Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Mirrorless Cameras => Topic started by: Stefan.Steib on April 29, 2015, 06:56:08 pm
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HCam Master TS 11-24mm
Ladies and Gentlemen - worlds first 11-24mm Shift and Tilt System
over 130 degrees of Image angle diagonal, up to 15mm of shift and unseen Movements with a Superwideangle ZOOM !
More to come soon.
Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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Excellent news Stefan!
Eduardo
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Hi Stefan, how do you control the diafragm? preset with a Canon camera?
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Ingenious as always.
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Jaime
right now we can only use these EF lenses prestopped down.
Easy to handle, just remove the lens while the aperture is closed to working f-Stop from the body.
Can either be done on a Canon Body - or as well with a Metabones or similar EF->Emount adapter on an Alpha body.
But be assured I am already "thinking"..... ;)
Regards
Stefan
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What's the image circle of the 11-24? ... any weird color shifts, soft edges, falloff?
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I thought this lens used an outsized image circle. Glad to get corroboration. It seems this is a preferred way of getting superior edge/corner performance, unshifted.
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Attention old Info - see post below - full Shift now available
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Ok Jury - here are the results of the widest shift competition ever.
I was a bit positively surprised but also bit negative.
Test Conditions: evenly lighted white wall, lens set to infinity, stopped down to F11. For explanation the internal "hole" is not quite square so depending of how you rotate, you may either get to the smaller/shorter or the longer side. Thus I did the whole rotation 4x , horizontal and vertical and both in Landscape and Portrait mode. In theory there might be differing results if the adapter is rotated another 180 degrees, but that should be just a mirror of what I have documented here.
The positive news: the maximum shift of up to 12mm is at 15mm !
even at 14 mm focal length there is up to 10mm shift. That is more than I expected ! And this means NO vignetting in the corners. if you take some slight vignetting maybe because there is sky or stuff that can be stamped back with photoshop you can add another 2-3mm of shift !
The sharpness is excellent even to the usable limits, I tried it with our focusing target and at full life view zoom, it´s tack sharp to the limits.
Vignetting is a bit more but no problem to be removed in post.
Even better: distortion is also no more than in the center. Focus is really flat, at f11 I was able to move the focusing target around and have even focus on the walls surface.
Now for the negative news:
There obviously is an additional lighttrap that is not visible when the lens is shifted at open aperture. But it will become more and more visible when you use it stopped down and it reaches to the longer focal length.
This means from 16mm and longer the usable image circle stopped down is shrinking again to the value of the 11mm at wide start. so 24mm is pretty useless for all those who wanted to replace the TS-E 24mm with it.
Even the 17mm TS-E may have its usage on the Master TS as this allows both TS-E lenses over 20mm of shift.
So this solution is for the superwide specialists, nothing else can offer such an image angle from 11-16mm with up to 12mm of shift.
Actually even the combination with our shaved Nikon AF-S 2,8/14-24mm G-ED may make sense as there the maximum movements are reached from 18-22mm.
Next candidate to test will be the Tamron 2,8/15-30mm. I need to get this ASAP.
Following the actual tests this should max at shifts of either 20 -25 (if the construction is like the Canon) or from 22-28mm if it is similar to the Nikon.
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As promised here fresh from the calculator the pricelist.
One drawback - our eloxing will take longer than expected,
we´ll have some delay from this, the final versions will be shipping in 4 weeks, I had expected these to be ready in 2, but .....that´s life.
Version 2 of the HCam Master TS is improved for usage with the 11-24mm. With the first version we had some vignetting that was not useful, so the opening of the unshifted adapter is now 3mm broader and 7mm !!! higher.
That does a lot of more movements for all lenses, but especially for the 11-24mm this was essential.
Further: this is the first of a new generation of TS adapters - it has an interchangable back bajonett mount, which will fit for Sony emount, Mft, Samsung NX, Fuji and Canon M. This alone is a big improvement, as this will allow dealers to get one TS adapter and some bajonetts and have all customers of evil cameras served.
The Canon lens does have a full Canon International guarantee intact - as the rebuild is done by Canon Germany .
We do this because this is the only way to keep the full quality of this amazing lens -plus- ensure the rebuild is done by specialists who are trained for this lens. That costs more, but I think at this level of quality we want to reach , that is the only way for full user satisfaction !
Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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Approximately what will US price be for the 11-24 TS? Can I buy the lens from say like B and H and get the TS from some dealer or do you buy the lens and TS as a unit of kit? I would like to be able to use it on both Sony A7r and a Canon 5d. Is that possible?
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The US Price will be defined by the actually valid exchange rate from € to US $ (€ Prices see Pricelist above)
Buying the lens in the US and sending it back and forth US->EU->US will cost more than buying it here and modifying it from a new lens with EU/Worldwide Guarantee. So we offer only complete lenses with full Canon Guarantee.
Shaving the Sunshade will not diminish any funktionality of the lens. I personally suspect the "sunshade" is more a protection for the protruded frontlens,
But that is not any negative for straylight or other reflections.
Regards
Stefan
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Thanks for posting the specs ... interesting kit.
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HCam Master TS V2 with Canon EF-L 4/11-24mm
Attention - today at 9.56 am german time the gordian knot has been cut.
I got the info from Canon how to remove the back Lighttrap and now we have full shift to the longer side:
Maximum 15mm all around at 18mm focal length !!!
at 19mm shift 14,5mm
at 20mm shift 14mm
at 21mm shift 13,5mm
at 22mm shift 13mm
at 23mm shuft 12,5mm
at 24mm we still have 12mm (in Landscape!)
- vertical full 15mm !!!
all measured at F11 !
A major breakthrough !!!
Now we are ready to deliver the system.
Even better: no additional costs for this second modification !
The first final adapters will ship in 3 weeks.
So if anyone needs one asap, he can order now, as we need to proceed the Canon 11-24mm also around 2-3 weeks until its back from ordering, cutting,shipping and final brushup.
Hip Hip Hurra - Mission accomplished !
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Rain is pouring here down like crazy, but I did some shots from my Balcony:
even the corners full shifted at 18 or24mm focal length are tack sharp with f11. The focus scale on the lens points to something like a bit over 1 m to have best focus from there to infinity. Set and forget. Only thing you will have to do with this is set to manual exposure, and then change exposure time when you do a walktrough of a building/rooms/total view.
The wet dream of an old viewcamera user like me.
;D
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Here´s a view to the Preliminary cover.
the gel filter holder is completely gone - we have open space now from inner edge to edge of bajonett mount, with the electronic contacts protruding maybe 2-3 mm.
the Canon 11-24mm is nearly free of distortion ! About the same like the TS-E 17mm or 24mm.
Even at 11mm there is not much vignetting and it is tack sharp all over nearly from open aperture. A fantastic lens and worth every penny ! I think this will become a revolution in architecture photography.
About other lenses: I would think a 16-35mm would even match better.
because then you will already have overcome the starting small image circle of 16mm at 20-22mm and will have the full range up to 35mm !
I will have a brandnew 15-30 Tamron for Nikon(it has a little mechanical pin- so we will be able to use the aperture with the Novoflex Nikon G-ED->EOS adapter !!!) and a new version Canon 16-35mm either tomorrow or latest friday.
So the real fun starts now.
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just for the research: I will have also access to a Nikon G-ED AF-S 2,8/17-35mm, Lets see how that will perform.
BTW: just tested
Sigma ART 1,4/50mm landscape vertical shift 15mm /f11 no vignetting
Sigma ART 1,4/35mm landscape vertical shift 12mm /f11 no vignetting
Sigma ART 1,4/24mm landscape vertical shift 7-8mm /f11 no vignetting
Sigma ART 4/24-105mm landscape vertical shift only 2-3mm /f11 no vignetting, doesn´t improve on any focal range. I´d call this unusable for TS.
Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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Dear Stefan, how you decide where acceptable image quality ends over such 'extended' image circle?
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Quite simple - first visual:
On Lifeview 100% Zoom you can pretty much see if the sharpness will reach where you need it.
second: Imagine a Zoomlens as a stepless teleconverter. The image circle starts at the shortest focal length with the highest possible resolution.
with the growing diameter the max resolution goes down a bit. But in absolute numbers this means that the behaviour is mostly identical to the
charakteristics of the lens when in widest angle. If the corners are sharp there the larger image circle will be also usable. If the corners are already crap
when in Wideangle forget about the tele.
third: it´s trial and error also. This is usage of lenses that was never intended to happen. Experiment !
Regards
Stefan
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Here is a sample of what can be done - nobody at Sigma probably ever tried this:
Here is a sample of the Sigma ART 1,4/35mm shifted about 12mm diagonal
(I was a bit off center) with the HCam Master TS V2.
The image is a bit cropped and I have straigtened it in Photoshop as it is very difficult sometimes to hit perfect angles when you want to go straight.
But otherwise that´s what you get. The tower is a bit unsharp on top but that was close to the imagecircle´s border.
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Thank you, Stefan,
here its look very good, yes.
But for my experience LiveView sharpness in maximum zoom level can be a little over-positive on my A7r.
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Some new food for the people following the new HCam Master TS V2
A short look on todays Setup of my HCam Master TS V2 for the shooting. The Canon 16-35mm offers 15mm of shift vertical from 22-34mm. I use it prestopped down to f11. See the nice Handle I added to the hotshoe. I found this to work perfectly when you have the setup split in half from out of the bag - Head and camera.
Sony A7R, Meike Batterygrip -full radio remote trigger/Timer.
Novoflex Magicball, HCam TS Rail and Crossrail.
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Some new food for the people following the new HCam Master TS V2
A short look on todays Setup of my HCam Master TS V2 for the shooting. The Canon 16-35mm offers 15mm of shift vertical from 22-34mm. I use it prestopped down to f11. See the nice Handle I added to the hotshoe. I found this to work perfectly when you have the setup split in half from out of the bag - Head and camera.
Sony A7R, Meike Batterygrip -full radio remote trigger/Timer.
Novoflex Magicball, HCam TS Rail and Crossrail.
You have a production version to accommodate the Canon 16-35mm F:4 for shifting?
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This shown HCam Master TS V2 is still a prototype, but I will have the final versions begin of next week, as projected.
As soon as the final version is ready there will be much more images and also some test shots, and..... probably a video. :-)
Greetings from Germany
Stefan
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Hey Stefan, would you have a link to get more info on your 11-24 TS product ? I'm not sure I understand how this works...
I already have a 17mm TS Canon mounted on a Sony A7R with metabones, would like to know if I can get an even wider solution. Thanks!
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I don't understand how to focus the Canon 11-24 and other Canon lenses with this system. Also, is there a way yet to control the aperture?
best,
geb
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For most actual infos please see our Facebook profile
https://www.facebook.com/HCamde-122001131245665/
Aperture is prestopped down, that works really good and after a while it is really not missing any more.
Because if you use these superwideangles prestopped down, there is no focusshift, the range of focus in the focusindicator can be seen very accurately
and the Sony A7 cameras have a very good finder which takes the stopdown very accurately without becoming grainy or degraded.
Regards
Stefan
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Thanks Stefan! How does focussing work with the 11-24mm?
best,
geb
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I can only advise anyone to focus these superwideangles VERY carefully. Means in 100% Liveview.
If you do this, performance is stunning, as is this 11-24mm lens.
Regards
Stefan
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Here a view on our new product - the HCAM HDS Doubleshifter
Movements for your Sony A7x/A6xxx or Leica SL beyond viewcameras.
2 x15mm, combined with a Canon TSE 17 +8º of tilt and another 12mm of e.g. diagonal shift if wanted.
An architecture photographer´s dream come true.
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I can only advise anyone to focus these superwideangles VERY carefully. Means in 100% Liveview.
If you do this, performance is stunning, as is this 11-24mm lens.
Regards
Stefan
Isn´t the 11-24mm focus-by-wire only?
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No - works manually as well.
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No - works manually as well.
I had no idea, great news!
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and what about the sigma ART 12-24 ?
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I have a customer who tried to cut the Sigma. The result was not so good, because the image circle is not as large as the Canon EF-L 11-24.
Only some mm of shift available on 24x36.