Luminous Landscape Forum

Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Digital Image Processing => Topic started by: Jsostar on September 13, 2013, 01:20:11 pm

Title: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Jsostar on September 13, 2013, 01:20:11 pm
I am not sure how long the $9.99 price will last, if signup for Adobe's new Subscription plan for Photoshop CC and LR5.

I found this FAQ link about Adobes new plan.

http://http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#pslr-bundle (http://http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#pslr-bundle)



Quote
Photoshop photography program offer


What is the Adobe Photoshop Photography Program offer?

This offer includes access to Photoshop CC and Lightroom 5, plus feature updates and upgrades as they are available; 20GB of cloud storage for file sharing and collaboration; and Behance ProSite for your own fully customizable professional portfolio. That means you get all the benefits of a Creative Cloud single-app membership for Photoshop CC, but with Lightroom 5 included as well, for a terrific monthly price (all prices are exclusive of VAT/local taxes):
    North America    $9.99 USD
    European Union    €9.99 EUR
    EMEA non-EU    $9.99 USD
    Australia/New Zealand    $9.99 AUD
    Asia Pacific    $9.99 USD
    Japan    ¥1,000 JPY
    United Kingdom    £7.14 GBP

This offer is available to customers who own a previous commercial version of Photoshop or Photoshop Extended, version CS3 or later (CS3.x, CS4, CS5.x, or CS6). Suites and volume licenses do not qualify. Requires an annual commitment with monthly billing. Available for purchase from September 17, 2013, through December 31, 2013 from Adobe.com only.

Quote
Will the cost of my Photoshop Photography Program membership increase?

Customers who sign up by December 31, 2013 will be able to continue their membership. This price is not a special introductory price for your first year only; it is the standard price for this level of membership. But if you cancel your membership in the future, you will not be able to re-join at this special price.


The way I interpret this, is the price will remain at $9.99 until I can no longer make my monthly payment.

Is this the right interpretation? 
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on September 13, 2013, 01:32:38 pm
I think so.

Unless, of course, they change the rules again!  :'(
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: jrp on September 13, 2013, 01:44:12 pm
The way I interpret this, is the price will remain at $9.99 until I can no longer make my monthly payment.

Unfortunately not.  What they are currently saying -- see some of the other threads here -- is that they have no current plans to change that price, but that does not, of course, preclude them deciding to do so at some point in the future.  (So it is not like a current phone contract, where the price is fixed for the duration at the time that you take it out, eg)

Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: MikeChambers on September 13, 2013, 03:42:26 pm
Unfortunately not.  What they are currently saying -- see some of the other threads here -- is that they have no current plans to change that price, but that does not, of course, preclude them deciding to do so at some point in the future.  (So it is not like a current phone contract, where the price is fixed for the duration at the time that you take it out, eg)

That is correct.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: lhodaniel on September 14, 2013, 05:18:26 pm
Mike,

I now understand that the bundled LR does perish when one discontinues the subscription. This conflicted with Eric's answer in the affirmative when I asked if the bundled LR license is perpetual, i.e. that one could continue to use the LR one had from the bundle at the end of a year after discontinuing.

If the CC LR license does perish, then that is a bit scary since LR catalog files are not backwards-compatible. This could be a bigger problem than PS not being backwards-compatible. A single LR perpetual license upgrade at the end of CC is not a problem, as long as there are never any version restrictions on upgrading LR. I have LR 4 now. If I quit CC at LR 8 and the CC license perishes, I want to be able to upgrade from 4 to 8. If I have to upgrade the LR perpetual copy at every step along the way, it defeats the benefit of the bundle.

Can you clarify this one more time?

Regards,
Lloyd
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: JimAscher on September 18, 2013, 10:59:43 am
I have just signed up, and noted the following "guarantee" regarding future pricing:

"Renewal

"The price is valid for a full 12 months. After that, we'll renew your contract automatically, at the then-current price of the offering, unless you cancel. The price is subject to change, but we will always notify you beforehand."

So, the pricing is not permanent.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: jeremyrh on September 18, 2013, 11:04:28 am
I am not sure how long the $9.99 price will last, if signup for Adobe's new Subscription plan for Photoshop CC and LR5.

I found this FAQ link about Adobes new plan.

http://http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#pslr-bundle (http://http://www.adobe.com/products/creativecloud/faq.html#pslr-bundle)


"This price is not a special introductory price for your first year only; it is the standard price for this level of membership. But if you cancel your membership in the future, you will not be able to re-join at this special price."



So, is it a special price or not?
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: john beardsworth on September 18, 2013, 11:36:04 am
It's a price that won't be doubled after a year, Jeremy, and would be the base price for any future price rises. So you might find it's £11 in a couple of years' time. At least, that's how I read what Adobe seem to be saying at present.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: DeanChriss on September 18, 2013, 01:05:30 pm
Based strictly on what I've read in print from Adobe, without making any inferences, the only thing we know is that the price for the photographer's bundle is $9.99 per month for the first year. Beyond that there is no price commitment. Given all the controversy I wouldn't expect the first round of price increases to be huge, but anything beyond those first 12 months is just a guess.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: hubell on September 18, 2013, 01:24:21 pm
Mike:
What would be very reassuring for many, and I think appropriate, is for Adobe to commit to pricing the special PS/LR CC package in the future at a level that preserves the 50% discount off the "regular" price of the PS CC single license. Thus, if Adobe at some raised the price of the PS only CC rental from $20 per month to $24 per month, the price of the special PS/LR CC rental would not be raised above $12 per month. (Of course, Adobe should decide not to raise the rent on the special package at all!) It's nice to know that Adobe has no "plans" to raise the price in the future, but the preservation of the discount does offer significant comfort that the original deal is a real deal and not a teaser price.
Thanks.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: madmanchan on September 18, 2013, 11:51:26 pm
I now understand that the bundled LR does perish when one discontinues the subscription. This conflicted with Eric's answer in the affirmative when I asked if the bundled LR license is perpetual, i.e. that one could continue to use the LR one had from the bundle at the end of a year after discontinuing.

I believe what I said originally remains true for Lr 5.  (However, it may not be applicable for future major versions of Lr.)

Quote
This could be a bigger problem than PS not being backwards-compatible. A single LR perpetual license upgrade at the end of CC is not a problem, as long as there are never any version restrictions on upgrading LR. I have LR 4 now. If I quit CC at LR 8 and the CC license perishes, I want to be able to upgrade from 4 to 8. If I have to upgrade the LR perpetual copy at every step along the way, it defeats the benefit of the bundle.

Unfortunately I can't give you a concrete answer to this yet.  But I can tell you that the Adobe exec staff is aware of this concern, and I hope there will be something official I can communicate to you regarding this.  (I can tell in the meantime that they have every intent to alleviate this concern, but I recognize that's rather meaningless till you have the specifics. I'm trying to get you those details as quickly as I can.)
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: jeremyrh on September 19, 2013, 02:55:22 am
It's a price that won't be doubled after a year, Jeremy, and would be the base price for any future price rises. So you might find it's £11 in a couple of years' time. At least, that's how I read what Adobe seem to be saying at present.
Well, that's what I guess too, but I'm not sure if it's entirely consistent - they say it's the price for this plan, but will subscribers after 31 December get that price? I guess not. So if they get a different price, say $20, how long will Adobe keep 2 separate streams of customers, before "offering" the $9.99 folk the "opportunity to upgrade" to $20 ?

I suppose it's worth a punt to find out - and that's probably what they are relying on.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: john beardsworth on September 19, 2013, 03:44:39 am
So if they get a different price, say $20, how long will Adobe keep 2 separate streams of customers, before "offering" the $9.99 folk the "opportunity to upgrade" to $20 ?
You just have to hope someone in Adobe has thought of that, but one has the impression they are "listening to customers" (my euphemism for making it up as they go!).

My guess is that they intend to let these streams persist because the $9.99 won't be a huge proportion of their total customer base in 3-4 years' time. You may as well bring these people on board, even if they're paying half price, and trust that they will continue to encourage others to use Photoshop while not leaving a market for any competitor. It also helps move a chunk of Lightroom's user base over to the subscription model which might make it easier to decide one day that its perpetual licence is "unsustainable" (although I do believe Adobe when they say that they do not intend to do this). So while the $20 people might whinge, I can see enough arguments to keep existing customers loyal.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: dseelig on September 19, 2013, 12:49:23 pm
still a ripoff
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: DeanChriss on September 19, 2013, 01:33:35 pm
I believe what I said originally remains true for Lr 5.  (However, it may not be applicable for future major versions of Lr.)

In the thread at http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=80687.msg661386#msg661386 Mike Chambers, also employed by Adobe, seems to say exactly the opposite, specifically:

"There are two ways you can get Lightroom.

1. You can purchase a perpetual license. This does not provide access to future new versions of the software, although you will have any access to updates (i.e. 5.1, 5.2, etc...) of that software.

2. You can get Lightroom as part of a Creative Cloud membership. You have access to Lightroom, including future updates and versions as long as you continue to be a member of Creative Cloud.

This offer is a Creative Cloud offer. It is not a Photoshop CC subscription, with a perpetual license of Lightroom thrown in. It is a Creative Cloud subscription that includes Lightroom and Photoshop.

Hope that helps...

mike chambers"

Perhaps I'm just easily confused, but is the official word now that LR obtained via a new CC subscription is a perpetually licensed copy of LR5?
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: AndreG on September 19, 2013, 01:51:02 pm
Hi,

I am confused! If I unsubsribe for some reason and purchase a perpetual licence of LR.

In your view, will I be able to open the files worked on with LR CC or I I caught for life with CC?

Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Manoli on September 19, 2013, 02:19:13 pm
... is the official word now that LR obtained via a new CC subscription is a perpetually licensed copy of LR5?

No.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Rick Popham on September 19, 2013, 02:41:59 pm
Hi,

I am confused! If I unsubsribe for some reason and purchase a perpetual licence of LR.

In your view, will I be able to open the files worked on with LR CC or I I caught for life with CC?



As it stands now, if you leave the CC subscription you can buy a perpetual license of LR which is the same version as that in the subscription.  So, yes, you'll be able to escape the Cloud and use your LR catalog in the sunlight. 

I wonder if you'd be able to just purchase a perpetual serial number and convert the subscribed version to the perpetual?
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: SunnyUK on September 20, 2013, 05:58:18 am
8 years ago none of us cared about LightRoom. Who knows... when it becomes time to ditch the CC package, maybe there's something new and fancy out there making any worries about LR and PS superfluous. Place your money, make your bet, there are no firm guarantees in life.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: tuthill on September 20, 2013, 06:20:45 pm
Here's another statement by an Adobe staff member in Adobe's public Support forum for CC which states that the current price at the end of your first year is the price that they are charging right now:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1300146?tstart=30
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: MikeChambers on September 20, 2013, 06:37:57 pm
Here's another statement by an Adobe staff member in Adobe's public Support forum for CC which states that the current price at the end of your first year is the price that they are charging right now:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/1300146?tstart=30

fyi, that information is incorrect (we are working to update the post).

Ill try to be really clear, since there is so much confusion on this. If you join the Photoshop photography program, the monthly price for that program may change in the future (up or down). We don't have plans to change the price, but just like all of our other prices for our services and products, the prices may change in the future.

You are not guaranteed that the price you pay per month will be $9.99 forever. It may go up, it may go down.

Unlike some of our other Creative Cloud promotions, where you get an introductory price for a year, and then after a year, it goes up to the regular price, the price for the photography bundle is the regular price. So, once you have been a member via the Photography program a year, your price does not automatically go up.

Hope that helps clarify things.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: tuthill on September 20, 2013, 06:43:23 pm
Thanks for the clarification Mike.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Eric Kellerman on September 24, 2013, 04:42:45 am
For potential Euro customers, I note that the price of the €9.99 subscription has already risen to €10.16 (or €12.29 with tax). €10.16 = US$13.73. Level playing field, Adobe?
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on September 24, 2013, 05:54:45 am
For potential Euro customers, I note that the price of the €9.99 subscription has already risen to €10.16 (or €12.29 with tax). €10.16 = US$13.73. Level playing field, Adobe?

Hi Eric,

I don't think it has changed, € 9.99 + 23% VAT = € 12.29 . They charge 23% for endusers which is the Irish rate.

That of course doesn't explain why the European customers must pay some 34.9% more due to (today's) exchange rate, for an electronic delivery. The excuse that it is more expensive to run an operation in Europe, must easily be offset by the Tax benefits they get by running things from Ireland, otherwise they would not be there to begin with.

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Craig Lamson on September 24, 2013, 09:30:23 am
fyi, that information is incorrect (we are working to update the post).

Ill try to be really clear, since there is so much confusion on this. If you join the Photoshop photography program, the monthly price for that program may change in the future (up or down). We don't have plans to change the price, but just like all of our other prices for our services and products, the prices may change in the future.

You are not guaranteed that the price you pay per month will be $9.99 forever. It may go up, it may go down.

Unlike some of our other Creative Cloud promotions, where you get an introductory price for a year, and then after a year, it goes up to the regular price, the price for the photography bundle is the regular price. So, once you have been a member via the Photography program a year, your price does not automatically go up.

Hope that helps clarify things.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com

So its NOT introductory pricing on the PS/LR bundle?  So that means you don't have to buy before Jan 1, 2014 to get the
$9.99 pricing?

Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: MikeChambers on September 24, 2013, 10:24:09 am
So its NOT introductory pricing on the PS/LR bundle?  So that means you don't have to buy before Jan 1, 2014 to get the
$9.99 pricing?


No. After Dec 31, 2013 the offer goes away, so you wont be able to sign up for it after then.

Basically, it is a special offer / program, where you only have a couple of months to join, but once you join, you keep it as long as your CC membership remains active.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Craig Lamson on September 24, 2013, 10:30:36 am
No. After Dec 31, 2013 the offer goes away, so you wont be able to sign up for it after then.

Basically, it is a special offer / program, where you only have a couple of months to join, but once you join, you keep it as long as your CC membership remains active.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com

So it really IS an introductory offer.  Man you guys have made a complete mess of this...
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: SunnyUK on September 24, 2013, 10:34:37 am
So it really IS an introductory offer.  Man you guys have made a complete mess of this...

It's a good deal. Far cheaper than the "introductory offer" for PS alone.  Does the label really matter that much? It's been clear from when it was first announced that the price, while probably increasing in line with other prices, will not jump dramatically to some "non-introductory" price. That's great for users. Consider yourself fortunate for being able to sign up for it. Don't worry; be happy ;-)
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Craig Lamson on September 24, 2013, 11:15:20 am
It's a good deal. Far cheaper than the "introductory offer" for PS alone.  Does the label really matter that much? It's been clear from when it was first announced that the price, while probably increasing in line with other prices, will not jump dramatically to some "non-introductory" price. That's great for users. Consider yourself fortunate for being able to sign up for it. Don't worry; be happy ;-)

That this is a "good deal" is personal opinion.  It's not mine.

Does the label matter?  Of course it does.  If a company like Adobe can't get this right, well, what else can we expect from them long term?

IMO this whole episode from Adobe has been  a mess and it does not lead to trust between a customer and supplier.

Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: SunnyUK on September 24, 2013, 11:20:23 am
That this is a "good deal" is personal opinion.  It's not mine.

Does the label matter?  Of course it does.  If a company like Adobe can't get this right, well, what else can we expect from them long term?

IMO this whole episode from Adobe has been  a mess and it does not lead to trust between a customer and supplier.

Okay. So we have different opinions. That's cool. But the trolling and harassing of Mike is not cool.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Eric Kellerman on September 24, 2013, 01:31:02 pm

I don't think (the price) has changed, € 9.99 + 23% VAT = € 12.29 . They charge 23% for endusers which is the Irish rate.

That of course doesn't explain why the European customers must pay some 34.9% more due to (today's) exchange rate, for an electronic delivery. The excuse that it is more expensive to run an operation in Europe, must easily be offset by the Tax benefits they get by running things from Ireland, otherwise they would not be there to begin with.


Thanks for that, Bart. Knowing I'm paying Irish sales tax sugars the pill about this much!
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Craig Lamson on September 24, 2013, 03:04:37 pm
Okay. So we have different opinions. That's cool. But the trolling and harassing of Mike is not cool.

Oh please, I asked a simple question.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: jeremyrh on September 24, 2013, 04:02:56 pm
It's a good deal. Far cheaper than the "introductory offer" for PS alone.  Does the label really matter that much? It's been clear from when it was first announced that the price, while probably increasing in line with other prices, will not jump dramatically to some "non-introductory" price. That's great for users. Consider yourself fortunate for being able to sign up for it. Don't worry; be happy ;-)
For me the point is that if this IS an introductory offer, and that those joining on January 1 2014 will have to pay a lot more, then there is a good chance that the good price we have now will mysteriously disappear at some point in the not-too-distant future as it wil become unsustainable for Adobe to keep 2 prices for the same product.
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Isaac on September 24, 2013, 04:22:08 pm
... it wil[l] become unsustainable for Adobe to keep 2 prices for the same product.

Because?

(Airlines have multiple prices for the same seat -- it depends when you buy.)
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: MikeChambers on September 24, 2013, 05:22:33 pm
For me the point is that if this IS an introductory offer, and that those joining on January 1 2014 will have to pay a lot more, then there is a good chance that the good price we have now will mysteriously disappear at some point in the not-too-distant future as it wil become unsustainable for Adobe to keep 2 prices for the same product.

Just to be clear, no one can join after Dec 31, 2013. If you want to join this program, you have to sign up by the end of the year. At the end of the year, the offer doesn't exist anymore. You won't be able to sign up.

Anyone who had signed up before then will remain in it as long as they keep their membership active.

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: NigelC on September 25, 2013, 08:26:09 am
This offer seems to have bypassed the UK - just checked Adobe UK website
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: john beardsworth on September 25, 2013, 08:52:37 am
Not sure you looked very hard - see https://creative.adobe.com/plans/offer/photoshop+lightroom?store_code=gb&locale=en
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: NigelC on September 25, 2013, 09:56:50 am
Not sure you looked very hard - see https://creative.adobe.com/plans/offer/photoshop+lightroom?store_code=gb&locale=en

This is what my wife says when I can't find my glasses/car keys/her handbag/anything else, but she usually adds "you've got senile dementia" so thank you for your restraint!
Title: Re: CC & LR5 New Subscription: How long does the price remaiin at $9.99 a month
Post by: Wayne Fox on September 25, 2013, 08:17:23 pm
So it really IS an introductory offer.  Man you guys have made a complete mess of this...

seemes pretty clear to me.  Introductory offers entice you to join for a discounted price for a period of time with an automatic increase in price when the time is up (usually pretty significant).  Typical of many businesses such cable/satellite TV .  Adobe has a couple of introductory offers going as well

But this is differentWhile there is no guarantee there won't be a price increase in the future (what company does that?), there is no automatic increase.  Not introductory, it's just a special limited time offer.  And certainly adobe could decide to extend it , and indeed they could decide it's just a standard package that is always available in the future if it seemed a good approach.  But for now it's a limited time offer, no guaranteed built in price increase after the year.