Canson Baryta Photographique vs. Latest Ilford GFS

[DeanChriss]

I just finishing the last of my 24" original Ilford GFS. By "original" I mean purchased before the company went under and came back again. I've used sheets of Canson Baryta Photographique and I can't see any difference between it and the original Ilford and my "old" Ilford printer profiles are fine when used with the Canson. Indeed, older threads here report there actually is no discernible difference, though the Canson seems very slightly less warm (more neutral). I have not used any Ilford paper made since the company came back from the dead.

B&H sells a 24"x50' roll of Canson Baryta Photographique for $148 and a 24"x39' roll of the "new" Ilford GFS for $164. Cost is not the primary criteria, but is there any reason to buy the Ilford over the Canson?

Thanks.

[Mark D Segal]

Nothing noteworthy that I know of, and I've made test prints of the Outback target from both (sheets, not rolls, but shouldn't matter).

[DeanChriss]

Nothing noteworthy that I know of, and I've made test prints of the Outback target from both (sheets, not rolls, but shouldn't matter).

Thanks, Mark. That's helpful.

As a point of information, I have seen more surface defects in the Canson Baryta Photographique than in sheets of the original Ilford GFS, and rolls of the original GFS were also remarkably free of surface defects. I have no idea whether that comparison is still valid after Ilford's reemergence.

[Mark D Segal]

I've printed a few hundred sheets of the new Ilford GFS and have not needed to discard a single sheet yet, so it seems fine. As well, the paper is enclosed in a poly envelope inside the box now, which was not the case with the previous packaging.

[DeanChriss]

I've printed a few hundred sheets of the new Ilford GFS and have not needed to discard a single sheet yet, so it seems fine. As well, the paper is enclosed in a poly envelope inside the box now, which was not the case with the previous packaging.

Interesting... Except for surface scuffing due to the lack of a poly bag, that was exactly my experience with the "old" Ilford GFS. By comparison I've had a couple defective sheets due to surface defects out of every 25 sheet box of Canson Baryta Photographique I have used. I haven't used the Canson rolls, but it doesn't take many surface defects on a roll to waste a lot of paper and ink, not to mention frustration. Perhaps there is a good reason for the cost differential.

Thanks very much, Mark.

[Ernst Dinkla]

B&H sells a 24"x50' roll of Canson Baryta Photographique for $148 and a 24"x39' roll of the "new" Ilford GFS for $164. Cost is not the primary criteria, but is there any reason to buy the Ilford over the Canson?

Thanks.

You should also check the price of Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta 310 gsm, Felix Schoeller J23160 True Baryta 310 gsm. Identical to the new Ilford Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 310 gsm. All made by Felix Schoeller. MediaJet PhotoArt White Baryta 310 gsm is near identical. As F.S. is also the coating applier for Canson Infinity papers .................... I have not measured a recent sample of Baryta Photographique production but I expect even more resemblance than the old sample already had.

Edit: Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta 310 Inkjet Paper (24" x 50', 1 Roll) $129.18
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/Roll-Paper/ci/19443/pn/3/N/4077634578+4291422671

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
December 2014 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

[DeanChriss]

You should also check the price of Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta 310 gsm, Felix Schoeller J23160 True Baryta 310 gsm. Identical to the new Ilford Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 310 gsm. All made by Felix Schoeller. MediaJet PhotoArt White Baryta 310 gsm is near identical. As F.S. is also the coating applier for Canson Infinity papers .................... I have not measured a recent sample of Baryta Photographique production but I expect even more resemblance than the old sample already had.

Edit: Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta 310 Inkjet Paper (24" x 50', 1 Roll) $129.18
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/Roll-Paper/ci/19443/pn/3/N/4077634578+4291422671

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
December 2014 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

I don't think Felix Schoeller paper is available in the US, or at least I haven't found it. Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta certainly is available and considerably less expensive than either the Ilford or Canson alternatives. 

By "identical", can I assume you mean it has the same surface texture (or lack thereof) as GFS, in addition to the same spectral data and other traits? I apologize in advance for asking this, but in exploring paper alternatives I've often found that "identical" means "the same except surface texture".

Thanks!

[John Caldwell]

While I haven't ever used the GFS, I can say that I have printed hundreds of square feet of the Canson Photographique on H Z3200 and Epson 900 series machines. The Canson is my default paper, in fact. Prints several years old look excellent, for what that may be worth. I have never discarded a sheet of the Canson as a consequence of paper defect.

John-

[DeanChriss]

While I haven't ever used the GFS, I can say that I have printed hundreds of square feet of the Canson Photographique on H Z3200 and Epson 900 series machines. The Canson is my default paper, in fact. Prints several years old look excellent, for what that may be worth. I have never discarded a sheet of the Canson as a consequence of paper defect.

John-

As far as I can tell there's no noticeable difference between Canson Photographique and Ilford GFS, but my experience with the Canson is different than yours, and it's pretty odd. The defects I've seen are very random, occurring on random sheets and at random locations on a given sheet. There's typically only one, or perhaps two, on any defective sheet. Under good magnification many seem to be tiny and oddly angled divots in the surface that the ink doesn't quite get all the way into. I'd say the angle of the tiny depression causes one wall to shield part of the interior of the depression from ink, but I'm not at all sure about that. Usually the problems are completely invisible when viewed straight on (perpendicular to the paper surface) in good light, but at a certain off-perpendicular angle they stick out like a sore thumb. My wife first found this when matting some prints that I had already inspected when they came out of the printer. Until I viewed the print at the "correct" angle I couldn't see any issue. Most are like tiny specks and some are longer, like a very fine line up to perhaps 1/16" long. I don't think it has anything to do with the printer (Epson 7900) since I've never seen anything like this with any other paper, including nearly identical ones like GFS. Perhaps it is/was a batch related issue.

[Ernst Dinkla]

By "identical", can I assume you mean it has the same surface texture (or lack thereof) as GFS, in addition to the same spectral data and other traits? I apologize in advance for asking this, but in exploring paper alternatives I've often found that "identical" means "the same except surface texture".

Thanks!

There is no difference in texture between the papers I mentioned, not on the paper white, not on the printed areas.
I punched 1 cm diameter holes in the samples I have, went outside and compared them outdoors, overcast sky. Each sample had a slight difference in reflectance on the 90 degrees angle due to the paper fiber direction so when I noticed that slight difference I turned one sample 90 degrees and the match became 100%. If you do that with two samples of the same paper you will notice that difference/equality too. The papers are identical for every aspect a user can consider. I can not comment on what happens to their quality in packaging, distribution etc but in my opinion they all come from the same source.

Spectral reflectance of front and backside surfaces have been measured after the Photokina 2014 and showed identical spectral plots.

BTW, if a user does not have the equipment to make custom ICC profiles then check the different profiles (+ media preset recommendations) available from Felix Schoeller, Hahnemühle, Ilford Imaging, etc web pages. If not identical there could be a more compatible one for the user's specific printer.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
December 2014 update, 700+ inkjet media white spectral plots

[DeanChriss]

Ernst,

Thank you for your very detailed and thoughtful answer!