Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: Ken on May 18, 2011, 01:58:48 pm
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Why do some MF large-file users prefer eight and 16GB cards over larger capacity cards?
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How long does it take to change a card? And it spreads the risk a bit, if a card goes bad.
John
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BINGO - I use 4 and 8 gig cards
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I use 8s. WHen I bought them, they were less than half the price of a 16, so it was an economic issue.
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I use 8s. WHen I bought them, they were less than half the price of a 16, so it was an economic issue.
Well one of my personal cameras is a 5DMK-II, and I was annoyed when Sandisk Extreme 4GB CF Cards were discontinued and I had to buy 8's. Not only do I not like consolidating that amount of images on one card, I like having a card that gets comfortably full with a certain amount of images that doesn't exceed what I can recall I shot. Of course, that's not as easy a problem to create with 80MP files.... ::)
Steve Hendrix
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Well... there are different thoughts on this.
Personally I use large cards. I believe there is more chance of losing or damaging a card if you're using multiple cards and taking them in/out more often, trying to keep track of them, etc, etc.. than a large card failing.
Of course this is based on my own experience losing and damaging cards.. ;D
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I Like a variety. If I am shooting a stitched pano I will use a 32gig but otherwise I prefer 8's.
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4GB and 8GB here. 8 seems like a good balance for landscape and street work in terms of # of shots/ speed/ download/ formatting time etc (56 and 80MP backs)
4GB tops on the smaller cameras
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I like my 16 and even the 32gb cards. Why? Fewer read/right cycles making them more reliable--no card issues since going to the larger cards. Last problems were with the 4s, 2s, and especially one-gig cards that at this time I haven't seen with 8+ gb cards.
The 32 is great for HD video. With the 8 and 16, I shoot 1-2 days and seldom loose track of a card since it's in the camera and the camera is harder for me to put down and misplace.
Sure, more eggs in the basket syndrome over using smaller cards, but so far, larger, more reliable cards, faster to down load just a couple of cards over several at the end of the day, no changing cards in the heat of battle, etc.
I've been using the 8s and 16s for better than 3+ years and perhaps 250,000 images and seldom use anything smaller any more.
I recommend using a card that's big enough to shoot the entire job or an entire day. 8 and 16 do the job for me for my raw workflow using DSLRs. However, what works for me and my workflow may not work for you and YRMV!
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How long does it take to change a card? And it spreads the risk a bit, if a card goes bad.
John
Agree. Nikon shooters have the option of on camera backup, so maybe this make them (and me since I am a nikon shooter ) more confident when using some how larger cards. I never buy the bigest and newest cards. It's too risky and too expensive. So a moderated size will do.
Finally maybe the fact that you don't go "motor shooting " at 8fps with a medium camera leads to a more deliberated work with fewer shoots and more control.
Just my 3 cents,
James
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I bought 32GB card but it didn't work on my H4D-60, so i gonna buy another card, but i really not sure if i should get something smaller than 32GB, is 16GB good enough? I have 12GB to use for my Hassy, i was using this 12GB for my Canon DSLRs before, but now i use 2x 8GB and 1x 4GB for Canon and now i will keep that 32GB for the Canon as well [but it seems the card is not very reliable but i will give it a try] so i will leave that 12GB for Hasselblad and add one more, i am toning between 16GB and 32GB.
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Hi,
Optimal size is from 4Gb to 8Gb. It's safe and easy to manage. In old days we had 12-24 frames. And it was optimal too. It's better to Loose 50 images than 200.
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I think i will go with 16GB card now added to my 12GB and i will take one 8GB as well to be used for MF, and i will use that 32GB which didn't work on my Hasselblad for Canon, this way i can be safe for a while, later if i see myself i am shooting a lot of MF that eating my card size rapidly then i can think about 32-128GB cards.
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i was asking a cassette camera man that why do some of the old school guys still like to stay with tapes.he told me that that cards and hard drives are not that reliable as tapes.so even in the case he has to use cards,he use small ones,so you will not have your whole day work on one card,and once it got a problem you can not recover anything.
i think that is a good i idea. cards are not that reliable,hard drives are even less reliable.small card not only saves your money but also split the photos.
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Kinda curious to those who shoot smaller cards because they're worried about the card failing and losing their eggs..
Do you regularly carry extra batteries, lights, cameras, lenses, etc.. to a shoot? You know, the equipment that really does fail from time to time?
I'd use 256k cards if they fit my shooting style. Besides that the newer, faster, more reliable cards usually come out in the larger sizes.. to me.. anything that removes distractions (like changing and keeping track of memory cards) during a shoot far outweighs the almost nonexistent possibility of a card failing and not being recoverable. And I've already mentioned they can be lost, misplaced, written/formatted over if one falls out of sync with the rest, or even a camera dropped while fumbling around with a process you could have removed from the equation.
13-14 years of digital now.. I've had a Lexar card fail and later we found out the controller wasn't working well with Canon and Lexar fixed that (didn't use Lexar again for years), and an ultra-cheap SD card physically split in half because the outside case was came unglued. Even the cards that have been washed, rinsed, and dried on high have survived.
Speaking of lost cards. I recently pulled a car from storage and had some work done on it.. and during the work they found a "smart media" card from my Olympus C3000 of 1998 vintage I can't wait to get to my new home and dig out a smart media card reader and see what's on it.
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How long does it take to change a card? And it spreads the risk a bit, if a card goes bad.
John
I've never bought into that argument. Every time I've ever had a card problem it was either user error or caused by a card reader, and that's since 1998. I've been able to recover at least 98% of the images any time there was a problem.
I believe there is more change of risk by using multiple cards. More chance of losing them for sure. More chance of putting them in some other camera for formatting it and then having to recover images.
For photographers who do weddings, one card is much safer.
With my medium format, I use different sizes. In studio, whatever is needed for a session. An 8gig is more than enough. For a big family session with many break downs, or something like the engagement party I photographed today (part mf & part 5dmk2) I'll use the 32gb card. A Trancend 16gb 400x card is like $74 so it's not a big expense.
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I have had 3 cards fail. One cheapy and 2 Sandisc. All were replaced no problem on that score but I did lose work on 2 of the occasions. None of the cards were mishandled and all 3 were less than a week old.
So call me a nervous ninny if you will. Paying clients and past experience tells me to be a little careful.
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i was talking about a camera man works for discovery.com and most of time he have to travel a long way with all the work he did,which is extremely valuable. if you only shoot around your yard in good weather,in walk distance,i think the cards are quite safe,otherwise the cards manufactures are doomed.
i only said it is a good idea. i did not say everyone stays with 256k cards and keep a deck of ...cards
thanks
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I have had 3 cards fail. One cheapy and 2 Sandisc. All were replaced no problem on that score but I did lose work on 2 of the occasions. None of the cards were mishandled and all 3 were less than a week old.
So call me a nervous ninny if you will. Paying clients and past experience tells me to be a little careful.
You bring up another good point. Use your gear for a while before taking it on a paid job. Test, retest, put it through the wringer before using it for important work.
Cards do fail. It's why the card companies have RMA services in place. And I'd like to see some reliable statistics on the percentage of cards that fail. I suspect that number is very low, much lower than cards that get lost, misplaced, accidently written over, etc. And I further when these failures take place. Anyone familiar with electronics know most electronics that fail, fail within the first few days/weeks of use. It's been my experience that once a card works fine for a month or so, you can almost consider it bullet proof.
In contrast.. camera equipment. Their electronic components are in the same class. But their mechanical components fail more are they wear, get dirty, don't get maintained (cleaned and lubed), jolted, etc..
I'll admit, I'm not a "sky is falling" type of guy. I am careful, I do test my gear before taking it on a paid gig, and I don't unnecessarily abuse my equipment. But.. I don't baby it either. My cameras and lenses have scratches, worn areas, and I'll always put 'convenience of use' above protection. I never use the on/off switch either, not for changing cards nor batteries. I don't want to have to worry about it. If a camera ever failed through such use I'd simply look for one that fit my style of use.
With all that said.. I've had very few equipment failures. Much less than you'd expect for someone who routinely drags their gear through the jungles of South East Asia and all that entails.
Failing memory cards? I don't give it a thought. Ever.
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Using two 32Gb and one 64Gb. never had a need to worry. on P65+ back.
Like others here, I made more mistakes with more cards.
K.I.S.S.
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I chalk it up to a bunch of nervous ninnies and self proclaimed risk assessment experts.
Its easy tagging people who encountered issues as "nervous ninnies". The fun part begins when "macho photog" hits a bump.
I've already given my opinion on the issue. While it is of course "self proclaimed" as all opinions are, it is backed up by a bit more than 30.000 correctly documented support cases since 2001 and probably something like 100.000 so-so (in terms of information accuracy) other cases.
You bring up another good point. Use your gear for a while before taking it on a paid job. Test, retest, put it through the wringer before using it for important work.
Cards do fail. It's why the card companies have RMA services in place. And I'd like to see some reliable statistics on the percentage of cards that fail. I suspect that number is very low, much lower than cards that get lost, misplaced, accidently written over, etc.
The current rate of true hardware failures is quite low indeed, the positive trend started around 2006.
And I further when these failures take place. Anyone familiar with electronics know most electronics that fail, fail within the first few days/weeks of use. It's been my experience that once a card works fine for a month or so, you can almost consider it bullet proof.
This is, in general, a good rule of thumb. However, there are several nuances when it comes to card. The media itself has a limited life expectancy that is very reachable, especially with poor wear leveling algorithms (that's in practice similar to light bulbs, except that some clever load spreading is active in the background). The controller is essentially a small computer with its own firmware and the field is (was) evolving quickly. When you have a device that's not working with a new computer and/or OS you either upgrade its firmware or driver and that's it. When a card encounters a similar issue it is, for all practical purposes, dead for the user. Lexar has on several occasions updated the firmware of cards and that firmware upgrade restored access to the customer data either by making the interface more compatible or by improving defect management and bypassing the troubled area). Last but not least, the interfaces between the card components are relatively thin and subject to more mechanical stress than, say, in the midst of a rigid phone.
In contrast.. camera equipment. Their electronic components are in the same class. But their mechanical components fail more are they wear, get dirty, don't get maintained (cleaned and lubed), jolted, etc..
Very true.
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How long does it take to change a card? And it spreads the risk a bit, if a card goes bad.
John
Nah, on contrary to me. I had 6x 4GB before but replaced them with one 32GB last year. What that brought me was 8GB extra and only one card to keep track of. Works like a charm... ;)
Not to mention no more keeping track of what is on which card... and no more card wallet in bag :P...
Have never had a single flash card go wrong. Very solid technology at least with quality brand.
Regards
Anders