Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: kmhpix on May 15, 2012, 03:47:45 pm
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I just talked to Darren from DTG (dtgweb.com) about an order I had place for Ilford Gold Fibre Silk paper. He told me that DTG hasn't been able to get Ilford Gold Fibre paper. He said Mac Group, which is the USA distributor for Ilford paper, will stop supplying Gold Fibre Silk. He suggested that changes may be made Ilford's Smooth Glossy and Smooth Pearl.
Can anyone confirm this information? Will we be able to get Gold Fibre Silk in the future, or is it being phased out?
Cheers,
kmhpix
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There is no demise of Ilford Gold Fibre Silk - I have made enquiries and learned on very good authority. But I have no idea what DTG's or Mac Group's stories are all about.
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If you can´t buy the Ilford Gold Fiber Silk try the Canson Baryta Photographique. Pretty much the same.
Best regards.
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Why would a best seller be killed? Try here:
http://www.atlex.com/shop-by-brand/ilford/gold-fibre-silk-baryta
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Be assured that ILFORD GALERIE Prestige Gold Fibre Silk is not going away. The product is a mainstay of the ILFORD GALERIE line and will continue to be distributed by Mac Group in North White Plains, NY.
Here is a link to the product page on the NEW www.ILFORD.com.
http://www.ilford.com/en/products/photo-inkjet/galerie-prestige/gold-fibre-silk/
Brenda Hipsher
Mac Group Field Marketing Manager, ILFORD
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I guess I panicked unnecessarily. I am glad to hear reassurances from you all.
Thank for your comments,
Ken Hanson
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I guess I panicked unnecessarily. I am glad to hear reassurances from you all.
Thank for your comments,
Ken Hanson
Well, something positive happened after you panicked. We now know another industry representative reads this forum.
--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
340+ paper white spectral plots:
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
update april 2012: Harman by Hahnemühle, Innova IFA45 and more
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Well, something positive happened after you panicked. We now know another industry representative reads this forum.
Or they have a Google Alert set up for IGFS :D
Neil
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Be assured that ILFORD GALERIE Prestige Gold Fibre Silk is not going away. The product is a mainstay of the ILFORD GALERIE line and will continue to be distributed by Mac Group in North White Plains, NY.
Here is a link to the product page on the NEW www.ILFORD.com.
http://www.ilford.com/en/products/photo-inkjet/galerie-prestige/gold-fibre-silk/
Brenda Hipsher
Mac Group Field Marketing Manager, ILFORD
Hi Brenda:
I see that smooth high gloss is now available in sizes other than 8.5x11, but no 17" width, is there a reason for that? Great paper, it's very close to Cibachrome in appearence.
Tom
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The information communicated regarding the availability of Ilford Gold Fibre Silk was the exact information as provided to us yesterday by customer service at MAC Group, the exclusive US distributor for Ilford products. It appears that this information provided to us was inaccurate based on the subsequent postings as listed here. I have asked for additional clarification since there appears to be conflicting information being provided.
It is true availability has been constrained on many products including Gold Fibre Silk. The current information we have from MAC Group is back ordered product will begin shipping sometime in June, which has changed from the earlier projections of May.
In terms of the product line as a whole, there are indeed changes to the line. As you can see by the page listed (http://www.ilford.com/en/products/photo-inkjet/) there are some products being newly introduced, some have been discontinued and the products have been grouped into new product families and are being repackaged; Prestige and Premium.
DTG will be updating our website to reflect changes to the Ilford product line as this information is made available. If you have questions regarding the Ilford product line or other alternative papers please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you.
Gary Barker
DTG National Sales Manager
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Additional clarification on the Ilford product line...
While Ilford is "discontinuing" products in reality what they are doing is expanding and reclassifying the product line. The Prestige products will be considered a Five Star premium product which will typically contain heavier weight papers. Papers like Gold Fibre are being discontinued under the old name/packaging and being reintroduced under the Prestige group of products.
Ilford is also adding a more economic selection of products under the Premium classification, which will be considered Four Star products. These products will offer a high quality product that is more cost effective for the home studio, student and ardent amateurs and passionate photographers.
Again, DTG will be updating our website to reflect these changes as product transitions from the current products and packaging to the new Prestige and Premium offerings. If you have questions regarding availability during this transitional period please do not hesitate to contact us.
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The package changed, the paper is the same.
I opened the previous and the actual profile for my Epson R3000, exact match. They have just renamed the profile.
Moreover, opening the profile in ColorSync, here is the CIED field:
CTI3
DESCRIPTOR "Argyll Calibration Target chart information 3"
ORIGINATOR "Argyll chartread"
CREATED "Tue May 10 15:42:56 2011"
KEYWORD "DEVICE_CLASS"
DEVICE_CLASS "OUTPUT"
KEYWORD "COLOR_REP"
COLOR_REP "iRGB_XYZ"
KEYWORD "TARGET_INSTRUMENT"
TARGET_INSTRUMENT "Xrite DTP41"
KEYWORD "SPECTRAL_BANDS"
SPECTRAL_BANDS "31"
KEYWORD "SPECTRAL_START_NM"
SPECTRAL_START_NM "400.000000"
KEYWORD "SPECTRAL_END_NM"
SPECTRAL_END_NM "700.000000"
So, despite they say the profiles have been generated with...
(http://cl.ly/2C1a1F0E2H0P2h1q100s/Screenshot%20%202012-05-26%20at%2013.22.01.png)
...the truth is that they used Argyll CMS and the old Xrite DTP41. Not a big deal but, why did they tell a lie? :)
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Brenda, can you update this group on the availability of the repackaged/renamed Gold Fibre Silk? Also, I hope that Ilford improves the packaging. The boxes on the discontinued version of Gold Fibre Silk were so flimsy that I never once received a box of 17x22 paper that was undamaged. (The boxes would always shift inside retailer's carton and get bashed corners.) Thank you!
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Brenda,
If it's not going away, then why do my orders for it keep getting cancelled?
--Joe
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Brenda,
If it's not going away, then why do my orders for it keep getting cancelled?
--Joe
Maybe because your dealer doesn't know the new product cat # and name ....
http://www.ilford.com/en/products/photo-inkjet/galerie-prestige/gold-fibre-silk/
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Maybe because your dealer doesn't know the new product cat # and name ....
Many, if not most, packages of GFS (sizes and sheet counts) are missing not just from my local dealer's inventory, but also from the on-line product listings at B&H, Adorama, and Shades of Paper. For example, I just checked, and a box of 13"x19" can only be found at Adorama and Shades of Paper, and both of them are listing only the box of 10 sheets. The other places don't have it at all. It really looks to me like dealers are running out of stock.
If this is because Ilford has plenty of stock and it's just that every one of these dealers is unable to figure out what new SKUs to use, then that sounds like an Ilford problem, not the dealers' problem. To me it doesn't add up. I'm definitely confused.
I bought some Canson Baryta Photographique today just to try it out. That seems to be in stock everywhere.
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Jan, according to many in the know (my own experience is limited with Ilford GFS) Ilford GFs and Canson Baryta Photographique have very similar (perhaps even identical) characteristics.
I can vouch for the Canson paper and the manufacturers profiles (at least for Epson Pro 7900/9900 printers) having a very good Dmax and again, at least for the Epson printers, excellent colour gamut.
I do have some smaller paper sizes of Ilford GFS and I liked the results but from many months ago could not really find the paper sizes I wanted.
Hence, after some research, I made the move to Canson Baryta Photographique.
At this point, as far as semi-gloss papers are concerned, I have found my home.
The next goal for me is decide on a canvas surface...
Regards
Tony Jay
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Maybe because your dealer doesn't know the new product cat # and name ....
http://www.ilford.com/en/products/photo-inkjet/galerie-prestige/gold-fibre-silk/
The paper is here to stay from everything I've been informed, but the packaging remains a mystery. There is nothing I could find on their website that specifies whether the packaging remains the traditional 10 sheet and 50 sheet boxes. If they have discontinued 50 sheet boxes and are focusing on selling 10 sheet boxes at the prices they've been charging for this packaging, it's a deal-breaker. I would like to see an official definitive statement from the company regarding pricing and packaging policy, just to put the whole matter to rest.
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Yes the Canson Baryta is so similar as to be almost identical.
But I moved on to the Harmon Baryta and Baryta warmtone a long time ago. Especially for bw the Canson and Ilford had way too much bronzing and gloss differential for me on the new Canon and the HP Z. Even with a post coat of uv spray it was unacceptable. With True Black and White on the Canon the Harmon is just outstanding for monochrome work.
john
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Yes the Canson Baryta is so similar as to be almost identical.
But I moved on to the Harmon Baryta and Baryta warmtone a long time ago. Especially for bw the Canson and Ilford had way too much bronzing and gloss differential for me on the new Canon and the HP Z. Even with a post coat of uv spray it was unacceptable. With True Black and White on the Canon the Harmon is just outstanding for monochrome work.
john
I see zero bronzing from this paper printed in an Epson 4900. As for gloss differential, if no ink is sprayed onto a certain spot in the print because the highlights are completely blown, and you examine the print at an unusual and unconventional angle for normal print viewing, then yes, that spot will have a slightly different reflectance than the rest of the image; but it becomes apparent under rather unnatural viewing conditions and if one is controlling one's histograms properly it just shouldn't be an issue when looking at prints in a normal viewing position. That's my experience with IGFS in both the Epson 3800 and 4900.
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I believe you. I think it is working much smoother with the Epson K3 in ways it is not with the other printers. It is totally unacceptable for black and white with the new Canons.
If you lay down a dark background anywhere near a lighter value then your screwed. And this is with careful linearization and ink limiting of the media. The other really bad issue I had with the Ilford is the way it scratches. Look at the white borders of any print and I'd be shocked if it didn't have scratching there. I found it scratched before I even got it in the printer, and that was handling it with cotton gloves. I just gave up. I can throw the Harmon around like a matte paper and I never had a scratched emulsion.
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Jan, according to many in the know (my own experience is limited with Ilford GFS) Ilford GFs and Canson Baryta Photographique have very similar (perhaps even identical) characteristics.
Regards
Tony Jay
Add the Innova IFA69 Baryta to the two clones. If still available, the Innovaart site does not show it anymore in the catalog but I see that several distributors still advertise it.
Interesting to read that Innova has a different opinion on Baryta on its Fibaprint page:
>> The first step was to find the right paper, a task that was made simple by modern improvements to Titanium dioxide. Unlike other ‘Baryta’ type papers which have since been launched onto the market, we were confident our choice of a smooth, fibre-based paper with Titanium dioxide, rather than Barite, would deliver because Titanium dioxide is now at least as good, if not better than, the Barium sulfate used in barite papers. <<
http://www.innovaart.com/en/fibaprint.html
--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
340+ paper white spectral plots:
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
update april 2012: Harman by Hahnemühle, Innova IFA45 and more
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I saw the same thing on the Innova website. I believe that titanium dioxide is more expensive than barium sulfate but perhaps it's not terribly relevant given the amounts that are used in the production of inkjet papers. TiO2 is the compound of choice in the paint and coatings industry where really large volumes are used. The new Innova paper is being marketed as a substitute/replacement for Museo Silver Rag. David Williams who used to be with Museo is now with Innova and of course Museo did have some QA/QC issues last year which were the subject of a thread here on LuLa.
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>>............... we were confident our choice of a smooth, fibre-based paper with Titanium dioxide, rather than Barite, would deliver because Titanium dioxide is now at least as good, if not better than, the Barium sulfate used in barite papers. <<
http://www.innovaart.com/en/fibaprint.html
--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
340+ paper white spectral plots:
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
update april 2012: Harman by Hahnemühle, Innova IFA45 and more
Sure, they can "be confident" because they are the vendor. I have no reason to believe any of it one way or another because it is just a bald statement with no explanation of what differentiating chemical reactions of these components work better with what inks. Perhaps the only way to really know is for someone who knows how to test things systematically to do so. There's nothing like seeing the results of tests with one's own eyeballs and brains to cut through what is often just marketing hyperbole.
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Sure, they can "be confident" because they are the vendor. I have no reason to believe any of it one way or another because it is just a bald statement with no explanation of what differentiating chemical reactions of these components work better with what inks. Perhaps the only way to really know is for someone who knows how to test things systematically to do so. There's nothing like seeing the results of tests with one's own eyeballs and brains to cut through what is often just marketing hyperbole.
I agree, the hype about Baryta triggered similar sceptical thoughts in my brain. Aardenburg-Imaging should tell one day.
--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
340+ paper white spectral plots:
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
update april 2012: Harman by Hahnemühle, Innova IFA45 and more
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Ernst, yes Aardenburg will tell on the print permanence aspect, of course important. But the other issue is the image appearance and that is something users can evaluate for themselves by buying and profiling both types of paper and comparing the results with a good test image that reveals fine differences in colour rendition and tonality.
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Both Baryta (Barium Sulfate) and Titanium Dioxide are used to improve the 'whiteness' of the paper without resorting to OBAs. They are by and large non-reactive substances and shouldn't have an impact on print permanency which is more dependent on the coating and the composition of the pigments. Back in the good old days of wet photography there was a very good Baryta darkroom paper (I believe it was manufactured in France) that had a great black point and good B/W curve. I used to do a lot of printing on it and found it to be one of the best papers available. Really performed well with Selenium toning.
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Yes the Canson Baryta is so similar as to be almost identical.
But I moved on to the Harmon Baryta and Baryta warmtone a long time ago. Especially for bw the Canson and Ilford had way too much bronzing and gloss differential for me on the new Canon and the HP Z. Even with a post coat of uv spray it was unacceptable. With True Black and White on the Canon the Harmon is just outstanding for monochrome work.
john
+1 for me as well. I find that the Harman Baryta is much more to my liking than the Canson or Ilford papers. I'm getting my best B&W work by far on the Harman paper with my Epson 7900.
Dave
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Recently I was commissioned to do a 30 image portfolio for a client. I was looking for a special paper and tested a bunch including the Ilford Gold Fiber Silk and Harman by H. Gloss Baryta and Gloss Baryta Warmtone.
I judged the test prints for several weeks, displayed them so colleagues to give me their thoughts and finally selected the Harman by Hahnemuhle Gloss Baryta Warmtone. Detail was amazing, sharpness outstanding and the color beautiful. AND, absolutely no bronzing or gloss differential when printed in an Epson 9900 using Imageprint 9.
Right now, I am printing on only two papers....
Epson Hot Press Natural
Harman by H. Gloss Baryta Warmtone.
Mike
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Is there something wrong with the distribution of Ilford's entire line? B&H is showing discontinued for even the Ilford Pearl.
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I just got an email from the folks at Shades of Paper, and they got their first shipment of Ilford GFS (now "Ilford Prestige Gold Fibre Silk") in today. I asked about availability of 13x19" sheets, and they have 10 sheet boxes, but no 50s.
Before y'all panic, they did say that 50 sheet boxes are in the new lineup and are on order. Other sizes:
8.5x11" 10 Sheet and 50 sheet
11x17" 25 sheet
13x19" 10 Sheet and 50 sheet
17x22" 25 Sheet
17", 24", 36", 44", 50"x39' rolls
Neil
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So essentially Ilford is simply changing the name/packaging? Is that all?
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So essentially Ilford is simply changing the name/packaging? Is that all?
I think the price has increased as well since it now has a "premium" name! ;)
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So far we have had no indication of price changes here in Toronto. If they move out of the competitive range with Canson Baryta Photographique they may run into a sales constraint.
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Well, they chopped an inch off the length of the rolls...
Neil
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Hey Joe,
If your orders are being cancelled its possible that you're ordering under the OLD product codes. Since the packaging and naming all changed then of course the order codes changed as well.
Just double check that you're using the NEW order codes. I'll be happy to provide that for you if you'll tell me what size and count you're ordering.
Brenda K. Hipsher
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well actually I read it. But I have been away for a few days and have missed out on several posts. Trying to catch up now!
Brenda K. Hipsher
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Checking on the 50 sheet box issue for you and will get back to you.
Brenda K. Hipsher
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Yes I'm seeing 8.5x11 and 13x19 sheets along with 24x50 rolls. I'll check on this and see what's happening on the 17" product.
Brenda K. Hipsher
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It does appear that ILFORD GALERIE Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 17x22 will be available in 10 sheet and 25 sheet boxes. However, it also appears that purchasing 2 of the 25 sheet boxes will remain at about the same cost as the 50 sheet box previously. This will give you some added flexibility without causing your per print cost to go up.
As for the durability of the actual boxes themselves I have not yet seen them. This comes from ILFORD directly so please keep us posted on your experience with the new ones.
Brenda K. Hipsher
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I have had no trouble up to now getting 17x22 in the new white boxes of 50. The boxes themselves are flimsy, and the paper inside is no longer in a plastic sleeve, which seems to me an unwise economy. Sounds like the price of the 25 sheet boxes is creeping up, but then again, nothing ever creeps down pricewise.
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Brenda,
I was recently buying 50 sheet boxes of 17x22 at B&H for $160. While B&H doesn't yet show your rebadged product, other competitive online sources are showing 25 sheet boxes at $140. That's nearly double the price.
Marc
It does appear that ILFORD GALERIE Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 17x22 will be available in 10 sheet and 25 sheet boxes. However, it also appears that purchasing 2 of the 25 sheet boxes will remain at about the same cost as the 50 sheet box previously. This will give you some added flexibility without causing your per print cost to go up.
As for the durability of the actual boxes themselves I have not yet seen them. This comes from ILFORD directly so please keep us posted on your experience with the new ones.
Brenda K. Hipsher
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I saw the same thing on the Innova website. I believe that titanium dioxide is more expensive than barium sulfate but perhaps it's not terribly relevant given the amounts that are used in the production of inkjet papers. TiO2 is the compound of choice in the paint and coatings industry where really large volumes are used. The new Innova paper is being marketed as a substitute/replacement for Museo Silver Rag. David Williams who used to be with Museo is now with Innova and of course Museo did have some QA/QC issues last year which were the subject of a thread here on LuLa.
Alan:
TiO2 is not as inert as you might expect; it's widely investgated as a photo oxidation catalyst, e.g., http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12967124
or http://iopscience.iop.org/1742-6596/182/1/012039/pdf/jpconf9_182_012039.pdf
Not exactly not the activity you'd want for organic dyes exposed to light! I'm sure Innova tested for stability however.
Tom
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Brenda,
I was recently buying 50 sheet boxes of 17x22 at B&H for $160. While B&H doesn't yet show your rebadged product, other competitive online sources are showing 25 sheet boxes at $140. That's nearly double the price.
Marc
I see the same increase in price at Atlex, my usual source. Harmon, Canson and Epson are now less expensive than IGS!
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I see the same increse in price at Atlex, my usual source. Harmon, Canson and Epson are now less expensive than IGS!
We will get a better idea of whether or not this market is competitive by watching what happens to prices of these three other comparators.
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Alan:
TiO2 is not as inert as you might expect; it's widely investgated as a photo oxidation catalyst, e.g., http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12967124
or http://iopscience.iop.org/1742-6596/182/1/012039/pdf/jpconf9_182_012039.pdf
Not exactly not the activity you'd want for organic dyes exposed to light! I'm sure Innova tested for stability however.
Tom
It is an interesting material in many ways (self cleaning tiles, glass and much more) and has not always been a good whitener for photo carriers (oxidation of PE barriers in RC papers) but there is now also a wide experience in using the different forms of TiO2 the right way. And encapsulated pigment particles are beyond organic dyes though still related to them.
--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst
340+ paper white spectral plots:
http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
update april 2012: Harman by Hahnemühle, Innova IFA45 and more
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I see the same increse in price at Atlex, my usual source. Harmon, Canson and Epson are now less expensive than IGS!
IMO, IGS is popular for a single compound reason - it is a nice paper at a decent value. Take away either of those and sales will most likely plummet like a stone. Especially given the growing number of excellent alternatives.
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I think this is correct, and therefore I think it is incumbent on the company to clarify in public once and for all definitively what is happening to supply, packaging options and prices. Customers can also get fed-up with ambiguity and walk.
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IMO, IGS is popular for a single compound reason - it is a nice paper at a decent value. Take away either of those and sales will most likely plummet like a stone. Especially given the growing number of excellent alternatives.
I agree as well; I have a slight preference for the Harmon paper, but not enough to justify the higher cost over the previous pricing of IGS. If the IGS price increase remains, I'll switch.
A price increase of this size is a marketing mistake.
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A price increase of this size is a marketing mistake.
Firstly, we don't know for sure whether prices of similar packaging have increased from the manufacturer across the board. That remains to be seen.
If there were a huge price increase, it will be either a marketing mistake or a marketing coup. That would remain to be determined. I'm not convinced that this paper business is necessarily a fully competitive one. Ostensibly it looks like it is, but we don't know whether there are tie-ups or commonalities at some critical junctures in the chain from production to wholesaling. There could be some interesting surprises under the hood - or maybe not.
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But I moved on to the Harmon Baryta and Baryta warmtone a long time ago. Especially for bw the Canson and Ilford had way too much bronzing and gloss differential for me on the new Canon and the HP Z. Even with a post coat of uv spray it was unacceptable. With True Black and White on the Canon the Harmon is just outstanding for monochrome work.
+1.
The huge success and awards given to the Harmon paper seems to have spurred Ilford to make new papers in their Prestige Galerie line.
I've yet to see swatches of the new range, but hopefully something like the Smooth Gloss or Smooth Pearl (whatever that is) will compete with Harmon Baryta Gloss.
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After getting an email from Ilford today re: their new Prestige line, a message which also mentioned that the Gold Fibre Silk had been rebranded, I wandered over to B&H. They show 50 sheet packs of Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 13x19 for $140 USD. I have always bought these 50 packs locally, but I believe this to be approximately the same price as their previously branded product. So, hopefully, much ado about nada.
John
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Everything I hear and see from here in Toronto supports this view.
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I've never bought the 13x19 sheets, but B&H prices for 17x22 sheets have gone from $3.20/sheet (50 pack) to $5.60/sheet (25 pack). They appear to no longer offer the 50 pack, so admittedly it isn't a true apples to apples comparison, but it's what I'll have to pay. And maybe this is the only significant increase -- I just checked 17" rolls -- paid $93.77 about one year ago, and the price is now $112.50, a much smaller increase.
For anyone that goes off to B&H to search they've (incorrectly) spelled the new product "Fiber" instead of "Fibre" in their titles.
Marc
After getting an email from Ilford today re: their new Prestige line, a message which also mentioned that the Gold Fibre Silk had been rebranded, I wandered over to B&H. They show 50 sheet packs of Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk 13x19 for $140 USD. I have always bought these 50 packs locally, but I believe this to be approximately the same price as their previously branded product. So, hopefully, much ado about nada.
John
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I purchased 17x22 in. IGS from Atlex in February @$200 USD/50 sheet box; current price for 50 sheets is $280 (2 x 25sheet/box @ $139/box). For me it's a 40% price increase.
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Unfortunately, when Ilford rebranded their line and changed a few things as far as qty in box per version of paper, they also increased their prices. Even HP did a price increase twice within a month on most of their supplies...and some of my customers aren't happy about that which I completely understand.
If the GFS is a bit higher than expected, you can always go toward the Canson Baryta Photographique as it is VERY similar to the Ilford. You can't really tell the difference apart, but when put together, you can see very small differences. I believe the brightness of one is a little more (which I can't remember which one was a tad brighter). But still about the same quality.
Chris W
Atlex
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It would be interesting to get a better understanding of what lies behind the price increases, because for papers made in Europe, the value of the Euro has declined substantially relative to the dollar over the past months and is likely to continue doing so at least until financial markets believe the various debt situations there are under control. True, factors such as transportation increase with oil prices, but those have wiggled around a pretty steady average for quite a while now. So again, where's the inflation coming from? Have the key material inputs to the papers become so much more expensive? Perhaps, as there's been a lot of commodity price inflation in general. It would be good to see any large price increases explained by someone who knows.
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Ilford GFS is (perhaps was) the paper I use most frequently. Its packaging was always more flimsy that some (like Epson) but it was adequate. Now that the paper is placed directly into the box without any plastic bag, the top sheet always has glossy splotches that are caused by "buffing" against the cardboard box. Often the second sheet has a few similar splotches and the third sheet is fine. I think the fact the paper has some room to move around inside the box is the cause, but this never happened with the old packaging. So, aside from being more expensive you now lose a sheet or two from every box. What an improvement!
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Have you tried printing the top sheet to see whether it makes things better or worse once ink is applied? I'm still using my older stock so I haven't come across this yet.
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Have you tried printing the top sheet to see whether it makes things better or worse once ink is applied? I'm still using my older stock so I haven't come across this yet.
I haven't tried this, thinking I'd just be wasting time, but when I get a chance I will.
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Nothing to lose but a bit of ink. I asked just in case the ink may mask the problem - if so the paper would of course be usable.
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Unfortunately, when Ilford rebranded their line and changed a few things as far as qty in box per version of paper, they also increased their prices. ...............................
Chris W
Atlex
Chris:
You say rebranded but Ilford says all new products (see the ad at the top of this page - most times). Has IGS been reformulated or is it merely a change in packaging (and price)?
Tom
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Packaging - I've been assured this paper is the same as it's always been - it's an important piece of their product line.
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Have you tried printing the top sheet to see whether it makes things better or worse once ink is applied? I'm still using my older stock so I haven't come across this yet.
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Nothing to lose but a bit of ink. I asked just in case the ink may mask the problem - if so the paper would of course be usable.
Printing does mask the problem, but whether you can see it or not depends how hard you look. I wouldn't sell it to anyone, but it's good enough for a proof that would eventually be thrown out anyway.
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OK, sounds like an issue that should be brought to the attention of their senior management. It can't cost them a mint to slip a plastic envelope around the paper.