Luminous Landscape Forum
Site & Board Matters => About This Site => Topic started by: JohnBrew on July 17, 2014, 09:09:52 pm
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It's really nice to see a newcomer to the M8 ranks. While I did move on to the M8.2, I still shoot it quite a bit. A recent European trip found me with only the M8.2 and three lenses - a nice travel kit without the weight of my D800 and various lenses. In spite of all the new, light weight mirrorless designs on the market I'm still traveling with the Leica and will continue to do so. It's just so RIGHT for a photographer who began with a Leica M film body and doesn't want to put up with the hassle of film. My M8 images continue to sell better than all my Nikon DSLR stuff so there must be something magic to it. Many Leica photographers moaned about the lack of FF with the M8, but APS sensors still have their proponents and utilizing the best part of whatever lens you are using has something to do with it.
I, too, used the 35 'Cron ASPH with my M8 and it was a perfect compliment to the camera body. But today I mostly shoot with the 50 Lux ASPH as I feel I have more creative control.
Anyway, to sum up, the M8/8.2 is still very viable as a photographic tool and many of us are proving it every day.
You can see my recent images from Europe on my website by clicking on the "Italy - 2014" and "Corsica - 2014" folders.
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I don't get the need to go on and on (on the web) about the whole leica street photography thing. How many other genres of photography need their adherents to boast ad nauseum about their gear choice for that genre?
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How many other genres of photography need their adherents to boast ad nauseum about their gear choice for that genre?
Landscape D800E ?
Some photographers seem to enjoy boasting about their gear choice, and some photographers seem to enjoy deriding photographers who enjoy boasting about their gear choice.
"For what do we live, but to make sport for our neighbours, and laugh at them in our turn (http://pd.sparknotes.com/lit/pride/section57.html)?"
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John, I seem to have missed the significance or your post;.....
".........It's really nice to see a newcomer to the M8 ranks..."
......Has there been one?......an article here that I missed perhaps?
Without wishing to be rude or unpleasant, I took a look at your site but could find very little if any 'street photography' in it's classic meaning. Much of your site appears to be holiday snapshots and some (quite nice) views/landscapes.
I don't really understand this fad with calling oneself a 'street' photographer to make self concious snapshots of the backs of peoples heads with highly selected and expensive gear.......I'm havign trouble here remembering the names of any really good modern 'street' protagonists and this so called 'genre' is much devalued nowadays not least by the public animosity.
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Personally I agree with your general point....
I'd suggested taking a look at The Inspired Eye site (http://www.theinspiredeye.net), though, if you want evidence of genuine, contemporary "street" photography pursued by everyday people without huge equipment budgets.
But I enjoyed the article and the author's web site, there's some really interesting work there. And surely a secondhand M8 is not all that extravagant these days?
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…an article here that I missed perhaps?
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/out_on_the_streets_with_the_leica_m8.shtml
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John, I seem to have missed the significance or your post;.....
".........It's really nice to see a newcomer to the M8 ranks..."
......Has there been one?......an article here that I missed perhaps?
Without wishing to be rude or unpleasant, I took a look at your site but could find very little if any 'street photography' in it's classic meaning. Much of your site appears to be holiday snapshots and some (quite nice) views/landscapes.
I don't really understand this fad with calling oneself a 'street' photographer to make self concious snapshots of the backs of peoples heads with highly selected and expensive gear.......I'm havign trouble here remembering the names of any really good modern 'street' protagonists and this so called 'genre' is much devalued nowadays not least by the public animosity.
I didn't see anywhere were John described himself as a "street photographer". Just as an M8 owner. And I don't see that as a reason to demean his photography.
This forum is getting more and more like DPReview every passing week. Sad.
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I don't get the need to go on and on (on the web) about the whole leica street photography thing. How many other genres of photography need their adherents to boast ad nauseum about their gear choice for that genre?
Ben,
You'd be surprised at the number of people who write to us each year, wanting to understand "the whole leica street photography thing". There are newcomers to photography who have never shot, film, never shot with a rangefinder camera, and never had a chance to enjoy the Leica. If one works on the assumption that this is "ad nauseum" then one ignores those who might find it interesting. Which clearly we don't want to do.
Michael
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I suppose I'm just a tiny bit surprised to see an "old" camera of questionable measurable specifications being featured here. For goodness sake, the Autofocus in it doesn't even work!
Seriously, I believe that over time, certain cameras rise above the measurable capabilities and will always be sought for the unique aspects that they provide. I would like to see Michael select one digital camera, not less than 8 years old, to shoot with for a while. I'm curious what one he would choose.
I still shoot film. Maybe, it's because I have a killer Olympus OM kit.
ken
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John, I seem to have missed the significance or your post;.....
".........It's really nice to see a newcomer to the M8 ranks..."
......Has there been one?......an article here that I missed perhaps?
Without wishing to be rude or unpleasant, I took a look at your site but could find very little if any 'street photography' in it's classic meaning. Much of your site appears to be holiday snapshots and some (quite nice) views/landscapes.
I don't really understand this fad with calling oneself a 'street' photographer to make self concious snapshots of the backs of peoples heads with highly selected and expensive gear.......I'm havign trouble here remembering the names of any really good modern 'street' protagonists and this so called 'genre' is much devalued nowadays not least by the public animosity.
The gentleman who wrote the article said he acquired his M8 in 2013.
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You can't explain why anyone would use a Leica.
I know the jokes about rich doctors and trophy cases, in the past probably made a few myself.
Then I bought an m8 mostly on a whim and have used it from day 1. Not everyday, or every project, not always for what it should be used for, but for some reasons when I use it things turn out pretty.
I have people ask me what "camera' they should by and I say an M8. It's now cheap, doesn't require a dozen lenses, it isn't logical, but it will force a beginning photographer to make a photo rather than just take a photo.
(m8 images)
(http://www.russellrutherford.com/leica_m8_comp_sm.jpg)
The only complaint I have with the m8 is it doesn't tether and it shoots a beautiful file with studio flash, though nobody would probably use it for that except me, but it does love flash.
I have to admit I have a true fondness for Leicas, enough where I bought an S2 to use for commerce. I haven't got my head around the s2 file like the m8, but I'm learning it and I guess learning to love it.
(s2 images)
(http://www.russellrutherford.com/s2_bike_girl.jpg)
(http://www.russellrutherford.com/s2_sitting_there.jpg)
I don't think Leica will ever make an easy to use, logical cost effective camera, but on the other hand, I don't think any camera gives the pleasure of a leica, but as always that's up to personal opinion.
IMO
BC
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I don't get the need to go on and on (on the web) about the whole leica street photography thing. How many other genres of photography need their adherents to boast ad nauseum about their gear choice for that genre?
I suspect that if there were a range of sensor-based rangefinder camera makers, we would focus less on brand and more on the way RF cams allow/nudge a person to see things they might not otherwise. But since there's only one maker we tend to reference the brand. And since that brand is a deliberately upscale one it evokes all the economic & social issues, and reactions to those issues, you might expect.
I bought two low-mileage M8.2s a few months back, both from friends of friends, for a total cost less than that of one new D800E. Having connections to bauble-buying MDs has its benefits when new iterations of those baubles come along. ;) I've been an RF user, Leica & otherwise, since the early 1970s...they're my favorite kind of camera. I really enjoy the way I see things with 'em, which IMO has a positive effect on the resulting photos I take. That was my takeaway from Mr. Raddatz's article too.
-Dave-
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Enjoyable read and nice images Nicolas.
Ive never shot with a Leica but would love to own one and 'shoot street' somewhere exotic. I tried with a DSLR and got some great shots however something smaller and 'back to basics' appeals.
Dave
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It's a shame we don't have "likes" for posts on this site. If we did I would give bcooter's response five stars. Thank you, James, for your post.
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I always find it odd when somebody expresses a preference for a particular instrument (camera, guitar, car) and somebody else tells him he's wrong. How can a preference be wrong? On the other hand, I have my doubts that bcooter's files are better when he uses the Leica, or really, even much different than what he could pull out of another camera, plus Lightroom or Photoshop, in terms of a print. (And the last two studio shots are gorgeous...but they would be gorgeous with a D800 or a Panasonic G7.) In fact, I believe that, more and more, preference is becoming the decisive rationale for any camera choice. I like my m4/3s because they're inconspicuous, and I've almost stopped using the D800 for much of my work. I had an M8 for a while, and still have an M7 which I haven't used for years, and I had to ruin quite a few photos before I realized how ill-suited they were for what I was doing...they can take beautiful photos, but they're just not my...preference.
(I'm kind of groping here in the foggy past, but I think bcooter was quite engaged -- as was I -- in trying to figure out what was wrong with the M8 back in the magenta days...he's apparently adapted quite well.)
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Ben,
You'd be surprised at the number of people who write to us each year, wanting to understand "the whole leica street photography thing". There are newcomers to photography who have never shot, film, never shot with a rangefinder camera, and never had a chance to enjoy the Leica. If one works on the assumption that this is "ad nauseum" then one ignores those who might find it interesting. Which clearly we don't want to do.
Michael
Fair enough.
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(I'm kind of groping here in the foggy past, but I think bcooter was quite engaged -- as was I -- in trying to figure out what was wrong with the M8 back in the magenta days...he's apparently adapted quite well.)
The M8's extended IR sensitivity turned me off to the camera c. 2007, but now it's one of my favorite features. (I do have a pair of IR-blocking filters for when necessary.) I've taken nearly as many IR photos—handheld, mind you—with mine as the "normal" variety. Perspective can change with time & experience.
-Dave-
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In the Leica street vibe department, among friends of LuLa, I'd like to give a shout out on behalf of Allen Bourgeois, who has been doing lovely work with his Monochrom and posting it steadily to this thread:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=72404.0
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Ben,
You'd be surprised at the number of people who write to us each year, wanting to understand "the whole leica street photography thing". There are newcomers to photography who have never shot, film, never shot with a rangefinder camera, and never had a chance to enjoy the Leica. If one works on the assumption that this is "ad nauseum" then one ignores those who might find it interesting. Which clearly we don't want to do.
Michael
I can't understand why today one would feel that a Leica is a better choice for so called "street photography" than countless other cameras would be. It seems to me that some people just are hung up on following some kind of camera tradition. Is there a point to that? I have no idea, but if it makes them happy, I'm fine with it.
Keep in mind that W. Eugene Smith used Minoltas SRT 101s for Minamata. And I certainly never heard anyone trying to follow the Minolta SLR tradition although many would do well to have a fraction of Smith's talent and passion. He used a variety of cameras over his career.
I can't say that any of these photos resonated with me. So maybe it was the fault of choosing to use an M8 instead of a Minolta. ;)
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I always find it odd when somebody expresses a preference for a particular instrument (camera, guitar, car) and somebody else tells him he's wrong. How can a preference be wrong? On the other hand, I have my doubts that bcooter's files are better when he uses the Leica, or really, even much different than what he could pull out of another camera, plus Lightroom or Photoshop, in terms of a print.
It's not always about whether prints can be made to look indistinguishable under controlled conditions. I can't speak for bcooter but I make better photos when I enjoy using the camera. In the real world, if the camera drives me up the wall or somehow rubs me the wrong way I can't give the photo the attention it deserves. Similarly if a file from one camera requires more PS or LR work to look as good as files from another camera, I'll use the second camera.
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I am not absolutely sure of the accuracy of the following exchange (I thought that it was between Hemingway and Capa), but it is a fun if easy tidbit:
Ernest Hemingway: "Good pictures, what camera do you use?"
Irving Penn: "What typewriter do you use?"
I use a Leica, have done so since 1968; and a variety of MF and LF equipment in the past, and now mainly a Canon 5d2. I still prefer to use my M9 whenever I can. Yes, there are many cameras today that make using a Leica a bit quaint. Then again, using a Leica reduces the chance of achieving well-exposed, in-focus mediocre images.
Jean-Michel
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Now the concept of "street photography" has always seemed a bit nebulous to me and appeals not at all. However, should I chose to take up the challenge, I'd be inclined to select a camera (a) with the possibility of AF, and (b) a tilting screen which would enable me to shoot from waist level and/or discreetly.
Choosing a manual focus rangefinder would seem to be a perverse option unless it's overwhelmingly important to feel spiritually aligned with the Old Masters of the genre. Not that such a choice would necessarily preclude producing great results, clearly.
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Now the concept of "street photography" has always seemed a bit nebulous to me and appeals not at all. However, should I chose to take up the challenge, I'd be inclined to select a camera (a) with the possibility of AF, and (b) a tilting screen which would enable me to shoot from waist level and/or discreetly.
Choosing a manual focus rangefinder would seem to be a perverse option unless it's overwhelmingly important to feel spiritually aligned with the Old Masters of the genre. Not that such a choice would necessarily preclude producing great results, clearly.
Getting the appeal of doing it is partly what helps to determine what camera is best and in what situations. It has to work for what you're doing.
The Leica appeal is partly historical, but also has a rational basis.
Leica street modality: (i) lightweight camera with controls fit to the hand, (ii) bright, contextual viewfinder, (iii) wide angle, (iv) zone focus, (v) no shutter lag, (vi) you are in the action.
There are other street modalities, but this is the classic street modality. Zone focus is typical, but there is no faster, surer way to focus an ultrawide than through a rangefinder. You are in the action, so you are engaged with your subject, and the camera's eye is /your/ eye. With practice, you can lift the camera to your eye, frame, and shoot, within one second.
My personal favorite street camera was the Nikon F with straight prism. It was small enough to carry in one's palm.