Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Colour Management => Topic started by: Trinity on April 25, 2014, 04:15:00 pm
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This'll be easy for someone. As a Lightroom 5 user I want to do my own printing on an IPF6300. I want to obtain some custom ICC profiles and have downloaded an ACPU file and have managed to get a tiff target patch ready to print. I believe I have to go into the printer driver first and switch off the colour management and then print - but, how do you do that please.
Let me know if it's all wrong by the way.
Thanks.
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Correct, you want popup menu (Output profile) to show" None (No Color Correction).
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I want to obtain some custom ICC profiles and have downloaded an ACPU file and have managed to get a tiff target patch ready to print.
Canon's driver is incompatible with ACPU so you won't be able to select "No Color Management" without Doyle's XML driver hack. You can download his XML file and read me here: http://www.dypinc.com/Canon/AppColorMatchingInfo.xml.zip Don't get me starting on Canon's dumb use of special casing....
Otherwise, Canon's Photoshop Printing Plug-in is THE way to print profiling targets on those pritners. Works with any version of Photoshop and it's super easy and reliable. Download the plug-in from Canon's site and choose "None" for the output profile when printing.
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Sorry but I'm a bit dim on this - the two answers to date seem to contradict each other. Is it possible to just do me an idiots set of instructions if your view prevails digitaldog.
I have Lightroom 5, and I'm sure people send of for custom profiles when using LR - don't they?
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Sorry but I'm a bit dim on this - the two answers to date seem to contradict each other. Is it possible to just do me an idiots set of instructions if your view prevails digitaldog.
I have Lightroom 5, and I'm sure people send of for custom profiles when using LR - don't they?
AFAIK, if you're printing from LR, you can't use the Photoshop plug-in. So use ACPU and the 'standard' Canon print driver.
AFAIK, once the profile is built, you can use it in Photoshop and LR etc. It's been years since I had a Canon in the office (IPF5000) but I seem to recall a profile built with the plug-in can be used in the driver and vise versa. That may have changed, I may have this memory wrong and Scott will correct me. But bottom line is, for LR, you'll use the standard driver not the plug-in of course so just print the target with that driver using ACPU.
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Is it possible to just do me an idiots set of instructions if your view prevails digitaldog.
http://digitaldog.net/files/DDPrintingTargetsVideo.mov
And why isn't the service providing you the profile sending you instructions? ???
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They will on Monday. but it was Friday night, today's Saturday, thanks for the help it's much appreciated.
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AFAIK, if you're printing from LR, you can't use the Photoshop plug-in.
Right, the Photoshop Printing Plug-in only works for Photoshop.
So use ACPU and the 'standard' Canon print driver.
Can't do that. The printer driver is incompatible with ACPU. You can't select "No Color Management" under color mode when in ACPU. Canon makes use of 'special casing' and only allows "No Color Management" to show up in apps that are specifically named in a certain XML file that's installed with the driver.
Now, you might be thinking "That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of" and you would be correct! But that's what they do and Doyle was brilliant in discovering this and he has given us an updated XML files with a bunch of additional apps named so that we can print with the No Color Management option. Everytime a new version of Lightroom or Photoshop comes out we have to update this darn XML file.
Anyway that's the deal. Out of the box, the printer driver isn't compatible with the ACPU so you can't print your targets through it unless you perform the aforementioned hack. Those that have Photoshop should simply install the wonderful Canon iPF PS Print Plug-in and print the target that way. That's THE longtime preferred way of printing targets on iPF pritners for many reasons. And yes, profiles can be used interchangeably between the driver, plug-in, PS, LR, Mac and PC etc.
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Can't do that. The printer driver is incompatible with ACPU.
Just ACPU? You could print the target in say i1Profiler?
Yes that is the dumbest thing I've heard of in a long time. WTF is Canon thinking?
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So can you print the target in Photoshop with the plug-in, then just use that profile in LR and elsewhere or has something's changed in the year's since I had a Canon to play with? I seem to recall I could use the profile in either location (that is, driver and plug-in). Of course, if you don't have Photoshop and hence the plug-in, that's kind of moot.
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Just ACPU?
And every other app that's not explicitly mentioned in the XML file.
You could print the target in say i1Profiler?
No, it's not supported either. I can't believe you haven't run into this before now!
Yes that is the dumbest thing I've heard of in a long time. WTF is Canon thinking?
They weren't. We've been providing this feedback for years but some boats are hard to turn around.
So can you print the target in Photoshop with the plug-in, then just use that profile in LR and elsewhere or has something's changed in the year's since I had a Canon to play with?
Nothing has changed. Profiles are fully interchangeable and the ACPU has never been supported.
I'm sure you get to use you're clients iPF printers. And you don't even need the the printer to play around with this. Simply install a dummy printer with the driver so you can goto the print dialog in ACPU and i1P, select the iPF printer and see all this for yourself. I often have 20+ printers installed on my computer even though I only have 3 printers in my own studio. Having all my clients printer's installed helps me support them when I'm not onsite.
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Well if you run the ACPU, pull in the tiff patch file, go to print (from the ACPU) - then within the printer driver -special settings - Application Colour Matching Priority off - then print - wouldn't that get you your printed page to send off?
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Well if you run the ACPU, pull in the tiff patch file, go to print (from the ACPU) - then within the printer driver -special settings - Application Colour Matching Priority off - then print - wouldn't that get you your printed page to send off?
Special Settings? Application Colour Matching Priority off? These aren't things that appear anywhere in the Canon iPF printer driver. The option for turning color management on or off is under Main>ColorMode>No Color Management. If you don't see sections like "Main" "Page Setup" and "Utility" then you might be using a generic printer driver instead of the real Canon driver (which you need to use).
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No, it's not supported either. I can't believe you haven't run into this before now!
I've never tried in i1P since the Canon I had predated that and I used the Photoshop plug-in. That's what my customers have done too.
Nothing has changed. Profiles are fully interchangeable and the ACPU has never been supported.
Good, then the Photoshop Plug-in route is the way to go.
I'm sure you get to use you're clients iPF printers.
Did three last week, all printed from the Plug-in out of Photoshop.
And you don't even need the the printer to play around with this.
Canon sent me an IPF5000 years ago for some work, it's long gone. I'm an Epson user <g>. Plus I don't buy printers. Well I haven't in a very long time. That used Kodak XL-7700 I paid $10K for back in the early 90's made up for a lot of printer money! ;D
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You may have gathered that I see the crescent, you see the whole of the moon.
My Canon image PROGRAF Printer Driver 2010 (for Windows 7) is version 4.31 - should I have downloaded something else? All the headings I mentioned are featured.
Roll on tomorrow when I can make a few calls.
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Did three last week, all printed from the Plug-in out of Photoshop.
That on-board calibration process is really cool isn't it? Complicated with the x400s with the different common and unique calibration options but it's great that we have such easy access to perfect consistency over time and across different printers.
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My Canon image PROGRAF Printer Driver 2010 (for Windows 7) is version 4.31 - should I have downloaded something else? All the headings I mentioned are featured.
That sounds like the right one. I didn't know you were on Windows! No XML hack needed then. Your "Tabs" then along the top of the printer driver should be "Main" "Page Setup" "Layout" "Favorites" and "Support". Under the "Main" tab you'll see "Color Mode" where you must select No Color Correction.
If this doesn't sound like what yore seeing, why don't you send us a screen grab?
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It's also worth mentioning that on the iPF printers, calibration and profiling are two different processes that must be done in concert. The printer has a special on-board calibration routine that linearizes the printer. This MUST be run prior to profiling. That way, over time you'll be able to repeat the calibration procedure to get back to the state the printer was in when it was profiled. All printers drift, and new print heads can print differently than old print heads so this calibration procedure allows for us to have perfectly consistent out year after year, even across print head replacements. It's an often overlooked feature on the iPF printers but it's important.
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Well here's what I get on the windows setup. No sign of colour mode, but under Layout there's special settings with an off / on toggle application colour matching priority.
Just didn't get the chance to ring the supplier today after all, tomorrow for definite, the suspense is driving me nuts.
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That on-board calibration process is really cool isn't it?
Dunno, the targets were sent to me. Didn't get to play with any of that stuff.
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Under the Main tab, change "Easy Settings" to "Advanced"
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Dunno, the targets were sent to me. Didn't get to play with any of that stuff.
If you're going to offer remote profiling for that printer this would be a good thing to know about since they are so intrinsically tied. If you make a bunch of profiles for them and later on they find the calibration and run it, all of your profiles will be invalid. Calibration is really important on the iPF pritners!
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If you're going to offer remote profiling for that printer this would be a good thing to know about since they are so intrinsically tied. If you make a bunch of profiles for them and later on they find the calibration and run it, all of your profiles will be invalid. Calibration is really important on the iPF pritners!
While I'm sure that's all true, and it's good data, it simply isn't something I can control or be involved with, no more than if someone decides to use 3rd party inks or papers from companies that produce less than consistent control over the media. Same if I work with press profiling which I do and which we both know takes daily process control. Again, good to know but nothing I can control remotely. Heck, I'd love if every client ran targets through Maxwell and I could see the reports but it simply isn't possible.
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While I'm sure that's all true, and it's good data, it simply isn't something I can control or be involved with, no more than if someone decides to use 3rd party inks or papers from companies that produce less than consistent control over the media. Same if I work with press profiling which I do and which we both know takes daily process control. Again, good to know but nothing I can control remotely. Heck, I'd love if every client ran targets through Maxwell and I could see the reports but it simply isn't possible.
Fair enough. I personally feel it's my responsibility to 'see the bigger picture' and educate my customers on all the variables so that they can be empowered with the knowledge to make the best decisions for getting and maintaining optimal color now and down the road.
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Calibration is really important on the iPF pritners!
Further and OT, it does sound like an issue Epson's do not suffer. Their intrinsic stability and consistency among multiple samples of the same make is astounding! When I built the Exhibition Fiber profiles for Epson, using 5000 patches and 6 different model around the country to average the data, they were 0.5dE differences among them. That's really good!
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Further and OT, it does sound like an issue Epson's do not suffer. Their intrinsic stability and consistency among multiple samples of the same make is astounding! When I built the Exhibition Fiber profiles for Epson, using 5000 patches and 6 different model around the country to average the data, they were 0.5dE differences among them. That's really good!
The high volume shops I deal with are seeing the need to re-lineaze using Epson ColorBase every 6-12 months on their Epson's. Low volume consumers often don't have the volume to see much drifting over the life of their printers but the high volume shops see a visible difference within a year. So yes, you saw excellent consistency across a bunch of relatively new or underutilized printers that were freshly linearized with ColorBase from the factory, but that linearization will drift with heavy usage.
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So yes, you saw excellent consistency across a bunch of relatively new or underutilized printers that were freshly linearized with ColorBase from the factory, but that linearization will drift with heavy usage.
No ColorBase as I recall but we're going back a number of years. And at least two were from pretty high volume users although the term (high volume) is up to interpretation.
Are the needs to recalibrate the Canon less in the same kinds of production environments?
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No ColorBase as I recall but we're going back a number of years.
Epson uses ColorBase at the factory to linearize every printer coming out. Pretty cool! You can see how great the results are.
And at least two were from pretty high volume users although the term (high volume) is up to interpretation.
I'm thinking 4-20 hours of printing 5+ days a week. 5 prints a day average doesn't count.
Are the needs to recalibrate the Canon less in the same kinds of production environments?
No. Neither printer drifts enough for the average consumer to notice in the lifespan of the printer. High volume pros tend to calibrate their Canon's every 4-6 months and Epson's every 9-12 months.
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Thanks for sticking with me on this Scott, see where you mean, and I thought I'd gone everywhere on the page.
You see the whole of the moon http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsNTmjlf1vI
Keith.
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Thanks Scott for bringing up the color calibration importance of the x400 Canon printers. Fortunately, I did color calibrate my Canon ipf6400 this weekend, before I printed my targets from my new Xrite i1 photo pro. Yes, I turned off color management, definitely always do that.
I also calibrated my smaller Canon Pro-1. They come with their own software to do this also -requiring the i1 or colormunki, and ran some targets on it also.
I am glad to know how important that is, I was not sure and I figured that if Canon included it, I was gonna use it. Yes the unique and common calibration distinctions are strange, but I studied the manual and think I have a small handle on Canon's procedure and was successful on both of my Canons.
Thank you, Debra