Luminous Landscape Forum

The Art of Photography => The Coffee Corner => Topic started by: michael on April 17, 2013, 06:16:55 pm

Title: A Matter of Character
Post by: michael on April 17, 2013, 06:16:55 pm
In my essay A Matter of Character (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/a_matter_of_character.shtml) I've asked that if you'd like to propose any camera or system (now or from the past) that you think has "character", why not post a comment here?

Remember though – this is all about "opinion" There's no right or wrong. Keep it civil please.

Michael
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 17, 2013, 06:26:46 pm
In my essay A Matter of Character (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/a_matter_of_character.shtml) I've asked that if you'd like to propose any camera or system (now or from the past) that you think has "character", why not post a comment here?

Remember though – this is all about "opinion" There's no right or wrong. Keep it civil please.

Michael



Michael, not only civil, but short: it's gone 00.25hrs here and I need my beauty sleep. Badly.

Camera heaven would be a 500 series with a full-frame sensor. That I could afford to buy. I don't ask for much.

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 17, 2013, 07:17:15 pm
Funny, isn't it?  Character in a camera is a hugely underrated factor in choices we make.

How could I ever find character in the melted Mars Bar (sorry for the theft Rob) that is my Canon DSLR?  Not so much a love/hate relationship as a "commercial expedience"/loathing co-existence.

On the other hand, as Rob knows, I just acquired yet another Hasselblad - a 501CM - and for me a principal character trait that makes the mighty Swede such a fond companion is that it is almost organic and simply about pure function.

Going up a size, my Sinar provides the ultimate image control and certainty. But, despite having used them for decades, Sinars are devoid of soul and, hence, wanting in character.  By contrast my Linhof Technika is a technological barbarian with great character and a strong sense of the heights of beautifully seductive industrial design harking back to Art Nouveau and Art Deco.  This closely reflects Michael's Jaguar/Lexus point in his story.

Sorry for the long-winded response.

Walter
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: dsaxe on April 17, 2013, 07:21:54 pm
Interesting article, Michael. You are right about cameras having character. My favorites were my Hassleblad X-Pan, a Contax G2 and of course my Leica M9. (I seem to be partial to rangefinders) I have owned many camera but those are the ones that stand out the most. Interesting though is the fact that I also owned a Fuji X-Pro 1 and sold it a few months ago because I thought it lacked character. Chaq'un son gout.

Cameras are for the most part a very personal experience—just like many tools we have owned. I am sure carpenters have their favorite hammers, artists prefer certain paintbrushes to others, and at one time many years ago, I used to work as a draftsman (pre-computer), and I could not function without my Faber-Castel 3H pencil.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: AFairley on April 17, 2013, 07:44:50 pm
For me (limiting myself to cameras I actually have owned), the camera system with the most character would have to be the Nikon F and the alphabet Nikkors that were out at the time.  I now have an almost mint red dot body with a 50mm f1.4 sitting out on display in my office.  I never get tired of looking at it and handling it.  (Though that may just be the remains of youthful infatuation.)  Not the film camera I would choose if I went back to shooting film, but definitely the one with the most character.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Peter Mellis on April 17, 2013, 08:13:16 pm
Only two of the cameras that I have owned and used over the years have had real character; a Voigtlander Vitessa L and a Pentax Spotmatic. I can't really define why, in either case. None of the digital beauties come close.

My wife's TR3 that had a hole in the floor on the passenger side and side curtains had character, as did my MGB. Can't explain that either.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: joezl on April 17, 2013, 08:35:48 pm
Mamiya 7II, Contax G2, Speed Graphic (no kidding). There are so many more but these three gave me a markedly different way of working at different times in my career which, in turn, has influenced the way I think about photography.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: telecentricity on April 17, 2013, 08:56:55 pm
The soul of any camera is made up of the photographs it took.  This is why an M3 or Nikon F are immortal, as everyone knows.  (Look at any war image from David Douglas Duncan or Larry Burrows).

But you asked about character, not soul.  All modern pro DSLRs allow you to forget completely about the camera and concentrate entirely on the image.  That is excellent industrial design but it is still not character.  I define a camera's character as its ability to draw attention to itself in a positive way such that the act of making a photograph is a harmonious fusion of camera and subject.  Robb Kendrick's wet plate photos of cowboys might be a good example of the character of a camera adding to the artistry.

My suggestions for cameras with character:  Zeiss Super Ikonta B, Sony NEX 7n with a W-Nikkor 3.5cm/1.8 and Fuji Instax Mini.

Just my thoughts.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Jeff-Grant on April 17, 2013, 08:59:50 pm

Camera heaven would be a 500 series with a full-frame sensor. That I could afford to buy. I don't ask for much.

;-)

Rob C

+1
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: tsjanik on April 17, 2013, 09:05:14 pm
Only two of the cameras that I have owned and used over the years have had real character; a Voigtlander Vitessa L and a Pentax Spotmatic. I can't really define why, in either case. None of the digital beauties come close.

My wife's TR3 that had a hole in the floor on the passenger side and side curtains had character, as did my MGB. Can't explain that either.

My first car was an MGB* and my first 35mm a Spotmatic.  I agree they both had character, the difference is the Spotmatic always worked.   ;D

Tom

NB: If I were to choose something current, I might pick the 645D; in some ways like a Spotmatic, except for all the buttons I don't use.

*and my college roomate had a TR3.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: ndevlin on April 17, 2013, 09:40:21 pm
That's easy:

Nikon F3

Canon EOS-1

Mamiya 6

Nothing I have shot since the dawn of digital has come close. 

- N.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Pelao on April 17, 2013, 09:55:34 pm
I've had a fair number of cameras over the years. There was a Ricoh long ago that had this strange lure for me - I just had to use it.

Anyway, I had not come close to the feeling of character until I purchased my X-Pro 1. I don't have the zoom. With the primes, which are excellent, it is utterly fluid in use. It's kind of arrogant: it has a sense of excellence about it. If you are into gadgets it's a real let down. I want to create photographs using a tool that was made by people who love to do the same, and this camera is it.

To  borrow some Michael's phrase, it kind of sneers at toasters.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ray McGuinness on April 17, 2013, 10:05:12 pm
My all time favorite camera with with the most character was my medium format field camera the Horseman VHR.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: TimBray on April 17, 2013, 10:07:02 pm
I had the budget for either and ended up with the X-E1, strictly for reasons of character.   Having been a Pentax and (coincidentally, I didn’t arrange for the merger) Ricoh guy, obviously I’m a sucker for character.  Never had a Fuji before, aside from a lamentable point-and-shoot way back around Y2K.

I’ve never worked with a rangefinder-style EVF like the X-E1 has before, and I’m very taken with it.  The readout is crisp and excellent and it’s got the enlarge-to-help-manual-focus button, which is very seductive. I wonder how the X-Pro optical viewfinder will work with the upcoming long tele-zoom?

Recently, on the Big Island of Hawaii, I went on a long and quite arduous multi-hour hike across rough lava to where the live lava was, to poke a stick in it (pix & story at http://goo.gl/GL9dl ).  I took only the X-E1 and the 35mmF1.4 prime, totally appreciated the featherweightness of that combo, and the pix came out pretty good.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: David Sutton on April 17, 2013, 10:31:34 pm
The camera that replaced my Pentax Spotmatic, the Rollei 35, had character. Never got same number of keepers from it but I always really looked forward to using it. That counts for something.
My current character camera is shaping up to be a Kodak no 4 Screen Focus which I'm converting to take 120 film. Red bellows and beautifully constructed from what appears to be cedar. I can't wait to take it out into the field.
Cameras post 1918? Bah!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Pelao on April 17, 2013, 10:37:22 pm
I had the budget for either and ended up with the X-E1, strictly for reasons of character.   Having been a Pentax and (coincidentally, I didn’t arrange for the merger) Ricoh guy, obviously I’m a sucker for character.  Never had a Fuji before, aside from a lamentable point-and-shoot way back around Y2K.

I’ve never worked with a rangefinder-style EVF like the X-E1 has before, and I’m very taken with it.  The readout is crisp and excellent and it’s got the enlarge-to-help-manual-focus button, which is very seductive. I wonder how the X-Pro optical viewfinder will work with the upcoming long tele-zoom?

Recently, on the Big Island of Hawaii, I went on a long and quite arduous multi-hour hike across rough lava to where the live lava was, to poke a stick in it (pix & story at http://goo.gl/GL9dl ).  I took only the X-E1 and the 35mmF1.4 prime, totally appreciated the featherweightness of that combo, and the pix came out pretty good.

Just read the story. I've never been anywhere near fresh lava. Amazing features form as it cools. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Dave Bridenstine on April 17, 2013, 11:04:03 pm
Interesting enough thread to prompt me to register.  I got interested at age 12 with my dad's Bolsey B2 rangefinder. Talk about quirky. Shot for the college newspaper with a Yashica twin-lens and a Yashica manual slr (manual stop-down after focus and manual mirror return.) But the one I like to handle (still own it), the one that does what I want it to do and gives me the info to do it is my OM2n.  Had this conversation with a friend at church several weeks ago -- there is just something very satisfying about taking a photo with a solid, competent manual device.  Will now have to take another serious look at the X Pro 1.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Schewe on April 17, 2013, 11:48:49 pm
I've asked that if you'd like to propose any camera or system (now or from the past) that you think has "character", why not post a comment here?

Well, it may not fall into the typical "character" status, but I would have to say my Sinar P 4x5 camera that I bought when Aldermans (a big Chicago camera store) went out of business. This was in 1977 or 78 (can't remember). It was a huge price for the time, an Expert kit for just under $4K. I still have an use the camera from time to time (now with an IQ 180 back). There's just something about the gears that I love! Something about Swiss precision...

No, it's not sexy to fondle...and it's a pain to set up. The bellows are kinda long in the tooth (I have tape on some places where there are light leaks). But the darn thing has served me well ad helped me produce some really nice images over the years.

I used to love the 'Blad...but I sold it...
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Stephen Scharf on April 18, 2013, 12:01:07 am
Michael,
I have to say that I'm personally very pleased you've discovered the X-Pro1. When I read your original blog entry you were considering one, I thought about dropping you a personal note recommending it.

For the me, the X-Pro1 is absolutely my definitive camera of character. I bought my X-Pro1 and the wonderful 35 mm/1.4 prime last November, having become smitten with the X-series after taking my sweet little X10 to Utah for landscape photography in October, and having it consistently smoke my old warhorse Canon 1D MkII for image quality, resolution, color, dynamic range, signal/noise and all-around experience of use. I got mine almost exactly when firmware version 2.0 came out, which made a dramatic improvement of autofocus performance compared to versions 1.0 and 1.3. Version 2.03 of the firmware has taken this performance even further. Fuji is clearly listening to customers and consistently making improvements for us. What a nice change fro the norm as far as some other manufacturers.

Using the X-Pro1 takes me back to the days when I learned the craft of photography using my completely manual Olympus OM-1s. I think that some of the wonderful qualities of the X-series cameras is that they force you to intellectually and physically re-engage with the process of making images, an experience I had not realized I had been missing using my Canon dSLRs until I got my X10. Personally, I love the "hands-on" experience of the X-Pro1, where you have to use your hands on the camera body (and lens) to made exposure and focus adjustments. And it has a real, wonderful, bright, clear optical viewfinder! The optical viewfinder is a revelation. Like you, I've never liked EVFs, so for me, the fact the X-Pro1 (and the X10, for that matter) had an optical viewfinder was a very compelling feature. The electronic hybrid overlay was merely icing on the cake. I would estimate that use the optical viewfinder 99% of the time.

I rented the 18-55 zoom recently, and was so impressed with it, that ordered it and just received mine yesterday. As much as I love the image quality from the 35mm prime, my guess is the 18-55 will be on the camera most of the time. I agree with you that the image quality of the 18-55 is excellent. Personally, I am really waiting for the 23mm prime to ship as it will then turn my X-Pro1 into an X100S-equivalent.

What I am most impressed with the X-Pro1, though, is the image quality. The detail, resolution, low noise, dynamic range, and those Fuji colors! Gasp! This camera also, as Sean Reid describes it, "draws" in black and white absolutely beautifully.

So, Michael, I sincerely hope you'll enjoy yours as much as I love mine, but I am confident you will. This camera makes me want to pick it up, get out and generate work with it, and, at the end of the day, that's what it's all about.

Some pics from the X-Pro1:

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/Napa%20Valley-4.jpg)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/Napa%20Valley-5.jpg)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/City%20Street%20Art-4.jpg)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/Giants-Champions.jpg)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/PPLandCloudsWeb.jpg)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/puma_cat/fujixpro1pics/Pierce-Arrow-Silver-Arrow.jpg)


Regards,
Stephen Scharf
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: kipdent on April 18, 2013, 12:23:50 am
This thread idea seemed the perfect place for me to throw a monkey wrench into the mix. From LuLa, I first started reading about the Sigma DP2 Merrill. I wrestled with how impractical a camera it is and thought I was crazy for even considering it. But I took a leap of faith since I cannot afford a medium format back for my Contax 645, and decided I wanted something really different than my Leica M9 which, I thought, the X-Pro 1 was too close to conceptually.

I've had the camera for five days, and I can say have not been this excited about a camera in at least 20 years. I can't stop taking images with it, and every time I print an image, I am giddy beyond words. I'm stunned, astonished, and electrified that a $799 camera can produce images of such quality, three-dimensional texture and realism. I'm almost speechless. It is truly not for everyone, I'm sure, and is frankly ridiculously clunky to use--but so what! In a way, its impracticality also gives it character--but more than anything, it is its output that defines its character. Count me as a complete convert, and fully bonded to the DP2--so much so, I will not shed a tear when I sell my M9.

After sleeping on it, one more camera comes to mind--my Polaroid SX-70. Just looking at it makes me smile.

Kip Peterson
Fallbrook, California

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: tesilab on April 18, 2013, 12:39:38 am
You wrote:

For example, the camera can optionally display a live histogram on either the EVF or the OVF (Optical Viewfinder). But not if Power Save is turned on. What's that about?!
Is this a bug? Is it a quirk? It certainly isn't a feature.


I would guess it was a simple and deliberate choice. Powersave means saving power to them. The histogram is taxing on the battery, so they automatically disable that feature when in that mode, since it is inconsistent with that priority. You may feel that it should only effect how long the idle camera will remain powered on, with whatever settings, but they might have a more comprehensive approach.

It's a great article. Fuji gets it so almost right, but I'm not sold on xtrans filter array. The RX1 with auto-iso in manual mode has also spoiled me, though if the X100s (and the improved Lightroom) had been released back in December, it might have made a big difference.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: markd61 on April 18, 2013, 02:03:58 am
For me it would be the Topcon Super D.
I have to say it would actually be one of many cameras from the 70's that exude character. Alpa 10D. Exakta VX-1000, Nikkormat, Rolleiflex, Hasselblad, Rollei SL66, Kowa 6, Petri FTEE and the original Olympus PEN cameras
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Phender on April 18, 2013, 03:17:04 am
As this seems a bit of a trip down memory lane I would have to say that as a child of about 12 I thought the Minolta 16mm subminature camera was about the ants pants, just oozing character and what is more style. When I grew up it was a Mamiya 6 that had that character and as British sports cars are also hot in this thread an Austin Healey Sprite MkI - Noddy car for grown ups and oh so quirky.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: laughingbear on April 18, 2013, 04:02:17 am
It was in October 2003, I was taking some pictures in rather rough conditions, high winds, driving rain, and most critical of all, we were sand blasted on this beach. I had this camera only since 2 weeks or so, and it started to become attached to my right hand permanently.

There were other photographers as well, and one of them I remember, I should meet him again in the local pub a few hours later.

Sand and salt, a rotten combination for every camera, and usually has to be avoided. However, I put my faith in the manufacturers claims, and in deed I should never be disappointed, neither lenses nor body ever gave me any trouble in that respect at all. In the pubs mens room I held the entire camera and lens into the sink and was  cleaning it under fresh water running from the tap, when this chap came in and at first he looked at me as if I would be serial killer or something the likes.

He never saw anyone holding a camera under the tap for a longer time. I was moving her around to make sure every surface is thoroughly soaked. In my bag I had a large leather cloth, and rubbed her dry afterwards.

Build like a tank, perfect fit for my hands with the vertical grip attached, rock solid, never gave me any troubles for years, I loved the color rendition, the lenses were amongst the very best produced at this time, and both, lenses and body fully weather sealed. I had this camera in heavy rains (Irish rain!) for many hours.

It was the Olympus E-1, a love affair that should last many years.  :)

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ben Rubinstein on April 18, 2013, 05:20:58 am
Canon A1, only camera I ever fell in love with.

(http://www.getdpi.com/gallery/files/8/9/8/andenaig.jpg)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Bob J on April 18, 2013, 06:10:24 am
The 'Toaster oven' comment stung a little, I might have to comfort my own NEX 7 which is looking full of character with it's rear screen which, after a year's use is looking the kind of ugly that only a mother could love...

Have been using some other film cameras of character though, as part of a film challenge over at Dyxum - started with the Dynax 7 and Minolta XG-M - the first of which is Amazing while the second has possibly everything you need from a MF SLR but is very light on character (other than the annoyance of a touch sensitive metering system which doesn't always react to my touch).

Heaps of character were exhibited by the next film camera - a Minox 35EL: a real bitch to load, a bit fiddly and uncomfortable in operation (two strokes of a quite stiff lever to wind-on), but a gorgeous little lens - oh and to compete with the 'Jag' factor, I found mine doesn't cock the shutter if you wind it on with the lens retracted.

I'm now on on to the Contax G1 using a 90mm - I'm sure that will be an education too...
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Sareesh Sudhakaran on April 18, 2013, 06:27:05 am
Character? Mamiya RB67, Nikon F2 - any camera that doesn't require batteries.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: BernardLanguillier on April 18, 2013, 06:27:42 am
Hum... Yes... I have probably used some of those...

Kodak SLRn
Mamiya ZD

And recently the DP2m.

Now for the first 2 I could never really get over the downsides and truely enjoy the experience though.

Cheers,
Bernard

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Pete_G on April 18, 2013, 07:45:20 am
Another vote for the Hasselblad V series. The weight, shape and the sounds it makes when winding on or releasing the shutter.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: soboyle on April 18, 2013, 07:53:10 am
..it's little brother, the X-E1. Wonderful camera with the 18-55 and the 35. Perfect for the projects I've been working on in dimly lit museums. They are working the quirks out with each successive camera release. The Q menu went a long way at squashing the handling of the camera and getting to buried menu items. I do miss the optical viewfinder of the X100.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rawcoll on April 18, 2013, 08:00:26 am
A very thought provoking article. I suppose I tend to associate character with something I experienced in my formative years. I don't know whether it was the simplicity of things in those days, mechanical even, that I find characterful, or whether it is just that those experiences were indeed formative. Or perhaps it is because we have issue with all the modern technology that is foisted upon us whether we want it or not. It will be interesting to see if, in 20 or so years time, folk brought up today on plastic boxes containing a computer and with a lens attached, will  regard them as characterful when compared with the equipment that will then be available.

In that respect my most characterful camera is one I bought some years ago, the Lumix LC1 (twinned with the Digilux 2). Yes, it had an EVF (poor by today's standards, mind), but the whole thing operated in a way that harped back to what I was familiar with, an aperture ring on the lens and speed ring on the top plate. Where they should be! Oh, what joy! Quirky? Yes, the 6 second delay whilst the raw wrote to the card, during which one couldn't take another photo!  And the noisy sensor. When I sold it recently I thought how good it would be if they made a camera in the same mould, with the straight forward simplicity, with a modern sensor and EVF. Well, maybe the X-E1 is just that. I am starting to seriously contemplate buying in to the system.
 
What is interesting, though, is that at the same time as wanting to harp back to my formative years, I am still quite happy to embrace the modern conveniences that come in the retro package, such as a good EVF and A/F!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: psimison on April 18, 2013, 09:00:22 am
I purchased a Fuji Xpro1 about 8 months ago.  I was skeptical.  Today, I really like the camera for its output and lens quality.  They have and continue to improve the software to run the camera.  It is quirky, but so am I.  I have the 35, 18-55 and have ordered the 55-200.  I will buy the 14 soon and others as they come out.  The only place that Fuji is short is in their information.  The sometimes grow muchrooms and other times seem to have cranial-rectonitis.  High quality product.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Alan Smallbone on April 18, 2013, 09:42:18 am
I bought my X-Pro 1 and the three primes shortly after it was released. I had rented a copy and really liked it and ordered it. Even though it was quirky to begin with I felt it really made me connect back to photography. I had also just been diagnosed with prostate cancer and was soon to start successful treatment and the small lighter camera was a real joy to use and carry with me daily even when I was not feeling so good, I would never had carried my dslr around as much. So in a way it was also good therapy. 

I had started years ago with a Canon A-1 and I still have it and some FD lenses, which I can adapt easily to the X-Pro 1. I still use my Canon EOS setups from time to time but they mostly sit at home, over the last year. I now have the 14mm prime and I have preordered the 55-200mm and really looking forward to it. I like my Fuji so much that my wife now as the X-E1 and the kit zoom and she is having a lot of fun with it. The firmware improvements have been great and really helped the camera a lot, and like Michael mentioned it has character and is maturing. High quality lenses, small package, fun to use and great image quality.

To me a very successful camera that has made it a lot of fun to carry with me daily.

Alan
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: RSL on April 18, 2013, 09:44:29 am
I don't think "cameras" have character as much as lenses have character. I loved the character of the 50mm f/2 Summicron on my M4. I love the character of the 16-35mm f/4 on my D800, and I love the character of the Panasonic Leica 25mm f/1.4 Summilux on my E-P1. The other lenses in my lens stable do good work, especially the 70-200mm f/4 on the D800, but there's less "character" there.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: JeanMichel on April 18, 2013, 10:10:22 am
A camera such as the X-Pro is attractive to me, primarily due to its hybrid viewfinder and AF ability while framing trough the OVF. I am a very long time user of Leica's (M3,4, 6 and now 9) with mainly a ( 1962)35 and (1968) 50 Summicron. The 'character' of the images I make with those  is as much due to how the camera feels in hand and eye, and the mental process that accompanies it's use. Whenever I used a 4x5, a Mamiyaflex, or Hasselblad, and now a Canon 5d2 I am photographing very differently -- not better or worse, just differently. Still, I love the idea of photographing people with my Speed Graphic, handheld -- there's character there too -- perhaps some day again.
Jean-Michel
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 18, 2013, 10:21:30 am
Box Brownie.

Got me hooked before I was knee high to a grasshopper and I've been addicted ever since.

Ditto.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 18, 2013, 10:23:02 am
Character? Mamiya RB67, Nikon F2 - any camera that doesn't require batteries.




I agree with the F2; had the F, F2 Photomic, the F4S and then sold the latter to go backwards to a simple F3. The best, IMO? the F2 because it had more comfortable rounded edges and corners. The FM and FM2 were okay for higher synch, the only use I gave them, but not in the same league at all. I, too, detest battery dependence. But today and digital - what choice can one possibly have?

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: tolims on April 18, 2013, 10:35:36 am
Exata Varex IIb camera body. Mine came with Zeiss Jena 50mm f2,8 lens. The selftimer and 130 degree left hand film rewind lever gears when activated sounds very subtle mechanically - like when winding a precision pocket watch. The shape of camera body is somewhat triangular and the shutter button can only be operated using left hand as it is located on front left hand side when in use, however very practical when shooting as i am right handed. Has   built in film cutter!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: David S on April 18, 2013, 10:47:11 am
Pentax XM and Leica CL from the olden days.

Dave S

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: mbaginy on April 18, 2013, 11:09:02 am
- Pentax Spotmatic F (my first SLR)
- Leica M3 double stroke with dual range 50/2
- Nikon F2

Still quite pleased with my 5D but it can't compare in character with the above.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: marlon127 on April 18, 2013, 11:24:14 am
X1-Pro definitely has a nostalgic feel to it. But it's really just a quirky digital camera.  Kind of like taking a classic car and updating all but the body with modern technology.  But hey if it makes you feel good why not.  I'm personally a bit more partial to the NEX7 it's just got more stuff that I'd use.  My current loves include the Rx1, Fuji GF70, and Leica M6.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Misirlou on April 18, 2013, 11:55:58 am
To me character is the quality in a camera that makes me want to just pick it up and go shooting. Particularly if it's one that encourages me to leave less interesting examples behind. My cameras with character get kept forever, rather than sold when some improved tech comes along.

35mm:
Leica IIf RDST
Bolsey B2
Olympus OM1n

MF:
Rolleiflex C and D
Hasselblad 500
Mamiya Press

LF:
Busch Pressman D
(Favorite lenses are Schneider and Fuji)

Honorable Mention:
Bronica RF645
Polaroid SX70
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: JimGoshorn on April 18, 2013, 12:31:53 pm
I had a Nikon FTn, FM and F3 and would say that any one of them was more enjoyable to use than my Canon 1Ds3 but of the group, my favorite memories are of using the FM with it's motor winder.

In an effort to reclaim those "good old days", I recently acquired an XE-1 and the longer I use it, the more endearing it becomes. It's character comes from it's quality, relative simplicity and Fuji seems to show a genuine interest in improving the system to meet the needs of photographers.

Jim
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: bobdales on April 18, 2013, 12:41:10 pm
I remember most fondly my Voigtlander Vitessa L-1.  Loved the lens and all the character you get in one camera with barn doors and a plunger.  The digital world is pretty much plain vanilla computerized picture-taking implements until recently.  The Fujis are tempting.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: NancyP on April 18, 2013, 01:05:57 pm
My first camera: my mother's Bakelite box brownie that she gave me at age 7 after she got a new camera. My father's Minox. Now, Sigma DP2M.

My first film SLR, the Mamiya-Sekor 1000D, and my first and currently only digital SLR, Canon 60D, are too straightforward and mainstream to have character.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 18, 2013, 01:23:37 pm
Exata Varex IIb camera body. Mine came with Zeiss Jena 50mm f2,8 lens. The selftimer and 130 degree left hand film rewind lever gears when activated sounds very subtle mechanically - like when winding a precision pocket watch. The shape of camera body is somewhat triangular and the shutter button can only be operated using left hand as it is located on front left hand side when in use, however very practical when shooting as i am right handed. Has   built in film cutter!


Had the IIa and then the IIb; the Leica models after the R6 tended towards that same wedgie shape. Hated the release on the side of the lenses, though.

Too good an opportunity for a little self-love to let slip away:

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Mexidea on April 18, 2013, 01:34:51 pm
From what I´ve read in the earlier posts older cameras are generally the favourites - and I couldn´t agree more... Maybe age has something to do with that.
The Nikon D800 I now use is a marvellous machine, but character? Not much.
Neither have the other newer cameras I´ve used ("newer" for me, from 1995 and onwards...), e.g. a Canon 5D I borrowed some time ago to get more pixels than the ones my D200 could provide.
I think I´ll give my vote to my Nikon F which I bought in Amsterdam in 1969, a vote influenced also by the memories attached to it. But it does really have some character on it´s own with it´s squarish and not so ergonomic design.
My second choice would be a Thachihara or Ebony 4x5" folding camera, which I unfortunately don´t have.
A photo of my venerable Nikon F is nostalgically attached...
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Grant Stovel on April 18, 2013, 02:34:39 pm
Perhaps the Fuji has character but one wearing a mask and not so sure of itself.

I am nearing the end of a 4 month odyssey to Italy, Greece Ukraine and France.  The Fuji has not inspired me one little bit.  I was using my Canon 5 D with 24-105 and 16-35 .....but after seeing another photographer having fun with her Olympus OMD.....I bought one and had fun ever since....let alone some of the best travel shots I have ever taken.  alas the 32 pounds of other gear remains shut in my Kata...and the Olympus points the way to FUN.

The Fuji is surely a great camera....but not in my hands.

 
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Harald L on April 18, 2013, 03:06:05 pm
In the real world there's no perfect camera at all. First off all a camera has to fit to your needs. A sports photographer will never be happy with a Ebony.

But then I believe that flaws become character attributes as soon as you are able to master them well while others don't.

Having said this I really enjoy my X-Pro 1. I wouldn't if my wife could master it ;D
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on April 18, 2013, 03:33:12 pm
and since I like taking at least 24 little pictures every second, my favourite camera of all time was the Bolex: Sweet Swiss clockwork precision.

(http://www.moviecamera.it/immagini/foto%20cine/Paillard%20Bolex%20H16.JPG)

My first professional outing was to shoot 4 different vehicles converging simultaneously at the centre of a 4-way split screen.

Equipped with a matte box (http://www.bolexcollector.com/accessories/filter60.html) with a three-quarter frame matte - plus a few mm for borders, I carefully rewound the film to the same start point for each of the four exposures. When the workprint came in from the lab, I couldn't believe that it actually worked. From that moment on I loved the Bolex  :-*

(I still have the Gossen LunaSix Pro meter I used then...alas the camera was never mine)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: ericperlberg on April 18, 2013, 04:03:03 pm
While its true that no camera I've come across is perfect the cameras that I own that I feel have character are my M9, my Sigma DP2Merrill and my recently purchased Fuji X100s for similar and not so similar reasons. I've also owned a Canon IDs MkII, a Nikon V1, a Canon Rebel, a Leica X1, a Ricoh GRDII and a Panasonic LC1 none of which had character though most were good cameras. Somehow they were lacking in that je ne sais quoi necessary for character.

The three cams which I feel have character all feel responsive to me and my kind of shooting. It's as though I've bonded with them and they sing my song.

I love that my M9 is brassing and that I can use a lens designed, built and used by someone else in 1950s. I love the look of the files it creates. I love that its digital brain is embedded in a historically significant mechanical body that so many great photographers have used. I love that I don't have to dive into menus on an LCD screen to change settings for my shots. There are plenty of things which annoy me about the camera too.

From the moment i first held my Sigma DP2M it felt goldilocks right, not too big, not too small. It just fit in my hand in such a comfortable way. Within minutes I figured out how to use the thing, it was just logical and simple. And when I saw the files I literally became giddy. Blimey!

The fuji x100s has some of the historical character of the Leica from that wonderful scrolly script on the top plate to dials in just the right places and a view finder that allows me to work appropriately to the situation at hand.  It just feels and works like how I've come to think a camera should feel and work. And the image quality hasn't disappointed. I enjoy using it.

I know that one man's ceiling is another man's floor but the 3 above cams for me are tools I'm keeping.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: massimo.gori on April 18, 2013, 04:35:09 pm
I was waiting for this article, Michael, and I knew that one of these days you had to write it.

One year with the x-pro1, all the four primes, several thousands pictures... And now I am wondering how I could live with a DSLR all the years before.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 18, 2013, 04:59:11 pm
and since I like taking at least 24 little pictures every second, my favourite camera of all time was the Bolex: Sweet Swiss clockwork precision.

Chris,

I shared your passion for the Bolex until I got a job in television and thereby began a long and torrid affair with the Arriflex 16 ST.  The Arri was pin registered and so the image was very stable.

Thanks for reminding me that I had a life before stills.  I had almost forgotten entirely.

Walter
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on April 18, 2013, 05:21:59 pm
Yes, I too moved on to the Arri 16s, but the electric motor was not nearly as sexy as that Swiss clockwork - and I kept sending those damned mag cores to the lab!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 18, 2013, 05:48:18 pm
I hear you Chris, and I probably agree about the clockwork aspect.  Mind you, the Bell & Howell 70DR had a clockwork mechanism that was part of agricultural machinery, but it too had a charm.  I covered a lot of Vietnam moratorium stuff with the Arri back in the day and it might have been that grip arrangement that gave the security in a riot of feeling that you were in some way armed with a weapon of defense.

Crikey, it was the 60s — how long ago was that!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on April 18, 2013, 05:54:12 pm
...I covered a lot of Vietnam moratorium stuff with the Arri back in the day and it might have been that grip arrangement that gave the security in a riot of feeling that you were in some way armed with a weapon of defense.

exactly! Arri felt like a meaningful Teutonic weapon - whereas the Bolex was covered in fine 'Morocco Leather'  :D - what was that anyway? - camel?
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 18, 2013, 06:00:45 pm
I hear you Chris, and I probably agree about the clockwork aspect.  Mind you, the Bell & Howell 70DR had a clockwork mechanism that was part of agricultural machinery, but it too had a charm.  I covered a lot of Vietnam moratorium stuff with the Arri back in the day and it might have been that grip arrangement that gave the security in a riot of feeling that you were in some way armed with a weapon of defense.

Crikey, it was the 60s — how long ago was that!



For me, that's when real life began; before that was a period of twiddling my thumbs waiting for the time to come. Seems like last year.

Without that decade, nothing in my life would have happened. Which might have been handy for LuLa, though.

Oh well - enjoyed it while it lasted; it can never happen again because all innocence has been lost - everywhere.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: michael on April 18, 2013, 06:12:17 pm


(http://www.moviecamera.it/immagini/foto%20cine/Paillard%20Bolex%20H16.JPG)

The Bolex pic almost brought a tear to my eye. Regrettably never owned one, but used to covet them. Only a Questar telescope provoked similar lust.

Michael
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: AFairley on April 18, 2013, 06:31:28 pm

(http://www.moviecamera.it/immagini/foto%20cine/Paillard%20Bolex%20H16.JPG)

The Bolex pic almost brought a tear to my eye. Regrettably never owned one, but used to covet them. Only a Questar telescope provoked similar lust.

Michael

Arrgh, you had to say Questar.   ;D  Intense teenage lust.... 
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: david loble on April 18, 2013, 06:53:32 pm
My Olympus 35RC always felt like an extension of my eye, or maybe my brain? Called it a baby Leica, couldn't afford the real thing. I took it everywhere, for years, even using it a little bit about 5 years ago. Then I dropped it and I can't find a repair shop with the parts but can't get myself to toss it out.

I've been using using the XE-1 for 2 months, mostly with the 35mm lens and it comes closer to that "old" feeling everyday.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: alban on April 18, 2013, 07:26:13 pm
I thought the X-Pro was (is) a fine camera but I couldn't stand the amount of buttons crammed in such a small space. Too bad.

And where is that Mamiya 7 ?


Cheers
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 18, 2013, 07:33:41 pm
Looking at it now, the Bolex H16 (I don't think that one is the Reflex 'Rex") smacks of the similar Euro industrial design as the Linhof ..... and the Hasselblad.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Christopher Sanderson on April 18, 2013, 07:41:54 pm
And now that the Questar has found 'Kepler 62 (http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/kepler/news/kepler-62-kepler-69.html)', I'll be off there with the Bolex  ;D

and while I am on flights of fancy, check out Chris Hadfield's latest moonrise photo (https://twitter.com/Cmdr_Hadfield/status/325026285313208320/photo/1) (a very sweet tweet)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: redkev on April 18, 2013, 09:55:41 pm
Leica red dial 3f, Leica M4, Hasselblad 500c, original Canon F1, Canon A1, Cambo view camera. I have still not met a digital camera with soul. I have owned many digital cameras but I am still searching for "the one". I currently use a Olympus OMD 5e, and have an assortment of other Panasonic micro 4/3's bodies and lenses. I like the Oly but I have not really connected with it in a way I did with the various film cameras mentioned above. I am waiting for the update of the Fuji, version 2' not just a software update. Meanwhile I will make due with the Oly.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: maxgruzen on April 18, 2013, 11:11:43 pm
Deardoff 4x5......Lovely wood
Linhof 4x5 handheld......beautiful german machining
My Leicas of the '50 & '60's
My Merrill DP2......ugly as sin
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: OnlyNorth on April 19, 2013, 02:05:31 am
Here in East Europe,for those,who had not relatives in the West,there were Exakta Varex 1000 with its two buttons for exposure time and detachable prism and Flektogon 4/20mm lens and the huge Pentacon Six  6x6 both from East Germany.Near them was wonderful Czech Flexaret VII 6x6,4.5x6 and 35mm ::)... in a single camera.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: acoljub on April 19, 2013, 03:55:02 am
Topcon Re-2 with Topcor 1.4/58mm. In 70-ies. Those were the days...
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Sareesh Sudhakaran on April 19, 2013, 04:02:55 am

I agree with the F2; had the F, F2 Photomic, the F4S and then sold the latter to go backwards to a simple F3. The best, IMO? the F2 because it had more comfortable rounded edges and corners. The FM and FM2 were okay for higher synch, the only use I gave them, but not in the same league at all. I, too, detest battery dependence. But today and digital - what choice can one possibly have?

Rob C

I have an F2AS, the AS is dead. I also have an FM10, not built like the F2, but totally battery-free! What a joy to use - it's like a boy who was brought up on computers is suddenly given an abacus.

Why can't we have solar powered cameras, like Swiss watches+Eco-Drive? The shutter mechanisms are already available, we just need to drive a sensor for 1 fps or so. Doable?

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on April 19, 2013, 09:00:37 am
The Iskra 6x6 folder that I have has character while it is actually an improved copy of the Agfa Super Isolette. The Polaroid Pathfinder roll film cameras, like the 160 that I have, belong to that group, modified to sheet film or not. My Canon 5D MK II does not have it. Some Olympus Pens, digital and film, have it. Almost all Fuji's medium format film cameras have it but that ugly MF SLR.

The Fuji digital reviewed by Michael has it though it does not have the extra features I also had foreseen in 2009: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/32926676

--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
December 2012, 500+ inkjet media white spectral plots.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: tjbates on April 19, 2013, 09:35:10 am
I think film cameras (movie and stills) have more character than digital cameras. Why? Because for me at least they provide(d) a more sensory operational experience than the polycarbonate menu driven cameras of recent years. There was a certain smell, a certain sound, a certain touch. Cameras with character are for me cameras that operate mechanically more so than with a menu based system. The Bolex was and is such a camera. The Arri SR, ST, B&H 70DR Eclair ACL (not the CP16!) and for stills, my late father's humble Pentax K1000.
After shooting aerials of my high school back in 1976 on a Bolex I was hooked. Now many years later after a career shooting broadcast news, I still remember the scent of the film, the sound of the shutter and feel of cool metal nestled in my hands.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: dvinez on April 19, 2013, 09:51:49 am
Michael: I've owned several no-character cameras,  the Nikon Em, Canon A2, Panasonic FZ30, Nikon D80 and now the D7000. The only cameras I've owned with character have been the Nikon Ftn Photomic,  Nikon F3 & the  Minolta Dimage 7Hi (really). I'm currently using a Nikon V2 and it has potential,  believe it or not.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Peter McLennan on April 19, 2013, 09:57:37 am
[
I think film cameras (movie and stills) have more character than digital cameras.

For that reason, I'll add to your list the rackover Mitchell and the Arri IIC.  Beasts, both.  Seminal cameras. Real characters.


For still cameras, I must add the Pentax 6X7.  Nobody who's tripped the shutter on that giant SLR can forget the experience.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: iowa mike on April 19, 2013, 10:02:21 am
 :)
  Character would be defined as the camera I might run back into a burning house to save. For me that would be an ancient Rollei 2.8f that has been my favorite camera for over thirty years.
  I should also say that while it is my favorite camera it is also the one I probably use the least anymore, sigh. Love, go figure?
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: JeanMichel on April 19, 2013, 10:03:55 am
and since I like taking at least 24 little pictures every second, my favourite camera of all time was the Bolex: Sweet Swiss clockwork precision.

(http://www.moviecamera.it/immagini/foto%20cine/Paillard%20Bolex%20H16.JPG)

My first professional outing was to shoot 4 different vehicles converging simultaneously at the centre of a 4-way split screen.

Equipped with a matte box (http://www.bolexcollector.com/accessories/filter60.html) with a three-quarter frame matte - plus a few mm for borders, I carefully rewound the film to the same start point for each of the four exposures. When the workprint came in from the lab, I couldn't believe that it actually worked. From that moment on I loved the Bolex  :-*

(I still have the Gossen LunaSix Pro meter I used then...alas the camera was never mine)


Ahhh! I owned the same but in the 8 mm version, with a a beautiful Angénieux zoom with a silky zoom handle that could be me moved in and out with my pinkie! That was such a joy to use compared to the school's 16 m Bell and Howell's. Wish I'd kept it.
Jean-Michel
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: rasterdogs on April 19, 2013, 11:48:22 am
I'm inclined to view this in regards to the digital cameras I've experienced
I find the X-pro1 and X-100s to be the digital cameras I've used that bring back the fun I had using film cameras (Nikon F, Nikkormat, Hasselblad 500C).
The Fuji cameras with their hybrid viewfinders (used in OVF mode 90% of the time) provide great capability in non-obtrusive, form factors that are a joy to use as I wander around looking for pictures.
The user interface is less 'computer-ish' than what I've experienced with my Canon DSLRs.
For me these cameras are a joy to use.  Fun tools.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rand47 on April 19, 2013, 12:01:58 pm
From the film world:

Leica M4 (wish I still had it - it was a dream come true to be able to buy it new in 1968.)
Olympus OM1 & OM3Ti - the 3 had the best metering system I've ever used.  The OM3 Ti was what a Leica SLR should have been, just superb in every way.

Digital:

Sony a900 - a purpose-built still image machine with much of the best from film days.  The solid feel, the ergos, that wonderful viewfinder that allows easy manual focus even wearing glasses, the IQ - just a very satisfying photograpger's camera.

Sigma DP2 & 3 - I echo Kip Peterson's comments about the thrill of making prints from these files and the forced deliberation of working with the camera's clunkiness.  I'm in love with these little bricks.

Fuji X-100 - which "is" a character rather than having character.  I have an absolutely love-hate relationship with this one.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Thingo on April 19, 2013, 12:17:40 pm
An interesting concept.

There are cameras I think of fondly, for a variety of reasons:

But character, that's along a different spectrum. For me, the funny little *istD has real character. There were lots of additional control combinations that fell easily to hand, just waiting to be discovered: since they weren't in the owner's guide. But once discovered, never forgotten, each truly useful. The *istD is "well sorted".
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: ErikKaffehr on April 19, 2013, 01:43:13 pm
Hi,

For me it was always about a camera that would do the job and do it well, my milestones:

Minolta SRT 101 a good camera that happened to be my first SLR

Minolta XM the first modern Minolta as good as the 101

Minolta Dynax 9Xi, pretty close to what I wanted

Pentax 67 was a decent MF camera I liked a lot, apart from viewfinder reminding me of a black hole

Sony Alpha 700 was a pretty good camera that I probably made my best pictures with

Sony Alpha 99SLT - this is the first camera I can make work as I want, and it even makes decent pictures



Best regards
Erik
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Peter McLennan on April 19, 2013, 07:15:22 pm
Chris,

... began a long and torrid affair with the Arriflex 16 ST...
Walter

Todally.  Nothing to beat an Arri S with hundred foot loads and a Zeiss 8mm Distagon up front.  My weapon of choice for many a shoot.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: tomsi42 on April 19, 2013, 07:36:32 pm
I too liked this article, and with the thoughful replies, decided to register to the site forum.

I read the initial rveiws of the X-Pro here, and got confused as many seemed to like it; but your reviews seemed that it was just a strange camera. I had that feeling when I had the original Sigma DP2; so I decided not to pursue Fuji further.

But a few months ago, I was able to try out the X-E1 for two weeks (with 18-55mm and 35mm /1.4); and I was surprised to find a very nice camera with good handling, and a great character (I installed the latest firmware). The RAW support was still flaky; CaptureOne 7 was still the only real choice. That has now been solved - I get great files with both LR4.4 and C1 v7.1.

The thing that really struck me, after returning the X-E1, is how much I miss the camera (I shoot 4/3 and µ-4/3 currently; had Canon earlier). So it will be my system of choice in the future.

I like telecentricity's comment on a camera's soul. Looking back at my photographs. My take on the subject, is that I to get the best results with characterful cameras, not soul-less machines. The favourites during the times are the Olympus XA, Fuji S-304 (!) and Panasonic GF1.

A few photos from my X-E1 adventure (processed with LR 4.4RC, so trhey could be better).

(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8507/8483829486_c7f4bffe0e_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/tomsi42/8483829486/)

(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8248/8495345187_0517cdaecb_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/tomsi42/8495345187/)

(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8242/8505665118_799ff4e9ef_z.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/tomsi42/8505665118/)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: gregkoz1 on April 20, 2013, 12:56:54 am
Our cameras are extensions of ourselves.  I really loved my Rolleiflex /80mm Planar 2.8 and M-4.  With those 2 tools, I could do anything.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: DaveCurtis on April 20, 2013, 01:41:08 am
None of my modern Canon digitals have character. Perhaps the 1 series has a little.

However my first camera, my mums Kodak Retinette had truck loads! A fun quirky camera to use.

Slightly off topic "lenses with character" - , my new Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZE has plenty character. Classical rendition from f1.4 - f2. Interesting that a modern wide angle lens has been designed to draw this way.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 20, 2013, 03:53:40 am
[
For that reason, I'll add to your list the rackover Mitchell and the Arri IIC.  Beasts, both.  Seminal cameras. Real characters.


For still cameras, I must add the Pentax 6X7.  Nobody who's tripped the shutter on that giant SLR can forget the experience.


Yep, and I kept mine for about a year... found it to be what I imagine the early 6x6 Bronicas such as the S2 must have been: athletes that constantly leapt out of their own skins.

A shame, really, because on paper -a least - if offered such potential for large 120 trannies. In the end, slow synch., bounce from every moving part and the dfficulty in loading/unloading without the film flipping out of my fingers killed it for me. But other than that, it was beautifully made.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: pegelli on April 20, 2013, 03:54:15 am
I guess maybe I'm quirky but for me a camera that I enjoy taking out and shooting with has enough character for me.

In that way my current most used camera's (Sony A850 and NEX 6) have all the character I need.

But maybe I even think bread toasters have character, probably caused my education as an engineer  ;D (and when it burns the toast it's usually my fault, not of the toaster  ;))
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Riccardo on April 20, 2013, 05:05:08 am
You can feel the character, as well as the charm, but you can't define it.

I use digital cameras and printers by profession and I'm not a nostalgic for the good old days (maybe just a little).
Having said that, I think that no digital camera has character, as well as no printer or PC.
The inkjet prints have gained character and charm, but not the printers (unlike some enlargers).

A camera with character? Mamiya 6 (but not the Mamiya 7).
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Abernero on April 20, 2013, 05:07:28 am
Back in the day I used OM-1s which to me were wonderfully simple, full of that elusive character and I really connected with them, the OM-3 that replaced one of them I never got that feeling from regardless of how good it was in terms of results.
Similarly more recently going from D700 to D800; the D700 somehow seemed easier to get on with though the results from the newer machine are wonderful - not that the D700 was too shabby in that respect.  Having said that when did I actually last use the D700? So although it felt like it had more character it certainly isn't far enough up the character ladder to make me actually use it.
On the automotive analogy since I now drive a Morgan Threewheeler it is possible that I really don't need any more character from the machines in my life...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/39263697@N08/sets/72157632388832973/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/39263697@N08/sets/72157632388832973/)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: HSakols on April 20, 2013, 09:06:48 am
For me character was shooting in square format. I guess my Mamiya c220 had real character compared to a nikon d800.  I still miss the square. It has been years since I've projected square slides. 
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Pete_G on April 20, 2013, 10:03:01 am
[
For that reason, I'll add to your list the rackover Mitchell and the Arri IIC.  Beasts, both.  Seminal cameras. Real characters.


I was going to add the Mitchell BNCR, but you beat me to it, I agree with the Arri 2C as well, but there's nothing like seeing a Mitchell on a big crane, with a camera operator and a director, 20 feet above the ground. Old fashioned movie making.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Jason DiMichele on April 20, 2013, 10:53:28 am
Any folding technical camera for field work. Sensor size of any medium format (pref 6x7). I love the methodical ways of working with the technical cameras but kind of don't miss developing the E6 at home. That would be my ideal camera.

Cheers,
Jay
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: louoates on April 20, 2013, 03:43:22 pm
For me the camera with the most character was my Kodak 1 MP digital. I don't miss its gargantuan grain and artifacts. But it did start me on the digital path with my very first image manipulation. For that I am eternally grateful. Kodak, RIP
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: rickk on April 20, 2013, 04:49:10 pm
A variety of 120 folders and "press" cameras: Century Graphic, Graflex XL, Rapid Omega, Mamiya Press 23 and Universal, Voigtlander Bessa II
had plenty of character and quirkiness. All kept me busy with fine-tuning and fixing -- especially the Rapid Omega backs.
In that era, I was always seeking but never found a deal on a Plaubel Makina 67 or W67.
Later, the Mamiya 7ii and Fuji GSW 690ii were my tools of choice.
I still use the Mamiya on occasion and haven't been able to let go of the Century Graphic and a few select lenses.

Regards,    Rick
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: JV on April 20, 2013, 05:18:43 pm
The Fuji FP-1, a rangefinder camera with bellows that took Polaroid pack film.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on April 20, 2013, 08:14:50 pm
Most of my "character" cameras have been mentioned already: Speed Graphic and Mamiya 6, for example.

Also the Pentax Spotmatic. In 1971 my wife and I went on a Sierra Club two-week "High Light" trip (duffel plus food carried by mules) in the Sequoia and Kings Canyon National Parks, many nights above 11,000 feet, and crossing two passes at 12,000 and 13,200 feet. I brought two Pentaxes, one for Plus X and one with Kodachrome. Several other hikers had Nikons. During the two weeks, every one of the Nikons failed or broke at some point, but my two Pentaxes kept on working all the time.

But there's one camera nobaody has mentioned: The Zeiss Baby Ikonta, which was a pocketable folding camera that used 127-size film, with negatives about the size of a 35mm full-frame neg. Totally manual, wire finder, good lens, great for taking candids. My brother picked it up in a pawn shop and let me use it one summer, and that's what hooked me on photography.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: leeonmaui on April 20, 2013, 09:40:27 pm
My Pentax 645D, its the finest camera I have ever owned or will ever own I guess. It seems I argued with a lot of my other cameras and at times wanted to heave them out into the landscape I was shooting. I worked very hard and scrimped and saved, I ate lots of instant noodles to get the money to buy it used, and to assemble, lenses filters and a solid shooting platform. I bought a Lowpro h20 bag to nestle it in.
I don't feel the weight of it as we wander, I'm confident, I know it will be ready and able to work. most of its buttons and function remain unused, and I'm surprised every now and again by some of the tricks its has up its sleeve.
Rarely if ever do I shoot it hand held, its not that kind of relationship, its goes from the bag to the arca swiss in an easy transition, then it silently lets me get to work, mostly at the same settings shot after shot, it waits with me for light, in the chill of the morning and rests under my head, under the stars on trips, its not concerned with a bit of rain or snow or dust, although I fuss a bit and worry, it silently works its way through it all. its never out of my sight as I journey, my silent partner is too treasured to let out of my sight at airports or bus stations.
Its a big black brooding looking thing, now with scratches and a few wear marks, its character is one of silent support to my imagination, it just disappears as I shoot. It goes back in the bag, and we move on. it comes out of the bag, I compose, bracket trigger with a timer, 5 shots, it slowly works its way through the captures, and offers one up for inspection, I'll think, adjust look recompose,  and repeat, it will agree and work away. It goes back in the bag, we move on.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Jon Maxim on April 20, 2013, 09:43:38 pm
What a great article and discussions!

Here is my two cents worth (Oh no! We've just abolished the penny in Canada and so I guess that rounds down to 0 - about what my opinion is worth...):

My favorite camera was the Canon F1 bought in the early 70s. It was just the right weight and size and had all the right buttons and controls and no superfluous controls. I was able to take wonderful pictures with it and rarely screwed up. So I guess it had no character.

On the other hand, my father, the professional, had a Contarex. Now that was a camera with CHARACTER. You needed a fork-lift truck to carry it and it had more buttons and dials than I could ever possibly master. By this definition I think all modern day cameras have "character". They all are impossible for me to master. Of the more recent cameras my vote would probably have to go to the Pentax 645D. Nick Devlin is probably not aware that he is responsible for getting me into one, out of it and into my next camera. Although the Nikon D800E is helping me get better shots, it and its modern rivals still overwhelm me with choice.

All of this is to say that I finally realize what character in a camera would mean to me now. I still miss my F1 and 645D. Character in a modern camera would mean that it is different to all the rest of the cameras. For me that means that it should have only those controls I want (pretty well all manual) and nothing more to help me screw up shots. Oh and, of course, the best IQ and glass in the world. Does anyone really think they will ever make a camera like that?

Wistfully yours,
Jon
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: noisejammer on April 20, 2013, 10:03:43 pm
I'm another newbie...

Perhaps the three cameras that really had character for me were the first I used - a Rolleiflex (used for my first image when I was about 5), an Agfa Super Silette (which I was given when I was about 15) and my OM-2 (for my 21st.) The Agfa was drowned in a hiking accident and the Olympus was stolen, but I was able to eventually replace them both. The TLR still works perfectly.

I must confess to be astonished by how easy it was to pick up a Canon DSLR and use it - the interface is so well sorted out that it is wholly intuitive. I suspect that, having achieved this ergonomic excellence, the cameras lost their character.

And then came the X-E1. I've had it since Tuesday and I'm absolutely hooked. Like others, I have the 18-55 and the 35/1.4 but I bought an adapter to fit my OM lenses. The 16FE, 24/2.8 and 55/1.2 all achieve marvelous things... Rather amazingly, it is the only digital camera I've come across that actually benefits from a f/1.2 lens ... I've checked.

Of course, it does have some weirdness. Like everyone else, I'd like to see the AF button moved and I'd like to see the focusing aids from the X100s built in to the firmware. Who knows, I might even get my wish. :)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Riccardo on April 21, 2013, 08:23:07 am
I think the character is not determined by performance (or rather, not only by performance).
It 's something that has to do with the power, in the long term, to stand in front of us with strength and dignity, despite the limitations.
Nikon F, Olympus OM1, Polaroid SX-70 and 190, Linhof Technika, Mamiya 6 and many other cameras  have this ability, after several decades, while we know that none of the current digital cameras has this power, regardless their high performance. In a few years every current model will be forgotten and eclipsed by a more powerful model.
In their essence, digital cameras are expensive and high-performance disposable cameras (but without the character of a "Kodak fun"  ;))
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 21, 2013, 10:50:08 am
It pains me to admit it, but I think you are right: digital cameras are devoid of character because they are not really cameras; deep down in their dark and hidden hearts, they are computers with all the lousy attitude that brings with it.

At the moment, I can't even get into my own website to change some things. For a few days I've been kept out by a crazy system that asks me, over and over again, to log in with user name and password. As I said, over and over again. The best advice I've had so far is to clean the browser's cache, which has been done repeatedly to no avail; I await further instructions from Weebly... they introduced a system for getting into the website via Facebook, and I suspect that this is the cause of the goddam problem: I am not on Facebook and have no intention of getting involved. Maybe the reality is that I will have no option but to join. I hate this manipulation of self, this losing of control.

So yeah, digital cameras don't have it and never can - at least, not to an older generation.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: David S on April 21, 2013, 11:01:32 am
"So yeah, digital cameras don't have it and never can - at least, not to an older generation."

So is that part of the issue of character. What we started with defines what character is, for us, in a camera. Or something like that anyway. And does that then change the way we use the camera?

Dave S

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 21, 2013, 11:35:29 am
"So yeah, digital cameras don't have it and never can - at least, not to an older generation."

So is that part of the issue of character. What we started with defines what character is, for us, in a camera. Or something like that anyway. And does that then change the way we use the camera?

Dave S




I think so - it's much like people: we tend to be towards the characteristics within the people we grew up to know, and find the ways of the young strange - at the kindest - and I think that's the way it ever was, hence the thing about lack of understanding between very separate generations. In music, for example, I withdrew completely from the contemporary thing with the advent of UK punk. I could enjoy some Blondie, but none of the Sex Pistols, Stranglers, etc. etc. that my son used to love. I just couldn't listen: there seemed, to my ears, to be an absence of melody, story, and even a good beat. Perhaps Motown saw the end of listenable. As for dancing - going up and down on a missing-but-imaginary pogo stick isn't any kind of excitement - you don't even need a partner. Perhaps that's key: looking at punks, they must have had little chance of finding one they'd really want, only female (possibly) versions of the same thing as themselves.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: RSL on April 21, 2013, 11:48:17 am
So yeah, digital cameras don't have it and never can - at least, not to an older generation.

Come on, Rob. I doubt there are many, if any, on here from an older generation than the one I come from. I've shot with with everything from a "folding" Kodak that used 220 film, my granddad's 5 x 7 view with glass plates (he even had some flash powder and a flash plate), a Kodak Pony, a Speed Graphic, a 4 x 5 something or other view, an Ikoflex, a Rolliflex, a Canon 7, several Leicas, etc., etc., etc., and others I can't even remember. All of them had character -- many of them had bad character. But nothing I've ever held in my hands could come close to the incredible capabilities built into my three current digitals -- not even in the ballpark.

So what gives a camera "character?" Funkiness? Seems most of the cameras mentioned here as having character are antiques. I suspect that a lot of the "character" folks remember in their antique cameras is actually the character they had as young dogs when they were shooting those cameras. Yep. I have a lingering fondness for whatever it was I was shooting in high school. I can sort of remember the feel of the camera in my hand. But the main reason I can remember is that I was shooting girls, and that was an age at which shooting girls definitely was an activity loaded with "character," character that reflected onto and impregnated (perhaps a questionable term in this context) the tools involved.

Let's face it, when you hold a camera that can shoot 36 mp at ISO 6400 with less noise than you had when you pushed Tri-X to ASA 800, THAT's a camera with CHARACTER!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: David S on April 21, 2013, 12:33:01 pm
"Let's face it, when you hold a camera that can shoot 36 mp at ISO 6400 with less noise than you had when you pushed Tri-X to ASA 800, THAT's a camera with CHARACTER!"

Is that character or technical capability. Maybe they are always linked but I do not relate to capability as character. Because if that is how we define character, then it really isn't the camera but the photograph it produces that has the character.

Dave S

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: RSL on April 21, 2013, 01:28:48 pm
Hey, David, YOU GOT IT! Superb visual art has character, but much like the woman in Kipling's "Betrothed," equipment is only equipment, but a good exposure is a print.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: pegelli on April 21, 2013, 03:40:06 pm
Whoa there, that's one hell of a generalisation.
+1

Character is (1) a very personal opinion and (2) highly judgemental
How about this: the smell of fixer and stop bath was very characteristic, but did it have character?

Still a nice debate  :)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Riccardo on April 21, 2013, 05:06:58 pm
Is the equipment only equipment?  This is precisely the topic of discussion. If the equipment is “only” equipment, in that case no camera has character.
I agree that many of the cameras mentioned here reflect the nostalgia of those who have owned them, but we must not confuse the character with the charm of the old style.
Many cameras have imposed their own character as they appeared and not just now for a kind of myth.
The Olympus OM1 showed character already in the seventies and since it had a real character, that character is still present today, although it cannot compete in performance with today's digital cameras.
The character of the image is one thing, the character of the camera is another thing.
One might think that this story of the character is just smoke, but if we think that an object can have character, then there is no doubt that in the history of photography many cameras distinguish themselves for their character, but none of these is digital.
The advent of digital technology has put the words "the end" to an era: not the era  to produce stunning images full of character, but to produce cameras with character.
(and speaking of pictures, we might ask whether an image printed on RC paper can have character).
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 21, 2013, 05:42:37 pm
I think I'm either out on a float of my own, or haven't understood the concept I thought I was commenting upon: cameras with character.

I'm just back here at the machine having seen the show about Norman Parkinson. It's late, I'm tired, but I can tell you that I saw character again tonight: Hasselblad 500 Series. How I would love to be back in the day, looking into that divine machine and seeing things happen that never happened outside of it. I could say the same about the F, F2,  but what happened there were different dimensions of charm. The square allowed (for me) the development of the finely tuned shape and the Niks had the captured instant. Sometimes, you got both on both. Sometimes.

The ability today to shoot in available darkness doesn't give a camera character: it gives it one dimension of technical superiority. Not the same thing at all. But I neither want nor feel there's any sense in pushing my belief on others: all I can do is say how I feel about things. Should that appear to be sweeping statement, too broad a brush, then that's fine by me. It's how I see it - I don't pretend to speak for anyone else.

Anyway, if I ever manage to sell up and return to the UK, I think I shall abandon digital altogether and return to the fold of the Swedish Square. There, it would be practicable, here not.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: RSL on April 21, 2013, 05:43:08 pm
I think that if you believe a camera body has "character" you probably should check in at Nikonians, where people appear to have bought Nikon D800's to test them rather than to make pictures with them. They carefully calibrate autofocus for each of their lenses, making adjustments of a millimeter or two -- an adjustment that changes in a zoom lens as you zoom.

I do think that a violin has character. But each violin is different and has a different voice -- which is why a Stradivarius will cost you more than two million bucks. There's no other voice with that character. The same thing isn't true of cameras. One Nikon D4 will make the same pictures as another Nikon D4. On the other hand, one 24-70 won't necessarily give you exactly the same result as another 24-70. So I believe a lens might be said to have character.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 21, 2013, 05:52:24 pm
I think that if you believe a camera body has "character" you probably should check in at Nikonians, where people appear to have bought Nikon D800's to test them rather than to make pictures with them. They carefully calibrate autofocus for each of their lenses, making adjustments of a millimeter or two -- an adjustment that changes in a zoom lens as you zoom.

I do think that a violin has character. But each violin is different and has a different voice -- which is why a Stradivarius will cost you more than two million bucks. There's no other voice with that character. The same thing isn't true of cameras. One Nikon D4 will make the same pictures as another Nikon D4. On the other hand, one 24-70 won't necessarily give you exactly the same result as another 24-70. So I believe a lens might be said to have character.

Quite so; and I guess any 500 series or F or F2 would be the same. That only confirms their character as models of camera. I certainly wouldn't say the FM or FM2 had character: they were tinny and the only reason I had them was for higher flash synch. when I had to have that. The character of the camera is in how it feels; that of a lens in how it draws.

Buenas noches!

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Wayland on April 21, 2013, 06:20:42 pm
I started with a Russian brick called a Zenith B, I'm not sure it had character but it had attitude.

I loved my old Canon A1 more than my Pentax MX or my Nikon FE.

I had a little Ricoh 500 something that I enjoyed using.

My Broni ETR-S never really had character or any of the Hassleblads I used.

My Cambo was just industrial but the MPP had something about it.

The Canon DSLRs are like plastic handled axes, work well but nothing you could love.

When my G10 broke down I bought a Fuji X10 to replace it as a pocket notepad. I liked the look of it and went against all the online grumbling.

I have to say it's put a lot of the fun back into photography for me. It's a long way from being my best camera but using it puts a smile on my face.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: bevspics on April 21, 2013, 06:55:02 pm
hassy superwide c
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Hmm1000 on April 21, 2013, 07:12:46 pm
Yashica FR (oddly better than a Contax RTS, which looked so much better - and both benefitted from the Zeis lenses)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ray on April 21, 2013, 08:06:32 pm
I remember some years ago participating in a forum devoted to Canon cameras, where I had some lengthy discussions on certain technical matters.

One characteristic of some of these Canon devotees, which quite surprised me, was their total fascination with their own equipment. I recall one thread, which continued for several pages, where members would post images of their cameras and lenses, page after page.

Not only that, they would even post images of the boxes their equipment came in. For such people, I guess cameras not only have character, they are like lovable pieces of jewelry.

I was surprised because I've always viewed cameras as rather inadequate tools with less character than a lump of black coal. I buy a new one only when it offers an innovative and useful feature and/or better technical performance at an affordable price and convenient weight.

In the days of film, the major, innovative features which inspired me to buy a new camera were (1) the introduction of through-the-lens metering as in the Pentax Spotmatic. (2) the introduction of autofocussing, as in the Minolta Maxxum 7000, and (3) the introduction of lens image stabilization, as in the Canon 100-400 IS.

In the digital age, the major innovative features that have inspired me to buy a new camera have been the substantial increases in sensor resolution, tonal range, dynamic range and high-ISO performance, coupled with the bonus benefits of LiveView, AF fine tuning, fast frame rates, auto-exposure bracketing and video capability etc.

I look forward to the next major development which might be a change in the Bayer type CFA. I've always been a bit concerned about the concept of having color filters in front of the sensor which, on average, discard about half the total amount of light impinging upon the sensor. It doesn't seem a particularly efficient method or organizing things, considering that photography is all about light.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Josiah Davidson on April 21, 2013, 11:47:58 pm
Hey Kip,
You have surely identified a camera with CHARACTER. The new fixed-lens Merrill series cameras are oozing with character. Not by any means a do-all or do-anything camera, but instead a camera with a clear purpose and on a mission. It doesn't adapt to you, but rather you to it. If you accept it for what it is and learn to work within its character, it rewards you in spades!
I enthusiastically vote for your nomination.
Dave
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 22, 2013, 03:50:46 am
I started with a Russian brick called a Zenith B, I'm not sure it had character but it had attitude.

I loved my old Canon A1 more than my Pentax MX or my Nikon FE.

I had a little Ricoh 500 something that I enjoyed using.

My Broni ETR-S never really had character or any of the Hassleblads I used.

My Cambo was just industrial but the MPP had something about it.The Canon DSLRs are like plastic handled axes, work well but nothing you could love.

When my G10 broke down I bought a Fuji X10 to replace it as a pocket notepad. I liked the look of it and went against all the online grumbling.

I have to say it's put a lot of the fun back into photography for me. It's a long way from being my best camera but using it puts a smile on my face.



They sure did: avoirdupois!

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 22, 2013, 12:14:44 pm
But, Rob, thats exactly what you did!

 ;)


Only from my own perspective though; which automatically turns it into opinion, of course.

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Wayland on April 22, 2013, 01:07:22 pm

They sure did: avoirdupois!

Rob C


(http://www.wayland.me.uk/assets/images/1_smiley_biggrin.gif)  You're not kidding, it's certainly a lump to carry around.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 22, 2013, 02:08:30 pm

(http://www.wayland.me.uk/assets/images/1_smiley_biggrin.gif)  You're not kidding, it's certainly a lump to carry around.

Did you ever come across an English photographer called Rob Talbot? He had some success with picture books, one of which I bought, English Landscapes,SBN 0297 83475 4, and then (he) vanished off the radar - at least, I can't find him.

Looking at a lot of television documentaries about Britain, I conclude that the ideal way to enjoy it is by air on a good summer's day. Those endlessly repeated journeys by Portillo on his railway rides illustrate this well: from ground level there's not always a heap to see, but from the air, even an ordinary old railroad track has glamour!

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rifleman on April 22, 2013, 02:55:39 pm
Character? My dream camera is..... No.

Story,

My first full frame digi was a 5D. I loved it. It took interesting pix in most places, had the buttons in the right place for me, particularly the rear thumbwheel, was great in the dark! Super at night.

After some 20,000 shots, I upgraded. 5D mark 2

I never got on with the camera from day one. The controls were "wrong". What I was seeing wasnt happening in the camera. There were tech issues too-the Wft unit and the Gps malfunctioned at odd intervals, usually by destroying the gps ("Its Canons fault-its Garmins fault")

After 40,000 shots, Now I have a 1 Dx.

I still use the 5D. Often with a small or wide prime. Its a nice camera.


It has character.

I sold the mark2

To be fair, I have exhibited prints from all 3, without much technical comment from visitors or peers. Its just that the 5D is a nice camera, that produces pix that I like to see. And so does the 1  Dx, maybe its character will build as I use it more.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Wayland on April 22, 2013, 05:22:03 pm
Did you ever come across an English photographer called Rob Talbot? He had some success with picture books, one of which I bought, English Landscapes,SBN 0297 83475 4, and then (he) vanished off the radar - at least, I can't find him.

Looking at a lot of television documentaries about Britain, I conclude that the ideal way to enjoy it is by air on a good summer's day. Those endlessly repeated journeys by Portillo on his railway rides illustrate this well: from ground level there's not always a heap to see, but from the air, even an ordinary old railroad track has glamour!

Rob C

I've got one of his books on my shelf but I don't think I've ever met him. (You never know because I've talked to a lot of photographers on location over the years without always getting their name.)

Britain is a highly populated place and the railways tend to go through some of the most crowded places.

The roads take you to some quieter spots but if you really want to find the best spots then you need to get off the beaten track a bit.

That's part of the reason I'm lightening my kit a bit these days.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ray on April 22, 2013, 05:44:37 pm
I still use the 5D. Often with a small or wide prime. Its a nice camera.

It has character.

Niceness is generally not a term used to describe character. In fact, niceness generally implies a lack of character.
However, the 5D does have a rather upsetting characteristic, and that's banding in the deep shadows.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Peter McLennan on April 22, 2013, 07:45:24 pm

and while I am on flights of fancy, check out Chris Hadfield's latest moonrise photo (https://twitter.com/Cmdr_Hadfield/status/325026285313208320/photo/1) (a very sweet tweet)

He's just posted a video showing how he shoots and what he uses.  Pretty neat hand-holding a 400 f2.8 in microgravity.  

http://nikonrumors.com/2013/04/22/astronaut-chris-hadfield-how-to-take-photos-from-the-iss.aspx/ (http://nikonrumors.com/2013/04/22/astronaut-chris-hadfield-how-to-take-photos-from-the-iss.aspx/)

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: leeonmaui on April 22, 2013, 08:22:25 pm
that's one photo workshop I would pay to attend!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Wayland on April 23, 2013, 04:56:46 am
I think the deposit would be more than I could afford...
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: arcaswissi on April 23, 2013, 08:06:40 am
Sigma Dp1 - 3 Merrill. The first cameras since I digital time really impressing me. Enough quirks to be characterful :) but the quality of the files reminds me good old analog large format. I like them. On my flickr page I´ve some recent photos of my Merrills.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/arcaswissi (http://www.flickr.com/photos/arcaswissi)

The attached photo of Dp3m
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 23, 2013, 09:58:32 am
Sigma Dp1 - 3 Merrill. The first cameras since I digital time really impressing me. Enough quirks to be characterful :) but the quality of the files reminds me good old analog large format. I like them. On my flickr page I´ve some recent photos of my Merrills.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/arcaswissi (http://www.flickr.com/photos/arcaswissi)

The attached photo of Dp3m


I don't care about your camera, but I love your photograph.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: GEOFFREYJAMES on April 23, 2013, 04:04:20 pm
I decided I would become a photographer at 40. Apart from an M4,  which I used for holiday slides,  my only camera was a 1926 KODAK Panoram,  a camera the size of a shoe box,  with a scanning lens,  fixed speed (1/30th) and a fixed aperture (f22).  Roll film for it was no longer made ,  so I began by cutting down 11x14 sheet film into strips of 10 3/4 by 3 3/4 inches.  I had to load the camera in a changing bag,  one at a time.  If you used the camera on a tripod, which I did,  the little prism viewer on the top (which gave you a sense of the vertical "cut" ) was useless  The ends of the scan could be accurately figured out from incised lines on  top of the camera.   Eventually Kodak made me a special order,  with my own yellow boxes.   I should say the man who sold me the camera -- for $275 -- had persuaded some one who knew how grind lenses to take a Berlin Dagor,  reduce the diameter of the elements,  and re-assemble them in the Kodak barrel.  I worked with this primitive machine for about ten years.  I did a book on Italian gardens,  one on the Roman Campagna, and one on strange French gardens just before the revolution.  I submitted contact prints from the Kodak to the Guggenheim Foundation,  and they gave me a fellowship.  and there are prints from the Panoram in a bunch of museums, including MOMA.  I had repair guys in Rome,  London and NY who could repair the camera.  On a good day I could take about ten pictures.  It concentrated the mind,  and, yes,  it had character. 
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 23, 2013, 04:10:13 pm
I decided I would become a photographer at 40. Apart from an M4,  which I used for holiday slides,  my only camera was a 1926 KODAK Panoram,  a camera the size of a shoe box,  with a scanning lens,  fixed speed (1/30th) and a fixed aperture (f22).  Roll film for it was no longer made ,  so I began by cutting down 11x14 sheet film into strips of 10 3/4 by 3 3/4 inches.  I had to load the camera in a changing bag,  one at a time.  If you used the camera on a tripod, which I did,  the little prism viewer on the top (which gave you a sense of the vertical "cut" ) was useless  The ends of the scan could be accurately figured out from incised lines on  top of the camera.   Eventually Kodak made me a special order,  with my own yellow boxes.   I should say the man who sold me the camera -- for $275 -- had persuaded some one who knew how grind lenses to take a Berlin Dagor,  reduce the diameter of the elements,  and re-assemble them in the Kodak barrel.  I worked with this primitive machine for about ten years.  I did a book on Italian gardens,  one on the Roman Campagna, and one on strange French gardens just before the revolution.   I submitted contact prints from the Kodak to the Guggenheim Foundation,  and they gave me a fellowship.  and there are prints from the Panoram in a bunch of museums, including MOMA.  I had repair guys in Rome,  London and NY who could repair the camera.  On a good day I could take about ten pictures.  It concentrated the mind,  and, yes,  it had character. 


And I thought that I was getting old...

Image: Last year at Marienbad?

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Peter McLennan on April 23, 2013, 05:12:35 pm

I don't care about your camera, but I love your photograph.

Rob C

Agreed.  Beautiful!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: image66 on April 24, 2013, 05:21:27 pm
My camera of character is one that I'm still using after more than two and a half decades. The Olympus OM-2S. Granted, it sees only occasional use since the kit is upgraded to the OM-3Ti and a pair of OM-4T bodies, but it's the one that has kept me shooting film all these years.

Maybe, it's the unique sound? Maybe, it's the viewfinder with the left-side digitized analog display? Maybe, it is the hyper-simplified mode-switch that allows you to effectively have three exposure settings at your fingertip? Maybe, it's the spot-metering mode?

I don't know, but when I just want to walk around with a camera, it's the one I instantly gravitate to. It's so brassed up that I can't use it for client use as it scares people, but it is the one camera that will never be sold.

The new Fuji cameras do have character, but are they lifetime cameras? My Olympus E-1 probably is to some extent, but I haven't seen a single other digital camera that is anything more than the flavor of the year.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Mike Dunbar on April 26, 2013, 12:56:00 pm
Hello Michael,

Although I did read all the technobabble about the Fujifilm X-E1 I bought one this week on the back of your valuation of it as a photographer.

You were right.

Thanks.
 :)
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rhossydd on April 26, 2013, 01:50:01 pm
For me the most obvious 'camera of character' I've owned(and still do) is my Olympus OM1.
Everything about it was just right and all the controls fell to hand like no other camera I've owned. Anyone that's owned one won't need to be told how wonderful they are.

A second favourite no one else seems to have enjoyed much is the original Polaroid SX70. Quirky, weird and often quite remarkable pictures, if awfully expensive to use. I just hope the impossible project continue to evolve their film for it to the point Polaroid achieved and be worth using regularly again.

All my DSLR cameras Canon EOSs seem rather devoid of that particular appeal of handling, although they deliver great results.
The only digital camera so far I've tried that really has appealing character is the Fuji X-Pro1, which comes close to my other old film favourite, a Minolta CLE outfit I wish I'd never sold.

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: FrankG on April 29, 2013, 02:04:57 pm
For me it's a Rolleiflex TLR - hands down !

Waist level viewing, quieter than a whisper (leaf shutter), incredible IQ (xenotar or planar lenses), great handling & so well balanced... I can't say enough....best camera with character I ever owned.
I've had Plaubel, Sinar, Pentax 67, Nikon, Sony, Canon....
I've been on a quest to find the modern digital equivalent to the rollei which obviously doesn't exist...but this thread is a great help in seeing what's out there for me to supplement my dslr with (5D2).
I've tried a sony 5n (loved the flip screen), now have the rx100 (love the pocketability), and have taken many fave pics with both but neither quite 'hit the spot'.
The xpro-1 and the xe-1 are strong contenders (would love a side by side comparison if anyone has a link?) but i hear there's a new Nex7 in the pipeline.....
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 29, 2013, 03:53:24 pm
For me it's a Rolleiflex TLR - hands down !



My first experience with Rollei was via an aunt's Rolleicord Va (she also bought Vogue and Harper's Bazaar and that lit the fires), a works Rolleiflex and, finally, my own second-hand Rolleiflex T with 3.5/75 Tessar, and it wasn't part of the same family - well, I suppose it was, but felt very much the poor relation, the one left off the Christmas lists. By the time I could buy a 'proper' one I'd moved to Hasselblad. Years later, I was temporarily tempted by the Helmut Newton one that was introduced... but far too expensive for what it was - I think it cost about two grand (pounds) then, and a fixed lens didn't make sense when I already had that format well covered.

The Pentax 67... beautifully made but full of problems, the main one being very low synch. and the loading/unloading was always a frightening moment. Mirror/shutter bounce... so, not icon, for me, but memorable. Mine lived on a huge Gitzo.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: FrankG on April 29, 2013, 05:01:01 pm
My 6x7 pentax was also welded to a huge heavy Gitzo :-) Great image quality.
The Rollei was also occasionally on a tripod but also very comfortable hand holding.
I guess for everyone, & what this thread is about, it's what 'works for you & your personality & quest', i.e. what kind of pictures you want to make & what the best tool for the job is.
I am trying to replicate the Rollei experience - futile.
So many choices - all are interesting & I wish I could try them all out - the DPM series 1,2 & 3. The Fuji's x100s, xe-1, x-pro1.The Sony rx1 & upcoming nex7n?
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: kencameron on April 29, 2013, 07:47:24 pm
My first SLR had character - a Practica (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Praktica). Solid East German engineering to raise hard currency through sales to the capitalists. It went well with my Duffle coat and compensated for my failure to convincingly grow my hair long. My first digital camera had character - a Nikon Coolpix 950 (https://www.google.com.au/search?q=nikon+coolpix+950&hl=en&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=cQV_UbkYiPGIB-3YgZgI&ved=0CFIQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=1113), with the rotating lens and sensor unit, an excellent design  which I was sorry to see Nikon abandon. I dropped it into an estuary while climbing out of a kayak. My current Sigma DP2 Merrill has character. The idiot savant of contemporary cameras, challenged in daily life but very good at  its speciality.

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on April 29, 2013, 08:15:12 pm
As a school boy I used to lust after a Praktica IVb - I ended up with an Exakta Varex IIa which I loved dearly when I had it.  Traded it on on my first Hasselblad eventually.

Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rhossydd on April 30, 2013, 03:20:11 am
My first SLR had character - a Practica.
Yes, my first SLR was a Practica too. It did have character, but it's wasn't the sort appealing character that Michael was referring to in the OP!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: RobbieV on April 30, 2013, 02:34:27 pm
Character is whatever you remember about the camera when you're done shooting for the day.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on April 30, 2013, 04:01:09 pm
Character is whatever you remember about the camera when you're done shooting for the day.


Then none of mine (cameras) had character, I only remembered the girls. I think they all had character.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rhossydd on April 30, 2013, 05:32:19 pm
Character is whatever you remember about the camera when you're done shooting for the day.
For me, character is what make me want to pick a particular camera and shoot with it. It's the factor that makes the hardware less intrusive to what I'm looking at and trying to capture.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Pete_G on April 30, 2013, 06:03:00 pm
My first SLR had character - a Practica (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Praktica). Solid East German engineering to raise hard currency through sales to the capitalists. It went well with my Duffle coat and compensated for my failure to convincingly grow my hair long. My first digital camera had character - a Nikon Coolpix 950 (https://www.google.com.au/search?q=nikon+coolpix+950&hl=en&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=cQV_UbkYiPGIB-3YgZgI&ved=0CFIQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=1113), with the rotating lens and sensor unit, an excellent design  which I was sorry to see Nikon abandon. I dropped it into an estuary while climbing out of a kayak. My current Sigma DP2 Merrill has character. The idiot savant of contemporary cameras, challenged in daily life but very good at  its speciality.



Yeah, a Practica was my first REAL camera, after a Halina 35X. I bought it new, and can still remember the smell of it. A Meritar lens, if I remember. FWIW I too have a DP2 Merrill now, not quite as mad as the Practica, but almost.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Ziuko on May 06, 2013, 09:22:38 am
Interesting mix of cameras.  I ws predominantly interested in travel so mine were of necessity small and rugged.
I started with a Rollei 35 led fully manual camera, all through uni and travelling around america, I think it eventually died, I then picked up a second hand OM1 with a 50 mm f1.4 lens, for a big trip trip to Peru, where I shot every thing on Kodak Chrome 64 for the quality. Those two fully manual cameras were what connected me to photography,
The Rollei was manual flash as well, but I got used to using it, I guess I just got used to assessing what aperture to set for the flash even when drunk at Uni !

I traded the OM1 for an OM2sp but it was never quite the same, and then I got OM4Ti which was superbly built, but I still reckon the best pictures I got were with he OM1 and a 50mm f1.8 lens. I have an E 300 which has never inspired and is left in the cupboard these days in favour of the i-phone due to convenience.  But the new Fuji cameras have peaked my interest.

I think  the manufacturers have  over complicated photography, after all for a given lens and ISO, its shutter speed and aperture to get the exposure you want plus focus.  I think what I liked about the OM1 was the analogue exposure metre , the needle moving gave a feel for the exposure effect of the change in aperture etc. Also one 50 mm lens made you think and frame subjects more carefully.  I have been waiting for a full frame compact that did the basics well .
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rhossydd on May 06, 2013, 09:47:14 am
Welcome to Lula :-)
I think what I liked about the OM1 was the analogue exposure metre , the needle moving gave a feel for the exposure effect of the change in aperture etc.
I was thinking about this when I posted above.
There really is something very straight forward and intuitive about the OM1's metering. In addition the perfect placing of shutter speed and aperture controls, all immediately to hand, made it all completely natural and fast to use.
Quote
I have been waiting for a full frame compact that did the basics well.
I had and loved Rollei 35Bs too.
Unfortunately I don't think we'll ever see anything quite like a digital Rollei 35/Minox35/Fuji Super mini. It must be possible, but the marketeers just won't see a camera like this worth building. Maybe one day when the current madness of development pace slows down as the market saturates and there's less technological development possible, they'll spot the opportunity.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Metsolve on May 14, 2013, 05:23:55 am
In 1964 it was the Yashica D twin lens reflex.  As a young trainee, I would have preferred the Rolleiflex T f2.8 that my boss used but my budget didn't come close.  I learned the trade with that Yashica and put hundreds of rolls through it.  It never let me down.  The lens was slightly sharper than the Rollei too.  Much to my boss's surprise .  Then as now. The lens mattered more than anything else.

Many cameras followed including Linoff, Leica and Pentax. None really grabbed me until in 1973 I bought a Nikonos to try underwater photography.  Dead simple, manual everything, great viewfinder and the best wind on lever ever designed.  I found as a general, go anywhere, rugged picture taker, it was perfect and we were inseparable for years.

2013 and I just bought my fifth digital camera.  It may just be my third true love!  I wasn't expecting much of the Nikon V1 but it was so cheap, hardly more than the price of the two lenses that came with it and I wanted to try the EVIL idea without spending a fortune.  Apart from the price, the other brands still seem too big.  Not the bodies, the lenses.  I wanted a grab and go, travel alterative, to my full frame outfit that is just not portable enough. (no character either).   For the last few weeks I have been walking around with the V1 and 30-110 around my neck and the 10-30 in my pocket.  I've made prints as big as my 3880 can manage and I'm very happy.  The size and weight are just right.  Speed an accuracy is very impressive.  There are a few warts of course, most characters have them.   I took Michaels advice and put a piece of gaffer tape over the 'mode' dial.  It works well.  The settings I have settled on, after a bit of trial and error, are as follows; Centre weighted AE, auto ISO A3200 and exposure mode on manual.  This gives me full control of shutter speed and aperture and the camera takes care of exposure via ISO.  Of course I have to guess what ISO the camera is choosing but I can do that well enough after all these years.  I am not worried about high ISO noise with this camera anyway.  Its fine.  I can tell you, after selling photos in the local gallery for years, if a patron likes an image, a bit of noise doesn't matter.  Only photographers notice it anyway.  Normal people only see the art and noise has to be pointed out. Then they peer closely and say "Oh yes, I see."  Audiophiles don't listen to music, only gramophones.  Photographers need to watch out for a similar trap.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on May 14, 2013, 06:40:05 am
In 1964 it was the Yashica D twin lens reflex.  As a young trainee, I would have preferred the Rolleiflex T f2.8 that my boss used but my budget didn't come close. 


Never heard of that, I had a T and it was a 3.5/75 Tessar... not a great model of the Rollei, but better than nothing, and second-hand (at least), all I could afford at the time.

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: WalterEG on May 14, 2013, 06:57:21 am
Audiophiles don't listen to music, only gramophones.


Ooooh, I'll have to poach that one.  Goes hand in hand with my comment about cameras and pianos.  "I a guy buys a piano, he owns a piano.  If a guy buys a camera,he's a photographer."
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: kencameron on May 14, 2013, 08:12:28 am
The settings I have settled on, after a bit of trial and error, are as follows; Centre weighted AE, auto ISO A3200 and exposure mode on manual.  This gives me full control of shutter speed and aperture and the camera takes care of exposure via ISO. 
Interesting setting. I will give it a try on a similar camera. It seems to take a bit of a leap of faith to trust ISO 3200, but I guess that just shows my age.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on May 14, 2013, 11:51:12 am

Ooooh, I'll have to poach that one.  Goes hand in hand with my comment about cameras and pianos.  "I a guy buys a piano, he owns a piano.  If a guy buys a camera,he's a photographer."


The way I heard it was: If a guy buys a piano, he's a penist...

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Paul Sumi on May 14, 2013, 05:37:04 pm
Life-long amateur photographer.  My first "real" camera was the Minolta SRT-101, and it was the Kodak DC260 that got me into digital.

But it was the Olympus E-10 that sealed the deal, character-wise.  It was the first camera since my Minoltas that whispered, "let's go play," and I credit this camera with resurrecting a joy of photography that had previously fallen to the level of mere holiday and vacation snaps.

Since then, I have shot with a series of Canon DSLRs; very competent imaging tools when I need to "get the shot," but soulless - none of them invite me out to play.

These days, the Fuji X-Pro 1 is my "play" camera.  Part of the appeal is retro - a real shutter speed dial and aperture ring, even if the manual focusing is fly by wire.  Not sure if it reaches the same level as the E-10, but I really enjoy shooting with it.

Paul
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: wolfnowl on May 14, 2013, 06:11:35 pm
An Argus A-four (my dad's) was my first 'real' camera.  Four f/stops, 5 shutter speeds (including B), no batteries, no lightmeter, no rangefinder, fixed lens.  I just about wore out what was left of it.
(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3159/2857293255_9cdb4c9f22.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hamwithcam/2857293255/)
Argus a-four (35mm) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/hamwithcam/2857293255/) by HamWithCam (http://www.flickr.com/people/hamwithcam/), on Flickr

A Pentax Spotmatic-F was my first camera with interchangeable lenses; that opened a whole new world for me.

I've got a dozen or so old cameras, all purchased for different reasons.  I still like my Yashica Mat-124G for what it means to use it.

Mike.

P.S. And if I may, Kodachrome 25.  Definitely a film with character.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Metsolve on May 14, 2013, 07:02:14 pm

Never heard of that, I had a T and it was a 3.5/75 Tessar... not a great model of the Rollei, but better than nothing, and second-hand (at least), all I could afford at the time.

Rob C
Sorry Rob.  It was 50 years ago.  Probably an F not T.  I'm sure f2.8 is right though.
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Rob C on May 15, 2013, 04:00:54 am
Sorry Rob.  It was 50 years ago.  Probably an F not T.  I'm sure f2.8 is right though.


Now I envy you; yep, f2.8 Planar and Xenotar were the choices, I think, but since they were so far out of reach I didn't pay too much attention... They brought out a Helmut Newton-branded one for a while; it was even more ridiculously priced, which just goes to show you that MF pricing had always been subject to grandiose imaginations.

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: MAN on June 18, 2013, 07:03:42 pm
Thanks for the article. I even learned something that I did not find in the XPro-1 manual. Which reminds me of the quirky absence of an index in the manual.

I love the fact that I can use my Leica 90m summicron lens and use it effectively on the Fugi.

I do find it annoying that the 18-55 zoom lens protrudes very much into the optical viewfinder, especially when using the hood. The Leica lens with hood does so only moderately. Fugi needs to make the lens offset or the camera wider to separate the rangefinder optical viewfinder more from the lens.

Ultimately I would love to see them design the full frame rangefinder. If you have any pull with Fugi designers, perhaps you would consider this complaint. I do not like the 35mm format. I am amazed that this format from the video industry has had such success in the still camera. I much prefer the 5:4 format. I hope you will plug a 35:28 mm sensor - more data, better portrait format and more compatible with lenses designed for a 36:24 mm format.

Thanks again!
Title: Re: A Matter of Character
Post by: Deardorff on November 30, 2013, 03:52:03 am
Might as well get this one going a bit.

In small cameras, the Leica M4, Pentax Spotmatic, Nikon F, Nikon F3, Canon F1, Contax G2.

Medium format, Rolleiflex, Hasselblad 501.

Large Format, Deardorff 5x7 and 8x10 as  well as Linhof Technika.