Luminous Landscape Forum

Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: optofonik on June 25, 2011, 02:01:56 am

Title: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: optofonik on June 25, 2011, 02:01:56 am
Blocked up shadows.

I researched and discovered Epson went through some issues renaming their papers". As a result, I can't figure out what the paper used to be called in order to pick the right profile and print settings in the OEM Epson driver (I'm not using any RIPs

My prints are color accurate but the shadows are a disaster. I'm using NEC Spectraview II color managed monitors and CS4.

I got the paper at Samy's a few months ago for a great price and I want to get things right on it before moving on to more expensive papers.

Thanks in advance for any insight.

Mick
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on June 25, 2011, 04:53:26 am
Edit: removed an incorrect line.

Yes, better give them the same names In the US, EU, and an extra code like Innova does.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Rick Popham on June 25, 2011, 11:58:55 am
If I remember correctly, the "Matte Paper - Heavy Weight" became "Premium Presentation Paper".  The Archival/Enhanced Matte became "ULTRA Premium Presentation Paper". 

I wish they'd stop screwing around with these ridiculous names.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: howardm on June 25, 2011, 01:41:07 pm
Didn't the Epson marketing manager show up here a few days ago?

How about creating a magic decoder ring for all the names, new names and new new names?

They're taking a well-worn marketing page:  When you have no new product, just rename what you already have!   :o
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: optofonik on June 26, 2011, 12:28:48 am
"Matte Paper - Heavy Weight"

I'll try it. Offhand, I think I was using "Enhanced"; I know for sure it wasn't "heavy weight".

In the interest allowing their printers and papers to be seen as the perfect combination they promote them to be I don't understand why Epson wouldn't help customers to identify the changes they have made. With all the remaining stock still on the market they are shooting themselves in the foot by not supporting people who are still using is. I can't imagine anyone just throwing away a hundred dollars worth of paper simply becuase Epson wants them to buy the renamed paper. It's stupid.


Wish me luck.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on June 27, 2011, 01:13:42 am
I'm still checking some details and thus my delay in responding.

If there is interest, I'd be happy to elaborate on the naming conventions.

Let me know.

I thought it best at this time, to address some of the questions and will follow-up in 1-2 days with more information.

Ultra Premium Presentation Paper Matte, is the cut sheet version of Enhanced Matte Paper. 

Enhanced Matte Paper was originally called Archival Matte Paper.  The name changed several years ago.

Premium Presentation Paper Matte, (without the Ultra), is a more value priced paper.

It differs from the "Ultra" product both in weight and it has a different coating.

It carries a 4 star rating vs the Ultra version which has a 5 star rating.

On the 3880, a profile is only available for the Ultra version and that profile is not optimal for the non Ultra version.

I'm checking to see if a different profile might produce a better result.


Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.





Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on June 27, 2011, 03:09:06 pm
If using Premium Presentation Paper Matte with the 3880, the recommended color managed system to start with is setting the Media Type to Presentation Paper Matte and use the Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper profile.  In this particular scenario use 1440dpi not 2880dpi.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: optofonik on June 30, 2011, 03:17:11 am
Dano, thank you for taking the time to research and reply. I'll try your recommended settings over the holiday weekend and post back.

I would like to better understand the naming conventions. I think it might be useful to others as well.


Mick
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on June 30, 2011, 02:45:13 pm
I'm working on the doc as we speak.

Might take me a little while.

Stay tuned.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.



Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 07, 2011, 09:15:56 pm
Per the last post, I put together the following on how Epson names its papers. In the spirit of brevity, most of the information is in glossary form. Some of this may sound very basic, but due to the colloquial nature of photography, the same term can have multiple meanings so thought it best to include some of the basics.  Please note that some of the information may be slightly different outside of North America.

There are also 2 attachments
-My ongoing Glossary of Fine Art Terms, which may be a helpful reference.
-The Epson Star System chart showing previous and current names of cut sheet papers.

If there is interest, I would be happy to provide more details/insight into the naming of the latest Professional Papers as I was on the core team that developed those names.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.

Media
Any product with an ink jet coating that transports through an ink jet printer.

Paper
Any paper with an inkjet coating. All Paper is Media but not all Media is a Paper, e.g., vinyls.

Proofing Paper
Any paper with an inkjet coating designed for pre-press/contract proofing. These papers are NOT designed for original photography.

Signage
Reflective and backlit media designed for signage applications. Most signage media is designed for solvent based printers.

Coated Matte Paper
Any paper with a matte surface that has an inkjet coating.

Coated Gloss Paper
Any paper with a gloss surface that has an inkjet coating.

Photo Paper
Any resin coated (RC) paper that has an inkjet coating. RC papers are microporous type papers that encapsulate the paper base between two layers of polyethylene. Photo Black ink is used to maximize print quality.

Fine Art Paper
Any cotton fiber paper with an inkjet coating. Matte Black ink is used to maximize print quality. The term “fine art” has evolved into several meanings but started in the early days of ink jet where one for the first time could use papers from the fine art world. It is a naming category only, since many valuable fine art photographs are created on Coated and Photo Papers.

Cotton Rag
A legacy term that described a paper type made in the past. “Rags” have not been used in papers for decades, so technically cotton rag no longer exists but the term remains in circulation such as in Giclée, which does not have a technical meaning.

Professional Media
Any Epson media found on the Professional Imaging website and designed for use by Creative Professionals. 

Signature Worthy Papers
Epson’s best papers for photographers (mix of Photo and Fine Art).

Bright
Contains OBAs

Natural
Does not contain OBAs

Hot Press
Smooth surface

Cold Press
Textured surface

Opacity
Defines the opaqueness or ability to prevent two-sided printing from showing through.

(260), (250)
Parentheses are only used with roll paper, and the number represents gsm, which is an abbreviation for grams per meter squared. It provides a basis weight and does not describe paper thickness or caliper.

Mil
Equals one thousandth of an inch in thickness; not to be confused with millimeters (mm).

Ultra
Prefix used with cut sheet versions of Professional Papers to differentiate from non-Professional papers in the Epson Star System.

Epson Star System
A Good (3-Stars), Better (4-Stars), Best (5-Stars) system designed to help consumers/hobbyists in a retail environment choose the best cut sheet paper for their needs. Some Professional Papers are sold in this environment and always carry 5 Stars. The names of some cut sheet papers were changed with the implementation of this system and the same Professional Paper in roll format may carry its original name. 3 and 4 Star papers are not considered Professional Papers, which is why profiles for 3 and 4 star papers may not be available for Stylus Pro and Stylus Photo Printers.

 
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Mike Guilbault on July 07, 2011, 10:43:06 pm
Thanks Dano!
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on July 08, 2011, 03:13:09 am

Proofing Paper
Any paper with an inkjet coating designed for pre-press/contract proofing. These papers are NOT designed for original photography.

Photo Paper
Any resin coated (RC) paper that has an inkjet coating. RC papers are microporous type papers that encapsulate the paper base between two layers of polyethylene. Photo Black ink is used to maximize print quality.


Dano,

What makes the difference between an RC Proofing Paper like Proofing White Semimatte and an RC Photo Paper ?  So far I can not find a difference that matters.

In ads for the x900 printers Epson praises the wide gamut of the printers and refers to Epson Proofing White SemiMatte that was needed for that gamut. Ads for a wider market.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 08, 2011, 12:06:57 pm
Spoke with my colleague who is an expert on Proofing Papers:

From a technical standpoint, some RC Proofing Papers and some RC Photo Papers can be similar or the same. Proofing Papers are developed with specific white points to meet industry 4-color process printing standards and are typically on a smooth semi-matte finish. RC Photo Papers can have different surface textures and thicknesses that feel more photographic.  Some use Proofing Papers for Photographs and some use Photo Papers for Proofing.  There are two reasons for my earlier recommendation to not use Proofing Papers for Photography:

-Wedding photographers still use the term “Proofs” for letter size or smaller prints.  Thus some have mistakenly purchased Proofing Paper for their Proofs when a Photo Paper would be a better solution.

-Some fine art photographers make, “Proof Prints” before going to larger sizes.  Instead of using a letter size version of the paper they plan to use at a large size, some choose Proofing Paper thinking its designed for making Proof Prints.


Epson Proofing Paper White Semimatte has the highest L* value in the Epson Proofing Media line.  It's also capable of holding the highest ink load in the Epson Proofing Media line. That combination of L* and Ink Load leads to the largest possible gamut in reference to the 98% matching of the PANTONE FORMULA GUIDE solid coated.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on July 08, 2011, 04:02:34 pm

Epson Proofing Paper White Semimatte has the highest L* value in the Epson Proofing Media line.  It's also capable of holding the highest ink load in the Epson Proofing Media line. That combination of L* and Ink Load leads to the largest possible gamut in reference to the 98% matching of the PANTONE FORMULA GUIDE solid coated.


Dano,

Of all the RC papers I measured, including all the Epson RC papers and so including all the Epson proofing papers, it has the highest white reflectance at Lab 97.2 0.3 1.3 (samplebook) and even more neutral from the roll that I have. Keeping that neutrality + white reflectance numbers almost exactly after being exposed to sunlight on an east side window for 80 days now. Has no FBAs or very little. A gem that should get more recognition IMHO. The white reflection is better than that of EEF and it keeps that white. EEF has a cooler white for as long as it goes.

met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm



Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 08, 2011, 05:53:51 pm
The wonderful thing about ink jet vs AgX are the creative choices with paper types and surfaces. 

Danecdotally (Term used within Epson about my anecdotal industry observations) most artists/photographers using RC, dislike the semi-matte surface and prefer the surface of Exhibition Fiber or Luster and also the cool tone you mentioned.

But just two days ago I was visiting a photographer who raved about Premium Semimatte Photo Paper (260) and how much he disliked Luster because it reminded him of a plastic picnic table cover  :D

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 08, 2011, 10:33:47 pm
On the subject of Epson's naming conventions, I'd like to put in a vote for english ICC profile names. For example, the Epson 9900 profiles for newer media have names like:
SP7900 9900 CPBWFAP MK 1400 v1
SP7900 9900 ECG MK 2880 MK v1
Pro38 PSPP
etc.

Except for the media acronyms, this all makes pretty good sense, but the media acronyms drive me crazy. I can never remember what PSPP or PGPP is supposed to be short for, and have taken to making my own decoder lists. What's the point of an acronym like "CPBWFAP"? I'd sure like to see them expanded as Epson used to, as in:
Epson Stylus Pro 9900 7900 ArchivalMattePaper MK. 
The profiles names in this series made sense to me (or at least, they did if you could keep track of Epson's constantly shifting names!).

Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on July 09, 2011, 07:13:35 am
The wonderful thing about ink jet vs AgX are the creative choices with paper types and surfaces. 

Danecdotally (Term used within Epson about my anecdotal industry observations) most artists/photographers using RC, dislike the semi-matte surface and prefer the surface of Exhibition Fiber or Luster and also the cool tone you mentioned.

But just two days ago I was visiting a photographer who raved about Premium Semimatte Photo Paper (260) and how much he disliked Luster because it reminded him of a plastic picnic table cover  :D

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.


We all have opinions on what looks unnatural (or for some worse; plastic). The opinions differ though and could have been influenced per generation by the plastic that was introduced in their youth and its use at home. The culture of covering the table and furniture with plasticised PVC was not that widespread over here so that may have reduced the traumas about it :-) Plastic is not a dirty word for me. I am familiar with types and grades of plastic and know the cons and pros like many are familiar with qualities of wood, metal, glass, ceramics.

It would be interesting to put 100 paper samples, RC, Fiber, Barite, behind a matt that only shows the surface of each sample, sample partly printed, and then ask a panel to qualify the surface on its plastic or non-plastic look. A design student here considered HM Photorag Baryta as plasticy a week ago. I had to tell her that the surface was more a gelatine (probably PVA though) and that it was developed to look like analogue photo paper of the past. I have seen Fiber and Baryta papers that look more 'plasticy" on my scale. It could well be that she longs for the RC paper of her past. There are a lot of different plastic surfaces, from the wax like high density polyethylene to the chalky surface of old melamine. Then there are  the "natural" texture of low density polyethylene and the wide varieties of "synthetic" textures for all other kinds of plastics. I do not think the average consumer can qualify the glossy inkjet paper surface alone as plastic or non-plastic and in reality it is 50% polymere anyway even on baryta papers.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 09, 2011, 10:51:57 am
I agree the abbreviations for the profile names are not always intuitive. 

It would be nice if the names were acronyms (American dictionary definition of an abbreviation that can be pronounced as a word) but it just will not work.

Would it be of help to those in the Forum if I posted an explanation of what each profile name means e.g. CPBWFAP = Cold Press Bright White Fine Art Paper

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 09, 2011, 11:15:07 am
I agree that great RC papers are not used by some because they are deemed to be "plastic".

I remember comparing fiber-based AgX to RC AgX papers in high school (mid-1970s).

The RC papers reduced wash times and dried quickly but they looked awful.

To me RC papers today look and feel photographic but some still equate RC with AgX technology from 40 years ago.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.

 
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 09, 2011, 12:21:44 pm
Quote
It would be nice if the names were acronyms (American dictionary definition of an abbreviation that can be pronounced as a word)

Nice grammatical catch Dano! You are absolutely correct in pointing out that I used the term "acronym" incorrectly - there's no way that most of these letter combinations could be pronounced as a word!
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 09, 2011, 01:08:06 pm
I was careful to point out the definition came an American dictionary because my British wife would say an acronym does not have to be pronounced as a word.  But acronyms can also backfire as in my Kodak Professional days when I was promoted to Professional Imaging System Specialist.

Do let me know if there is a need for a published definition of profile abbreviations and also if there is interest in knowing why the Epson Pro Papers carry names like Exhibition and Hot Press etc.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Mike Guilbault on July 09, 2011, 06:37:30 pm
Hey Dano.. I think a list of the profile names would be great.  You explained it to me a while back for my 4900.. but I'm sure other newbys to printing would really appreciate it too.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Farmer on July 10, 2011, 02:10:27 am
I think your American dictionary might be feeding a pretty recent evolution of the term, Dano.

The word originated in the US with the definition ascribed by your better half, coming into the lexicon around 1943.  I suspect the current, US, alterantive has been taken into popular usage simply from the the common predilection for forming acronyms into such pronounceables* :-)

(* "verbing nouns and nouning verbs" being one of the lovely traits of English, even though stretching that to nouning adjectives might be reaching too far!)
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 11, 2011, 04:30:10 pm
Quote
Hey Dano.. I think a list of the profile names would be great.

At the risk of sounding greedy ... even better would be if you could get your techno-guys to update the profiles for new media with English names.

Even better than a decoder ring, would be not needing a decoder ring!

Until then, my process continues to be:
- Pick the media to print on
- Look through the list of profiles, and see if there's exactly one where the first letters of the media name match a profile
- If there aren't any matches, try to remember whether the paper's gone through a renaming

On another note, I've got some old stock of some S041062 (Epson Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper). There is no profile for it, but the Enhanced Matte profile isn't completely awful for it. It's not particularly photo-worthy, but it's synthetic, and doesn't mind getting a bit wet - I use it to label the mead that I make (mead, or melomel, is similar to wine, but uses honey to fuel the fermentation). Is there anything at all similar that anyone knows of? Epson makes a synthetic film for signage that looks potentially suitable for the purpose, but it's not in my sample book - and I think it only comes in rolls, and one roll would be a lifetime supply of labels for me!

Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 11, 2011, 06:51:00 pm
As soon as I get back from a long business trip I'll post the info about profiles.

Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper was designed for dye based inks some time ago, it works with pigment inks but as you mentioned, it is what it is.

A profile for Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper does exist with several printers and is called either PhotoQualityInkJetPaper or Photo Qlty IJP

For labels:

-There's Epson's New Sure Press L-4033A.  An amazing label printer but the cost is in the 6 figures so kinda overkill for your Mead : )
-There's an Epson consumer product called Photo Quality Self Adhesive Sheets which is Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper with an adhesive backing. 
-The other Epson branded products referenced are for solvent based inks.

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Marketing Manager, Professional Imaging
Epson America, Inc.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 12, 2011, 12:04:31 am
Thanks Dano,

That's really helpful - although none of my regular suppliers carry S041106, I'm sure I can find it somewhere: it looks perfect for my labels. I can't find the ICC profile on the Epson site though.

The SurePress, on the other hand, makes my 9900 look like a toy!

While I was looking for ICC profiles, I did find this list of "Acronyms" as the Epson web page calls them:
MPHW    Matte Paper Heavyweight
PGPP    Epson Premium Photo Paper Glossy (formerly Epson Premium Glossy Photo Paper)
PGPS    Premium Photo Paper Semi-gloss
PLPP    Epson Ultra Premium Photo Paper Luster (formerly Epson Premium Luster Photo Paper)
PQIJ    Epson Presentation Paper Matte (formerly Epson Photo Quality Ink Jet Paper)
PSPP    Epson Premium Photo Paper Semi-gloss
UPGP    Ultra Premium Glossy Paper
UPPM    Ultra Premium Presentation paper Matte
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Farmer on July 12, 2011, 03:56:51 am
I use it to label the mead that I make (mead, or melomel, is similar to wine, but uses honey to fuel the fermentation). Is there anything at all similar that anyone knows of? Epson makes a synthetic film for signage that looks potentially suitable for the purpose, but it's not in my sample book - and I think it only comes in rolls, and one roll would be a lifetime supply of labels for me!

Possibly not what you're after as it would like be overkill, but there's also:

http://pos.epson.com/products/SecurColorTM-C3400?ProductPK=634 for labels.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 12, 2011, 02:36:45 pm
While I was looking for ICC profiles, I did find this list of "Acronyms" as the Epson web page calls them:

There are indeed a few references on different Epson web pages to “Acronyms”, “Cotton Rag” and I think I once saw the dreaded, “Giclee”.   

The following is not comprehensive, but should explain most of the abbreviated profile names used by photographers and artists.

I’ve done my best to prevent any “anachronisms”  :)

In most cases, spelled out names are worldwide media products established by Seiko Epson.  Abbreviations are names of media developed regionally (many of these regional products were developed by Epson America).  We are looking into the spelling of names vs. abbreviations.  I do not have an ETA (abbreviation for estimated time of arrival) because it’s still a WIP (acronym for work in progress)

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Epson America, Inc.


SP
Stylus Pro Printer

SPR
Stylus Photo R-Type Printer

(240) (260) etc.
GSM following the profile abbreviation or name of many roll papers.

ARMP
Archival Matte Paper

CPBWFAP
Cold Press Bright White Fine Art Paper

CPNWFAP
Cold Press Natural White Fine Art Paper

DTBLM
DisplayTrans Backlight Media

ECG
Exhibition Canvas Gloss

ECM
Exhibition Canvas Matte

ECS
Exhibition Canvas Satin

EFP
Exhibition Fiber Paper

EMP
Enhanced Matte Paper

HPBWFAP
Hot Press Bright White Fine Art Paper

HPNWFAP
Hot Press Natural White Fine Art Paper

MPHW
Matte Paper – HW
Matte Paper Heavy Weight

PCM
Premium Canvas Matte

PCS
Premium Canvas Satin

PGPP
Premium Glossy Photo Paper
Also used for Premium Photo Paper Glossy

PGPS
Premium Photo Paper Semi-gloss

PLPP
Premium Luster Photo Paper
Also used for Ultra Premium Photo Paper Luster

PQIJP
Photo Quality Inkjet Paper
Also used for Presentation Paper Matte

PSPP
Premium Photo Paper Semi-gloss

SPP
Standard Proofing Paper

SPPAdh
Standard Proofing Paper Adhesive

SVFAP
Somerset Velvet Fine Art Paper

SWMP
Singleweight Matte Paper

USFAP
Ultrasmooth Fine Art Paper

UPGP
Ultra Premium Glossy Paper

UPPM
Ultra Premium Presentation Paper Matte

VFAP
Velvet Fine Art Paper

WCRW
Watercolor Paper Radiant White
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on July 12, 2011, 02:48:56 pm
There's one more, Dano:

UPPPMFKAEEMFKAAMOWTACITY

Ultra Premium Presentation Paper Matte formerly known as Epson Enhanced Matte formerly known as Archival Matte, or whatever they are calling it this year

 ;)

Eric
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 12, 2011, 04:12:04 pm
It might be an acronym in some language!

I'll bring it up at the next planning meeting  :)

Dano
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Farmer on July 12, 2011, 06:32:57 pm
For Europe, Australia and New Zealand, we can add one to Dano's excellent list:

TFP - Traditional Photo Paper
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 12, 2011, 07:34:01 pm
Quote
Possibly not what you're after as it would like be overkill

Thanks, but yes, even this little printer would be one more printer to care for.

I'm on something of a reducing diet for computers and peripherals. I haven't quite cut down to one of each, and I don't see myself going that far, but I'm trying to cut down on "occasional used" electronics.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on July 13, 2011, 03:35:24 am
For Europe, Australia and New Zealand, we can add one to Dano's excellent list:

TFP - Traditional Photo Paper

To EFP then as I understand it is the same paper.

And UPPM could get EMP Enhanced Matte Paper added as that name is still used in Europe.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

New: Spectral plots of +250 inkjet papers:

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 15, 2011, 12:02:28 pm
Branding is an interesting thing. I've read several intriguing articles about the subtle ways in which branding can affect the perception of a product.

One of the things I haven't seen mentioned in what I've read, is the effect of re-branding. It's just my guess, but I suspect that constant re-branding exposes a company to ridicule, and undermines the intended effect of the re-branding. "Formerly known as" is a phrase that doesn't seem to be given a lot of thought by marketing folks.

Do you remember a fairly successful pop singer who went by the name of "Prince"?. He tried to re-brand himself, and now seems to be the poster boy for why re-branding doesn't work...

Back to the subject of acronyms, and Epson's constantly changing list of media names, I'd like to suggest that Epson, along with most of the printer manufacturers, could stand to think more about consistency.

Let's take the process of making a print on one of Epson's printers. If I use Exhibition Fibre paper, the process looks like this:
- soft proof in Photoshop. The profile name isn't one of the worst ones, but I have to remember that the profile isn't called Exhibition Fibre, but contains EFP. Fortunately, Photoshop is smart enough to let me name soft profiles myself.
- put paper in the printer. The printer wants to know what I've put it it, but Epson mysteriously hasn't actually put the name of this media into a localized version of the firmware, so I have to remember to use Luster 260.
- print from Lightroom. Again, I have to remember that the (I don't have a better term than "acronym") in the ICC profile is EFP.

How many people have wrecked canvas prints because they accidentally told their printer that they had loaded "canvas", not remembering that for most of Epson's canvas media,  they should select "watercolor paper radiant white" as the media?

Making media names consistent isn't a difficult task from a software engineering point of view, but it's a little thing that that the potential to significantly affect the user's experience. I appreciate the problem of global vs. local media names, but I think that the solution lies in opening the firmware up, so that users can add local Epson media, or third-party media names to the media list in the printer's firmware. Similarly, if Epson can't figure out a consistent profile naming convention, letting users change profile names would be a real help to Epson's users.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Mike Guilbault on July 15, 2011, 05:09:27 pm
All that being said... I'd like a sexier name than Cold Press Natural/Bright.  Just doesn't bring forth visions of a lightly textured, tactile and organic type of paper.  Sounds very 'Cold'... not that "Hot Press" is much better!  ;)
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Farmer on July 15, 2011, 06:00:31 pm
letting users change profile names would be a real help to Epson's users.


But you can!  Set up the driver the way you need it (correct profile, other settings, etc), then click "Custom" and then save it under any name that you like "Such as "John's Awesome Canvas Setting" :-) or whatever you like/makes sense to you.  You can then Export those customisations and keep them safe somewhere.  If you go to a new computer, or reinstall the driver, or whatever the case may be, you can then import them.  Then, you know exactly what you're selecting.  So, they do let you change them effectively.

For even more control, go into the Utility tab of the driver and then click on Menu Arrangement and you can make groups and arrange the order etc of all the standard and customised settings/names.  You can even reset it to default if you lose control :-)
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Alan Goldhammer on July 15, 2011, 06:20:01 pm
But you can!  Set up the driver the way you need it (correct profile, other settings, etc), then click "Custom" and then save it under any name that you like "Such as "John's Awesome Canvas Setting" :-) or whatever you like/makes sense to you.  You can then Export those customisations and keep them safe somewhere. 
As the famous inventor and television evangelist of the small rotisserie is famous for saying, "set it and forget it!!"  Same can be said for driver settings and you can do even better by creating a LR preset as well if you have a common size that you print out.
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: Dano Steinhardt on July 16, 2011, 12:30:31 am
The printer wants to know what I've put it it, but Epson mysteriously hasn't actually put the name of this media into a localized version of the firmware, so I have to remember to use Luster 260.

Per the attached:
With the latest generation printers we are incorporating the regional paper names in the driver for ease when setting the Media Type.   

Dan (Dano) Steinhardt
Title: Re: (non-Ultra) "Premium Presentation Paper / Matte" on an Epson 3880
Post by: JohnHeerema on July 16, 2011, 03:32:33 pm
Quote
Per the attached:
With the latest generation printers we are incorporating the regional paper names in the driver for ease when setting the Media Type.

Thanks Dano,

I think that's a step in the right direction, even if it's only for the latest printers. As Alan et al have noted, the OS lets you save printer settings and assign custom names to them, and so I've got presets for all of the media types that I normally use (eg: 9900 Exhibition Canvas Gloss, 3800 Exhibition Fibre, etc). As a bonus, they help me to avoid the dreaded auto-black-switch on the 3800. I also use this for my non-Epson printers, and non-Epson media.

The printer firmware for the 9900 uses the printer LCD to ask you what you've loaded, which is what I was referring to. Maybe there's already a mechanism to let me add media types to that firmware menu: I haven't explored that option. For now, I just use my mental decoder ring.