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Author Topic: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?  (Read 6328 times)

ymc226

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Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« on: October 27, 2015, 10:22:02 PM »

My Mac Mini that I use only for photo editing has an attached external drive that contains my LR6 photos/catalog/backup.  The external drive is an OWC Guardian Maximus 6TB set up as Raid 1 so has 3TB of storage with equivalent mirror protection.  If I get another external drive and set it up as a Time Machine drive for back up of the Mac Mini and OWC (LR drive), is this enough for (local, not counting off site) peace of mind?  From a prior posted topic,  I wanted to use the NAS drive but that method would be too slow.   

I've also read the recent post regarding back up software which has a few recommendations.  Why wouldn't someone just use Time Machine for this purpose?
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2015, 12:20:34 AM »

Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up? Yes.
I based mine on the Chase Jarvis Complete Workflow ( google it ) and it has never failed.
Ideally use multiple drives each twice the size of the complete backup, but one 50% bigger will do.

Check my blog "Your Digital Legacy" at AspirationImages.com/blog

Ensure that you back up everything. Data, OS, users, settings, applications. Then if the machine dies you just build a new one exactly the same.
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kikashi

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2015, 05:07:54 AM »

Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up? Yes.

I agree. When my last Mac laptop died suddenly (it was pretty old), I bought a new one from the local AppleStore, restored everything from the TM backup and was up and running exactly as before by the end of the evening: I think I lost about a dozen keystrokes.

The only downside that I can see is that the TM backup is on-site, so a bad fire or some other disaster might wipe out both the Mac and the backup. For that reason, I keep off-site backups, made each evening and night, of most of my important stuff. It's not a substitute for a TM backup, as restoring will take a lot of time and, more importantly, a lot of effort, but it helps me to sleep easily.

Jeremy
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2015, 07:07:06 PM »

TM backup doesn't have to be on-site only. If you go into the preferences you can add any number of drives and it will just use them in order. I always have two on line. So first night it backs up to the attached drive and next night to the network drive. Unfortunately I don't think you can rely on any network drive alone. They are too slow for a start and more difficult to restore from.

I also have two extra hard drives and just swap them out with the attached drive. One goes to a relative living elsewhere. That way the worst that could happen is that I lose the recent stuff, but I probably still have the camera card anyway. For most work there are 4 backups.
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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2015, 08:24:13 PM »

Only 1, single backup isn't enough. Poop happens.
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picman

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2015, 03:23:42 PM »

I like SuperDuper (Carbon Copy Cloner is another). It makes a bootable, duplicate copy of your drive.
If your main dies, swap it out with the backup and you are almost immediately back in business.
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2015, 10:34:04 PM »

I like SuperDuper (Carbon Copy Cloner is another). It makes a bootable, duplicate copy of your drive.
That doesn't help if you have three drives to backup. You would need to repeat the process for each drive whereas TimeMachine will do all the drives automatically. Also a clone is only useful when you make it. You can't add to it. A month later if you weren't continually making them then you are are looking at losing a month of photos, email, documents, tax, etc. TimeMachine is set and (almost) forget.

Replacing all of the data for each clone takes a long time and is hard on the drives. Bringing a year old backup up to current status only involves the changes since it was made.

It may be OK if the drive fails, but what if the whole machine fails or you just want to upgrade? The clone won't work because the hardware is different. With TimeMachine you can buy a new machine to replace a five year old one and it will be exactly the same users, settings, data, applications but with the new operating system.
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tcphoto1

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2015, 05:47:37 PM »

I copy all images RAW and edited, documents and business related items to two Technology externals (duplicates) then run Time Machine.
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picman

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2015, 12:41:35 PM »

That doesn't help if you have three drives to backup. You would need to repeat the process for each drive whereas TimeMachine will do all the drives automatically. Also a clone is only useful when you make it. You can't add to it. A month later if you weren't continually making them then you are are looking at losing a month of photos, email, documents, tax, etc. TimeMachine is set and (almost) forget.

Replacing all of the data for each clone takes a long time and is hard on the drives. Bringing a year old backup up to current status only involves the changes since it was made.

It may be OK if the drive fails, but what if the whole machine fails or you just want to upgrade? The clone won't work because the hardware is different. With TimeMachine you can buy a new machine to replace a five year old one and it will be exactly the same users, settings, data, applications but with the new operating system.

SuperDuper does incremental backups. My main backup is set to backup at noon every day, only takes a few minutes. A couple of other backups are programmed at varying intervals.

The files are also in whatever format they were on the original drive. You can go on the back up and pull a file, folder or whatever.

Nothing against Time Machine, I've got one of those running too.
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EugeneN4

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2015, 02:55:05 AM »

Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?.......... In my opinion, yes. If never fails me, unless you are using 10.4.x or earlier version. I used time machine backup on my last ten+ machines and forty+ hardrives, it is 100% successful (so far) ;P
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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2015, 10:29:22 AM »

Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?.......... In my opinion, yes.
Again, IF you read the text provided, you'll see in many cases, TM's data is NOT a backup (there's only one copy).
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2015, 12:09:11 AM »

What is your problem?
I am not sure if you don't know what a backup is or just like to attack other people on things you know less about than you like to think.
Either way, your opinion is your opinion and other people's opinion is their opinion. Build a bridge and get over it.
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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2015, 01:12:02 AM »

http://www.macworld.com/article/1132118/storage/timemachine1.html


http://icanhelpyourmac.com/tip_archive/understanding_apples_time_machine/index.html

An important fact to remember is that a file is not "backed up" unless it is stored on two hard drives at the same time. If you delete the original file off your computer's internal HD it is no longer backed up. Yes, the file does still exist on the Time Machine HD, but if the Time Machine HD would fail in any manner there is no longer a copy on your Internal HD. In this way, your Time Machine HD is also a Storage HD, but don't rely on it as such
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2015, 02:36:24 AM »

dog,
I guess it is lucky that I recently retired from building data centres for a $7 Billion IT company. I now have time to read fiction.

I am not going to waste my time reading your pointless third party stuff. Your owns words are comical enough.
>unless it is stored on two hard drives at the same time - Two drives at the same time are the data drive and the backup drive. 1 + 1 = 2
>If you delete the original file off your computer's internal HD it is no longer backed up - Incorrect, the backup still exists and hasn't changed.
The rest is mindless drivel. Of course if the backup doesn't work then you have no back up. Like der,  that I why you a reliable redundant backup system.

Despite you bumbling on about there being only one backup, again you are making up quotes. I am going to quote myself as that is the only way I will ever get quoted correctly around you. TM can operate with any number of backup drives. As I said, I have 4, immediately before you said I had one.

TM backup doesn't have to be on-site only. If you go into the preferences you can add any number of drives and it will just use them in order. I always have two on line. So first night it backs up to the attached drive and next night to the network drive. Unfortunately I don't think you can rely on any network drive alone. They are too slow for a start and more difficult to restore from.

I also have two extra hard drives and just swap them out with the attached drive. One goes to a relative living elsewhere. That way the worst that could happen is that I lose the recent stuff, but I probably still have the camera card anyway. For most work there are 4 backups.



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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2015, 10:32:11 AM »


I guess it is lucky that I recently retired from building data centres for a $7 Billion IT company.
Oh Bob, I'm sure the plumber who replaced you is doing a fine job installing the toilets there.  ;D
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I now have time to read fiction.
Your time would be better spent honing your 'photography' skills...
Oh Bob, I worked for a multi billion dollar company too, making images (we were called photographers).
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I am not going to waste my time reading your pointless third party stuff.
Despite your promise not to read anything I post? What is the word used to describe people who say they are doing to do something but don't?
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Your owns words are comical enough.
Last week, you stated you would not do that, a promise I was expecting you to keep. Busted again Bob:
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=105479.msg869405#msg869405
What do they call people who say they are not doing to do something then go on and do it anyway? Hypocrites I believe is the proper term.
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The rest is mindless drivel.
The text you said you were not going to read, got it.
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Of course if the backup doesn't work then you have no back up.

Glad that simple concept sunk in Bob.
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Despite you bumbling on about there being only one backup, again you are making up quotes.
Lying like you?
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TM can operate with any number of backup drives. As I said, I have 4, immediately before you said I had one.
What an utterly unnecessary waste of disk space and system resources. Again, work on those snapshots Bob, better use of your time. Or stick to your own word and what you say you presumably learned. As Benjamin Franklin said: "Experience is a hard teacher, but fools will have no other."
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 01:53:12 PM by digitaldog »
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Andrew Rodney
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digitaldog

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FYI TM lovers
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2015, 12:57:28 PM »

http://www.macworld.com/article/3007573/operating-systems/what-to-do-when-mobile-time-machine-backups-linger-and-fill-storage-space.html



After reading the case of the missing El Capitan hard disk space and following all the advice in that column, Jim Williams still had an inexplicable 300GB that had no reason to exist. He ran a disk analysis program that showed that a hidden Unix directory named .MobileBackups.trash What is it and can he get rid of it?
This is a side effect of Time Machine, of all things. When one of your Time Machine targets is a drive that isn’t currently connected to your Mac, the backup system will continue to generate system snapshots up until all but 20 percent of drive storage is filled. After that point, Time Machine starts to delete snapshots and is more aggressive if you have very little storage available (less than 10 percent of drive capacity or less than 5GB).
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2015, 03:20:50 PM »

LMAO.
1. Ignoring all posts from people with over 10000 posts. Clearly keyboard warriors and not real photographers.
2. Ignoring all posts from people who post immediately after their own post. Clearly need professional help.
3. Sorry, I don't think you know much about TimeMachine. You should write a book on it.
 
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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2015, 03:25:09 PM »

Clearly keyboard warriors and not real photographers.
After viewing your images, you seem to fall into that camp. I'm not inspired, you didn't achieve much, I'm mostly disappointed :P 
Again, hard to take you seriously when you post you'll ignore me, then go into attack mode. Spend your time honing your photo skills Bob, time better spent.
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BobShaw

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2015, 06:35:51 PM »

Congratulations, you probably put more thought into that post than the last 10,000.
Not a mention of TimeMachine now.

Thanks for the critique.
I am not concerned though, because I have read some of your book and didn't think much of that either. (:-)
Ciao
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digitaldog

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Re: Is Apple's Time Machine enough for back up?
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2015, 08:54:42 PM »


Not a mention of TimeMachine now.
Post #11, 13,15 and most recently, #16. You're so good at ignoring me, but then posting as the angry retired old guy, you missed them.
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I am not concerned though, because I have read some of your book and didn't think much of that either. (:-)
Yup, Lee's video is more your speed. The conversion of a step wedge to Lab, that provides nothing useful impressed you. So I'm not surprised you are having difficulty with a book on color management. I guess we'd be even if I purchased one of your frames? Not at all interested in those snapshots.
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Ciao
Honest?
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