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Author Topic: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?  (Read 46250 times)

chez

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2015, 09:46:51 pm »

Baloney. Photographers do so utilizing other software options each and every day. Successfully so.

I base that assertion on over 40 years of shooting action sports as a full time working professional. Endorsed my first check for images published in Feb. 1975 and have been shooting high school, college and pro sports ever since. I am not guessing at my assertions. I live it and practice daily.

Can you get more detail from viewing a 100% RAW render vs the embedded jpeg? Absolutely. Does that equate that an experienced eye can't discern with enough accuracy to narrow down to the few selects to invest their time in importing for further processing ... vs importing the entire shoot? No.

While I would not recommend the workflow for all genres of photography ... there is no flaw in the process I and others have described. Is it ideal for all users? Of course not. Is it doable for high volume shooters? Without question. Do I ever discover that I made a wrong choice by making estimations based upon embedded jpegs? ... Almost never.

The bottom line is: Adobe should be offering broader options and improved efficiency for importing images into Lightroom ... not narrowing the options. I, for one, do not pay them to place more limitations upon my workflow. When other much more meager developers have offered such capabilities for years and years ... why is it wrong to request such capabilities from a software developer that measures it's revenues in the billions?
You need the culling feature at import..I don't. By catering to every specific need, the application will soon balloon into an umanagable piece of shite. I'd rather Adobe move towards a simple paradigm where certain functions are done in logical places rather than making an interface that caters to a small niche market.
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ButchM

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #61 on: October 06, 2015, 10:07:40 pm »

You need the culling feature at import..I don't. By catering to every specific need, the application will soon balloon into an umanagable piece of shite. I'd rather Adobe move towards a simple paradigm where certain functions are done in logical places rather than making an interface that caters to a small niche market.

You don't need the feature ... so no one should have it. ... Plus I didn't ask for 'culling" ... I asked for the ability to import only tagged images, not the entire card ... please actually read what I offered before you become hell bent on opposing what I suggest.

You miss the whole point .... the import dialog and UI for other apps that offer these capabilities is not cluttered, complicated or bloated (in fact both PM and Aperture take up a considerably smaller footprint than does Lr) ... Please tell me why if Adobe implemented such usefulness, how it would it impair your workflow? Are the folks who crunch the code for Adobe somehow less talented than their competitors?

Seems you can't really resist the temptation to be oil to my water ... not matter the topic.
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Wayne Fox

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #62 on: October 06, 2015, 10:33:16 pm »

I'd say that premise of culling raw files that are undeveloped is the flawed workflow.

I would agree for many, but sort of depends on your workflow and what you shoot.   My typical shoot is less than  100 images, and about 10 or so of those are shot simply to nail exposure. I always check them off in the Lightroom import dialog because I don't need or want them.  Very easy and quick, much more efficient than importing the large files then deleting them later.(and doesn't write a copy to the second location which is typically my startup drive).

Personally I"m surprised Adobe made such changes, since I think the established base of users is pretty large and most had managed just fine since LR has been introduced.  Sort of a "if it ain't broke, why fix it" kind of thing to me.  At least have an "advanced" toggle so the old interface is available for those that prefer it.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 10:34:57 pm by Wayne Fox »
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Simon J.A. Simpson

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #63 on: October 07, 2015, 04:01:31 am »

Personally I"m surprised Adobe made such changes, since I think the established base of users is pretty large and most had managed just fine since LR has been introduced.  Sort of a "if it ain't broke, why fix it" kind of thing to me.  At least have an "advanced" toggle so the old interface is available for those that prefer it.

Sounds very sensible to me.
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #64 on: October 07, 2015, 07:07:57 am »

Hmmm.  I'm shooting with a D810 and a 7DII.  I'm pretty sure they generate full size embedded jpegs.  Is this not the case?
Anyway it works for a lot of folks.
It wasn't the case for me last time I looked at them. Significantly smaller as far as I recall and why I found them less useful than others seem to.
Did some looking around for size info on them and came across this...
"Also note that not all cameras embed a full-sized JPEG in the raw file. Canon models up to the 1D Mark III embedded either a one-fourth or half-sized JPEG preview; more recent cameras embed a full size.'
Which seemed to tally with my experience last time I looked at embedded jpegs. They may also be more heavily compressed.

That's totally wrong, as this sample from an EOS-1D X illustrates:
That camera is not all cameras, so only proves a point for that particular camera. Anyway see quote above.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 07:13:38 am by jjj »
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #65 on: October 07, 2015, 08:05:08 am »

When I import the default seems to be all images n the folder selected are ticked and on the top right is a button indicating the number of images selected for import. All well and good but when I press the import button at that point I am taken back to the library module and a warning comes up telling me no photographed were able to be imported.

The way I have found around this is too deselect all images, no ticks on any thumbnails, and then select all again. After this little run around the import progresses as per normal.

A bit irritating as it took me a little while to work it out.

Otherwise no big deal. I did prefer seeing the folder structure I was importing into as with my commercial work it's all job number and folder based. Glad the move is gone. Never liked that.

I teach LR about once a month and the import is the place my students have the biggest trouble. I'm curious to see if this change helps. It could be my weak teaching of course.
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Damon Lynch

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #66 on: October 07, 2015, 08:20:47 am »

That camera is not all cameras, so only proves a point for that particular camera.
Sorry, i didn't realize you had only 8 year old cameras in mind. These days cameras of the kind Photo Mechanic users use all have full-size embedded JPEGs so they can display the zoomed-in image on the back of their camera's high-resolution LCD.
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #67 on: October 07, 2015, 10:51:07 am »

Sorry, i didn't realize you had only 8 year old cameras in mind.
I didn't. I was just showing that it isn't automatically the case that all cameras have full sized jpegs.
Don't extrapolate my comments to mean something else. It get tedious.

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James R

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #68 on: October 07, 2015, 12:00:05 pm »

Not a fan of the new import process.  1. visually, it isn't consistent with LR's look and feel 2. not understanding a separate page used to locate files for import 3. prefer changes that are additive--increased culling capabilities, not less. 

But, that is me.  In my perfect world, Adobe would buy out Photo Mechanic and make that the import mod.
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #69 on: October 07, 2015, 01:14:41 pm »

A performance hit is mentioned here with regard to the new import dialogue. And how to turn it off.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 01:42:39 pm by jjj »
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ButchM

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #70 on: October 07, 2015, 01:36:19 pm »

A performe hit is mentioned here with regard to the new import dialogue. And how to turn it off.

Interesting ... if you watch the entire video, Laura's list of what's been removed seems considerably longer than what's been added to the new Import dialog ....

I don't understand why a UI update must equate with the loss of functionality.

Unless of course the project is only half-baked and they had to rush it out prematurely in order to have something pretty to show off at Adobe Max reveal ...

Either way, I still think they screwed the pooch on this one ...
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #71 on: October 07, 2015, 01:37:59 pm »

I far better realised after watching the video I linked to above the ramifications of the new import dialogue.
I always use move on import as I copy files [from possibly several sources] to same HD as where LR photos are stored, check everything has imported properly and then import to LR. LR then just moves items to correct folder on same HD. This was because LR didn't and still doesn't always copy all files off the disk/phone and data can get left behind. I also seem to recall on testing such things a while back that Adobe software was slower at copying than using a file browser to move the same data.
Now I have to copy off HD/phone, copy into LR and then delete from two locations rather than just off the card to be safe.
So more chances of mistakes and at least doubling time to import data.

Also removing by feedback about what is going to be done such as with file renaming and file destinations, this is only going to increase mistakes on import.
LR seems to have gone down the simplistic route rather than a simpler route. I seen no benefit to removing these features as they will only increase the chance of errors, so anything but novice friendly - the supposed justification.
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #72 on: October 07, 2015, 01:41:39 pm »

Interesting ... if you watch the entire video, Laura's list of what's been removed seems considerably longer than what's been added to the new Import dialog ....

I don't understand why a UI update must equate with the loss of functionality.
Adobe [well photoshop] used to be good at not doing that. A shame John Nack is not still at Adobe.

Quote
Unless of course the project is only half-baked and they had to rush it out prematurely in order to have something pretty to show off at Adobe Max reveal ...

Either way, I still think they screwed the pooch on this one ...
Lightroom Queen website advised against the update whilst musing much the same thing, i.e. rushed out to hit the show.
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adias

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #73 on: October 07, 2015, 05:51:23 pm »

... LR didn't and still doesn't always copy all files off the disk/phone and data can get left behind. ...

I have been using Lr since V1.0. and I never found a single instance where image files were left behind or copied incorrectly. I copy (not move) files from flash cards to the HD. No sense in moving (i.e., deleting source files) as it is better (for technical reasons) to simply format cards in-camera.
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Rory

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #74 on: October 07, 2015, 06:31:53 pm »

I made a caustic reply in the rapidly growing thread on Adobe's feedback forum about the import module debacle http://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/new-update-6-2.  I received a very interesting like (see below).  Perhaps the natives are rising...

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Denis de Gannes

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #75 on: October 07, 2015, 06:35:35 pm »

I have been using Lr since V1.0. and I never found a single instance where image files were left behind or copied incorrectly. I copy (not move) files from flash cards to the HD. No sense in moving (i.e., deleting source files) as it is better (for technical reasons) to simply format cards in-camera.

Lightroom has never permitted the "move " option from cards, this is still the case today.
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #76 on: October 07, 2015, 07:02:47 pm »

I made a caustic reply in the rapidly growing thread on Adobe's feedback forum about the import module debacle http://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/new-update-6-2.  I received a very interesting like (see below).  Perhaps the natives are rising...
Is Chris no longer working for Adobe then?

EDIT - He also liked my post describing how the new interface would only increase errors. Interesting.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 07:30:57 pm by jjj »
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jjj

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #77 on: October 07, 2015, 07:13:28 pm »

I have been using Lr since V1.0. and I never found a single instance where image files were left behind or copied incorrectly. I copy (not move) files from flash cards to the HD. No sense in moving (i.e., deleting source files) as it is better (for technical reasons) to simply format cards in-camera.
Just because you have not experienced something, does not mean that particular something does not happen.
Any file types that LR does not acknowledge will be left on card. Movie files were an issue until LR relented and half heartedly accepted their existence. I nearly deleted some after testing LRs copy from card and discovering that it was potentially disastrous.

Also other very knowledgeable people have argued very cogently that formatting in camera is in fact a waste of time/not good practice. Not to mention that I've been caught out by using a card that was not emptied by computer, which I forgot to format before use and ended up running out of space. Having to individually delete images when working is not good. Far safer to delete properly off card straight after emptying, less chance of operator error that way I find. Having to reformat a stack of cards from several cameras at end of a long day is simply not worth the faff.
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Rory

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #78 on: October 07, 2015, 07:27:02 pm »

Is Chris no longer working for Adobe then?

Maybe he likes my looking for an alternative 😝
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ihv

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Re: What’s gone in Lightroom CC 2015.2 and Lightroom 6.2 ?
« Reply #79 on: October 08, 2015, 04:43:00 am »

Lightroom is doing Windows 8. Let's hope there is a Windows 10 trick coming.
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