Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: iCanvas on July 28, 2011, 08:37:54 am
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After learning that Epson Exhibition canvas is not water resistant, I may have to surrender to spraying. What is the best spray gun for canvas? I have searched through the discussions and many seem to use the Wagner spray gun. There are different models and what would be the best model?
Gar
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I use the wagner control max. It has a long hose so your air intake can be situated away from your spraying area. The air pressure is also adjustable. Best of all it's dirt cheap.
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Wagner is on the cheap-end---and it works. (Buy several for the cost of a better unit). Better choice is the Fuji hvlp systems. Many others out there...
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For the Wagners you want a Wagner Control Spray Max. For the high-end, the Fuji HVLP system is what most folks here are using.
If you're just doing a few canvases here and there the Wagner is just fine.
Neil
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Be careful on that Epson Canvas! If it's not waterproof, you may not be able to use the aqueous vinyl acrylic products. Test first before you commit to a spray gun or buying larger quantities of product.
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Is the Fuji system a bleeder or a non bleeder? Or does that matter when spraying a coating on canvas. Will the Wagner overspray? I understand that the Wagner is a bleeder, meaning that air comes out of the nozzle whether the trigger is pulled or not. Is the Fuji that way?
Another question is can you you spray without diluting the coating, or does it have to be diluted for it to come out of the nozzle?
Thanks,
Gar
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The Fuji hvlp is a "non-bleeder" gun.
You may need to dilute the solution slightly (BC Timeless). You definitely need to dilute the solution for BC Glamour II. Once you have your mix/ratio formula down, it's rather easy.
ken
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The wagner does continue to push air out when you aren't pulling the trigger but that's never bothered me. Any spraygun will have overspray, but again, I've never had much of an issue with mine.
I don't bother diluting my Timeless before spraying with the Wagner. I did dilute my Glamour II when I used it, per the instructions from BC.
Neil
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With the Wagner did you ever have any issues with it dripping out the nozzle or the trigger? I have seen some negative reviews online about the Wagner, but you never know who is writing the reviews. The Fuji may be an over kill for what I do. They are around $569.00 online.
Is the Wagner easy to clean?
Gar
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no dripping issues, just that you might wanna dig out the dried laminate from the nozzle area with a toothpick between coats if you stop using it for more than 5mins to prevent half dried gunk from flying towards your canvas.
cleaning it is a joy. remove the container, remove the nozzle and remove the hose, 5 mins wash and it's done.
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What is the best spray gun for canvas? I have searched through the discussions and many seem to use the Wagner spray gun. There are different models and what would be the best model?
Gar
Wagner HVLP Control Spray Double Duty Model# 0417274
Think I paid $65 for mine. And I have sprayed tons of canvas, just putting it flat on the floor and taping the corners down, maybe a piece of tape in the middle of the edge. Adjust your spray and flow so it's not too much product coming out at once. I've had no problems. In fact, you've got to work pretty hard to screw it up.
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Another vote for the Wagner Control Spray Max. I do one or two canvases a week with it using Glamour II diluted with distilled water. Nice even spray, no clogs, easy clean-up. (Good value ... paid for itself the first time I used it.)
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Yet another positive comment for the wagner. I was successful with it the first time I used it, after reading various posts on this forum. I have sprayed more than 400 ft of BC Lyve with Timeless varnish using the wagner, and it never gave me any issues. Easy to use, easy to clean and inexpensive... that does it for me!
Stefano
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I have tried just about every gun around and ended up with the Fuji Q4 and and I love it! The Wagner does the job but the over-spray is a little too much for me. If you are doing 1-2 prints at a time it will do fine (the over-spray does not have time to build up), if you are running 20-30 at a time, you will be in a cloud and everything will be covered in a fine mist. (which is why I changed to the Q4)
As for dilution, I tried the timeless and did not like it, I cut the GlamorII with 50% water and it is perfect...the finish that I get on the prints is perfect every time and it is not that heavy coat that you see a lot of prints have.
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Just wondering which of the Fuji HVLP models people have been using? There's quite a price difference between the Q4 ($919) and the Mimi Mite 3 ($549), with a number of models in between....
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In a nutshell: the Fuji minimite 3 is fine; the 4 simply adds a bit more power (not really needed here). The lower models are as loud as typical hvlp systems; the Super and Pro have noise reduction built in.
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The reason that I went with the Q4 is the off chance that it could spray without diluting...it can not but it comes close. Spray quality wise I believe that they are all the same, especially if you are cutting the Glamour with water.
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Is this the gun? Would this one be ok for coating Timeless on Lyve Canvas?
http://www.homedepot.com/buy/paint/paint-sprayers/wagner/control-spray-double-duty-93373.html (http://www.homedepot.com/buy/paint/paint-sprayers/wagner/control-spray-double-duty-93373.html)
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No, that's not the one. This one: http://www.amazon.com/Wagner-518080-Control-Spray-Sprayer/dp/B003PGQI48/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1316098137&sr=8-1.
It works fine spraying timeless, that's what I use it for.
Neil
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FUJI HVLP. very little overspray, extremely good control of the spray pattern and well built. Will last a lifetime. Produces the highest quality spray.
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Just wondering if anyone has experience with both to share if the double duty is sufficient. I can see that the Control Spray Max has the air being delivered via the tube and hence the air intake can be quite far away from where you are spraying, but would there be any difference in the actual spraying? The storage space required is quite huge between the two models, and if I could get away with not having to store all that hose and the seperate air intake, I think I would go this route. Oh.. and its cheaper too! So are there any other major differences or will the Double Duty model do just fine? Thanks.
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I have the double duty sprayer, spraying timeless onto epson premium matte and haven't had any issues. The biggest issue was figuring out where to have the spray dial set to for the optimum amount of coverage. Too much and your varnish runs, too little and your print isn't protected. I also filter my varnish before putting it through the spray gun.
How much spraying do you anticipate doing? How consistent do you think you can be with moving the sprayer across the canvas?
I am thinking of trying the bigger version mentioned in here and potentially the fuji system if it has a larger spray area. That could save me a ton of time and require fewer passes (reducing room for error in overlapping).
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I have the double duty sprayer, spraying timeless onto epson premium matte and haven't had any issues. The biggest issue was figuring out where to have the spray dial set to for the optimum amount of coverage. Too much and your varnish runs, too little and your print isn't protected. I also filter my varnish before putting it through the spray gun.
How much spraying do you anticipate doing? How consistent do you think you can be with moving the sprayer across the canvas?
I am thinking of trying the bigger version mentioned in here and potentially the fuji system if it has a larger spray area. That could save me a ton of time and require fewer passes (reducing room for error in overlapping).
I don't see myself doing more than 1 or 2 a week, so I certainly don't need the bigger unit I don't think. But are you saying that you are thinking of trying the Wagnar Control Max? Why do you want to upgrade to this unit when it seems like the actual spraying part should be the same as with the Double Duty.
I think I can be quite consistent with the spraying, but if there is an advantage between the double duty and the control max other than the fact that its probably lighter since the air intake is seperate, then I'd love to know.
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The main reason imo for a bigger/better hvlp spray unit is consistency. If you're only spraying canvas occasionally, the Wagner is fine. The reason to get a hvlp unit with the air intake further away is clogging. The sealant is basically clear and difficult to see when the overspray clogs the filters on the Wagner (with the filter on the sprayer itself). You will need to replace these filters regularly---they are inexpensive. Try, http://www.gleempaint.com/control-spray-parts.html I hate to say it, but the Wagner units are so inexpensive, that they are like "disposable" items. Other than replacing the filters (you'll pay more in shipping to get the filter than the filter itself), if you have problems, simply buy another...
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I hate to say it, but the Wagner units are so inexpensive, that they are like "disposable" items. Other than replacing the filters (you'll pay more in shipping to get the filter than the filter itself), if you have problems, simply buy another...
I completely agree! Printers are like that too now. If you need a new printhead for Canon, you should almost consider a new printer as two printheads and a full set of inks will probably cost the same price!
I for sure don't need the the super expensive system, and since I won't be spraying much, I don't mind the air intake being being right on the unit versus several feet away. So it looks like the Double Duty model might be just fine for me!
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I bought one of these - http://www.princessauto.com/workshop/air/air-tools/paint-guns/8160657-hvlp-paint-gun
I have a Dewalt air compressor and the combo works great. IMO, a decent compressor with just about any HVLP gun can do a fantastic job with very little overspray if set up properly.
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I have been looking into spray guns myself and that type is actually ideal if you already have a compressor.
Lowe's and Home Depot have a few different styles which are essentially large Air Brushes. they gravity feed which is very nice ,and are all relatively inexpensive.
On thing I noted when looking at them in the store is they say they are mostly suited for Lacquers and thinned paints,so depending on which protective product you will be using they may require different dilutions with distilled water to get a good spray pattern.
You will definately need to do a bleed test on any non water resistant canvas even if spraying and laying the canvas down.
Premier Eco Print Shield says no more than 20% dilution and they still say that it is only for water resistant canvas unless you spray the canned Lacquer Print Shield first to seal the ink.
These guns are sold and listed in the air tools sections of the stores and sites.
http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?partNumber=301337-47120-SGY-AIR86&langId=-1&storeId=10151&productId=3360950&catalogId=10051&cmRelshp=req&rel=nofollow&cId=PDIO1
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True, but I was looking the Fuji sprayer and decided that I could buy a gun and (good) compressor for that money and then I'd be able to use the compressor to drive a staple gun and canvas stretching machine (my next purchase). :)
I've sprayed undiluted Eco Print Shield and Timeless without issue. I think the specs on the packaging are quite conservative including the CFM requirements.