Phase One News: XF Body, IQ3 backs, 35LS, 120LS, C1 8.3, Website

[Joe Towner]

Because I'm a greedy, do we get flash TTL with the XF?  Carrying around a Profoto B1/B2 in a run and gun situation would be a blast, especially with the built in Air transmitter.

Yes, I treat my medium format camera like a dslr, goes everywhere & shoots everything.

[william]

I'd like to strongly lobby for Phase to develop and release a film back for the XF camera.  I'm guessing that the marginal costs of doing so would be comparatively minimal and the film back could largely be based on the existing film backs for Mamiya (or Contax) 645 cameras.  The costs would be more than recouped by the (admittedly small) portion of medium format digital users who also shoot film (to say nothing of those who would buy it as a film camera, as folks have done with the Hy6).

[AreBee]

bcooter,

I'm curious does the back rotate when using the waist level finder...

No.

[robert zimmerman]

Am I missing something or is phaseone cutting their ties to the professional imaging market with this move?
Obviously they've done their homework and are convinced high tech loving, well heeled enthusiast camera consumers are the target group.
Seriously, professional shooters who can put down 40 g's for a stills camera system? Or 8k for a body? Not in 2015.

[Jeffery Salter]

Hi Robert,

It's a big world out there with many different types of image makers. That would include Fine art,  lifestyle and resort, high end advertising and architectural photographers who have brought Phase One digital backs and cameras.  

Not mention Photography Equipment Rental houses or Production houses who like to have the latest tech on hand.

[ciccio]

in the real world there is no professional interest in these backs and in this body camera for that fat prices...to overpriced.
camera body is too overweight...
i have a lot of others solutions to shoot in a more free way...with same peep pixel quality...
the backs are only old sensor reshaped in new costume processor and pushed 1 stop !!! nothing to move for an upgrade.
and untill the next mouvement , the full frame cmos .....phase one shares will be eaten by all the others , leica s2 cmos 007,new pentax full frame cmos,nikon cmos 50 million, canon cmos 50 million and last from sony the biggest one !
sony probably is behind the phase one body , so they are making the market the japaneese the rest is only blah blah from sale people rep...
that is the real world.
if i really feel the need i can rent it , but i will never take it for a travel.

best,c.

[robert zimmerman]

Hi Robert,

It's a big world out there with many different types of image makers. That would include Fine art,  lifestyle and resort, high end advertising and architectural photographers who have brought Phase One digital backs and cameras.  

Not mention Photography Equipment Rental houses or Production houses who like to have the latest tech on hand.

Yes, it is a big world and I'm sure there are people that can afford anything. But, I don't see a relevance anymore for professional photographers. I'm not ruling everybody out but a large proportion of professional photographers that shoot stills for print and web imaging, it just doesn't make economical sense. I have a p1 IQ160 and a df body. I use that camera for some of my studio work, but I won't be spending 8.000 for a better single autofocus point. I don't need a seismographic shutter release or a touch screen, etc. Yes, it's pretty and it's technically impressive, but it's irrelevant for shooting people in a studio. I'm not dissing the camera, but 8k? Really? For a camera with a single autofocus point? Really?

[eronald]

J,

 This is the current hi rez single shot solution. Rental and cultural will be happy.
 Whether the new body is something a people photographer would *wish* to use is a different story.
 Go and try it out, and tell us. I suspect that Leica and Hassy sales are going to jump, now that the ergonomics of the Phase product are locked in and have become a known quantity, especially the single focus point: The fence sitters who waited for a fast camera will jump ship now.  Anyone who wanted a Pentax has probably already cut his check, and those who liked the Mamiya and who love C1 will upgrade after some grumbling about price, and will doubtless love this solid product.

Edmund

Ps. Have you seen the price and the quality of the Samsung S6 and iPhone 6+? They are neither cheap nor bad.
The tech is changing.

So I guess no more support for other makers cameras with new phase backs kind of puts an end to the "open platform" marketing line.

I'm curious does the back rotate when using the waist level finder and if not, what is the advantage of this body vs. a good used Contax?

Anyway, I'm sure it is a upgrade (fix) for some current phase owners that have the df camera and I guess an easier interface,  but for everyone else it's kind of a redo to a new system.

From the outside looking in $20,000 starting price for a camera/back that is still image only seems high given that real full fledged movie cameras can be bought for 1/2 the price, fully kitted out and ready to go,
the list of used medium format grows higher and the competition seems to be trimming costs.

Pentax and Hasselblad marketing must be dancing in the hallways tonight.

IMO

BC

P.S.  It may not sound like it, in the response I wrote, but I hope this and all professional cameras thrive.

Getting that out of the way, there is something to be said for getting it right the first time.

We all have been upgraded to death.  Cameras, software, computers, rinse and repeat.

I think I get an e-mail a day on something new.

When you look at the movie biz, they're still cranking away on 2.6 k down sampled to 2k Arri's.    Why?  because Arri got it right the first time.

I'm sure the day will come that Arri produces a 4k camera and I'm sure it will be used, but in all reality it won't make any difference in the quality or creativity of the work produced.

I've tested uprezzing 2k footage up converted and directly compared it to 4 and 5k footage and can rarely tell a difference, in fact it always seems to be more scene, lighting dependent than just pure pixel count.

I think this holds true for still cameras.  I'll bet that under most creative briefs, taking my Contax and a p30+ shooting next to this new Phase camera and an IQ back and nobody even the extreme pixel peepers will really see a difference.

Sure, a lot of professionals "can" put 40 grand on a still camera but when the pixels hit the screen will anybody notice, will anybody care?  

[hubell]

I think this holds true for still cameras.  I'll bet that under most creative briefs, taking my Contax and a p30+ shooting next to this new Phase camera and an IQ back and nobody even the extreme pixel peepers will really see a difference.

Sure, a lot of professionals "can" put 40 grand on a still camera but when the pixels hit the screen will anybody notice, will anybody care? 

This whole exercise was put into the proper perspective for me last night. I happened to have just purchased a coffee table book of color photographs by Steve McCurry, the Iconic Photographs. These are some of the most amazing images. Just breathtaking. All made with  35mm film, and I believe with old Nikons. Tack sharp? No way. Many are fairly fuzzy, and it did not detract one iota from the impact of the imagery. In a way, I wish it were otherwise, because it is much easier for me to afford an XF with a new IQ 380 than to make an image as powerful as the ones made by Steve McCurry.

[Jeffery Salter]

Hi Edmund,

We will all know once the camera is released and used in the field.  As a "people" photographer (my website link is below) I'm looking forward to the adding the XF and the new 35mm LS (it looks like a serious piece of glass and fills the gap between the LS 28 and LS 55mm perfectly)  to my camera kit.  

I don't keep track of LEICA or Hassy sales.  But I will say the new LEICA MM is a sweet camera and it would be great if on another thread a Hassy owner/user would give their experiences with the  H5X camera body it sells for $7500 at BH.

regards,
Jeffery

[BernardLanguillier]

This whole exercise was put into the proper perspective for me last night. I happened to have just purchased a coffee table book of color photographs by Steve McCurry, the Iconic Photographs. These are some of the most amazing images. Just breathtaking. All made with  35mm film, and I believe with old Nikons. Tack sharp? No way. Many are fairly fuzzy, and it did not detract one iota from the impact of the imagery. In a way, I wish it were otherwise, because it is much easier for me to afford an XF with a new IQ 380 than to make an image as powerful as the ones made by Steve McCurry.

+1

Now, this is PJ work and to some extend a perfect image quality would almost hurt the credibility of the image as a stolen snapshot of a fleeting bit of reality.

For many other types of photography, starting with fashion, there is mostly no content to start with. Everything is in the looks of the image, everything is a construction aimed at pleasing the eye. Lowfi style is one option, but not a very credible one. It doesn't mean that the latest 50,000 US$ phase one back is a must, just that I understand the mental association between this type of images and high quality imaging devices.

As far as spending 50,000 US$ now when you consider the speed of depreciation and lack of full frame CMOS, my personal view is that it can only been seen as reasonable for pros with the cash inflow (providing they are honest about the scale of potential productivity gains). As an amateur, I would start to consider seriously a full frame CMOS IQ4, because that's a camera I wouldn't need to upgrade for many years to come. Although I fully acknowledge the progress being made and appreciate the great effort done by Phaseone, the current generation is IMHO still half baked.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Jeffery Salter]

This whole exercise was put into the proper perspective for me last night. I happened to have just purchased a coffee table book of color photographs by Steve McCurry, the Iconic Photographs. These are some of the most amazing images. Just breathtaking. All made with  35mm film, and I believe with old Nikons. Tack sharp? No way. Many are fairly fuzzy, and it did not detract one iota from the impact of the imagery. In a way, I wish it were otherwise, because it is much easier for me to afford an XF with a new IQ 380 than to make an image as powerful as the ones made by Steve McCurry.

Hi Hcubell,

Your work is beautiful.  The world doesn't need another Steve McCurry.  You have a wonderful visual voice feel free to share it.

regards,
Jeffery

[eronald]

Jeffrey,

 I have no doubt whatsoever that you will be happy with the new body. One can see that Phase have very carefully designed these upgrades to fit in with the rest of their system, and I am certain that they will quickly integrate with your existing workflow, be compatible with all your software, perform very well, and that —as you certainly already have a decent dealer— support will be first class. Furthermore, as the system is modular, any initial small bugs will be confined to the body itself; the backs are a known quantity, and the best quality one can get.

 I personally like the Hassy body because it has a good AF solution, that solves the single-focus-point issue of most MF bodies. For me, focus trumps other qualities; but this is a personal quirk, like someone who prefers stick-shift cars. I would have like to see Phase provide focus points across the frame like an amateur SLR,, but probably  Phase learnt from their market studies that  their customers shoot closed down with studio flash and don't need such "gadgets". And for precision setups, liveview offers the possibility of setting focus wherever one wants when working from a tripod.

 Some people like getting a "new" camera because it bumps them out of their comfort zone. Some want "like the old one, but better". I think the "better" crowd are going to be happiest with this evolutionary but not revolutionary release from Phase.

Edmund

Hi Edmund,

As a "people" photographer (my website link is below) I'm looking forward to the adding the XF and the new 35mm LS (it looks like a serious piece of glass and fills the gap between the LS 28 and LS 55mm perfectly)  to my camera kit.  

I don't keep track of LEICA or Hassy sales.  But I will say the new LEICA MM is a sweet camera and it would be great if on another thread a Hassy owner/user would give their experiences with the  H5X camera body it sells for $7500 at BH.

regards,
Jeffery

[eronald]

Hi Hcubell,

Your work is beautiful.  The world doesn't need another Steve McCurry.  You have a wonderful visual voice feel free to share it.

regards,
Jeffery

Jeffrey,

 I agree you're a people photographer
 Hcubell, I will gratefully accept a print of yours, whenever you choose to send me one

Edmund

[douglevy]

Jeffrey - I have an H5X and Credo 40. It's amazing. I upgraded from an H1, which I shot on the Credo for 9 months or so and literally never shot a job for a client wider than 5.6. Now I shoot with the 80 wide open and probably get 80% in focus - true focus works.

-Doug

[chrismuc]

My thoughts about the XY: Wonderful camera, I like the styling following the slight angles of the IQ back housing, makes camera and back look like crafted in one piece. The programmable dials are useful, the top LCD is also neat, flush in the housing. Making the system modular and offering a waist level finder and different matt screens is perfect.

For me the critical key points are:

1. An auto-focus system of any new camera system today must have out-of-center focus points. From the released information it is not clear to me if that is available with the XY camera.
2. The camera with crop MF 50 MP CMOS back with it's high price will face tough competition by a huge choice of less expensive 40-50 MP cameras in 44x33/ 45x30/ 36x24 mm format (Z645, S, D810, A7r, 5DsR) that all also deliver professional image quality.
3. Considering the 60/80 MP 54x40 mm back options, I today would hesitate to invest so much money into a CCD back. There are too many drawbacks like lack of high ISO quality, degration of image quality with longer exposure times and especially when the sensor heated up. I have the feeling, a 100MP+ CMOS MF full frame back is at the horizon if Phase already advertises such optical ability of the Schneider lenses.
4. And: The software of camera and back must work as perfect as we are used from the Japanese camera manufactures (my IQ180 only works flawlessly since the very last firmware update, before I had several kind of touch screen insensitivity and cards writing problems).

Enclosed a IQ180 sample crop of a sky at ISO 35: upper one normal, lower one a few minutes later after the sensor heated up at 30°C + in the sun of Guangzhou.

I am wondering if the 3series IQ CCD backs show the same phenomenon or are improved or simply shut down earlier?

[Doug Peterson]

Schneider 35mm Full Res Sample Files

These were shot with the IQ380, and that is not yet supported in Capture One 8.3 so we can't share the raw files. The sharpening on this TIFF may be a bit heavy handed for some, so shoot us an email and I'll be glad to send you the raws once there is a public version of C1 which can open them.

[synn]

That is pretty impressive and a huge step up from the current 35mm I use, Doug. Can't wait to get a hold of the raw files!

[BernardLanguillier]

That is pretty impressive and a huge step up from the current 35mm I use, Doug. Can't wait to get a hold of the raw files!

+1

Cheers,
Bernard

[alifatemi]

Very promising indeed, how come you reach such a depth of field Dough?! As if they are merged pictures with different focus point! How much technical camera, say Alpa/Rodenschtock, can get better than this really in terms of edge to edge resolution and  sharpness?