substantial effort that deserves to be rewarded.
I fervently wish LULA roaring success with this new model, you guys well deserve that!

Jack Winberg
+1
Well stated, Jack.
I'll be signing up too!
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Schewe

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #315 on: November 30, 2015, 01:38:37 am »

Very well said, Jeff. Now tell me just how many of the articles published on LuLa over the past two years have been other than pro-bono. With Michael receding into the background and LuLa's 'authority' crumbling faster than a soufflé in a freezer – no amount of cash, by itself,  will halt the slide unless that cash is put towards the reconstructive surgery LuLa needs.

Well, I can't speak to the issue of self promotion/pro-bono because as you may have noticed, the only articles I've done here is zero. I have a golden rule, I don't do anything for free. So, I've never done an article for LuLa because the fee has been zero. That might change in the future...I do post for free on the forums but that's based on exchanging information more than doing an article-I want to learn as much as I teach. The articles I've done elsewhere have been paid for. I don't, as a rule, write for free.

Kev and I will be talking about this shortly...I'm due to go to Indy and shoot some print videos in Dec. I'm a big believer in pay content being paid for. It's the biz in me...
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jeremyrh

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #316 on: November 30, 2015, 01:44:39 am »

Care to point out where I was abusive vs. verbally aggressive?
Care to tell us the difference?
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AlterEgo

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #317 on: November 30, 2015, 01:49:52 am »

Care to tell us the difference?
it is in the eye of the beholder & Co.
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Schewe

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #318 on: November 30, 2015, 02:46:27 am »

Care to tell us the difference?

What do you think? Not terribly useful posting an ambitious post about something that's not very ambitious. So, have I pissed you off in the past? Probably...if not then, maybe now? Care to explain just a bit more specific?
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: A New Change For Luminous-Landscape
« Reply #319 on: November 30, 2015, 04:01:16 am »

I have found the tone in the forums unpleasant. No it's not scary. I'm Unafraid of someone sitting on another continent cap locking me into submission, but it is tedious. No it's not a learning process or a method of teaching. It's a disagreement over stuff like Adobe subscription or some such. It's a dick swinging competition.

Sure there are people that are abrasive at times, but who have a tremendous amount of info and who seem to get annoyed with idiots. I don't have an issue with these people. I guess a good example of this is Mr Schewe. It's a pity he doesn't post more often and I hope when this site goes behind a paywall that he will be able to start writing articles.

For me it's simple. If you are a really talented photographer I will pay attention and listen to what you have to say. If you have useful information and new ways of doing things I will pay attention. If you have a problem I can help with I will try to help. If you think others are idiots because they don't agree with your point of view on something like what is the best sensor or who makes the best software or how dumb is subscription software then you are like a hooting car. Slightly irritating but of no real concern to me other than to avoid your immediate vicinity.
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