Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Mirrorless Cameras => Topic started by: mbaginy on January 07, 2015, 07:23:26 am
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A few months ago, I bought an X-Pro1 with four prime lenses and, when the silver graphite X-T1 was released, one of those bodies as well. My intention is, to test, if the X-system can replace my Canon gear (FF bodies and seven lenses).
While I’ve made friends with the X-Pro1 and have decided to keep it and the 35/1.4 plus 18/2 lenses, I’m trying hard to find a way of using the X-T1 for macro photography. It’s about the same size as my old X-700 and a delight to use hand-held. But some details are frustrating: I can’t find an angle finder which fits the camera and the macro lenses available don’t meet my expectations.
I’d love to have a tripod mount on the macro lens. While the new extension tubes from Fujifilm are handy, they’ll not replace a true macro lens. I’ve tried using some Minolta MD gear I have with a Novoflex adapter. While this does work, it’s a far cry from the ease and enjoyment using my 5D Mk III with 180/3.5 and tripod mount. I’ve found an adapter from Enjoy Your Camera which allows EOS lenses to be mounted to the X-T1 and separate aperture blades seem to function in lieu of the Canon lens aperture. Does anyone have experience with such an adapter?
I guess there’s the possibility of buying a 100 or 105mm macro lens with tripod mount for (e.g.) Nikon, then using a Nikon to Fuji adapter. The Leica 100/2.8 macro with tripod mount would be my favorite. But I’m still not yet convinced. Maybe I’m a bit scared of using adapters. Does anyone using the X-system have experience in this respect?
And since I often shoot macros close to the ground, I absolutely need an angle finder. I’m not keen on external monitors (iPhone or iPad) mainly due to wanting to limit gear in the field and the number of electric gadgets. (A digression: I recall noontime or late evenings with fellow photographers where we’d have finished photographing in the best light and then ate breakfast or enjoyed drinks. Today everyone is busy, downloading images and charging batteries. One of the things I miss from analog days.) Having to keep the X-T1’s OLED viewfinder (or the monitor) turned on for a long time while I compose the shot is quite battery-consuming.
I’ve taken some recent advice and am warming towards a Really Right Stuff L-Plate. Not the same as a tripod mount but I’ve used one before with my 5D and could get used to it.
Does anyone use X-System cameras frequently for landscapes and macros? How have you experienced a possible switch from D-SLR to this system? While I like the camera very much (very intuitive functions), I fear I’ll be too limited especially when shooting macros. The IQ is good enough for me (compared to 5D Mk III), so that is of no major concern. I’ve also found my workflow using LR5.
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I don't do macro photography. I do have Canons and a good collection of L glass. I purchased my X-T1 for walkabout purposes because I was simply getting tired of the weight and size of a DSLR. Strangely I found myself using the X-T1 on my tripod as well. I use RRS L plates on my Canons and purchased one for my X-T1. In the end I also bought the Sunwayfoto L plate as it also featured a grip enhancement. It offers the same CNC precision and anodizing but at far lower price. I'm quite happy with the Sunwayfoto L plate.
http://smile.amazon.com/Sunwayfoto-PFL-XT1R-Dedicated-Fujifilm-Compatible/dp/B00KHDDHNM/ref=sr_1_22?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1420642356&sr=1-22&keywords=sunwayfoto
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Ron, thanks for your comments concerning the L-Pate(s). The Sunwayfoto version looks fine at a very attractive price. Good to know, that you're pleased with yours.
Once I turned 60, my rucksack seems to gain weight by the month. My dream was to have found a system which would allow me to decrease size and weight. But shooting macros as ground level and not having to lie in the dirt & mud is an even greater priority. I'm pleased with my Canon images and may stick with what I have. Maybe I'll simply reduce the gear I pack on hikes.
I do want to keep the X-Pro1 with two lenses. It will be somewhat like the old days when I shot with a Leica M3, then M7, later M7. I loved the Leica Ms (and manual focusing). The X-Pro1 is no rangefinder and it took some getting used to. I'll be able to adjust to its features. But I won't again maintain two complete camera system. Did so in the past -- Leica M, Leica R, Pentax 6x7. I still use my Leicaflex with 50/2 and color negative film. I'm hopelessly nostalgic.
Thanks for your comments and advice!
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You're welcome, Mike. I'm wondering if something like the Hoodman 3" Loupe might be adapted for your macro use with the articulated screen on the X-T1. It won't solve the battery issue you describe but carrying a few extra batteries seems normal to me.
http://hoodmanusa.com/cgi/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=HLPP3M
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Ron, I use a Hoodman for my 5D Mk III and am quite pleased with it. For macros at ground level with the camera in horizontal aspect, the tilting monitor is a fine aid. But as soon as I rotate the camera 90° to a vertical aspect, the problem begins - the monitor won't flip and I'd either need an angle finder of lie prone on the ground with my eye to the finder or to focus & compose on the monitor. A pain, to say the least. :'(
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Ahhhh.... good point, Mike. The articulation of the LCD simply doesn't do well in portrait orientation in this circumstance.
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I don't do serious macro work, but I have played with an old manual Tamron 90mm macro on my X bodies with a inexpensive adapter. Of course, I end up using two adapters, the Adaptall>Canon FD, then Canon FD>Fuji, so I'm sure there are some issues in there, but it does seem to work.
Not sure how to deal with the tripod mount on the lens - there is not one on the Tamron, of course. I too would love to have that stability. Perhaps there is some way to rig a macro rail attachment so it connects to both the camera and the lens?
As for the finder, Amazon lists several $50 right angle finders which allegedly fit the Fuji cameras. Optical quality is probably not ideal :) but the price is right.
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I’d love to have a tripod mount on the macro lens. While the new extension tubes from Fujifilm are handy, they’ll not replace a true macro lens. I’ve tried using some Minolta MD gear I have with a Novoflex adapter. While this does work, it’s a far cry from the ease and enjoyment using my 5D Mk III with 180/3.5 and tripod mount. I’ve found an adapter from Enjoy Your Camera which allows EOS lenses to be mounted to the X-T1 and separate aperture blades seem to function in lieu of the Canon lens aperture. Does anyone have experience with such an adapter?
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I’ve taken some recent advice and am warming towards a Really Right Stuff L-Plate. Not the same as a tripod mount but I’ve used one before with my 5D and could get used to it.
Does anyone use X-System cameras frequently for landscapes and macros? How have you experienced a possible switch from D-SLR to this system? While I like the camera very much (very intuitive functions), I fear I’ll be too limited especially when shooting macros. The IQ is good enough for me (compared to 5D Mk III), so that is of no major concern. I’ve also found my workflow using LR5.
The Fuji to Eos adapter with the separate aperture blades are a waste of time in my opinion, all they really do is add a lot of vignetting. I tried one early in my Fuji career. I was hoping the speedbooster people would come out with an adapter for Fuji to EOS, they did announce it early but now is vapor.
I also use the RRS l-plate, well worth it. I have done some stacked macros using Zerenstacker and it works quite well. I don't do a lot of macros but quite a few and I like doing landscapes when I can get the time. I have been quite happy with the Fuji and have not really used my Canon anymore. I wish I could control my MP65mm with the Fuji but we will see if that ever happens.
Another option, which I have found quite good, not perfect but works well is the Raynox DCR5320 Pro
http://raynox.co.jp/english/dcr/dcr5320pro/index.htm
It is surprising good for what it is, a diopter lens. I have used this for bugs with the 55-200 and other lense, working distance is quite good and will still autofocus. If you put a empty 39mm filter ring on the Fuji 60mm you can use filters and diopters easily with it
The Zeiss 50mm for Fuji is also another option, get autofocus and 1:1.
I use Capture One but that is a personal preference.
Alan
Alan
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Ken, your comments about the angle finder at Amazon are interesting. I'll check again but earlier investigations didn't show one for the X-T1. Those I did find were for the Nikon-style Fuji D-SLRs of a few years ago. But I will double check.
I used an old Novoflex bellows unit for Minolta MD mount with various Minolta lenses to try some macros. While the results were okay, handling seemed to time-warp me back decades ago. While I admit to a fair amount of nostalgia (film, many former SLRs, manual focusing, aperture rings, ...), I would not really enjoy using bellows in the field again; didn't like them then, don't like them any better today. I don't even know why I still have that old Novoflex thing! Having to fiddle with that would immediately persuade me to stick with my fine Canon macro gear (180 and 65mm macros).
I've been searching eBay (and my memory) for former macro lenses with tripod mounts. There really weren't that many (unfortunately). 180 or 200mm would be too long, 50 or 60mm too short. Best would be 100 or 105mm. Nikon didn't offer a tripod mount for their 105 micro per se but did offer a (longer) extension tube with tripod mount. Sadly, many fine lenses of analog days aren't all that great mounted to today's state of the art bodies.
I'll keep searching. Maybe I'll find a viable solution to my problem - else it's bye-bye X-T1 (and hello butt-kicking rucksack). I already feel my back aching.
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Alan, I didn't realise such a beast existed from Zeiss!! :o I just looked at their website and found the 50/2.8 for X-mount interesting. A little longer focal length would have been nice. And, as with all Zeiss macros lenses - no tripod mount (sad). But the L-Plate may make that loss less painful. I'll visit my local dealer soon for a chat.
So the EOS - Fuji adapter won't offer a true aperture alternative. That's sad. Possibly Novoflex will devise some unit in the future which transmits electric functions - they offer reversal rings like that. But I won't hold my breath.
Diopters. Haven't used them since ... wow, that was in the 40s! Minolta and Canon both offered excellent two-piece diopters. I'm not sure I could befriend them though.
I know that no gear (other than bellows) could offer what my Canon 65mm macro offers. Maybe I'm asking too much. Possibly I should stick to the path I decided to follow a few years ago: use what I have and quit shopping for other things. After all, the other man's grass is always greener.
Thanks for your comments and advice, Alan.
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Ken, your comments about the angle finder at Amazon are interesting. I'll check again but earlier investigations didn't show one for the X-T1. Those I did find were for the Nikon-style Fuji D-SLRs of a few years ago. But I will double check.
Oh, yeah, I forgot about those. Possibly a false alarm.... :(
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Mike, I have a Fotodiox Contax/Yashica adapter for FujiX and it's very good indeed and the attached lens is quite easy to use in full manual mode. For macro work I've used a canon 500D close-up filter on the front of the 55-200mm with a step-up ring. Wanting to get 1:1 I bought a Nikkor 105mm 1:2.8D and a Kiwi ( :o) adapter. And that works fine as long as you are not in a hurry for the first few weeks. A bit of practice at home with a tripod stood me in good stead.
I've no solution for the flip out back in portrait mode apart from lying on the ground looking at the rear screen. What's an extra battery or two to carry? The RRS l-plates are wonderful.
David
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David, thanks for your comments.
I have four spare batteries for my X-Pro1 and X-T1. Same battery!! (I have three different battery styles for my three different Canon bodies, with different chargers. Half of my rucksack is filled with batteries when I'm out shooting with the Canons! Only a slight exaggerastion.) I just wish Fujifilm would have put some more thought into designing (or having them designed) the batteries. They can be installed incorrectly - I've done than once when in a hurry.
I feel diopters and extension tubes (and bellows) aren't a solution for my regular macro shooting. I prefer a true macro lens were I'm not restricted by focusing distance and having to remove or add a certain component. Focusing from 1:1 to infinity is something I've come to like. I would consider anything else only an exception, when outdoors without my rucksack and regular gear.
I usually need time for setup and composition of a macro shot. Anywhere from 10 to 20 minutes is normal, depending upon the amount of shading bright sunlight or brightening shadows or or busy the fore and background are. That drains the X-T1's batteries far more than using the optical viewfinder of the 5D! A change of workflow. At least I don't need mirror lockup or a viewfinder shutter.
I shouldn't have gotten rid of my (very old) Nikon 105/4 micro. I preferred it to the 2.8 version due to the built-in lens shade. That with the longer extention tube with tripod mount would be ideal. But I don't know about optical quality. Those excellent lenses of yesteryear often don't shine on today's high end digital bodies.
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There are a lot of good macro lenses out there and as most prefer to manual focus for macro I think the adapter route isn't a bad one. I see there is a Zeiss Touit 50mm f/2.8M for the X mount offering a genuine 1:1 not tried it fairly pricey though it should be good.
Most macro lenses I've used are optically strong even older ones I've never been unhappy with the Tamron 90mm F2.8 I have. Not sure why Fuji didn't make a 1:1 macro lens yet.
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There are a lot of good macro lenses out there and as most prefer to manual focus for macro I think the adapter route isn't a bad one. I see there is a Zeiss Touit 50mm f/2.8M for the X mount offering a genuine 1:1 not tried it fairly pricey though it should be good.
Most macro lenses I've used are optically strong even older ones I've never been unhappy with the Tamron 90mm F2.8 I have. Not sure why Fuji didn't make a 1:1 macro lens yet.
I did have the opportunity to test the Touit 50mm Macro lens last year on a Zeiss sponsored junket (the Sony E-mount version which is identical optically) in Austria and Hungary and came away quite impressed. Compact and very sharp with very nice bokeh.
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Yes, that Zeiss 50/2.9 Touit looks quite attractive. I'll visit my local dealer shortly to get an offer. The lens doesn't yet seem available in Germany - at least when checking with an online shop (ac-foto) for price indications, I see, that it will take some time to deliver (> six weeks). I'd have hoped for a longer focal length - ideal for me would be the equivalent of my Canon 180 macro on FF. Oh well, life consists of compromises.
Quite true – most macro lenses are well built and probably constitute a good buy. I’m not overly concerned with price. An expensive but good lens will only hurt once, when I pay. But too great a (financial) compromise will hurt every time I use the thing.
Actually, the macro lens issue is the more simple part of my dilemma. Finding an angle finder for the X-T1 seems close to impossible! I’d hate to use an iPad or iPhone for ground-level macros. Might be a deal-breaker for my endeavor. The only thing hurting will be my back. After all, I’ve got a great Canon setup! No doubt Fujifilm will expand their lens selection as well as Zeiss and others. In five year’s time, there will probably be a far greater selection of lenses. But maybe still no angle finder, sigh.
Thanks for your replies, suggestions and comments. I've given myself till springtime to make up my mind what to keep or if to switch.
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Here's an idea, the Olympus OM 80mm f4 macro plus focusing extension tube. It has a tripod ring too. http://www.alanwood.net/photography/olympus/telescopic-auto-tube.htm (http://www.alanwood.net/photography/olympus/telescopic-auto-tube.htm). Manual stop-down. On FF it gives magnification range from .5 to 1.2, you can do the math for crop sensor ratios. OM to X-mount adaptors are readily available. However, the lens and tube combo will be pricey - I'd expect to pay in the $300-400 range.
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Finding an angle finder for the X-T1 seems close to impossible! I’d hate to use an iPad or iPhone for ground-level macros. Might be a deal-breaker for my endeavor. The only thing hurting will be my back.
It has a tiltable LCD so you can use that instead of looking through the viewfinder.
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It has a tiltable LCD so you can use that instead of looking through the viewfinder.
E.J., the tilting screen is fine at ground level as long as I'm shooting in a landscape (horizontal) orientation. Once I rotate the camera 90° to a portrait (vertical) orientation, the screen doesn't help at all and I either need to lie flat on the ground or use the non-existent angle finder. I've written to Fujifilm, asking if one is to be released in the near future or if they know of one which fits. Maybe they'll help.
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Here's an idea, the Olympus OM 80mm f4 macro plus focusing extension tube.
Alan, i really like that Olympus macro setup!!! Olympus were once leaders in macro lenses and gear for the OM system. I well remember their cameras and lenses. Had the OM1 for a number of years. I won't mind the cost and will immediately begin searching eBay and phone my local dealer. Thanks for that suggestion, even the focal length is fine (more to my taste than the Zeiss 50mm).
Alan, I'll fly to L.A. and invite you to a cold beer if you can now suggest a fitting angle finder! 8)
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E.J., the tilting screen is fine at ground level as long as I'm shooting in a landscape (horizontal) orientation. Once I rotate the camera 90° to a portrait (vertical) orientation, the screen doesn't help at all and I either need to lie flat on the ground or use the non-existent angle finder. I've written to Fujifilm, asking if one is to be released in the near future or if they know of one which fits. Maybe they'll help.
Very good point :)
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I received a reply from Fujifilm in which a representative explained, they have no intention of releasing an angle finder in the near future. Also, he does not know of such a finder which mounts to the X-T1. But he has forwarded my query to his colleagues at Marketing and R&D.
So unless I can find a shop which might custom-adapt an existing angle finder to the X-T1 body, I guess I'll forget about a switch (from Canon to Fujifilm). :-\ I'll then stick with my Canon gear but keep the X-Pro1 with 35 and 18mm lenses for traveling light and downtown photography. And the X-T1 with 23 and 56mm lenses will go on ebay. I had also bopught a leather half case for the X-T1 from Luigi Leicatime in Italy (plus one for the X-Pro1). I really like his cases, they're top quality!
Maybe in the future, ...
Thanks for your assistance, guys!
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Here's what I do:
- X-T1
- Sony A-mount 100mm 2.8 macro mounted via NovoFlex adapter
- RRS L-plate & tripod
- Fuji X-T1 wifi to iPad w/ remote App from Fuji
Nice big image on iPad for manual focusing and I don't have to look at either EVF or LCD.
Works better than most macro setups I've used. If you're interested I could take some snapshots of this setup in action.
Rand
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Rand, thanks for the comments and your offer. I'll download the app and try using both iPhone and iPad. I don't want to knock it till I've tried it, though my initial feeling isn't all that positive. I simply don't want to carry even more gear to the field - especially electrically-driven stuff.
Maybe I should keep a more open mind. But I dread photographing in a drizzle. While I have an umbrella mounted to the umbrella, covering camera and lens, I'd now have to cover myself holding the iGadget. Gosh, I'll need an even wider brim Stetson! I'll spend a few weeks trying out the iGadget shooting.
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Nice big image on iPad for manual focusing and I don't have to look at either EVF or LCD.
Rand, is it possible, that the app does not offer focussing? I mean, autofocus only and that can't be seen until after the shot has been taken?
I connected via wifi and received proper connection, was able to change various settings; all quite nice. But there is no "depressing the shutter release half way" for focusing. Once I activated the shutter release, autofocus went into action and the shot was taken. Apparently no means of (manual or pre) focusing using the app. Or am I missing something?
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It is touch screen focusing! ;D Makes stacking very easy, too.
Rand
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It is touch screen focusing! ;D
Rand
Well golly gee, gosh darn, I didn't realize! Would have been silly, to not offer focusing. Maybe I've been left behind a bit with recent technological advances. And yes, it (touch screen focusing) really does work. I'm not sure though, that I'll be able to learn to like that way of focusing. I've allowed myself a few more months of testing before I make a final decision. Who knows what will develop in the meantime.
By the way, I (mostly) enjoy shooting macros wide open and the thin depth of field that offers. Focus stacking isn't for me. Maybe in about 1% of my shots or so, I'd like to use it. An interesting technique though.
Thanks for your helpful comments!
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Mike,
You're welcome. It's a nice little system.
Rand
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It might be, that I’ve found a way of shooting ground-level macros in vertical orientation without having to lie on the ground like an infantryman.
I’ve searched the web high and low in those languages I speak and I’ve found a German forum in which an X-Pro1 user mentions, he can mount (thread-mount) the Nikon DR-3 angle finder for exactly the same situations which I had mentioned. That won’t help me use my X-T1 but I’ll possibly be able to use my X-Pro1 with EVF instead. I’ll now buy a DR-3 via ebay and test that setup.
Maybe I’ll be able to make the switch from Canon FF to the X-System after all. Now to find a nice macro lens – and I’ve received much useful advice from your replies. Thanks again!
I'm really excited about this discovery! :)