Luminous Landscape Forum

Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: Mr. Rib on July 18, 2012, 05:19:16 am

Title: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Mr. Rib on July 18, 2012, 05:19:16 am
I've been wondering if anything changed- what's the current Rollei / Sinar / Leaf (or should I say Phase One) policy on Hy6 system? Is it only supported in terms od warranty / repairs, is any of the aforementioned  companies still manufacturing them? Is there any future for the system? Also any suggestions why one shouldn't invest in it? I'll appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: design_freak on July 18, 2012, 05:37:25 am
You should know that...
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on July 18, 2012, 07:29:04 am
The Hy6 is still being manufactured by DHW in Germany.  I bought my body in January 2012 and my serial number actually also indicates that the camera was made in 2012…

Their main source of income are the TLRs that they still sell.  Most of their (limited) investments go into the Hy6 however.

The Leaf Aptus-II 10R and 12R backs are available in the AFi mount.  The Credo is not.  The Sinar backs should through an adapter also work.

As far as versatility is concerned the camera is unmatched I believe: 6x6 film back, 645 film back, 645 and square through Leaf backs, WLF, 45 prism, 90 prism, etc.

I personally see no reason to not invest in the Hy6.  DHW might not exist forever, but who knows what the future holds for Hasselblad and Phase/Leaf?
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Mr. Rib on July 18, 2012, 07:45:15 am
As I understand, Afi and Hy6 share the same digital back mount?
Leaf/Phase One don't offer their newer backs in Afi mount.. I understand it as that there will be no further digiback options in future releases for Hy6 camera by Leaf/Phase One. That's a bummer. However it's true that the market is so small nowadays, that predicting anything / planning few years ahead is impossible.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on July 18, 2012, 07:48:14 am
People buy into systems for different reasons. If you want the latest, secure and largest network around, the Hy6 and DHW won't fit the bill. They are a very small company making a very fine product, mostly in continuation of a design that was superb when introduced and is still one of the most flexible and finest pieces of gear out there.

There is disagreement as to how active a manufacturer DHW is, with opinions varying from "assembling old stock" to actively making new Hy6s. Its not clear who owns the intellectual property rights to the Hy6, and whether anyone will pick up the system moving forward as a platform.

DHW is responsive (in an old world way) to providing rapid service. They provide both limited international distribution and direct sales. I've dealt with them for years and have only good results.

Neither the Phase IQ or Leaf Credo backs currently mount to the Hy6, but the Leaf AFI II 10 and 12 do and are still made. Older Leaf backs that were made for the Hy6 (or AFI) are another option, but hard to find. Sinar backs can still come with an adapter to fit the Hy6.

The sizes of the AFI 12 is comparable to the IQ180, but the newer backs are more up to date in software and processing speed. That said, the AFI backs have a rotating sensor, which is just a delight to use. I have an AFI II 7 back with this proviso and can't imagine working without it.

The Hy6 has an extremely broad base of accessories, and can easily use the older PQ lenses, both manual and AF. Focus confirmation is very good, making use of the less expensive manual glass a real option, one which many of us have heavily supported. Schneider glass from 1990 on (if not earlier) is all usable and very fine. Edge to edge sharpness at 100% on all the lenses is typical. Some think the Schneider lineup for the Rollei (and the Hy6) is one of the best examples of a lens lineup. There are many special and lovely lenses available.

The Hy6 is one of the first "intelligent" MFD cameras, with adjustable focus offset (you can set for each lens as needed, very useful for sharp tuning), histogram on the handle for easy reading, changeable finders, backs, etc. Newer cameras are even better; however the Hy6 is quite usable and has excellent characteristics, both electronically and in the hand. Distribution and availability isn't ideal; the users are supportive of each other and very fond of their gear.      
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Mr. Rib on July 18, 2012, 08:10:32 am
Thanks for your insight guys! It encourages me to make the next step and get some hands-on experience with the system.
If only the situation was a bit more clear regarding the system future..
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 18, 2012, 02:29:23 pm
These days its hard to feel really secure about any of the MF camera and back makers.   As a 6008AF and Hy6/AFi shooter I can only echo the other posters sentiments.  New cameras, lenses, and parts are being made by the factory and available both directly and through some stores and dealers.  DHW has continued to develop new items for the platform - new lenses, chimney style finder, 6x6 back etc so I don't see it as stagnant. More and more camera bodies are being sold and  Leaf and Sinar both still offer new backs for the platform.    I love my AFi and its great to also be able to shoot film for personal projects with it.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: henrikfoto on July 18, 2012, 05:05:55 pm
Yair!

Can you confirm that new cameras of these types are still being made?

Henrik
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: yaya on July 18, 2012, 06:14:30 pm
Yair!

Can you confirm that new cameras of these types are still being made?

Henrik

The only thing I can say is that we (Mamiya Leaf) still make the AFi-II 10 and AFi-II 12 backs
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: henrikfoto on July 18, 2012, 06:18:37 pm
But isn't Leaf one of the patent owners?
Why so much secrets around the Hy6?

Henrik
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on July 18, 2012, 06:47:51 pm
It's not so much secret as confusing and complex. It was developed by a small group of companies, and then thru agreement other companies joined the party. These have (in many cases) changed hands since.

"Who got what intellectual property rights?" at the end of the day is not public information; nor is it typically.

Bottom line: DHW is still selling the bodies new.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: FredBGG on July 18, 2012, 07:26:10 pm
But isn't Leaf one of the patent owners?
Why so much secrets around the Hy6?

Henrik

http://www.dhw-fototechnik.de/

Not much on the site, but you can email them.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on July 18, 2012, 10:12:41 pm
But isn't Leaf one of the patent owners?
Why so much secrets around the Hy6?

My understanding is that Leaf and DHW worked out a deal.
DHW services the existing Leaf AFi bodies and in exchange for that DHW is allowed to freely produce the Hy6 camera.
Why the secrecy?  I have no idea...

If you feel uncomfortable buying directly from DHW you should still be able to buy Leaf AFi bodies from Leaf.
Same camera body, same firmware, only labeled Leaf instead of Rolleiflex...
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: yaya on July 19, 2012, 02:10:19 am
My understanding is that Leaf and DHW worked out a deal.
DHW services the existing Leaf AFi bodies and in exchange for that DHW is allowed to freely produce the Hy6 camera.
Why the secrecy?  I have no idea...

If you feel uncomfortable buying directly from DHW you should still be able to buy Leaf AFi bodies from Leaf.
Same camera body, same firmware, only labeled Leaf instead of Rolleiflex...


Leaf AFi body and accessories repairs are done by Sinar

We no longer have any AFi in stock. Neither bodies nor accessories

Yair
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on July 19, 2012, 12:57:30 pm
DHW will be at Photokina.  They are still working on their web site.  Their service is excellent and they seem to be in full control of the Hy6.  I guess this means that the Hy6 will continue to exist as long as there is demand.   

I always felt that the availability of a wide angle lens in the 20mm range of 35mm film days was paramount for a successful medium format system as such lenses would benefit the landscape photographers who can readily take advantage of the high sensor resolution.  Both Hasselblad and Mamiya have invested in such a lens and more recently, Pentax' expensive DA 25mm has become available.  Unfortunately, the  35mm S-Flektogon remained vaporware, and DHW has acknowledged recently that this lens will not be manufactured.  Of course, there are alternative back/lens combinations using an Alpa or a Horseman body, but these lack the convenience of a dedicated wide angle.

Thus, in response to your question, the Hy6 system is wonderful and there are outstanding lenses available.  It will continue to exist, with some limitations.  It is especially great for macro, portrait, and documentary photography. 

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on July 19, 2012, 02:14:36 pm
Unfortunately, the  35mm S-Flektogon remained vaporware, and DHW has acknowledged recently that this lens will not be manufactured. 

I hadn't heard this before.  Did you speak with somebody from DHW?
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 19, 2012, 04:15:42 pm
I've been e-mailing with Reiner at DHW about the 35mm over the last month and he's saying that it won't be available until next year, not that it won't be available at all.  

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on July 19, 2012, 04:31:21 pm
I've been e-mailing with Reiner at DHW about the 35mm over the last month and he's saying that it won't be available until next year, not that it won't be available at all.  

That is also the information that I consistently have received through Bernd.

He clearly said that it would not be announced at Photokina this year but most likely sometime next year.

Wait and see I guess.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 19, 2012, 05:22:52 pm
Yes, Lacunapratum can you clarify when you heard that?  I think at one point just before or just after the transition from Franke and Heikdecke to DHW they did say something like that, but everything I have heard this year is that the 35mm is still in the works.  I think I got an e-mail or read a post from someone else that it might help speed things up for people who are interested to let DHW know so they can gage the interest.

Getting back to the question of wide lens availability - I think the 40 with the AFi-ii 12 sensor provides very good coverage (the AFi-ii 10 at 56mm sensor width even a bit more) and the schneider 40mm S/A is a great optic.   Just doing a bit of math - the angle of view using the diagonal for a 25mm lens in 35mm format is 81.6 degs while the angle of view of the 40mm on the Hy6 with AFi-ii 12 is about 80.1 degrees.   Not to far apart now!

I guess if DHW comes out with the 35mm flektagon and it is paired with the AFi-ii 12 then the angle of view would be 87.6 degs or about 22.5mm in 35mm format.   Of course the angle of view of the new 25mm pentax lens on the 645D would be the equivalent of a 20mm lens in 35mm format so a tiny bit wider but is that enough to make a difference?

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on July 19, 2012, 06:10:34 pm
Maybe I'm missing the boat here, but if DHW only had a wee bit of funds for development, I'd rather they put it elsewhere than chase down one wide lens like that. Not sure that 35 mm is that much more than 40, and it seems to be rather complicated. I worry that their users would have a tech camera backup and not really pick up this (expensive) new lens.

So what would one dream for? Perhaps a few  "robustness" improvements on the body - or perhaps a removable handle (for travel)? Firmware seems pretty good, battery cover a bit more solid? Give the new 120 AF? Just some thoughts.

Or even spend a bit on promotional material - like a leaflet? Wow, now there's a radical thought. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 19, 2012, 07:27:08 pm
Geoff,
To a certain extent I agree with you - certainly about making good business decisions and good use of their available funds. However what if the profits from the 35mm sales gave them more financial resources than any work they could do with tightening up firmware? A 35mm lens is probably going to price out at the cost of a body and my guess is about half the people I know that shoot Rollei would buy one immediately.  Sometimes a small company gets fettered with fixed costs and only a small increase in sales can make a large difference in their available cash.   

Now once they have the resources,  I'd like to see them complete a few software / firmware things such as taking advantage of the light color temp meter which is built into the camera but not used as far as I know.  Also small stuff like when the chimney finder is attached the display is not reversed.  There are a few other small things.

Eric


 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Neil Folberg on July 20, 2012, 12:23:53 am
If I were making recommendations about the AFi body, I would strengthen the handle and connection to the camera (all power flows through the handle to the camera body unless you have an extra battery on the back). I was having power problems on a body that was replaced under warranty by Sinar, though I'm not sure that this was the source of the problem.

I would make the on/off switch a bit larger with more decisive click-stops.

It's great that you can use two batteries, especially with the 12 back, but you have to keep an eye on both the Leaf back's screen AND the camera body's battery indicator. When you're working fast, outside the studio and in volume this is hard to do. All of a sudden something doesn't work too well and you realize a battery needs to be replaced. If it's the battery on the back, and the camera body battery is still strong, all you have to do is slip off the battery on the back and the other one in the body takes over.

Those are all of my comments. It's a great camera to work with and the quality of the Leaf back is so good that I can't imagine an improvement in image quality (what would it look like? MORE detail? BETTER dynamic range? I can shoot straight into the sun and hold shadow detail along with a pleasing sky!), and it works lovely tethered in C1 when I have the ability to use it that way. Where there is a wifi network, the Capture Remote is great on the iPhone. Even at high ISO for places where I need it, and I try hard not to need it, it looks good. I have no trouble with the screen, I can read the histogram in full sunlight and check focus if I must - love the tilt-up screen and rotating back - and would not want to trade for the Credo. All I want is for everything to keep working forever - this is a a great tool with lifetime potential. Like a good film camera used to be (I used the Rollei SL-66 and then the 66SE from 1971 to about 2001 and I still miss the tilt and built-in bellows).

Neil
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 20, 2012, 03:10:01 am
It is a great camera.  I love it with the AFi-ii 12 as well Neil, and this summer discovered how wonderful a film camera it is too.  Exposure metering is really really good with film!   But I almost never run the camera battery down.  The AFi-ii 12 sucks them up very quickly but the camera itself seems to last forever.  I go for weeks without changing - thousands of shots.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Neil Folberg on July 20, 2012, 03:56:46 am
Eric,

perhaps you never use mirror lock-up or autofocus? I use both frequently - maybe that uses more power on the body?

the back surely uses plenty of batteries, especially when you check images. so I carry a lot -

Neil
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on July 20, 2012, 09:01:58 am
I use MLU a lot and AF less so. The battery in the body seems to last quite a while - to the point of rarely  needing attention. Less than 1/10 as often as the batteries on the back. Typically use 2-3 batteries for the back for a shooting day - by the time I'm through those, the brain is fried. That's with an AFI II 7, while the 12 uses more power. Not sure where the 10 is in this. Anyone have either a 10 or a 5 to report on? 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 20, 2012, 07:48:27 pm
Neil,
The AF could be a factor.  I do use it, but not that much. I couldn't imagine mirror lockup taking a lot of power but who knows?
E
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: xinchenc on July 21, 2012, 01:00:03 pm
AFi/Hy6 is a GREAT Camera.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: DeckardTrinity on July 24, 2012, 12:06:56 pm
I'll concur with others here that the Hy6 is a great camera system. I had the same questions early last year about whether or not it was a good idea to invest so much $$ into a system that has very limited support, but I've been very happy with my Hy6, coupled with the 50mm, 80mm, and 180mm AFD lenses. I shoot with the 6x6 back mostly, and have an Afi-7 that I play with from time to time too, but I'm majority shooting 120 / 220 film.

Now... as for all the rumors... :)

I have personally spoken with the owner of Rollei & Hensel service here in NJ on several occasions when I've had to bring in a lens for repair, or more recently to get the contacts in the grip of the Hy6 cleaned (they did that for free while I waited - great guys all around). I've heard their perspective on the breakup of F&H, and don't want to go repeating it in a public forum, but it's pretty clear that they were impacted quite a bit when the business went under.

For now they can only service the older 600x series cameras, TLRs, plus all the lenses that go with that (they do also service the AFD lenses). They were pretty clear when I went in to get the Hy6 dial looked at that they wouldn't be able to do much beyond spraying a little bit of contact cleaner in and hoping for the best (which turned out to be all that was needed). But... there is hope that one day they may be able to expand their service offerings to include the Hy6, which would be terrific news for us stateside folks who have to ship to Germany to get any substantive repairs done on the body. As of now though (or more accurately a few months ago when I last visited), there is nothing to report, so consider this mere speculation / rumor.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on July 24, 2012, 06:14:17 pm
Deckard,

During the transition Rollei Hensel service in NJ lost their official service status with Rollei and were not able to get it back.   I really like Onick at the NJ service though,  and he's been super helpful in the past.   The Hy6/AFi can be serviced in many places, but I'd go with the factory.  DHW does very quick service turnaround.  I shipped a 60-140 lens to them via USPS for service as was surprised how quickly it came back same thing with a body I sent in for firmware update.  Try that with Leica! Leica has taken more than 4 months on average to do simple services on my gear so I decided to sell all my Leica stuff.   Anyhow,  I don't worry about Rollei service.  Onick can do all the 6000 stuff and most of the lenses, but  I'd send the Hy6 to DHW.

Eric

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on July 24, 2012, 06:51:58 pm
I've had good luck with DHW for service - usually 1-2 week turnaround. Try that with Leica.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: xinchenc on July 24, 2012, 08:44:46 pm
The only feature that Hy6 has not developed yet is he AUTO White Balance.

As for the repair service, do all other brands repair your camera next to your door?
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Graham Mitchell on July 30, 2012, 05:29:24 pm
Unfortunately, the  35mm S-Flektogon remained vaporware, and DHW has acknowledged recently that this lens will not be manufactured. 

Source? This is news to me, and not of the good variety.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Graham Mitchell on July 30, 2012, 05:31:52 pm
Maybe I'm missing the boat here, but if DHW only had a wee bit of funds for development, I'd rather they put it elsewhere than chase down one wide lens like that. Not sure that 35 mm is that much more than 40, and it seems to be rather complicated.

Two thoughts...
1) as far as I know, the R&D is all done, so they just have to decide whether to go ahead and manufacture.
2) The 35mm is not a big step from the 40mm, that's true, but it will be AFD, I believe, and match very nicely with the 50mm AFD. (The 40mm is manual focus)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on August 01, 2012, 05:27:47 pm
A 35mm AF would have been great, especially with wider backs such as the Afi10 or 12.  Just received my 25mm Pentax DA, which is a marvel and so convenient to use.  Right now I am using a 24mm SA XL with a Sinarback 75 LV on my Horseman when I go out shooting with the Hy6 system, but the Pentax is definitely more convenient.  Hopefully they'll change their mind.   

Repairs are usually well done in Braunschweig, but not inexpensive, and shipping these days plus taxes for the repair itself add up.  But it works. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on August 02, 2012, 08:34:57 pm
Source? This is news to me, and not of the good variety.

I wrote an email to Reiner about this. 

His reply was that they currently are not working on the 35mm AFD lens and that after Photokina they will decide whether to continue with the development or not.

Stopping the development would in my opinion be a very big mistake which is also what I wrote back.

If you are interested in the lens and would consider buying one it might be a good time to be vocal about it and let DHW know...




Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: TMARK on August 02, 2012, 11:07:58 pm
Deckard,

. . . Try that with Leica! Leica has taken more than 4 months on average to do simple services on my gear so I decided to sell all my Leica stuff. 

Eric



Me too. An M8 that had a known issue they refused to acknowledge (a board was bad and creates horrid jaggies around blown highlights) and an M9 that was lost, found, then lost again and one day showed up at my door, three months later.  Which is why I never even considered the S2.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: bradleygibson on August 10, 2012, 01:08:20 am
Anyone have either a 10 or a 5 to report on? 

Very similar experiences with my 10.  Like Eric, the body rarely runs out of battery, at least compared to the back.  2 or 3 batteries on the back for a busy day's shooting is certainly doable, sometimes as many as four.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: paratom on August 11, 2012, 03:32:09 pm
I've had good luck with DHW for service - usually 1-2 week turnaround. Try that with Leica.
Leica calibrated my M9 and 4 lenses in 10 days.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on August 12, 2012, 03:03:01 am
Leica calibrated my M9 and 4 lenses in 10 days.


Yeah but you are in Germany correct?   Here in the US Leica still mails you a regular letter with an estimate after they have inspected the camera which they expect you to sign and mail back before they begin any work.  This alone is your 10 days just in the mail delivery times.   And that's not counting  the cue for repairs, repair times, or even the time in shipping the broken item to the service station originally and shipping time back after.   If you are unlucky and your gear needs to be returned to Solms then there are even more delays through this international shipping round trip.   A 10 day turnaround simply doesn't happen here with Leica.   Personally, I've never had service quicker than 3 months and one lens took almost 6 months.  What was wrong with that lens?  I sent it in because the focus ring was stiff - that's all.   I am happy to read others have had better luck with Leica, but unless they give me one, I'm never going to have another Leica camera.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: dergiman on August 16, 2012, 04:13:37 am
Just sent my Hy6 in to DHW for the firmware upgrade and some minor repairs. Turnaround was about 3 weeks incl. shipping times. First class service but not inexpensive. OTOH got a new set of lens caps for free.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on August 16, 2012, 07:03:29 pm
Yeah the firmware upgrade was expensive but they are changing the AF cells inside to an upgraded version so not just firmware but also some hardware changes. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on August 27, 2012, 07:11:16 pm
Maybe there will be a 35mm Flektagon after all....    ;)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on August 28, 2012, 12:09:49 am
Seeing is believing.   :D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on August 28, 2012, 01:17:48 am
True...  I guess we will hear more at photokina.   If there is one available, I'd sell my 30mm fisheye to raise funds for it.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on August 28, 2012, 10:22:40 pm
... only a white unicorn would be more valuable...
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on September 10, 2012, 06:41:31 am
 
"At the Photokina 2012 DHW photographic technology presents a strongly developed Hy6. It will bear the name Hy6 mod 2.

With rights received from the licensee, further modifications (firmware/hardware) are possible. Production of the Hy6 mod 2, as well as of the famous accessories, continues in Braunschweig."

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on September 10, 2012, 06:53:40 am
I also noticed during the weekend that the kits from the HK suppliers on eBay had gone down in price which already led me to believe that the rumors of a new body might be true.  I wonder which changes they might have made.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 10, 2012, 10:53:13 am
It's interesting news for sure!   I wonder if they will offer a body upgrade?
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on September 10, 2012, 06:32:02 pm
You are amazingly well informed or you have been watching their defunct website on an hourly basis for five years in a row.   :P
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on September 10, 2012, 06:46:18 pm
It was a total fluke. I was checking their moribund site this AM, just on the off chance they posted something and this popped up. Truly.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on September 10, 2012, 08:06:52 pm
DHW is actually more active than I thought.  
They also seem to have partnered up with the Impossible Project:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/impossible/impossible-instant-lab-turn-iphone-images-into-rea
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Graham Mitchell on September 11, 2012, 02:49:12 am
Nice to hear that the licence holder has allowed further development. Looking forward to hearing more.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Carl Glover on September 11, 2012, 04:07:35 am
Good news indeed!

I wonder what the differences are going to be?

Hopefully it will be a bit more robust for outdoor work. The 6008 series are very tough by comparison.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 11, 2012, 09:29:15 am
I got an e-mail from Reiner stating what would be improved in mod 2.  I'm pasting that below. He also wrote that there will be a chance to upgrade existing bodies for a fee. :)


The new HY 6 mod.2 will be completely in black. (Note - this is only for new cameras. Upgrades to existing camera bodies will not include replacing the colored body parts.)
The new camera includes the following :

Innovation 2012 – Hardware

Modifications of the handhold detent for better handling

Reinforcement of the handholds adaption, to guarantee the maximized protection for the housing

In cases of dropping or collision

Stand plate revised for protecting the autofocus module from damage


Innovation 2012 – Firmware

The objective lens register for the AF-Offset has been remarkably extended

The possibility to individually save the AF-Offset of the registered objectives

Best possible control of the battery capacity through a symbol in the operation center on the viewfinder display or in percentage shown on the handhold display

Fault management improvement

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 11, 2012, 11:30:00 am
Reiner just sent me another e-mail stating that he hopes the upgrade service for existing Hy6 bodies will be available shortly after photokina.  I am not sure about the date when the Mod 2 bodies can be purchased outright, but it sounds like soon.



Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: locpham on September 11, 2012, 02:13:29 pm
What great news!   :D

Reiner just sent me another e-mail stating that he hopes the upgrade service for existing Hy6 bodies will be available shortly after photokina.  I am not sure about the date when the Mod 2 bodies can be purchased outright, but it sounds like soon.




Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Graham Mitchell on September 11, 2012, 07:58:33 pm
The best part was "all black!. Finally!! )))
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Steve Hendrix on September 11, 2012, 09:35:04 pm
I got an e-mail from Reiner stating what would be improved in mod 2.  I'm pasting that below. He also wrote that there will be a chance to upgrade existing bodies for a fee. :)


The new HY 6 mod.2 will be completely in black. (Note - this is only for new cameras. Upgrades to existing camera bodies will not include replacing the colored body parts.)
The new camera includes the following :

Innovation 2012 – Hardware

Modifications of the handhold detent for better handling

Reinforcement of the handholds adaption, to guarantee the maximized protection for the housing

In cases of dropping or collision

Stand plate revised for protecting the autofocus module from damage


Innovation 2012 – Firmware

The objective lens register for the AF-Offset has been remarkably extended

The possibility to individually save the AF-Offset of the registered objectives

Best possible control of the battery capacity through a symbol in the operation center on the viewfinder display or in percentage shown on the handhold display

Fault management improvement




This is all very positive.


Steve Hendrix
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on September 11, 2012, 10:52:16 pm
very good news!
if now we could also get the ball rolling again on that 35mm :)
I am actually going to be in Europe for work next week, I am hoping to make it to Photokina on Saturday.
Joris.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on September 11, 2012, 11:22:03 pm
Seems all good.  I admire them for their patience in dealing with the legal issues.  These must have been a huge roadblock as the improvements are long overdue.  Well - finally they succeeded.  Seems like a win for all. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: yaya on September 12, 2012, 02:28:46 am
Watch carefully and see what camera is being used in this commercial (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRV-2_Un-kk&feature=youtube_gdata_player)

The brief had an AFi specified for its professional look with the WLF. There's another thread where some people say that their clients don't care what camera they use. Looks like Chanel still do...
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: HarperPhotos on September 12, 2012, 02:38:58 am
Gidday,

Looks like its only good for is a prop in a TVC to me Yair.

Cheers

Simon
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: yaya on September 12, 2012, 03:27:51 am
Gidday,

Looks like its only good for is a prop in a TVC to me Yair.

Cheers

Simon

You can say the same about the Ducati SS, the Profoto lights and maybe even KN:-)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: DanielStone on September 12, 2012, 03:37:18 am
they also used a Hasselblad 503CW, see the frame-grab below:

(http://i788.photobucket.com/albums/yy161/mr_danielstone/Picture1.png)

thought that the leather during the "looking down through the viewfinder" shot looked like my Hasselblad, guess I was right ;)

not that it matters, its just an ad to sell smelly stuff to rich women, or women who want to think they're rich cuz they use Chanel...

-Dan
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: amsp on September 12, 2012, 04:01:30 am
Thank heavens they got rid of that fugly blue color.

(http://www.photoscala.de/grafik/2012/Hy6_mod_2_01.jpg)

(http://www.photoscala.de/grafik/2012/Hy6_mod_2_02.jpg)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 12, 2012, 10:08:38 am
The very first ones were definitely blue/green, but the later ones were not. Neither of mine look blue at all - more of a grey than anything. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Anders_HK on September 12, 2012, 12:02:39 pm
Watch carefully and see what camera is being used in this commercial (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRV-2_Un-kk&feature=youtube_gdata_player)

The brief had an AFi specified for its professional look with the WLF. There's another thread where some people say that their clients don't care what camera they use. Looks like Chanel still do...

I really enjoy my Hy6. A good model in studio and some music really makes it a blast and as sexy to use as the ad makes it appear. Simply lovely to use, but in end only a tool, albeit magnificent one for making images. The Hy6 has made me focus on images instead of gear itself, the 6x6 WLF and the 80MP Leaf in C1 simply completes the chain.  ;D

Yair, any more info on the Hy6 that you can share???

Best regards,
Anders
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 12, 2012, 12:19:09 pm
I'm told by Reiner that even the oldest bodies - still with the V2xx firmware can be updated to the Mod 2.    The price to update bodies with v3.1 is about 350 euro and the upgrade cost for the older  bodies with with v2.xx firmware will be approx. 740 euro since they need more hardware updates.  

I think it's simply awesome that DHW is offering the update service.   I don't know of any other brand that is doing this - most only want to sell you the new one.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on September 12, 2012, 12:23:39 pm
Eric, do you have any information on how much a new body would be?  Thanks, Joris.
Title: Hy6 improvements
Post by: Rune Werner Molnes on September 12, 2012, 12:36:38 pm
Here's some nice improvements I'd personally like to see:

- Weather sealing (!)
- Better cold weather performance. (No error messages due to use in low temperatures).
- Overall more robust camera body, with control wheels that don't fail due to normal use.
- That 35mm lens would be nice, if it has filter threads and performs better in terms of overall sharpness than the current 40mm
- The ability to shim the DB for perfect alignment of sensor to the lens focal plane. (Like Alpa).
- Better battery capacity and battery performance in cold weather.
- More alternatives when it comes to choice of dedicated focusing screens.  (Like rule of thirds grid, with central cross split and micro-prism ring etc).
- A DB to attach with live- view focusing performing close to that of the Canon 5D MkII or similar ;)
- Full backward compatibility with older backs such as my AFi7 DB.

Rune Molnes
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: bcooter on September 12, 2012, 02:05:55 pm
Thank heavens they got rid of that fugly blue color.

(http://www.photoscala.de/grafik/2012/Hy6_mod_2_01.jpg)

(http://www.photoscala.de/grafik/2012/Hy6_mod_2_02.jpg)

Without any of us knowing the complete specifics of how the Rolleiflex and the new Hasselblad work in everyday use, you have to admire the companies for going forward.

The thing that has always bewildered me about the HY6 is the Rollei "looking" version was always present from the day the camera was announced, but instead Leaf and Sinar went with that Grey or Grey/Blue look and regardless of what anyone says, looks matter.

And as I said I admire the moving forward thought, but to put it in perspective yesterday, I shot 3/4 of the day with my Contax(s) and digital backs, then the remainder of the day with the RED 1's and Scarlet.

With the Contax I used the waist level finder, then with a prism the right angle grip and everything worked as planned, no disconnects (one dead battery) though no real issues, sharp images, etc. etc.

(http://ishotit.com/contaxphoto.jpg)

Would I like a little more accurate and multiple point autofocus . . . yes and I would also like a few other incremental changes, but overall if I decided I just had to have the new Rollei or the Hasselblad, what is it going to cost me to buy two bodies, two backs and an assortment of lenses and will I ever recover those costs in a 5d3, Handicam world?  Granted if I owned the lens set for either of these cameras and the digital backs that fit on the Rolleiflex I might bite. 

Don't misunderstand I'm not downplaying the efforts by either of these two companies and the new cameras look good, have improvements and if it was 2005 in the overheated, throw the budget out the window world, I and a lot of others would probably be putting down deposits for one of these two cameras and lens sets.

Today . . . with everything we are required to do in a day, I wonder that in the world of imagery for commerce, no person is immune from the financial and time pressures (both are kind of the same).  I was talking to the AD yesterday, (one I like very much) and she commented on how fast we all have to work and the limitation of time involved.  What we use to do in a three day shoot we do in a day.  How many projects she handles from start to finish that overlap due to less support help is an average 14 hour day for her and most of the people she works with.  She wants the best imagery she can get and if a camera helps she's all for it, though most of all she wants the shot list complete, on time, on delivery, no additional charges.

Knowing this,  I have to ask are these the cameras for todays time?

I hope so.

IMO

BC
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 12, 2012, 05:28:45 pm
Bcooter
People who love a camera should just stick with it - once you know a camera well enough to operate it without thinking about it, you can concentrate on the image which is what counts anyhow.   That said you must be curious about the Hy6 at least enough to visit this thread, so should you want a break, try a Hy6 for yourself with the WLF or 45 deg prism.   YMMV, but I like it much better than the contax (but I didn't have the WLF) and more than my DSLR's.  There are times when like your contax, it simply doesn't make sense and I use my Canon 5dii.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: DeckardTrinity on September 12, 2012, 07:02:25 pm
Now for the big question - will the 6060 back be offered in black as well? :)

I'd been holding off getting a second Hy6 body until I knew whether or not Leaf would be continuing support with their Credo backs. Now that that question has been answered, it's a safe bet I'll be opting for the mod 2 as my primary, and will probably send in my existing Hy6 to upgrade as well. Time to prepare end of year budget.  :D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: FredBGG on September 12, 2012, 10:45:12 pm
Watch carefully and see what camera is being used in this commercial (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRV-2_Un-kk&feature=youtube_gdata_player)

The brief had an AFi specified for its professional look with the WLF. There's another thread where some people say that their clients don't care what camera they use. Looks like Chanel still do...

But they made bloody sure that the cameras logo was not on camera.... ;)

Also... almost sacrelage to paint the Ducati like that.....  Raced one of those gems a while ago on Lake Mirage Dry Lake Bed.

More like this one...

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Ly4JoaztuFY/UBtHoFMP3PI/AAAAAAAAA38/WFtN6Ivk6-8/s320/ducati_750SS.jpg)

A gem from the 70s

But personally I enjoyed the Morimi Tre E Mezzo more

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sMQeAbk4T5M/TlmlqilVXcI/AAAAAAAABv4/3hK1osoKHmo/s1600/moto_morini_three-and-one-half_344.jpeg)

Should be playing with this one at Lake Mirage soon... that's if my friends can get me out of the surf... all work recently finished

(http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8441/7981473687_0356ec7f81_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on September 12, 2012, 11:46:47 pm
How relevant. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 12, 2012, 11:53:50 pm
How relevant. 

Comparing the Hy6 to stylish italian racing motorcycles isn't so far off as one might first think.   :D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on September 13, 2012, 01:31:21 am
Well, agreed. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: jeanlucco on September 13, 2012, 02:42:27 am
Hi guys, what about our loved Leaf Afi? Would it be possible to get the update mod.2 too?
Nice to know in advance for the budget  ;D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 13, 2012, 03:40:59 pm
JeanLuc
do you mean matching the outside color scheme?  Or compatibility for the digital back to work with the camera?   I have heard that DHW is committed to keeping the same communications protocol and mount so there should be no probs with the AFi or Credo or other backs.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Lacunapratum on September 13, 2012, 11:20:29 pm
The 35mm Flektogon is still mentioned in the most recent pdf catalogue posted on their new web site.  Perhaps the resolution of legal issues has given the company a new sense of optimism? 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 13, 2012, 11:27:48 pm
I am hopeful that the 35mm will be announced or spoken about at Photokina.   Considering the Mod2 and the new electronic shutter, it seems they definitely are moving forward and not just hanging on. 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Gigi on September 13, 2012, 11:42:49 pm
What's nice about the news we've heard so far is that the improvements are very strategic and very focused: they are helping their shooters who need it, not closing the system, allowing upgrades for a modest price (how about that?). With the shutter, they are finding niches, working important gaps in the current market, they can fill. Its lean, its small, but its scrappy, and more importantly, worthwhile.

Hats off to them.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: jeanlucco on September 14, 2012, 04:19:12 am
JeanLuc
do you mean matching the outside color scheme?  Or compatibility for the digital back to work with the camera?   I have heard that DHW is committed to keeping the same communications protocol and mount so there should be no probs with the AFi or Credo or other backs.
Hi Eric, no my question was more is DHW will be able to take in my Leaf AFI bodies and install the mod2 upgrage. Anyway, I should be in meeting in Holland Monday, I will do my utmost to make a return flight to Copenhagen via Koln. Cannot hurt so much to spend few hours in the Hall 4 ::) Ciao and take care. Jean-Luc
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: yaya on September 14, 2012, 06:14:02 am
Jean-Luc don't forget to stop at hall 9.1 on your way in/ out  ;)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Anders_HK on September 14, 2012, 10:24:03 am
Eric,

Per my telephone conversation with Mr. Hartje, CEO @ DHW today he explained the MOD 2 upgrade to me. I fill in your below with A>.

I got an e-mail from Reiner stating what would be improved in mod 2.  I'm pasting that below. He also wrote that there will be a chance to upgrade existing bodies for a fee. :)


The new HY 6 mod.2 will be completely in black. (Note - this is only for new cameras. Upgrades to existing camera bodies will not include replacing the colored body parts.)
The new camera includes the following :

Innovation 2012 – Hardware

Modifications of the handhold detent for better handling
A> Due few number of units had been reported to get their handle detent stuck in one position they have revised the design.

Reinforcement of the handholds adaption, to guarantee the maximized protection for the housing In cases of dropping or collision
A> This protect the housing if the handle accidentally get smashed into a wall or something, then there will be plastic damage to handle and not damage to housing of body.

Stand plate revised for protecting the autofocus module from damage
A> The AF module is located right above the tripod plate. Thus when using long tripod screws there have been risk to damage the AF module and this is fixed using a blocking plate to avoid this to occur. The AF module is expensive to replace.

Innovation 2012 – Firmware

The objective lens register for the AF-Offset has been remarkably extended
The possibility to individually save the AF-Offset of the registered objectives
A> Offset for more lenses is possible. AF-offset for all AFD lenses are now possible and are retrieved automatic for each lens used. User can modify the factory settings. E.g. for the 180/2.8 I believe he mentioned a factory offset of -15 and user can modify it if experience another value to better correspond to the actual offset.

Best possible control of the battery capacity through a symbol in the operation center on the viewfinder display or in percentage shown on the handhold display
A> This refers to power left in the camera handle battery.

Fault management improvement
A> To better avoid crashes (I have had nil so far ;D)

A> Mirror is more dampened through firmware improvement.



In all seem like good durability and usability improvements.

I very much like that they offer as upgrade, as compared to all other camera makers selling us incremental new models for $$$$$... such as Mamiya, Hasselblad, not to mention Nikon and Canon and the likes...  ;D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 14, 2012, 11:21:25 am
Anders,
Thanks for the additional info. 
I was reading the part about the mirror being even better damped - wow!  I mean the Hy6 Mirror was already the best damped in all the MF cameras and now its even better? Incredible!
RE: crashes... I've not had any either, but I've had some older AF lenses report an error when there wasn't any.

What I want to know is if the older non AF lenses can be modified such that the camera will recognize their focal length.    Also I am wondering about whether the light color temp sensor has been incorporated or not.  This would be great to have the ability to do auto white balance.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: xinchenc on September 17, 2012, 12:31:47 pm
Credo on Hy6
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: JV on September 17, 2012, 05:07:17 pm
The Photokina announcements so far make it pretty easy to justify a €350 upgrade :)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: xinchenc on September 18, 2012, 02:33:26 am
The latest news is:

to upgrade the HY6 mod1 in HY6 mod2 it is not possible.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 18, 2012, 02:36:34 am
Of course it is!  You just can't get the all black body panels.  You do get the firmware and other hardware.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Anders_HK on September 18, 2012, 04:11:54 am
The latest news is:

to upgrade the HY6 mod1 in HY6 mod2 it is not possible.

Above is incorrect.

Per my personal teleconvesation with Mr Hartje, CEO of DWH the upgrade of existing Hy6 will be available about two weeks after Photokina. It includes all Mod 2 updates but not change of body panels.

If you are in China perhaps conyact David at Livecoal in Hong Kong for clarification.

Best regards,
Anders
Title: Re: Hy6 improvements
Post by: rolleiflexpages on September 19, 2012, 01:13:49 pm
Here's some nice improvements I'd personally like to see:

- Weather sealing (!)
- Better cold weather performance. (No error messages due to use in low temperatures).
- Overall more robust camera body, with control wheels that don't fail due to normal use.
- That 35mm lens would be nice, if it has filter threads and performs better in terms of overall sharpness than the current 40mm

Rune Molnes

Dear Rune,

I am reading this thread with quite some interest. Good to see that DHW is actually improving the Hy6 concept and taking it further into the future. I have been trying for over two years now to arrange a factory visit but so far was advised that the time was not right. I hope this may change soon.

While the announced improvements for the Mod.2 can be useful for a number of users, I second in particular what you have put forward as desired improvements (see above). My Hy6 and AFi had to be sent in for parts replacement as they were not coping well with cold weather. It seems better now, though now and then it can still pop up sporadically (as witnessed in Icelandic weather recently). I would also have wished the camera/lenses were more weatherproof, or let's say, water-proof :-) Now I have to take extreme care of things and wipe rain drops away as soon as possible in order to avoid water getting into the camera or lens system.

One thing I do not quite approve with - the change in color. Frankly, I really like the dark greenish/greyish color a lot and much more than the dull black. So, if I ever get another Hy6 mod 2 or 3, it should be the same green/grey.

Cheers,
Pascal
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 19, 2012, 02:25:52 pm
Both of my Hy6/AFi bodies are not blue but gray and I like this a lot.  I prefer what I have to an all black version as well.  I do not like the very early blue gray bodies though.

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Rune Werner Molnes on September 20, 2012, 04:19:19 am
I find the strong opinions in here about the looks and color of the camera quite fascinating. Personally I do not find it interesting or particularly relevant.

If there was introduced a new camera with the specs I'm looking for, I would buy it in pink if I had to  :P

On the other hand form usually follows function, and functional design usually ends up looking good, which is a nice bonus but not very important. (To me that is).
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: BernardLanguillier on September 20, 2012, 04:52:41 am
Both of my Hy6/AFi bodies are not blue but gray and I like this a lot.  I prefer what I have to an all black version as well.  I do not like the very early blue gray bodies though.

I would probably invest in the Hy6 system if they had a pink version with irregularly spaced red dots.

Cheers,
Bernard
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Mr. Rib on September 20, 2012, 08:09:29 am
For me, so far, from MF players, DHW / Rollei is the unexpected winner. They've shown that they survived and keep developing their product which in their case is at least 'good enough' announcement for a camera which is in my opinion currently the best MF camera, although I played with it for a short while only (but I did 'play' with H3D and AFDIII / DF.. jesus...). They offered an upgrade program for current camera bodies (do you hear that L/H/P1?) and the upgrade is priced REASONABLY (nah, this part won't even be heard by H/P1 or L). The biggest vulnerability of their system was the vague future of the manufacturer and their message tells us 'we are on our own two feet now'. That is a message good enough for me to make them the winner from L/H/P1 bunch and their 'announcements'.

Probably owning two camera manufacturers under one roof would be too much.. but anyway Phase One is probably working on a totally new camera- as well all know it's costly and time consuming, why didn't they take the opportunity and buy/invest in Rollei? Would that be a bigger cost? Was the patents situation an obstacle not worth it? It IS a great system.. They could fine-tune the Hy6 and introduce a revamped version in a year or two from the moment of their takover (so it would be NOW) and it would be more like a rev 3 camera with P1 resources.. Everyone would be happy- film magazines, interchangable viewfinders, great lenses.. one thing that isn't there is the V-grip and again, with their budget I think they could modify the body to make a V grip possible, then probably work a bit on the weather sealing and all the other stuff to make it even better.. but yeah, that's would be too good to be true.
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 20, 2012, 11:00:09 am
I would probably invest in the Hy6 system if they had a pink version with irregularly spaced red dots.

Cheers,
Bernard


You might have better luck with Hasselblad on that one! 
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Anders_HK on September 20, 2012, 12:37:34 pm
Was the patents situation an obstacle not worth it?

The interesting fact is that the rights to Hy6 have been and are with Leaf, and thereby indirect in hands of Phase One...

I agree, P1 should have gone the Hy6 and Rollei Schneider path. The quality is way above Mamiya 645.  8)
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 20, 2012, 01:04:40 pm
Anders,
I agree too. The Hy6 would have made a better platform for them to start with.  Maybe phase will still pick this up? Not too late!

But the licensing issues must have been more complex.   There were four companies involved - actually five if you include F&H too.    Jenoptic, Sinar, Leaf, Kodak, and F&H.  Now there is also Phase too.   I do not know if they had any contractors or other groups that could also have some rights.  Anyhow there could have been several groups holding some individual rights after everything so maybe none had a complete enough set to move forward?    In any case I think I read somewhere that DHW now has the rights to work on the firmware from Jenoptic or a group that was contracted by them.  I am completely reading between the lines so I could be wrong, but it appeared that DHW had the rights to make film cameras (which happened to also work with digital backs) but that they may not have had permission until recently to sell bodies for digital use or something like that.  You'd have to wonder if there was also any other movement in rights at the same time that would make the path open for other groups to work with this?

Anyhow I can't tell you how happy I am to see them be free to move forward with this and make updates!  The best getting better!

Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: Anders_HK on September 20, 2012, 03:24:29 pm
Eric,

Here;
http://www.photoscala.de/Artikel/photokina-2012-Rolleiflex-Hy6-Mod2-Rolleiflex-FX-N-Electronic-Shutter
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A//www.photoscala.de/Artikel/photokina-2012-Rolleiflex-Hy6-Mod2-Rolleiflex-FX-N-Electronic-Shutter

Above was first time I read of it officially, though I heard from reliable source the other year. The rights have as far as I reckon been with Leaf for some years and since the Kodak pull out. It was just recent resolved that DHW will be able to continue developing the camera. Mr. Hartje admitted that had taken some time to solve.

It sure is good news  ;D
Title: Re: Current Hy6 / Afi situation
Post by: EricWHiss on September 20, 2012, 05:41:07 pm
Anders,
Thanks for the link.
I'm sure excited about the new electronic shutters!  I have this idea to make myself a handheld camera with all the X-act2 lenses I have now in electronic shutter but the Lens Control S was so big it kind of ruined the idea.  But if I could control the new shutter with a phone or some other small device (arudino)  then it could work great!
Eric