Luminous Landscape Forum

The Art of Photography => User Critiques => Topic started by: cjogo on February 23, 2013, 12:34:13 AM

Title: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 23, 2013, 12:34:13 AM
Up to a second floor apartment ...great architecture  ;)
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 23, 2013, 01:38:51 AM
Composition is very satisfying to me. There are curves all over the place but the subject (the stairwell as your title proves), being black and more dominant than the other tones in the image, holds them all together well. To my mind, there is a clear start (railing at bottom centre) and a satisfying end (railing in the void in the top of the image).

Some may suggest toning down the glare in the window but that is not too bad for me because it takes the eye back from the end of the spiral at the top, down to the start of the railing at the bottom and you end up going round the picture in a continuous loop with no need or desire to exit.

Great shot.
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: wolfnowl on February 23, 2013, 01:41:41 AM
Nicely done.

Mike.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: seamus finn on February 23, 2013, 06:13:01 AM
Fine composition. I'd love to see a human figure in it, maybe a silhouette, starting to climb the stairs, or maybe disappearing at the top, but then, that might make it a cliche.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on February 23, 2013, 09:34:32 AM
Lovely shot just as is. (Adding people would spoil it, IMHO.)
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Heinz on February 23, 2013, 09:57:32 AM
I like the angle, different. Nice image.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: seamus finn on February 23, 2013, 10:16:48 AM
Quote
Lovely shot just as is. (Adding people would spoil it, IMHO.

On reflection, I think you're right, Eric.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: RedwoodGuy on February 23, 2013, 11:31:56 AM
Up to a second floor apartment ...great architecture  ;)
These kinds of photographs are even more common than wet pavement. Usually they are shot from above, with a mysterious person dressed in black climbing the stairs. So when a photographer can pull it off, as you have here, it is really refreshing. There's simplicity, rhythm and elegance here that is a pure joy to behold.

The lighting is warm, beautiful and looks truthful. Was there a lot of photoshop done here?

The blacks in here are velvety smooth and magnificently placed in the composition, which is smooth, flowing, and graceful. There are a million ways to come away from here with a boring photograph, you avoided them all. For me, this shows the artist as well as if you were in a reflection.

The photo definitely communicates a lyrical feeling to me by both the composition and the handling of the light. I'm usually not that interested to "compare" pictures of one photographer, but in this case, I think this is one of the best photos you have posted since I have been here.

Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: RSL on February 23, 2013, 11:43:38 AM
Anybody think of Atget when he looks at this? I do. Very nice, Jogo.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: RedwoodGuy on February 23, 2013, 11:46:14 AM
Oh, let's all follow the leader now. I do! I do! I do!
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: RSL on February 23, 2013, 11:48:25 AM
No kidding. Do you even have a clue who Atget was, RG? Remember: you're different. You don't need to go look at any dead guy's photographs, so if you admit that you know, you'll sort of have stepped out of character.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Chris Calohan on February 23, 2013, 11:51:37 AM
Brevity:

I like how the lines in the curves combined with the verticals all serve to push the image upward.

Using the black of the rail against the softness of the walls and the brightness of the window provide cohesiveness to line, shape and color

Two niggles: the over brightness on the ceiling and the spot on the left wall.

Well, a third: I cannot see the artist in this shot. Sorry, I could not resist a little RGism.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 23, 2013, 12:25:08 PM
T

The lighting is warm, beautiful and looks truthful. Was there a lot of photoshop done here?




Not much CS work on this one ... the exposure was just under a minute -- I placed the zones where I wanted them to fall and then processed the film to follow ...  thanks all for viewing  ;)
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: RedwoodGuy on February 23, 2013, 12:26:49 PM
Brevity:
 

Well, a third: I cannot see the artist in this shot. Sorry, I could not resist a little RGism.
Well, continue it as long as you enjoy it.  
You can't see the artist, because you don't know what to look for. You don't know what to look for because you have no artistic nature in you. Sitting behind a computer working photoshop levers is not going to instill useful talents in you, unless you are shooting for becoming a video gamer.

What is ironic is that you continue to amuse yourself with this idea, under the tutelage of a guy professing that everyone must "read the books," and somehow you have read none by any artists?

Carry on now, Professor.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Chris Calohan on February 23, 2013, 12:43:05 PM
Well, continue it as long as you enjoy it.  
You can't see the artist, because you don't know what to look for. You don't know what to look for because you have no artistic nature in you. Sitting behind a computer working photoshop levers is not going to instill useful talents in you, unless you are shooting for becoming a video gamer.

What is ironic is that you continue to amuse yourself with this idea, under the tutelage of a guy professing that everyone must "read the books," and somehow you have read none by any artists?

Carry on now, Professor.

Do you make this stuff up? Where does this come from? I may not read the same books as you, but I can assure you I've read tons about other artists. Whether I chose to quote them or acknowledge their presence is my choice, and therefore not for you to surmise as to the why?

I'll bet money, marbles and chalk I can paint better than you, sculpt, throw a pot, cast, do a nice encaustic, make a salt, albumen, platinum or gum print or just about anything under the sun artistically better than you and that includes shooting photographs. You're a hack who is by the very definition given to you recently, a troll. You're boring.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 23, 2013, 01:51:55 PM
Oh, let's all follow the leader now. I do! I do! I do!

RG, I don't know why you wind members up like this. The poster whose comment you are referring to, merely said that the image of this thread reminded him of the work of another photographer.

What is wrong with that?

I did not see any suggestion that we should mimic another photographer and I am amazed that you did.

In any event, your comment is expressed flippantly, in my opinion, and is an attack on another member's comment. Would be great if you could avoid doing that and stick to comments which do not denigrate other reviewers or their comments.

You could have discussed your apparent concern by asking if the other poster was suggesting we should adopt the style of the named photographer or you could have said you hoped the other poster was not suggesting we should copy the style of the named photographer.

Please revert to your helpful critiques and do not denigrate other reviewers or their critiques.
Roger
PS  I do not want to be the critique police but I will comment on the ways I think members are undermining the purpose of this forum.


Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 23, 2013, 01:59:46 PM
Brevity:

I like how the lines in the curves combined with the verticals all serve to push the image upward.

Using the black of the rail against the softness of the walls and the brightness of the window provide cohesiveness to line, shape and color

Two niggles: the over brightness on the ceiling and the spot on the left wall.

Well, a third: I cannot see the artist in this shot. Sorry, I could not resist a little RGism.

Chris, why did you do this? Did anyone ask you to précis RG's critique? Did any one say they had trouble reading RG's critique? I am blown away at your rudeness.

Why do you think critiquers have to express themselves as you would (assuming you had the same thoughts)? What makes you think your words are better than RG's or that your short critique is better? Are you saying short critiques are always better than long ones?

What gives you the right to decide that some of RG's comments are superfluous?

Please stop attacking other reviewers and their comments.
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Rob C on February 23, 2013, 02:09:52 PM
Fine composition. I'd love to see a human figure in it, maybe a silhouette, starting to climb the stairs, or maybe disappearing at the top, but then, that might make it a cliche.


Not unless she's a naked cliché, in which case, I imagine she'd be a clichée. I always enjoyed the thrills of schoolboy French - much as did Helmut Newton his ladies on staircases. Well, to be precise, his images of ladies, naked or otherwise, on staircases; his enjoyment or otherwise of such ladies is beyond my ability to know, but as I understand his better-half was often with him, perhaps the question is redundant or the enjoyment was, at best, a hurried one.

Rob C
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 23, 2013, 02:14:29 PM
Well, continue it as long as you enjoy it.  
You can't see the artist, because you don't know what to look for. You don't know what to look for because you have no artistic nature in you. Sitting behind a computer working photoshop levers is not going to instill useful talents in you, unless you are shooting for becoming a video gamer.

What is ironic is that you continue to amuse yourself with this idea, under the tutelage of a guy professing that everyone must "read the books," and somehow you have read none by any artists?

Carry on now, Professor.

RG, I understand how insulted you felt when someone rudely tried to rephrase your critique but that insult does not justify, in my opinion, your direct attack on the reviewer.

Sure, he started it but you did not suffer any damage that you needed to retaliate for. The "he started it" excuse tries to justify one's own poor behaviour by reference to another's poor behaviour and should be restricted to the kindergarten playground.

I am sure you know how you could have responded politely without dragging yourself down to his level.

You could have even said: "Thank you for writing your 'version' of my critique. I don't know why you felt you had the right or need to do so but please never do it again without my permission. Your version does not express what I had to say."
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 23, 2013, 02:16:00 PM
... PS  I do not want to be the critique police but I will comment on the ways I think members are undermining the purpose of this forum.

Finally, after so many years, someone to reveal to us the true purpose of this forum. And it took him only 27 posts to figure that out.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 23, 2013, 02:18:38 PM
... Please stop attacking other reviewers and their comments.
Roger

You sound like a reasonably intelligent man... you surely can see the irony in the above, can't you?
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Rob C on February 23, 2013, 02:22:55 PM
Be gentle, Slobodan; he spends life like a bat at rest. Or playing rugby. It comes with the territory.

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 23, 2013, 02:34:34 PM
Do you make this stuff up? Where does this come from? I may not read the same books as you, but I can assure you I've read tons about other artists. Whether I chose to quote them or acknowledge their presence is my choice, and therefore not for you to surmise as to the why?

I'll bet money, marbles and chalk I can paint better than you, sculpt, throw a pot, cast, do a nice encaustic, make a salt, albumen, platinum or gum print or just about anything under the sun artistically better than you and that includes shooting photographs. You're a hack who is by the very definition given to you recently, a troll. You're boring.

Here we go again, two adults (I assume) locked in mortal combat, rolling on the kindergarten floor, desperate to wound each other and why? What is the fight about? It's about a major catastrophe on this forum!

What is the catastrophe? It started when one member had the rudeness (in my opinion) to publish an abbreviated version of another member's detailed critique. The member whose critique was abbreviated naturally felt insulted and responded by attacking the other's credentials, and so on.

How will the war end? I don't know but I do know that nothing good for the forum will come out of it and that much time, better spent on the purpose of this forum, will be consumed by the war. Will anyone "win"? Of course, not! They have both damaged their reputations by engaging in this pointless exercise.

Could the war have been prevented? Yes! If the abbreviator had not attacked the critiquer by commenting adversely on the critique, the critiquer would not have felt the need to attack the abbreviator. Secondly, if the first reviewer had chosen not to respond to the abbreviator by attacking the abbreviator, the war would not have got off the ground.

We cannot control what others do to us but we can choose how we respond. Please stop making comments which denigrate other members or their posts. If someone does this, please do not respond by denigrating other members or their posts.
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Chris Calohan on February 23, 2013, 03:10:09 PM
At least you could have had the decency to let RG make the first rebuttal, but as acting critique dectective, I guess you had to make a comment to show your authority.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: William Walker on February 23, 2013, 03:46:36 PM
Oh, let's all follow the leader now. I do! I do! I do!

Red, two wrongs don't make a right. For a while you held the moral high ground here. This post, for me, is a turning point. It was really silly of you.

As you know, I was one of the first (if not the first) to try and make you feel welcome here - you have shown that you have a "stout heart", no doubt. Unfortunately, what you have also shown is the inability to take some friendly advice. I am pretty sure I suggested in one of my posts that you had made your point regarding who you are and what you stand for. Surely you only needed to do that once? You rise to the bait every time.

As I said in a previous post too, you have taken a fait amount of abuse here, I understand that. But do you know what? I think you have brought a lot of this upon yourself. I can't help thinking that you should let a bit of your sense of humour loose. I am sure you have one. Last throw of the dice, from what I can see. This cannot go on for ever, something has got to give...

Regards
Wiliam





Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on February 23, 2013, 06:36:51 PM
Oh, let's all follow the leader now. I do! I do! I do!
All posts in this thread prior to the one I just quoted were responses to cjogo's fine image. RedwoodGuy's is the first irrelevant post, a gratuitous insult, and it seems to have started another flame war.

Please, lets try to keep to the point of the thread.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 24, 2013, 02:46:28 AM
Back to the image ;D  It was a Super Wide Hassy camera -- f16  about a minute exposure... not much room in this foyer // lucky I had the wide angle to fill the frame ..
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 24, 2013, 03:32:14 AM
Finally, after so many years, someone to reveal to us the true purpose of this forum. And it took him only 27 posts to figure that out.

Actually, I knew the stated purpose of the forum before I started posting here. The website says the forum is "A place for reasoned and civilized discussion about user submitted photographs."

That's why I started posting. But instead of "reasoned and civilized discussion", I found that many members persist in flaming critiquers and their critiques and all too often strayed from the stated purpose of the forum.

The low point was just recently, when one member called another a troll.

It seems incredible to me that one adult photographer would call another a troll. I mean there is no one path in photography and no one response to any image. So, why would someone put down another who has just as much legitimacy to their opinion as the abuser has to his?

In my opinion, calling a person a troll brings into question the IQ level of the abuser. Unfortunately, I suspect the IQ level of the abuser is so low that he cannot appreciate how poorly such a comment reflects on him.

All very sad. I don't have any other experience of critiquing forums. Do you know of any that truly offer reasoned and civilized discussion?

I have come to realise that the reason why so many attacks occur in this forum is that this forum is not, or is poorly, moderated. Abusers get away with everything. Do you know whether it is moderated?

I cannot understand why a moderator would allow a member to call another a troll.

If a moderator is reading, I urge him/her to get the forum back on track to its stated purpose.
Roger


Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 24, 2013, 03:33:41 AM
You sound like a reasonably intelligent man... you surely can see the irony in the above, can't you?

Actually, I don't see any irony. I just see a polite request.

Maybe you could explain the irony that you see.
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 24, 2013, 03:34:45 AM
Be gentle, Slobodan; he spends life like a bat at rest. Or playing rugby. It comes with the territory.

;-)

Rob C

Another personal attack. Ha ha ha.
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: rogerxnz on February 24, 2013, 03:37:00 AM
At least you could have had the decency to let RG make the first rebuttal, but as acting critique dectective, I guess you had to make a comment to show your authority.

Not sure that your comment adds to the discussion. Do you have a problem with the content of my posting?
Roger
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Rob C on February 24, 2013, 04:50:18 AM
Another personal attack. Ha ha ha.
Roger




So, now you think that all those of us who love live upside down because of geography are trolls? Amazingly astounding! Bring on the southern dancing girls! Or, as in the song, the clowns?

;-)

Rob C
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: stamper on February 24, 2013, 06:24:42 AM
Roger read this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29

It applies to you and RG. You have a sophisticated and well honed approach. My IQ might not be as high as yours but it is sufficiently high to recognize what you are about. :o

Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: stamper on February 24, 2013, 06:28:35 AM
Quote Roger

I have come to realise that the reason why so many attacks occur in this forum is that this forum is not, or is poorly, moderated. Abusers get away with everyything. Do you know whether it is moderated?

Unquote

You have been here long enough to know it is moderated. I suspect you have now overstepped the mark and will be soon be ejected. I hope that - apart from RG - nobody else who has been provoked by you will suffer the same fate. :o
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Rocco Penny on February 24, 2013, 08:22:03 AM
Just to make this stand out a midst the din

That is a very pretty interior finish.
Stairwells done by masters are quickly becoming art in themselves.
Many stair builders put common touches on their creations,
but this stair you have captured is one of the prettiest I've seen in a very long time.
Here only the very wealthy have anything close/ even older apartments and public and commercial space don't have stairwells like this one.
Altogether a real treasure and photographed in a way that makes one think.
Thank you for the image
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: michael on February 24, 2013, 09:52:35 AM
Chris and I work on the assumption that people posting here are reasonable and intelligent adults.

Apparently this is often a misconception.

Unless people can police themselves we have little interest in doing the policing. Neither of us have the patience or time to be a school-yard monitor.

Next step - instant banning of anyone that acts like a jerk.

Final step - shut down the forums. They gain us little, and simply are a pain in the ass to administer.

I am not joking.

Michael
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Rob C on February 24, 2013, 11:16:13 AM
Chris and I work on the assumption that people posting here are reasonable and intelligent adults.

Apparently this is often a misconception.

Unless people can police themselves we have little interest in doing the policing. Neither of us have the patience or time to be a school-yard monitor.

Next step - instant banning of anyone that acts like a jerk.

Final step - shut down the forums. They gain us little, and simply are a pain in the ass to administer.I am not joking.
Michael




I'm sure you are not, and perhaps that's part of the purpose some people really have. I hope you don't let them ruin a good thing - at least, pretty damned good for the rest of us.

Rob C
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on February 24, 2013, 12:34:35 PM
Over the years we had some very spirited debates on some rather contentious issues (e.g., war, politics, elections), the last of which was about gun control. Sparks were flying, emotions ran high, but ultimately it turned out to be remarkably civil, in spite of hugely polarized views. Let me repeat: wars, politics, elections, gun control.

Are we now to trip over (gasp!) critiques!?

It is no secret that I view only a couple of individuals as responsible. I also have no illusions that some other members, including moderators, might see me as culpable... such is life. On my part, I can only do what I just did: stop enabling the former.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 24, 2013, 01:36:58 PM
Just to make this stand out a midst the din

That is a very pretty interior finish.
Stairwells done by masters are quickly becoming art in themselves.
Many stair builders put common touches on their creations,
but this stair you have captured is one of the prettiest I've seen in a very long time.
Here only the very wealthy have anything close/ even older apartments and public and commercial space don't have stairwells like this one.
Altogether a real treasure and photographed in a way that makes one think.
Thank you for the image

Very difficult to find a stairwell of such mastery > still standing in any major city, today .  This was  on the  Ile de Citie. And it took some nerve to capture ,,,but I had to have it.  ;)
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: nemo295 on February 24, 2013, 02:01:10 PM
Anybody think of Atget when he looks at this? I do. Very nice, Jogo.

It's certainly reminiscent of his subject matter. But Atget would have framed the shot so that the graceful form of the molding at the top wasn't cropped off.
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: tom b on February 24, 2013, 02:16:35 PM
The Art gallery of NSW had an exhibition of Atget's photographs recently. One thing that stood out was the number of images that had strong vignetting (https://www.google.com.au/search?q=atget+severe+vigneting&aq=f&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=qmQqUbmJK4etiQfx2YDIAQ&biw=1302&bih=1221&sei=DmUqUYrdFMjtmAXJiYGADQ#imgrc=S6eDPruUh6X1qM%3A%3BFO9_CC0eawws9M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252F3.bp.blogspot.com%252F_lYtgTLSnwf4%252FTUsy6fdMrkI%252FAAAAAAAAACI%252Fq_GxiQcPPcQ%252Fs1600%252Fatget8Notre%252BDame.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fannasphotoportfolio.blogspot.com%252F2011_02_01_archive.html%3B800%3B566) on the top two corners. So similar but different.

Cheers,
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 24, 2013, 03:09:00 PM
It's certainly reminiscent of his subject matter. But Atget would have framed the shot so that the graceful form of the molding at the top wasn't cropped off.

That was the widest camera in my bag -- nearly a 21mm on a 120 >> I was at the wall > sometimes you just can't include everything  >> so you get the max the surroundings allow ..
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: nemo295 on February 24, 2013, 06:59:18 PM
That was the widest camera in my bag -- nearly a 21mm on a 120 >> I was at the wall > sometimes you just can't include everything  >> so you get the max the surroundings allow ..

We all know what that feels like.   :D
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: John R on February 24, 2013, 08:01:03 PM
A really fine abstraction, as in well cropped with the human eye.

JMR
Title: Re: Paris Stairwell
Post by: cjogo on February 24, 2013, 09:47:03 PM
thanks all -- trying capture the world  .......one shot at a time  ;D